Take a look at our
ThinkPads.com HOME PAGE
For those who might want to contribute to the blog, start here: Editors Alley Topic
Then contact Bill with a Private Message
ThinkPads.com HOME PAGE
For those who might want to contribute to the blog, start here: Editors Alley Topic
Then contact Bill with a Private Message
Time for a New Business Laptop
-
- Junior Member
- Posts: 331
- Joined: Sun Nov 19, 2006 10:43 am
- Location: North Central Florida, US
Time for a New Business Laptop
Good evening, folks. I've finally reached the point in my career where I feel I can afford a relatively new laptop (in fact, my maximum budget might allow me to buy a new current model, though I'd happily opt for a used model that can still do everything a modern computer needs to do.)
Here's the thing. I'm using a ThinkPad T60 with a 14" screen, which makes my laptop just over 12" across. It uses a classic TP-type keyboard and a classic matte LCD.
I'm not interested in anything bigger. This machine is primarily for work even though I also use it for entertainment. I would also like a matte LCD and a classic type keyboard (the kind with a contoured CAPS key and ridges on the home keys--I do a LOT of typing for my profession, so I must have a keyboard meant for typing).
Are my requirements even possible to fulfill with a modern ThinkPad? Or at all?
Input is appreciated.
My favorite all-time laptop is the IBM ThinkPad 600E, and I quite like its successor T series. But I'm not sure that's even an option anymore.
All I do know is that I need to upgrade to a modern version of Windows.
Here's the thing. I'm using a ThinkPad T60 with a 14" screen, which makes my laptop just over 12" across. It uses a classic TP-type keyboard and a classic matte LCD.
I'm not interested in anything bigger. This machine is primarily for work even though I also use it for entertainment. I would also like a matte LCD and a classic type keyboard (the kind with a contoured CAPS key and ridges on the home keys--I do a LOT of typing for my profession, so I must have a keyboard meant for typing).
Are my requirements even possible to fulfill with a modern ThinkPad? Or at all?
Input is appreciated.
My favorite all-time laptop is the IBM ThinkPad 600E, and I quite like its successor T series. But I'm not sure that's even an option anymore.
All I do know is that I need to upgrade to a modern version of Windows.
T420 i5-2520M 2.50GHz 4 GB RAM 64-bit OS WIN7pro SP1
T60 1951-46U Intel Core Duo 1.83GHz 1 GB RAM 60 GB XPpro
TP 600E 2645 PII 366MHZ 160MB RAM 37.2GB WIN98SE
Computers do exactly what you tell them at amazing speeds; this can be bad if what you told them wasn't what you had in mind.
T60 1951-46U Intel Core Duo 1.83GHz 1 GB RAM 60 GB XPpro
TP 600E 2645 PII 366MHZ 160MB RAM 37.2GB WIN98SE
Computers do exactly what you tell them at amazing speeds; this can be bad if what you told them wasn't what you had in mind.
-
- ThinkPadder
- Posts: 1450
- Joined: Fri Oct 11, 2013 7:45 pm
- Location: North Ridgeville, Ohio, United States
- Contact:
Re: Time for a New Business Laptop
I was kind of in your situation not a few days ago.
The last laptop I bought new, my T61p, works fine and all but - let's face it, it's almost 8 years old now. I despise the clickpads on the *40 series and am also not fond of the 6 row keyboards found on the *30s and *40s... so I looked at the *20 series and found an attractive combination of "ThinkPad purism" keyboard/ultranav and modern computing components and amenities. I ended up with a T420 just the other day which is about the same size physically as my T61p, despite having a smaller screen diagonal.
Unfortunately you're not going to find any ThinkPads with hardware capabilities significantly better than what you've already got in your T60 with the 4:3 aspect ratio. Upgrading to anything newer and you're stuck with 16:10 or 16:9.
That said, you can examine the X series (the X220 as a notable model) for something that fits your width constraints; otherwise you're looking at the 14" widescreens like the T420 which will be about 10-15% wider than the 14" T60 (they're about the same size as the 15.4" widescreen model T60/T61s).
The last laptop I bought new, my T61p, works fine and all but - let's face it, it's almost 8 years old now. I despise the clickpads on the *40 series and am also not fond of the 6 row keyboards found on the *30s and *40s... so I looked at the *20 series and found an attractive combination of "ThinkPad purism" keyboard/ultranav and modern computing components and amenities. I ended up with a T420 just the other day which is about the same size physically as my T61p, despite having a smaller screen diagonal.
Unfortunately you're not going to find any ThinkPads with hardware capabilities significantly better than what you've already got in your T60 with the 4:3 aspect ratio. Upgrading to anything newer and you're stuck with 16:10 or 16:9.
That said, you can examine the X series (the X220 as a notable model) for something that fits your width constraints; otherwise you're looking at the 14" widescreens like the T420 which will be about 10-15% wider than the 14" T60 (they're about the same size as the 15.4" widescreen model T60/T61s).
T480 with T25 keyboard | T25 | W520 i7-2860QM·Quadro 2000m·IPS FHD | T601F T9900·NVS 140m·LED AFFS UXGA
T420 IPS FHD | X220 IPS FHD | T61p·T61·43·42p|X13 Yoga G3·220T·301·41T·24·23·22|G41|A31p·22m|i1200|TransNote
600|770Z|770|760XD|760EL|701C|755C
T420 IPS FHD | X220 IPS FHD | T61p·T61·43·42p|X13 Yoga G3·220T·301·41T·24·23·22|G41|A31p·22m|i1200|TransNote
600|770Z|770|760XD|760EL|701C|755C
Re: Time for a New Business Laptop
If you can, I would wait for the next generation thinkpad models ex. T450, as the dedicated trackpoint buttons are coming back. If you can't, I would recommend a T420 with 1600x900 resolution display. It is one of the last 'classic' thinkpads with the old keyboard layout, and is most close to your T60. Having briefly owned a T420, the screen is decent but nothing special. However, you will find that the chassis and lid is quite stiffer and stronger than your current laptop. In fact, I would say that my W530 (bigger version of T420 with new layout keyboard) and similar models have excellent, and even greater build quality than many of the T6x models I have handled. Less gaps, better fit and finish, and durability. The glass-fiber reinforced palmrest and LCD bezel plastics may feel cheaper, but feel stronger at the same time.
Current Thinkpads: W530 (functional classic keyboard mod), X301, T61, T60, T43, A31p, T23, 600X, 770
Other: mk5 Toughbook cf-19, mk1 Toughbook cf-53
Other: mk5 Toughbook cf-19, mk1 Toughbook cf-53
Re: Time for a New Business Laptop
I'd keep the T60 unless there's something specific it won't do. As others have discussed, almost everything has got worse on Thinkpads since then. You can put Win 7 on it if you wish.
Work: T60/61 FPad (Win 7, UXGA IPS); T60/61 FPad (Win 7, UXGA IPS); forever.
Toys: X1 (first gen, Win 7); T450s (Win 7).
Toys: X1 (first gen, Win 7); T450s (Win 7).
-
- Junior Member
- Posts: 331
- Joined: Sun Nov 19, 2006 10:43 am
- Location: North Central Florida, US
Re: Time for a New Business Laptop
Thanks for the advice.
On the other hand, the typing is almost as fantastic as it was on my 600E, so I'm not unhappy with it as a workstation.
For that reason, exTPfan's suggestion may be okay... I wish I could have everything I want in the same machine, though... I want a modern version of a 600E.
If I keep this machine, I need a RAM upgrade, and I want a bigger HD. Anyone know what that + Win7pro might set me back?
I am interested in something more durable; my T60 is less durable than my 600E was. There is an uncomfortable amount of flex in the palm-rest, and part of the front corner even cracked off for no apparent reason (other than what, for a 600E, would be handling well within ordinary tolerances).brchan wrote:even greater build quality than many of the T6x models I have handled. Less gaps, better fit and finish, and durability. The glass-fiber reinforced palmrest and LCD bezel plastics may feel cheaper, but feel stronger at the same time.
On the other hand, the typing is almost as fantastic as it was on my 600E, so I'm not unhappy with it as a workstation.
For that reason, exTPfan's suggestion may be okay... I wish I could have everything I want in the same machine, though... I want a modern version of a 600E.
If I keep this machine, I need a RAM upgrade, and I want a bigger HD. Anyone know what that + Win7pro might set me back?
T420 i5-2520M 2.50GHz 4 GB RAM 64-bit OS WIN7pro SP1
T60 1951-46U Intel Core Duo 1.83GHz 1 GB RAM 60 GB XPpro
TP 600E 2645 PII 366MHZ 160MB RAM 37.2GB WIN98SE
Computers do exactly what you tell them at amazing speeds; this can be bad if what you told them wasn't what you had in mind.
T60 1951-46U Intel Core Duo 1.83GHz 1 GB RAM 60 GB XPpro
TP 600E 2645 PII 366MHZ 160MB RAM 37.2GB WIN98SE
Computers do exactly what you tell them at amazing speeds; this can be bad if what you told them wasn't what you had in mind.
Re: Time for a New Business Laptop
If you're intent on using that machine for a prolonged period of time, you really need an SSD. It will breathe a whole new life into an old system.Nigellus wrote:If I keep this machine, I need a RAM upgrade, and I want a bigger HD. Anyone know what that + Win7pro might set me back?
RAM upgrade? Presuming all you need is a 2 GB stick, $15-20. W7 ? No clue.
...Knowledge is a deadly friend when no one sets the rules...(King Crimson)
Cheers,
George (your grouchy retired FlexView farmer)
One FlexView to rule them all: A31p
Abused daily: T520, X200s
PMs requesting personal tech support will be ignored.
Cheers,
George (your grouchy retired FlexView farmer)
One FlexView to rule them all: A31p
Abused daily: T520, X200s
PMs requesting personal tech support will be ignored.
-
- ThinkPadder
- Posts: 1450
- Joined: Fri Oct 11, 2013 7:45 pm
- Location: North Ridgeville, Ohio, United States
- Contact:
Re: Time for a New Business Laptop
A Win 7 Pro license will probably run close to a hundred bucks. Anymore Microsoft doesn't sell Windows 7 licenses outright (at least not for the corporations I work with); you buy a Windows 8.1 Pro license which comes with a downgrade key for Windows 7 Pro.
Your T60 should take a Merom Core 2 Duo CPU as an upgrade. I think you can run up to a T7600. As far as RAM, you can go as high as 3GB. With an SSD, that'd be quite a respectable combination.
Your T60 should take a Merom Core 2 Duo CPU as an upgrade. I think you can run up to a T7600. As far as RAM, you can go as high as 3GB. With an SSD, that'd be quite a respectable combination.
T480 with T25 keyboard | T25 | W520 i7-2860QM·Quadro 2000m·IPS FHD | T601F T9900·NVS 140m·LED AFFS UXGA
T420 IPS FHD | X220 IPS FHD | T61p·T61·43·42p|X13 Yoga G3·220T·301·41T·24·23·22|G41|A31p·22m|i1200|TransNote
600|770Z|770|760XD|760EL|701C|755C
T420 IPS FHD | X220 IPS FHD | T61p·T61·43·42p|X13 Yoga G3·220T·301·41T·24·23·22|G41|A31p·22m|i1200|TransNote
600|770Z|770|760XD|760EL|701C|755C
-
- Senior ThinkPadder
- Posts: 8545
- Joined: Tue Jun 28, 2005 5:07 am
- Location: Ann Arbor, MI
- Contact:
Re: Time for a New Business Laptop
ajkula66 wrote:If you're intent on using that machine for a prolonged period of time, you really need an SSD. It will breathe a whole new life into an old system. RAM upgrade? Presuming all you need is a 2GB stick, $15-20.
These upgrades add up to $200 if not more. My recommendation is to get something from the *20 generation (i.e. X220 or T420) and sell this T60 for $60. The OP would enjoy a substantial performance boost, and such a laptop should also outlast the T60.theterminator93 wrote:A Win 7 Pro license will probably run close to a hundred bucks.
Dell Latitude 7370 (QHD+, 2.84lb); HP Pavilion x2 12-b096ms (1920x1280, 3.14lb); Microsoft Surface 3 (1920x1280, 2.00lb);
Dell OptiPlex 5040 SFF (Core i5-6600); Acer ET322QK, T272HUL; Crossover 404K; QNIX QHD2410R; Seiki Pro SM40UNP
Dell OptiPlex 5040 SFF (Core i5-6600); Acer ET322QK, T272HUL; Crossover 404K; QNIX QHD2410R; Seiki Pro SM40UNP
Re: Time for a New Business Laptop
No argument from me on this one, since it's an excellent piece of a common-sense-advice...pianowizard wrote:These upgrades add up to $200 if not more. My recommendation is to get something from the *20 generation (i.e. X220 or T420) and sell this T60 for $60. The OP would enjoy a substantial performance boost, and such a laptop should also outlast the T60.
With that said, I know a *ton* of people who are still hanging onto their T6*/R6* units solely because of their 4:3 aspect ratio, and I can't say that I fault them for it...
I just installed an SSD into one of my clients' T61p 4:3 units a few days ago and likely cut myself out of the possibility of buying it from them for the next few years...
...Knowledge is a deadly friend when no one sets the rules...(King Crimson)
Cheers,
George (your grouchy retired FlexView farmer)
One FlexView to rule them all: A31p
Abused daily: T520, X200s
PMs requesting personal tech support will be ignored.
Cheers,
George (your grouchy retired FlexView farmer)
One FlexView to rule them all: A31p
Abused daily: T520, X200s
PMs requesting personal tech support will be ignored.
-
- Senior ThinkPadder
- Posts: 8545
- Joined: Tue Jun 28, 2005 5:07 am
- Location: Ann Arbor, MI
- Contact:
Re: Time for a New Business Laptop
I don't think the OP mentioned requiring 4:3, though both of his favorite Thinkpads have indeed been 4:3. Assuming he does prefer 4:3, another obvious advice would be upgrading to a 4:3 T61. Get one with a Vista COA sticker so that he won't need to spend any additional money to upgrade Windows. (To preemptively prevent yet another diatribe against Vista, let me reiterate something people familiar with Vista have been saying for over 4 years: with SP2 and all other updates installed, Vista is fantastic. There's no need to avoid it.) To avoid the Nvidia "time bomb", get one with Intel graphics. It's hard to find an Intel-GPU T61 with 1400x1050 but the OP's current T60 is 1024x768 anyway, so just settle for 1024x768. Microsoft will cease support for Vista in Jan 2017, but by then Windows 7 should have become much more affordable than it is now. Upgrading to 7 then would give this T61 three more years of use.ajkula66 wrote:With that said, I know a *ton* of people who are still hanging onto their T6*/R6* units solely because of their 4:3 aspect ratio, and I can't say that I fault them for it...
Dell Latitude 7370 (QHD+, 2.84lb); HP Pavilion x2 12-b096ms (1920x1280, 3.14lb); Microsoft Surface 3 (1920x1280, 2.00lb);
Dell OptiPlex 5040 SFF (Core i5-6600); Acer ET322QK, T272HUL; Crossover 404K; QNIX QHD2410R; Seiki Pro SM40UNP
Dell OptiPlex 5040 SFF (Core i5-6600); Acer ET322QK, T272HUL; Crossover 404K; QNIX QHD2410R; Seiki Pro SM40UNP
Re: Time for a New Business Laptop
Once again, no argument from me on that one. While my T61 is a 16:10 unit, I'm in love with it. Seriously.pianowizard wrote:I don't think the OP mentioned requiring 4:3, though both of his favorite Thinkpads have indeed been 4:3. Assuming he does prefer 4:3, another obvious advice would be upgrading to a 4:3 T61.
The only aspect of Vista that I find undesirable is its lack of native TRIM support. With that being said, there are ways about it.Get one with a Vista COA sticker so that he won't need to spend any additional money to upgrade Windows. (To preemptively prevent yet another diatribe against Vista, let me reiterate something people familiar with Vista have been saying for over 4 years: with SP2 and all other updates installed, Vista is fantastic. There's no need to avoid it.)
Once again, sound advice.To avoid the Nvidia "time bomb", get one with Intel graphics. It's hard to find an Intel-GPU T61 with 1400x1050 but the OP's current T60 is 1024x768 anyway, so just settle for 1024x768.
I wouldn't be so certain when it comes to the part of your statement that I've underlined, but I've been wrong before and will most definitely be wrong again...Microsoft will cease support for Vista in Jan 2017, but by then Windows 7 should have become much more affordable than it is now. Upgrading to 7 then would give this T61 three more years of use.
...Knowledge is a deadly friend when no one sets the rules...(King Crimson)
Cheers,
George (your grouchy retired FlexView farmer)
One FlexView to rule them all: A31p
Abused daily: T520, X200s
PMs requesting personal tech support will be ignored.
Cheers,
George (your grouchy retired FlexView farmer)
One FlexView to rule them all: A31p
Abused daily: T520, X200s
PMs requesting personal tech support will be ignored.
-
- Admin Emeritus
- Posts: 23809
- Joined: Mon Sep 18, 2006 5:17 am
- Location: Loch Garman, Éire
Re: Time for a New Business Laptop
Lovely day for a Guinness! (The Real Black Stuff)
Lenovo: X240, X250, T440p, T480, M900 Tiny.
PS: the old Boardroom website is still available on the Wayback Machine.
Lenovo: X240, X250, T440p, T480, M900 Tiny.
PS: the old Boardroom website is still available on the Wayback Machine.
-
- Junior Member
- Posts: 331
- Joined: Sun Nov 19, 2006 10:43 am
- Location: North Central Florida, US
Re: Time for a New Business Laptop
Thanks for the suggestions, everyone.
It looks like the decision may have been taken out of my hands. I'm being provided a laptop by a company I contract for. Assuming I understand the cryptic e-mail they sent me, I'm getting this:
It looks like the decision may have been taken out of my hands. I'm being provided a laptop by a company I contract for. Assuming I understand the cryptic e-mail they sent me, I'm getting this:
What do you guys think of this one? I'm a little disappointed because I asked specifically for a T series or X series ThinkPad, and the lack of a TrackPoint is going to drive me crazy... but on paper, this machine looks good otherwise.Lenovo Flex 2 14-inch 1080p Touchscreen Laptop(Intel Core i7-4510U Processor, 10-Point MultiTouch Full HD Display(1920 X 1080), 8GB DDR3L SDRAM, 500GB HDD +8GB Solid State Hybrid Drive, Windows 8.1, 0.8-inch thin just 4.2lbs, Bluetooth® 4.0, USB 3.0, HDMI, HD Webcam)
T420 i5-2520M 2.50GHz 4 GB RAM 64-bit OS WIN7pro SP1
T60 1951-46U Intel Core Duo 1.83GHz 1 GB RAM 60 GB XPpro
TP 600E 2645 PII 366MHZ 160MB RAM 37.2GB WIN98SE
Computers do exactly what you tell them at amazing speeds; this can be bad if what you told them wasn't what you had in mind.
T60 1951-46U Intel Core Duo 1.83GHz 1 GB RAM 60 GB XPpro
TP 600E 2645 PII 366MHZ 160MB RAM 37.2GB WIN98SE
Computers do exactly what you tell them at amazing speeds; this can be bad if what you told them wasn't what you had in mind.
-
- ThinkPadder
- Posts: 1450
- Joined: Fri Oct 11, 2013 7:45 pm
- Location: North Ridgeville, Ohio, United States
- Contact:
Re: Time for a New Business Laptop
Specs on paper - to me - only enhance or detract from a particular class of machines.
I just set up a bunch of Toshiba Tecra W50 laptops that someone bought because they looked good on paper. Yeah, they're speedy... but they just feel like junk. Super flimsy LCD lid, cheesy feeling plastic all over. I give them 3 years, maybe 4.
I just set up a bunch of Toshiba Tecra W50 laptops that someone bought because they looked good on paper. Yeah, they're speedy... but they just feel like junk. Super flimsy LCD lid, cheesy feeling plastic all over. I give them 3 years, maybe 4.
T480 with T25 keyboard | T25 | W520 i7-2860QM·Quadro 2000m·IPS FHD | T601F T9900·NVS 140m·LED AFFS UXGA
T420 IPS FHD | X220 IPS FHD | T61p·T61·43·42p|X13 Yoga G3·220T·301·41T·24·23·22|G41|A31p·22m|i1200|TransNote
600|770Z|770|760XD|760EL|701C|755C
T420 IPS FHD | X220 IPS FHD | T61p·T61·43·42p|X13 Yoga G3·220T·301·41T·24·23·22|G41|A31p·22m|i1200|TransNote
600|770Z|770|760XD|760EL|701C|755C
-
- Junior Member
- Posts: 331
- Joined: Sun Nov 19, 2006 10:43 am
- Location: North Central Florida, US
Re: Time for a New Business Laptop
Exactly, which is why I'm looking for someone with experience with this particular machine and ThinkPads.theterminator93 wrote:Specs on paper - to me - only enhance or detract from a particular class of machines.
(I wonder if I can trade it if it bothers me too much...)
T420 i5-2520M 2.50GHz 4 GB RAM 64-bit OS WIN7pro SP1
T60 1951-46U Intel Core Duo 1.83GHz 1 GB RAM 60 GB XPpro
TP 600E 2645 PII 366MHZ 160MB RAM 37.2GB WIN98SE
Computers do exactly what you tell them at amazing speeds; this can be bad if what you told them wasn't what you had in mind.
T60 1951-46U Intel Core Duo 1.83GHz 1 GB RAM 60 GB XPpro
TP 600E 2645 PII 366MHZ 160MB RAM 37.2GB WIN98SE
Computers do exactly what you tell them at amazing speeds; this can be bad if what you told them wasn't what you had in mind.
Re: Time for a New Business Laptop
I will exchange my T500 with intel graphics for your 600E if interested
5140,L40SX(3),PS/NOTE 425(2),PS/2 NOTE,700T,730T,700,700C(3),720C,701C(3),701CS(3),360P,360PE,750P,380,385,PC110,TRANSNOTE, Z50,240,240X,600,600E,600X(2),A31P,750C,755C,770,X40,X60,X61S,X61T,R50,R51E,R61I,
T20,T21,T30,T42(2),T43,T60,T61(4),T500(2),W520,HP95LX,100LX,200LX,300,PSION II,3,NEWTON130
T20,T21,T30,T42(2),T43,T60,T61(4),T500(2),W520,HP95LX,100LX,200LX,300,PSION II,3,NEWTON130
Re: Time for a New Business Laptop
Your personal opinion may vary based on how you use it, the Flex does not have track point, and does not have dedicated touchpad buttons either, and have a different keyboard layout, however, I think it have a full touch screen, and probably a better 'feel' to the keyboard.
IMO, you should try the Lenovo Flex 2 14-inch for a bit, and if you do not like it, you might consider getting a used T420 or T420s, a good one could be found for around $300.
IMO, you should try the Lenovo Flex 2 14-inch for a bit, and if you do not like it, you might consider getting a used T420 or T420s, a good one could be found for around $300.
===
Re: Time for a New Business Laptop
No one mentioned the T410.
Nearly as fast as the the T420, and has a 16:10 matte LCD. This would be closer in screen size to his current T60 instead of getting a T420.
Just a thought. I love my T410 and don't plan on "upgrading" from it anytime soon.
Nearly as fast as the the T420, and has a 16:10 matte LCD. This would be closer in screen size to his current T60 instead of getting a T420.
Just a thought. I love my T410 and don't plan on "upgrading" from it anytime soon.
New:
Thinkpad T470 16GB RAM 250GB SSD LinuxMint
Old:
ThinkPad Tablet 16GB 1838-22U
IBM Thinkpad X61T, T61, T43, X41T, T60, T41P, T42, T410, X301, T430s, T450, T460
Thinkpad T470 16GB RAM 250GB SSD LinuxMint
Old:
ThinkPad Tablet 16GB 1838-22U
IBM Thinkpad X61T, T61, T43, X41T, T60, T41P, T42, T410, X301, T430s, T450, T460
-
- Junior Member
- Posts: 331
- Joined: Sun Nov 19, 2006 10:43 am
- Location: North Central Florida, US
Re: Time for a New Business Laptop
Well, this is interesting. The lack of TrackPoint isn't as debilitating as I thought it would be due to the touchscreen.
T420 i5-2520M 2.50GHz 4 GB RAM 64-bit OS WIN7pro SP1
T60 1951-46U Intel Core Duo 1.83GHz 1 GB RAM 60 GB XPpro
TP 600E 2645 PII 366MHZ 160MB RAM 37.2GB WIN98SE
Computers do exactly what you tell them at amazing speeds; this can be bad if what you told them wasn't what you had in mind.
T60 1951-46U Intel Core Duo 1.83GHz 1 GB RAM 60 GB XPpro
TP 600E 2645 PII 366MHZ 160MB RAM 37.2GB WIN98SE
Computers do exactly what you tell them at amazing speeds; this can be bad if what you told them wasn't what you had in mind.
-
- Junior Member
- Posts: 331
- Joined: Sun Nov 19, 2006 10:43 am
- Location: North Central Florida, US
Re: Time for a New Business Laptop
Well, this Flex 2 does what I need it to do. However, so far, I feel like I'm fighting with it, which is a feeling I've never gotten with a ThinkPad (which, to be fair, probably stems from the fact that this is NOT a ThinkPad).hhhd1 wrote: IMO, you should try the Lenovo Flex 2 14-inch for a bit, and if you do not like it, you might consider getting a used T420 or T420s, a good one could be found for around $300.
I like the performance. I like the fact that I can download anything I need, and it actually works (keep in mind I was running Windows XP).
I do not like the touchpad. Are there any touchpad experts who can tell me how to use a touchpad properly? I mean, since touchpads are so popular, there MUST be a good way to avoid the problems I'm running into, right?
Touchpad problems include:
1.) The obvious problem is it's a real pain to have to remove my fingers from the keyboard to do anything with the cursor that I can't accomplish with the tab button.
2.) Even more annoying, my computer will randomly scroll to a different open program window if I accidentally brush the thing while typing.
3.) When I double click (or even single-click) there seems to be a nearly 100% chance that I'm going to scroll to a different open program window.
All of the above seriously interfere with my productivity.
The way I dealt with problem #2 on my T60 was I simply uninstalled the drivers for my touchpad. But my T60 had a trackpoint.
I'm thinking maybe I can do this on my Flex and rely solely on the touchscreen. But even then I still have to remove my hands from the keyboard, which still cuts into my productivity.
Last edited by Nigellus on Tue Jul 14, 2015 8:45 am, edited 1 time in total.
T420 i5-2520M 2.50GHz 4 GB RAM 64-bit OS WIN7pro SP1
T60 1951-46U Intel Core Duo 1.83GHz 1 GB RAM 60 GB XPpro
TP 600E 2645 PII 366MHZ 160MB RAM 37.2GB WIN98SE
Computers do exactly what you tell them at amazing speeds; this can be bad if what you told them wasn't what you had in mind.
T60 1951-46U Intel Core Duo 1.83GHz 1 GB RAM 60 GB XPpro
TP 600E 2645 PII 366MHZ 160MB RAM 37.2GB WIN98SE
Computers do exactly what you tell them at amazing speeds; this can be bad if what you told them wasn't what you had in mind.
-
- Senior Member
- Posts: 817
- Joined: Thu Sep 29, 2005 6:18 am
- Location: Seattle, WA
Re: Time for a New Business Laptop
I have never found a brand that can equal the touchpoint and touchpads consistency and ease of use.
T43p,T61,X200,X200s,x201,T500,W500,T510,T410,T410s,T420s,T430,T430s
-
- Senior ThinkPadder
- Posts: 8545
- Joined: Tue Jun 28, 2005 5:07 am
- Location: Ann Arbor, MI
- Contact:
Re: Time for a New Business Laptop
Actually, if this were a Thinkpad, the touchpad would probably be even worse. Recent Thinkpads' clickpads are the worst touchpads ever invented.Nigellus wrote:I feel like I'm fighting with it, which is a feeling I've never gotten with a ThinPad (which, to be fair, probably stems from the fact that this is NOT a ThinkPad)...I do not like the touchpad.
I am a touchpad expert, not clickpad expert. I currently have two laptops with clickpads: the Sony Pro13 and the HP Pavilion X2. Both are far better than Thinkpads' clickpads, but still harder to use than traditional touchpads with buttons.Nigellus wrote:Are there any touchpad experts who can tell me how to use a touchpad properly?
Touchpads WITH BUTTONS are popular (even though most people don't use them right). I don't know how popular *clickpads* are. They are certainly extremely unpopular among Thinkpad users, including those who like or at least don't mind traditional touchpads.Nigellus wrote:I mean, since touchpads are so popular, there MUST be a good way to avoid the problems I'm running into, right?
This isn't a problem when I am using a traditional touchpad, which I almost always configure to the maximum pointer speed. I lose a few milliseconds when I am removing my right hand from the keyboard, but because the touchpad can move the pointer faster and more accurately (i.e. no overshooting) than the trackpoint, at the end the touchpad usually (though not always) wins. I also appreciate having an excuse to move one of my hands around, because it's uncomfortable to rest my palms on the warm palm rest all the time.Nigellus wrote:1.) The obvious problem is it's a real pain to have to remove my fingers from the keyboard to do anything with the cursor that I can't accomplish with the tab button.
On my Sony's and HP's clickpads, I don't have these problems 100% of the time, but often enough to be slightly annoyed. I recommend you to look at the driver's advanced settings to see if there's something you can adjust.Nigellus wrote:2.) Even more annoying, my computer will randomly scroll to a different open program window if I accidentally brush the thing while typing.
3.) When I double click (or even single-click) there seems to be a nearly 100% chance that I'm going to scroll to a different open program window.
On this Sony and HP, my biggest problem is that I often have to try two or three times to successfully right-click on something. The only way to get right-clicking to work 100% of the time is if I actually look at the clickpad and press very close to the bottom right corner. On touchpads with buttons, right clicks always work.
It seems that more and more keyboard designers fail to understand the importance of touch. Key tops need to be properly curved. The function key row needs to consist of actual keys, and these keys need to have gaps between groups of four. Both the trackpoint and touchpad need to have actual buttons so that we can feel where they are without looking. And it's important to never shuffle keys around whimsically.
Dell Latitude 7370 (QHD+, 2.84lb); HP Pavilion x2 12-b096ms (1920x1280, 3.14lb); Microsoft Surface 3 (1920x1280, 2.00lb);
Dell OptiPlex 5040 SFF (Core i5-6600); Acer ET322QK, T272HUL; Crossover 404K; QNIX QHD2410R; Seiki Pro SM40UNP
Dell OptiPlex 5040 SFF (Core i5-6600); Acer ET322QK, T272HUL; Crossover 404K; QNIX QHD2410R; Seiki Pro SM40UNP
-
- Junior Member
- Posts: 331
- Joined: Sun Nov 19, 2006 10:43 am
- Location: North Central Florida, US
Re: Time for a New Business Laptop
Agreed. While my typing isn't as bad as I'd feared, there is a noticeable degradation in quality.pianowizard wrote: It seems that more and more keyboard designers fail to understand the importance of touch. Key tops need to be properly curved. The function key row needs to consist of actual keys, and these keys need to have gaps between groups of four. Both the trackpoint and touchpad need to have actual buttons so that we can feel where they are without looking. And it's important to never shuffle keys around whimsically.
I want a modern 600E, please. Lenovo. If you're reading this. That's what I want.
And just so we're clear, a modern 600E would be exactly the same with the addition of a ThinkLight, a more advanced LCD, and, of course, modern innards. There is absolutely no reason I can think of to mess with the overall design unless you want to try to shave several eighths of an inch off the thickness.
I would be willing to pay more for such a machine than I would pay for a comparable machine in another form factor.
T420 i5-2520M 2.50GHz 4 GB RAM 64-bit OS WIN7pro SP1
T60 1951-46U Intel Core Duo 1.83GHz 1 GB RAM 60 GB XPpro
TP 600E 2645 PII 366MHZ 160MB RAM 37.2GB WIN98SE
Computers do exactly what you tell them at amazing speeds; this can be bad if what you told them wasn't what you had in mind.
T60 1951-46U Intel Core Duo 1.83GHz 1 GB RAM 60 GB XPpro
TP 600E 2645 PII 366MHZ 160MB RAM 37.2GB WIN98SE
Computers do exactly what you tell them at amazing speeds; this can be bad if what you told them wasn't what you had in mind.
-
- Junior Member
- Posts: 331
- Joined: Sun Nov 19, 2006 10:43 am
- Location: North Central Florida, US
Re: Time for a New Business Laptop
Thanks for the insight. This touchpad setup is indeed a single plate (no individual buttons).pianowizard wrote: I am a touchpad expert, not clickpad expert. I currently have two laptops with clickpads: the Sony Pro13 and the HP Pavilion X2. Both are far better than Thinkpads' clickpads, but still harder to use than traditional touchpads with buttons.
There are markings on the bottom of the pad to designate "buttons" but it's just an illusion. You can press anywhere on the bottom right or left quadrants to right or left click.
Also, you can move the cursor anywhere on the pad, even by swiping the designated "buttons."
I think this is probably a huge part of the problem I'm experiencing.
T420 i5-2520M 2.50GHz 4 GB RAM 64-bit OS WIN7pro SP1
T60 1951-46U Intel Core Duo 1.83GHz 1 GB RAM 60 GB XPpro
TP 600E 2645 PII 366MHZ 160MB RAM 37.2GB WIN98SE
Computers do exactly what you tell them at amazing speeds; this can be bad if what you told them wasn't what you had in mind.
T60 1951-46U Intel Core Duo 1.83GHz 1 GB RAM 60 GB XPpro
TP 600E 2645 PII 366MHZ 160MB RAM 37.2GB WIN98SE
Computers do exactly what you tell them at amazing speeds; this can be bad if what you told them wasn't what you had in mind.
-
- Junior Member
- Posts: 331
- Joined: Sun Nov 19, 2006 10:43 am
- Location: North Central Florida, US
Re: Time for a New Business Laptop
By the way, if you're actually serious, you should PM me. That machine might be better than my desktop that I'm replacing and, since it will work with my T60's docking station, would make a suitable replacement.Khipata wrote:I will exchange my T500 with intel graphics for your 600E if interested
You might have to talk me into it, though. I love my 600E. That computer and I have been though a lot together. Ten years of near daily use is a long time.
T420 i5-2520M 2.50GHz 4 GB RAM 64-bit OS WIN7pro SP1
T60 1951-46U Intel Core Duo 1.83GHz 1 GB RAM 60 GB XPpro
TP 600E 2645 PII 366MHZ 160MB RAM 37.2GB WIN98SE
Computers do exactly what you tell them at amazing speeds; this can be bad if what you told them wasn't what you had in mind.
T60 1951-46U Intel Core Duo 1.83GHz 1 GB RAM 60 GB XPpro
TP 600E 2645 PII 366MHZ 160MB RAM 37.2GB WIN98SE
Computers do exactly what you tell them at amazing speeds; this can be bad if what you told them wasn't what you had in mind.
-
- Junior Member
- Posts: 331
- Joined: Sun Nov 19, 2006 10:43 am
- Location: North Central Florida, US
Re: Time for a New Business Laptop
Well, I hate this chiclet keyboard. Granted, the touchpad makes it more unlikeable than it otherwise might be. Well, that and the bizarre key layout.
I'm the last one to look a gift horse in the mouth. But, when it has to be done, it has to be done.
I'm liking the pricepoints on the T420s lately. I might buy one.
BUT, I like all the modern conveniences of this Flex2. And it was free.
Maybe I'll buy an ultranav usb keyboard. Anyone have one for sale?
That'll take the sting out of this mess of a keyboard around the office at least.
The trouble is I DO do a lot of typing when I'm on location as well... But because this Flex2 is so thin, there's room for a keyboard in my briefcase.
I'm the last one to look a gift horse in the mouth. But, when it has to be done, it has to be done.
I'm liking the pricepoints on the T420s lately. I might buy one.
BUT, I like all the modern conveniences of this Flex2. And it was free.
Maybe I'll buy an ultranav usb keyboard. Anyone have one for sale?
That'll take the sting out of this mess of a keyboard around the office at least.
The trouble is I DO do a lot of typing when I'm on location as well... But because this Flex2 is so thin, there's room for a keyboard in my briefcase.
T420 i5-2520M 2.50GHz 4 GB RAM 64-bit OS WIN7pro SP1
T60 1951-46U Intel Core Duo 1.83GHz 1 GB RAM 60 GB XPpro
TP 600E 2645 PII 366MHZ 160MB RAM 37.2GB WIN98SE
Computers do exactly what you tell them at amazing speeds; this can be bad if what you told them wasn't what you had in mind.
T60 1951-46U Intel Core Duo 1.83GHz 1 GB RAM 60 GB XPpro
TP 600E 2645 PII 366MHZ 160MB RAM 37.2GB WIN98SE
Computers do exactly what you tell them at amazing speeds; this can be bad if what you told them wasn't what you had in mind.
-
- Junior Member
- Posts: 331
- Joined: Sun Nov 19, 2006 10:43 am
- Location: North Central Florida, US
Re: Time for a New Business Laptop
Is there room for a RAM upgrade in the 410?Temetka wrote:No one mentioned the T410.
Nearly as fast as the the T420, and has a 16:10 matte LCD. This would be closer in screen size to his current T60 instead of getting a T420.
Just a thought. I love my T410 and don't plan on "upgrading" from it anytime soon.
T420 i5-2520M 2.50GHz 4 GB RAM 64-bit OS WIN7pro SP1
T60 1951-46U Intel Core Duo 1.83GHz 1 GB RAM 60 GB XPpro
TP 600E 2645 PII 366MHZ 160MB RAM 37.2GB WIN98SE
Computers do exactly what you tell them at amazing speeds; this can be bad if what you told them wasn't what you had in mind.
T60 1951-46U Intel Core Duo 1.83GHz 1 GB RAM 60 GB XPpro
TP 600E 2645 PII 366MHZ 160MB RAM 37.2GB WIN98SE
Computers do exactly what you tell them at amazing speeds; this can be bad if what you told them wasn't what you had in mind.
Re: Time for a New Business Laptop
T410/s will take a maximum of 8GB (2x4GB) RAM.Nigellus wrote:
Is there room for a RAM upgrade in the 410?
...Knowledge is a deadly friend when no one sets the rules...(King Crimson)
Cheers,
George (your grouchy retired FlexView farmer)
One FlexView to rule them all: A31p
Abused daily: T520, X200s
PMs requesting personal tech support will be ignored.
Cheers,
George (your grouchy retired FlexView farmer)
One FlexView to rule them all: A31p
Abused daily: T520, X200s
PMs requesting personal tech support will be ignored.
-
- Junior Member
- Posts: 331
- Joined: Sun Nov 19, 2006 10:43 am
- Location: North Central Florida, US
Re: Time for a New Business Laptop
Well, I was just outbid on a T410.
In other news, I was at a meeting today and I happened to look at a colleague's laptop. Her's looked remarkably like my Lenovo Flex 2.
But it was a Macbook of some kind. So it wasn't black. But it was otherwise remarkably similar to the untrained eye.
I'll say it again, Lenovo, if I want a Mac, I'll buy a Mac.
This Flex is really a hassle to type on. I need to get back into a ThinkPad. Or buy an ultranav...
In other news, I was at a meeting today and I happened to look at a colleague's laptop. Her's looked remarkably like my Lenovo Flex 2.
But it was a Macbook of some kind. So it wasn't black. But it was otherwise remarkably similar to the untrained eye.
I'll say it again, Lenovo, if I want a Mac, I'll buy a Mac.
This Flex is really a hassle to type on. I need to get back into a ThinkPad. Or buy an ultranav...
T420 i5-2520M 2.50GHz 4 GB RAM 64-bit OS WIN7pro SP1
T60 1951-46U Intel Core Duo 1.83GHz 1 GB RAM 60 GB XPpro
TP 600E 2645 PII 366MHZ 160MB RAM 37.2GB WIN98SE
Computers do exactly what you tell them at amazing speeds; this can be bad if what you told them wasn't what you had in mind.
T60 1951-46U Intel Core Duo 1.83GHz 1 GB RAM 60 GB XPpro
TP 600E 2645 PII 366MHZ 160MB RAM 37.2GB WIN98SE
Computers do exactly what you tell them at amazing speeds; this can be bad if what you told them wasn't what you had in mind.
Re: Time for a New Business Laptop
Thanks but I already bought 600, 600E and 2 of additional 600X-s All working with dead batteries. Sorry, I would REALLY exchange but too late... I am in love with old thinkpads and making a collection as much as I can. Whatever you see in my signature is just a fraction of what I have
5140,L40SX(3),PS/NOTE 425(2),PS/2 NOTE,700T,730T,700,700C(3),720C,701C(3),701CS(3),360P,360PE,750P,380,385,PC110,TRANSNOTE, Z50,240,240X,600,600E,600X(2),A31P,750C,755C,770,X40,X60,X61S,X61T,R50,R51E,R61I,
T20,T21,T30,T42(2),T43,T60,T61(4),T500(2),W520,HP95LX,100LX,200LX,300,PSION II,3,NEWTON130
T20,T21,T30,T42(2),T43,T60,T61(4),T500(2),W520,HP95LX,100LX,200LX,300,PSION II,3,NEWTON130
-
- Similar Topics
- Replies
- Views
- Last post
-
-
Wrong Time in Windows 10/11 (-1h)
by canonmasta » Fri Dec 15, 2023 6:22 pm » in ThinkPad X230-X280 / X390 Series - 1 Replies
- 2461 Views
-
Last post by RealBlackStuff
Sat Dec 16, 2023 1:29 am
-
-
-
I'm Back and This Time It's Personal
by ZaZ » Sun Dec 24, 2023 6:58 pm » in ThinkPad L430/L530 and later Series - 11 Replies
- 5003 Views
-
Last post by RealBlackStuff
Wed Jan 17, 2024 1:48 pm
-
-
-
How new my laptop really needs to be? A guide to modern computing
by mikemex » Wed Jan 31, 2024 2:57 pm » in Off-Topic Stuff - 9 Replies
- 2453 Views
-
Last post by mikemex
Sun Feb 11, 2024 3:14 pm
-
-
- 1 Replies
- 7055 Views
-
Last post by robinadams
Fri Dec 15, 2023 12:05 pm
Who is online
Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 17 guests