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T41 Fan Noise ... I Think

T40/T41/T42/T43 Series
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Callahan
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T41 Fan Noise ... I Think

#1 Post by Callahan » Fri Nov 25, 2016 9:14 am

Well, I finally joined the forum today ... have visited over the years for an answer to this or that concerning my ThinkPads. This forum usually pops up when I do a Google search, which I was doing a few hours ago.

I have a ThinkPad T41 (1.6 Banias), a ThinkPad T42 (1.5 Banias) and a T42 (1.6 Dothan) with a 15.1 screen. I bought all three ThinkPads in 2010 as used ... the T41 and T42 (1.5) were first but I was disappointed that the T41 did not even come with a CD burner, just a CD/DVD player ... I found out later from searching around that this was common for the T41 ... from what I read about others also mentioning this fact. About six months later I decided I wanted another T42 ... found a seller/Company in the state of Washington ... after mentioning exactly what I wanted, to make the sale, he said he had the perfect one for me ... it was like new and that I would be very happy. He mentioned it was T42 (1.6) but he did not mention it had the larger screen ... later I found out it also came with the newer Dothan Pentium M processor. It was as he said ... very new, it really looked like it had never been used ... the keyboard was new and not wore down or shiny from use, all the stickers were still on the lower left palm rest. It truly looked like a gem of a buy and still is, although it's hardly ever used. I mostly use the older T41 for everyday computing. One thing also, I added a DVD burner to all three ThinkPads.

One more thing and then I will get to my fan problem question ... in case anyone would wonder, why buy three ThinkPads in 2010 ... well at that time, I was still using Windows 98SE and through another forum, I was able to "modernize" or have Windows 98SE really running OK as it got older ... finally in 2012 I finally decided to move on from Win98SE and installed Windows XP on the T41. My original plan was to have three ThinkPads ... each installed with Windows 98SE, Windows 2000 and Windows XP ... but I went to eBay and bought three copies of Windows XP and installed those on all three ThinkPads. I really want to use my ThinkPad T42 (1.6) but it sits wrapped up in a towel in a laptop case looking very new. I keep all three ThinkPads updated so it gets a little "playtime" ... I added new memory to it last year to make it a 2 GB machine. The others have 1.5 total memory. The T41 was the "worst" of the bunch ... it did show use with the keyboard being worn down to shiny, so I replaced that keyboard with a new one. No bad pixels on any of them. The rubberized top or whatever it is was also showing more wear or use with the T41.

Since I just joined today ... I thought I would mention my ThinkPad history. Really like these machines and hope to keep them running for many years with Windows XP. The T41 will always be used more than the T42's I guess ... they were both like new compared to the T41 so I just give it the extra daily use.

So this happened just about five hours ago with my TP T41 ... a grinding or loud noise but when I put my ear to the keyboard ... it sounds like it's everywhere in the case. My temp gauge is not showing to much heat buildup ... when it does go up and the fan would normally kick on to a higher speed, that when the loud noise also starts ... when the temp drops lower, the noise goes away as the fan is no longer running or running very low.

I ordered a reconditioned fan assembly from an eBay seller and two brand new fan assemblies only. It didn't amount to much cost and both orders have free shipping. They are mentioned to work with the T40, T41, T42. However, when I did a Google search ... I came across articles mentioning a short and long fan assembly. Tried searching to find out what I might actually have inside ... I have had all three ThinkPads apart to install memory and new CMOS batteries since 2010. The fan assembly I ordered looks like what is already in my ThinkPads.

I don't know for sure if that would be the short or long fan assembly. How can I tell for sure which is which? Also, do you agree with me that it probably is the fan or are there other possibilities?

I don't have time now to take the T41 apart ... maybe in two weeks or less.

Thanks... finally glad to join the forum.

Callahan

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Re: T41 Fan Noise ... I Think

#2 Post by RealBlackStuff » Fri Nov 25, 2016 9:55 am

Welcome to the forum.
On each of your TPs is a sticker on the bottom, that says something like TYPE 2373-EU9 followed by S/N and the date.
To help you further, we need to know the 7-char. TYPE from each of those machines. S/N and date are not required.
T4x machines with different graphics (Intel or ATI) have different fans.
AFAIK the Intel gfx and the standard ATI models all have a short fan.
The T41p/T42p all have a long fan (a.k.a. M10).
It's rather a mix-up that's why we want those TYPEs, better known as MTM (see MTM-link at top of page).

As for the noise, you could have dirt in the fan, old-age wear, or a gremlin in it.
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Re: T41 Fan Noise ... I Think

#3 Post by kfzhu1229 » Fri Nov 25, 2016 11:26 am

RealBlackStuff wrote:Welcome to the forum.
On each of your TPs is a sticker on the bottom, that says something like TYPE 2373-EU9 followed by S/N and the date.
To help you further, we need to know the 7-char. TYPE from each of those machines. S/N and date are not required.
T4x machines with different graphics (Intel or ATI) have different fans.
AFAIK the Intel gfx and the standard ATI models all have a short fan.
The T41p/T42p all have a long fan (a.k.a. M10).
It's rather a mix-up that's why we want those TYPEs, better known as MTM (see MTM-link at top of page).

As for the noise, you could have dirt in the fan, old-age wear, or a gremlin in it.
Don't forget Radeon 9600 T42 and X300 T43 also use long fan but seems like a different one for T43/p to deal with the higher TDP. I can tell the rotation speed for T43 fans are faster and also noisier with a higher pitch
Dell Lat CP MMX-233 64mb 40gb W2k
600 PII-266 416mb 40gb WXP
T23 PIII 1.13ghz 1gb W7
Precision M4300 X9000 8gb 160gb WUXGA Ultrasharp fp W10
T530i 15.6" i7 16gb fp W10
UXGA:
A30p PIII 1.2 1gb W7 (IDTech)
T43p 2.26 2gb fp W10 (Sharp)
Lat C840 P4-2.5 2gb 60gb W7 (Ultrasharp)

Callahan
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Re: T41 Fan Noise ... I Think

#4 Post by Callahan » Fri Nov 25, 2016 3:28 pm

RBS ... OK, thanks for the reply. Here's the information from all three ThinkPads. As I mentioned in my first post, the T41 (1.6) appeared to be used more than the T42s. I bought the T41 and the T42 (1.5) from Buy.com and the other T42 (1.6) came from a seller/company in WA. They were all advertised as refurbished.

So on the bottom of the T41 (1.6) there is no little long white sticker with the information you asked for. On the bottom of the T41 is only "Type 2373" ... however, I have System Information for Windows installed and it supplies this information:

IBM 23738RU / ThinkPad T42 / SN: 99PZVTC

ATI Mobility Radeon 7500 AGP

Why it is saying T42 when it's supposed to be a T41 ... I don't know unless when it was being refurbished something was replaced inside.

------------------------------------------

OK, now the T42 (1.5) ... it does have the long white sticker with this information: 2374-E88 and with the System Info Tool also: ATI Mobility Radeon 7500 AGP.

------------------------------------------

The T42 (1.6) also has no long white sticker ... it looks like it was cut off or never applied. There are no scratch marks from a razor blade or any tool marks from anything. How the white sticker was removed so carefully ... I don't know.

However, the System Information Tool says the following: 2373VFZ and also ATI Mobility Radeon 7500 AGP.

So I guess from reading your post, I may have a "short fan". I'm not sure what I am getting from eBay. This is what I ordered ... the first one shown for $6.88 but I paid $5.88. I got the last one at $5.88. As I remember it looks like what is inside my computer, when I last had it apart.

http://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_from=R4 ... acat=58058

Also, if you count 4 items down I ordered two of these new fans ... thought maybe I could just replace the fan part only. Not out much money if I can't use them.

New CPU Cooling Fan for IBM Lenovo Thinkpad T40 T41 T42 T43 T43P + Thermal Paste
$4.54

Also to add ... the T41 had more dust inside than the two T42s and I cleaned them all with a new small paint brush I keep handy for computer work ... used a small portable sweeper with the brush and q-tips to get everything as clean as possible ... did hit the fan good but I will check it out again.

If you need more information, let me know ... thanks again.

Callahan

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Re: T41 Fan Noise ... I Think

#5 Post by RealBlackStuff » Fri Nov 25, 2016 4:10 pm

If stickers are missing, go into BIOS (press F1 immediately at bootup).
On the first page you will see System-Unit Serial number, we need the first 7 characters.
2373-8RU is a 14.1" T41.
Take this from someone who knows: you can't believe everything that Micro$haft says, it's NOT a T42.
2374-E88 is a 14.1" T42
2373-VFZ is a 14.1" T42
All three have the same GPU: 32MB ATI Radeon 7500
This is what a short fan looks like, and what you have in all 3 machines: http://www.ebay.com/itm/162165253940

Callahan
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Re: T41 Fan Noise ... I Think

#6 Post by Callahan » Fri Nov 25, 2016 5:15 pm

Here are the numbers from the BIOS ...

T41 1.6 ... 23738RU

T42 1.5 ... 2374E88

T42 1.6 ... 2373VFZ

You said that the T42 1.6 should have a 14.1 screen size ... it is larger about an inch long and wide from the other T42 and T41.

The picture of a short fan looks like what I remember in my computers but what I ordered does look larger and different. I will probably end up throwing it into a box with other surplus electronics stuff. I will wait till I hear for sure what fan is inside and will order the right one.

Callahan

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Re: T41 Fan Noise ... I Think

#7 Post by RealBlackStuff » Fri Nov 25, 2016 5:28 pm

The T40/T41/T42/T42/R50/R51/R52 motherboards will all fit in a 14.1" and a 15" laptop.
So the one with the missing sticker was probably a 15" chassis with the mobo from a 14.1"
I wouldn't worry about that.
Go to the HMM link at the top of this page and download the HMM manuals for your machines.
They will tell you a lot.
Also, there are hundreds of T4x posts on this forum, plenty to scrounge info from.
Use this Google search: https://www.google.com/advanced_search? ... as_qdr=all

kfzhu1229
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Re: T41 Fan Noise ... I Think

#8 Post by kfzhu1229 » Fri Nov 25, 2016 7:23 pm

Callahan wrote: The picture of a short fan looks like what I remember in my computers but what I ordered does look larger and different. I will probably end up throwing it into a box with other surplus electronics stuff. I will wait till I hear for sure what fan is inside and will order the right one.

Callahan
I don't think you have to throw it out. AFAIK long fans will still work fine in short fan motherboards (maybe Intel GMA T43 is the only exception) just they usually spin faster and gets noisier.
Dell Lat CP MMX-233 64mb 40gb W2k
600 PII-266 416mb 40gb WXP
T23 PIII 1.13ghz 1gb W7
Precision M4300 X9000 8gb 160gb WUXGA Ultrasharp fp W10
T530i 15.6" i7 16gb fp W10
UXGA:
A30p PIII 1.2 1gb W7 (IDTech)
T43p 2.26 2gb fp W10 (Sharp)
Lat C840 P4-2.5 2gb 60gb W7 (Ultrasharp)

Callahan
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Re: T41 Fan Noise ... I Think

#9 Post by Callahan » Sat Nov 26, 2016 7:09 am

Thanks kfzhu1229 for the tip ... I was going to probably just store it unless I run into somebody locally that could use it. I really don't know any other people using older ThinkPads. I will probably just order a small fan setup, they don't seem to be too expensive and they come with free shipping.

I will look into what you said and see if I can find more information about it. I need to get the computer apart and check everything out. Funny how I searched and read everything I could find on my ThinkPad models over the last five years ... also downloaded and saved videos from YouTube. I have a CD or two filled with information and downloads but I never heard anything about short and long fans till yesterday.

Callahan

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Re: T41 Fan Noise ... I Think

#10 Post by Callahan » Sun Nov 27, 2016 11:02 am

Well, I had an interesting development this morning. Went to start up my T41 that I posted about earlier ... it wouldn't completely start. It actually starts for about two seconds and then there are two short beeps and "Fan Error" appears in the upper left corner ... then it shuts down.

So I guess that confirms a "fan problem" for sure. I have been searching on Google for some information. It's funny, since I first joined the forum several days ago and posted about the fan problem, I have been using the T41 fairly steady. It was making the loud noises ... on and off ... mostly on if the temp started going up a little to the next level for a higher fan speed.

I was watching the temp reading but it wasn't getting really hot or in the "red zone" at any time. Was prepared to shut everything down real fast, if that had happened.

I guess the only question I am asking ... does this sound like a complete breakdown of the fan system? Should I be looking for anything else? Could a connection possibility have come loose, could the thermal paste have dried out? ... any ideas or suggestions of anything else going on inside?

I ordered a "small fan setup" from eBay and with the first fan setup order which may be a "long fan setup" ... I should be good to go when they both arrive next week.

I will have time in a week or two to take the T41 apart and check the fan setup inside for dust, maybe try a drop of oil somewhere or look for a loose connection.

Sure glad to have one of those T42s for a backup.

Callahan

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Re: T41 Fan Noise ... I Think

#11 Post by RealBlackStuff » Sun Nov 27, 2016 11:05 am

I'd stop using that machine until your new fan arrives.
Or take the fan from the T42 and put it in your T41, using fresh thermal paste.

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Re: T41 Fan Noise ... I Think

#12 Post by Callahan » Sun Nov 27, 2016 5:46 pm

Yes, I can wait till the fan arrives. I do have a question about thermal paste. The one fan is shipping with thermal paste, the other didn't mention any thermal paste being included. Not knowing for sure what brand of thermal paste will be sent. Do you recommend that I order a top brand thermal paste from eBay to use instead?

I have never worked with thermal paste before. I see that Arctic Silver seems to be the main brand being sold at eBay. If I get extra tubes or a supply ... does that stuff dry out or get hard in those tubes or syringes over time?

http://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_from=R4 ... e&_sacat=0

Callahan

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Re: T41 Fan Noise ... I Think

#13 Post by RealBlackStuff » Sun Nov 27, 2016 9:44 pm


Callahan
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Re: T41 Fan Noise ... I Think

#14 Post by Callahan » Sat Dec 10, 2016 6:11 am

Well yesterday afternoon (Fri) I took the T41 apart and replaced the fan with the one I purchased on eBay. I also replaced the 1.6 Banias processor with the 1.7 Banias processor that I got for $4.99.

All went well ... very smooth operation. With the help I got here and downloading videos from YouTube, made all the difference. Watching those videos beforehand ... replacing a fan setup and using thermal paste correctly ... big help.

I used NT-H1 thermal paste ... went with the pea size drop, maybe a tad more ... a large pea, wanted to be sure the corners were also covered.

Computer started up again with a quiet fan. The other fan had been making clicking sound noises sometimes over the past year. It fooled me, I thought my hard drive was going bad and was going to replace it. I'm pretty sure those strange sounds must have been coming from the fan.

I did attempt to clean the old fan with a brush, portable sweeper and placed some oil in it with a toothpick ... but it just didn't spin freely. The new replacement fan would easily spin several seconds, I also placed a little oil into that fan after cleaning out some dust.

The newer 1.7 processor is showing on CPUZ and Everest. I don't notice much speed difference as I thought the 1.6 processor setup was OK for me anyway ... but it seems fast or jumping around really good.

I still have to update my two T42s ... the one is a 1.5 Banias and the other is a 1.6 Dothan. Two 745 SL7EN (B1) 1800 MHz 2 MB processors are on their way from China, maybe arriving in 10 or 12 days.

Hopefully those updates will go just as well as this one went. I will be able to check and clean the fans, place a little oil on them, clean out the fan space area and have two very fast T42s with the processor updates.

Very glad these older ThinkPads are fairly easy to work on for some problems. It's keeping track of all the different screws when doing the take-apart. Not all the screw holes have screw numbers beside them but I have my own drawings with all that information. I can't understand with the design ... why all the screw holes on the bottom didn't have screw numbers beside them.

Callahan

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Re: T41 Fan Noise ... I Think

#15 Post by Callahan » Fri Mar 03, 2017 5:09 am

Hi all ... been wanting to get back here and post about my experience with replacing the fan in my T41 last December. All went well ... after I took the old fan out I noticed some light dust/dirt in the area where the old fan assembly had been. I had cleaned the inside of my T41 and T42s before with a small new paint brush and my old trusty portable Hoover sweeper from the 80s.

However, I didn't know there would be dust/dirt visible after the fan was taken out ... it makes sense since dust gets into everything. I have the one T41 and two T42s ... the T41 was repaired and I decided to take the two T42s apart, take the fans out and clean that area out on those also.

Additionally, I put new thermal paste on on the CPU. The one T42 ... the 15in model that is almost like new was not bad in the dust area ... it seemed like a very light film of some dirt/dust but the thermal paste seemed to be dried out more than the other two ThinPads ... almost like a powder or it was a powder. So it was good that I ran a check on those two models.

I used the Noctua NT-H1 paste that was recommended here ... that went well and my temps seem just fine most of the time (middle 40s C) until I open a program or browser that 'may' send the temps up to 55 or 60 C. After replacing the fan in the T41, I discovered the TPFC.62 cooling program and installed that on all three ThinkPads.

Everything working good for now ... the eBay seller (AZ-US) sent me a good used fan for the T41 ... good blade spin, so I took a chance and ordered two more to have as spares ... those fans also have a good blade spin ... like maybe 5 or 6 seconds. He was selling them for $5.44 that included free shipping. I thought maybe later, I might not be able to get a good replacement fan if I need another one.

Thanks again for the help ... I have some other questions that I will start as a new thread or topic down the road.

... just to add, the fan blade spin on those fans I bought from eBay are probably in the 4 to 6 second range. I guess that's good ... the old fan had hardly any spin to it. The new (used) fan is very quiet and most of the time I don't even know it's actually running.
.....

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Re: T41 Fan Noise ... I Think

#16 Post by kfzhu1229 » Fri Mar 03, 2017 7:02 pm

I feel like as for the dusting, these old ThinkPads REALLY handle them well. I also had two T43 which haven't been opened for 10 years and was heavily abused for 8 years and both of them barely had any dust on their motherboards (As all of you know, T43/p's fan spins REALLY fast, in fact, 1.5 times the speed of T42's and possibly one of the fastest), while my cousin's crappy Lenovo Erazer laptop had a HUGE amount of dust collecting all over the place after 1.5 years of use! Like it was so bad that the dust ruined the RAM connection and therefore caused a lot of weird issues before I cleaned the dust and reseat the RAM...
Dell Lat CP MMX-233 64mb 40gb W2k
600 PII-266 416mb 40gb WXP
T23 PIII 1.13ghz 1gb W7
Precision M4300 X9000 8gb 160gb WUXGA Ultrasharp fp W10
T530i 15.6" i7 16gb fp W10
UXGA:
A30p PIII 1.2 1gb W7 (IDTech)
T43p 2.26 2gb fp W10 (Sharp)
Lat C840 P4-2.5 2gb 60gb W7 (Ultrasharp)

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