Check Display on W500

[san]

I am considering purchasing a second hand W500, but prior to buying I would like to know whether it has a LG or Samsung LCD panel.
It is a WUXGA display - but how do I check what exact display it is ? Appearently FRU #44C9614 which I found by the Thinkpad serial number can be both ..

[ajkula66]

Do yourself a favour and order the machine with a WSXGA+ LCD since the quality of WUXGA LCDs is downright horrible on W500 series.

[san]

Yes I have heard that - however, I read that the Samsung display is mostly responsible for this poor reputation. The LG WUXGA was supposed to be substantitally better ?

That said, I really do want a high quality display especially comming from the T60p UXGA IPS panel I know this will feel like a compromise no matter what. I even bought a Macbook Pro 15" to try out the said LED display marvel. While I was impressed with the display, especially the brightness and vived colors, appearently the nature of the LED backlight causes me headache and even "motion sickness" after a short while. That, and the MBP is certainly no Thinkpad when it comes to ergonomics.

Ajkula, how happy are you with the WSXGA+ in your T500/W500 ?

[ajkula66]

I've seen and owned WSXGA+ LCDs on other ThinkPads, not on W500, and these were acceptable, nothing more than that.

The W500 that I used for quite a while had an absolutely ridiculous WUXGA display, just like the T61p I owned at one time.

Put it this way: there is likely no way that any display could have significantly worse viewing angles and colour reproduction than that one did, crippling an otherwise excellent and impressive machine.

My $0.02 only...

[mad3d]

Yes I have heard that - however, I read that the Samsung display is mostly responsible for this poor reputation. The LG WUXGA was supposed to be substantitally better ?

My W500 has the WUXGA LG screen. You can find the model using Everest (you can download a 30 day trial). Go to display -> monitor -> manufacturer. My screen is listed as a lp154wu1-tlb1. I've been quite happy with the screen. While the viewing angles pale in comparison to my old UXGA T60p or SXGA X61t (and what doesn't), the contrast and colors, once calibrated slightly, are excellent. I work for an aerial photography firm and have had no major issues with color matching between my company's calibrated professional monitors and my W500. The one thing you'll notice when compared to other notebooks is that it still doesn't get super bright (if you like that sort of thing). There are no issues with brightness in a well lit room, but good luck trying to use it outside or in direct sunlight.

I think you'd be happy with an LG screen model.

[ajkula66]

mad3d wrote:

I think you'd be happy with an LG screen model.

While I'm honestly glad to hear that someone is (reasonably) happy with their WUXGA LCD on a W500 unit, there is no way that I'd personally advise anyone to take a gamble of that nature on a $1,500 laptop, since there's no way of guessing which LCD it will arrive with...

BTW, Everest wasn't able to identify the screen on the W500 that was in my house...at all. So there are some interesting LCDs floating around in this generation of ThinkPads...

[visionguru]

...The W500 that I used for quite a while had an absolutely ridiculous WUXGA display, just like the T61p I owned at one time.

Put it this way: there is likely no way that any display could have significantly worse viewing angles and colour reproduction than that one did, crippling an otherwise excellent and impressive machine.

Your comment is obviously subjective: "absolutely ridiculous"? "no way..any..worse"?

I've been using ThinkPad since ThinkPad 770. I found that the WUXGA screen is not bad at all, it so much better than the SXGA+ screen on my T23.

I think color reproduction is just a driver issue. Denser pixel often means lesser viewing angles. The W500's WUXGA is acceptable at 60 degree agel (120 total).

Frankly, all the manufacturers are basically using the same technology and machinery, the difference is trivial for the same generation LCDs.

Everest sure can read the LCD model. On my W500 it's "Manufacturer LP154WU1-TLB1", a LG.

[ajkula66]

visionguru wrote

Your comment is obviously subjective: "absolutely ridiculous"? "no way..any..worse"?

I've been using ThinkPad since ThinkPad 770. I found that the WUXGA screen is not bad at all, it so much better than the SXGA+ screen on my T23.

I think color reproduction is just a driver issue. Denser pixel often means lesser viewing angles. The W500's WUXGA is acceptable at 60 degree agel (120 total).

Frankly, all the manufacturers are basically using the same technology and machinery, the difference is trivial for the same generation LCDs.

Of course my comment is subjective. As is yours. And everyone else's on this forum.

You're fairly new around here, so you'll be forgiven for attempting to impress with "using ThinkPads since 770"...especially when you're responding to post made by someone who sells more ThinkPads in a month than most people on this forum get to see in a lifetime.

Having said that, just a couple of quick remarks here:

a) LCDs on T23s, including the SXGA+ ones, were nothing to rave about. If you want to go that far in the past, try A30p. Now that was a good LCD, and then some, seven years ago.

b) Driver issue argument doesn't hold water. That LCD looked poor in Vista and in several Linux distros. It's just bottom-of-the-barrel quality panel, no ifs ands or buts there. And how come IPS/AFFS screens with high pixel density had excellent viewing angles?

c) If you want to see what an acceptable (not great) WUXGA LCD looks like, check Panasonic CF-52 in the WUXGA version.

d) Workstation-class notebook (which is how I see W500) is supposed to have a workstation-class LCD. It doesn't. Lenovo dropped the ball with T61p and kept up the good work with W500.

It's NOT a "widescreen vs. 4:3" issue. I've taken pictures of W500 against Z60m with a WSXGA+ LCD. Let's just say that Z60m blew it away by a million margins in both colour reproduction and viewing angles.

Now, put it against UXGA version of T60p and that's when you really want to throw W500 up against the wall.

Once again, it's a sin...W500 would've been a great machine if it had an acceptable screen.

[visionguru]

I'm not here to impress anyone. By mentioning "since 770", I merely want to say I'm not exactly a newbie, I do have comparisons.

I would not have posted in this thread if not reading your comments. You are basically saying the 15" WUXGA LCD panels on ThinkPad T61p & W500 are garbage. Seriously, is that true? That bad?

Lenovo does not make any LCD panels. Just like Dell & HP, they buy from big manufacturers such as Samsung & LG (these two companies are making more LCD panels than all others combined). I think it's fair to say that the WUXGA LCD in W500 is industry standard. Lenovo might not have many choices because they need large quantity.

Yeah, there are better LCDs (such as T43p's UXGA), the W500's WUXGA is not bad at all (especially at high lightness levels), actually it's better than the 14.1" SXGA+ screens of T23 and T61.

[ajkula66]

visionguru wrote:

You are basically saying the 15" WUXGA LCD panels on ThinkPad T61p & W500 are garbage. Seriously, is that true? That bad?

That is exactly what I'm saying. I've had W500 against a variety of other ThinkPads and non-ThinkPads, side-by-side, and when it comes to LCD it is downright ridiculous. Everything else on this machine is very good or excellent. I've never ran into almost any of the issues that people were complaining about when it came to W500 (turbo memory, keyboard flex...) and would be happy to buy it if it had an acceptable screen.

WSXGA+ on Z60m was an acceptable screen, and my understanding is that the same holds true for W500 with this resolution.

WUXGA on Panasonic CF-52 is an acceptable screen. And I doubt that Panasonic makes their own LCDs.

visionguru wrote:

the W500's WUXGA is not bad at all (especially at high lightness levels), actually it's better than the 14.1" SXGA+ screens of T23 and T61.

Let's not forget that:

a) None of these (T23/T61) SXGA+ LCDs were particularly bright, or had any type of decent viewing angles and/or colour reproduction. These were "on the go" multitask laptops, and were not expected to have great LCDs. W500 is supposed to be a workstation unit, and should be compared with A30p/31p, T42p/43p and T60p, all of these in 15" UXGA format. Let's not go there, you know what a T43p with an IPS LCD looks like so any comment on my part is really not required.

b) Once you start pumping up the brightness on W500's LCD, you lose any colour accuracy that the screen has to begin with...and get a washed-out-neon-light-like type of effect...

Sorry, but I'm not buying this type of "downgrade" after years of being faithful to the brand...and sticking with defending ThinkPads through all of their ups and downs...once Lenovo decides to put a decent LCD on a non-tablet machine, I'll be happy to return as a customer...

[ScotchDiver]

visionguru wrote:

That is exactly what I'm saying. I've had W500 against a variety of other ThinkPads and non-ThinkPads, side-by-side, and when it comes to LCD it is downright ridiculous. Everything else on this machine is very good or excellent. I've never ran into almost any of the issues that people were complaining about when it came to W500 (turbo memory, keyboard flex...) and would be happy to buy it if it had an acceptable screen.

I am happy (ecstatic in fact) to report that the LG display on my new W500 is excellent (for a TN at least). I've spent the last 3 years using a UXGA FlexView T60p so I was well prepared for disappointment in the screen area, but the LG panel really suprised me. Horizontal viewing angles are GOOD. Vertical viewing angles are ABOVE AVERAGE. Brightness is VERY GOOD. Contrast is GOOD. I shouldn't really comment on color accuracy as I spend 98% of my time writing code, but some pictures I took with my Canon DSLR looked fine on this display too. Sure, I wish I could get an IPS screen again, but the LP154WU1-TLB1 is about as good a TN as I've seen on a laptop.

I expect in the long run I'll be just as happy with my W500 as I was with the T60p. That is, as long as I can get the keyboard swapped out. Seriously, the left third of the thing feels like it's being held up by a rubber band.

Scott

[diegot]

I have to say that I am quite happy with the WUXGA screen in my W500. I am very picky about screen quality and the LG screen on this laptop is very good (not excellent, color reproduction could be better but contrast is great, brightness is adequate for most situations and viewing angles are good). I own and have seen other LED screens with ridiculously high brightness and glossy screens but the contrast is awful and viewing angles are terrible at best. In the end, it is all in the eye of the beholder but I am trying to be objective by comparing it to other high end laptops from HP, Dell and ASUS. The W500 matte screen (LG) is quite good and unless you are a photographer of hardcore web designer, it will definitely suit your needs. Given all the bad comments about it, it actually surpasses my expectations by far.

These are the screen specs as reported by Everest

[planetf1]

I've got a new W500 with 1920x1200 screen, and it's *awful*. No two ways about it, it's basically unusable. The viewing angle is shocking in both dimensions and the display is very washed out. Unacceptable.

Nothing since my old 760EL (STN) has come close

My daughter has a Dell Studio 1920x1080 screen which is lovely.

Does this res screen come in both Samsung and LG variants? Anyone know how to check which under Linux (Fedora 12). Couldn't see anything from dmidecode. Am thinking of installing a win7 partition to check with "everest" (?) otherwise.

is the cheaper high-res W510 screen better?

[planetf1]

To return to this thread.

Today the laptop was sent to our local repair ppl. The screen was becoming intolerable -- I think it's dimmed further. The comparison with *any other* monitor was v.significant. I proved this by measurement too.

Are there any new LCD panels being provided as service parts
Still the same samsung and LG parts?
Is the LG screen generally deemed better -- should I be pushing for this.

The *spec* of the W500 appears to be showing "200 nits+" - the best I could measure with an uncalibrated device, with W500 full brightness was 60. Other monitors comfortably configured recorded 120-140, with some new led dell models achieving 300 (totally unnecessary/painful indoors)

That suggests to me a fault (hence in for repair).

Intrigued as to what will happen
- unfixable - bother
- replace with another samsung panel - sceptical any better (2nd repair?)
- replace with LG panel -- likely to be "good enough" ?