Here's your Broadwell Thinkpad: W550s Are you dissapointed?

[aPanzerIV]

I hopped on the Lenovo site today and found this:

http://shop.lenovo.com/us/en/laptops/th ... ies/w550s/

I think we can safely assume the W1 rumor was a hoax, however not all is lost; we have regained trackpoint buttons!

So far the options are pretty limited; Here are the options you can choose from:
- Processor selection is limited to the I5-5500u and the I7-5600u
- 7 Pro 64 or 8.1 Pro 64 (as always)
- A choice between a 1080p (non-ips?), and two 3K IPS displays, one with touch, one without.
- Quadro K620M 2GB is the only graphics card availible
- A selection of ram capacities between 4 and 16Gb
- 500Gb is the only hard drive option, all others are SSD's ranging from 128 to 512Gb
- Fingerprint reader is optional; webcam mandatory (why?)
- It appears we can select to have two batteries; with a maximum capacity of 116Whr
- 90W adapter is not available, so we are stuck with a 65W one
- Intel wireless, with or without bluetooth


So while Lenovo is taking a step in the right direction with design, they seem to be taking a step back in options. Will have to see if they provide some more customizations for the new lineup.
Discussions? Comments? I hate Lenovo rage? Post it here.

[brchan]

I don't like the looks, especially the offset keyboard, drop and down hinges. The idea of a thin workstation with sacrifices also doesn't make too much sense. At least the trackpoint buttons are back though.

I really want a numeric ultrabay keypad like on the T2x and A3x series.

[ajkula66]

I'm not quite certain that I understand what the intended target market for this machine is.

There's little doubt in my mind that Lenovo will have a winner with the latest incarnation of X1C. It's an attractive proposal for a business traveler. T450s will fare at least as well - and likely better than - T440s has.

However, an ultrabook workstation which is really none of the above...

[pianowizard]

However, an ultrabook workstation which is really none of the above...

The business PC divisions of IBM/Lenovo, Compaq/HP and Dell have been copying each other for over a decade now. This W550s emulates Dell's Precision M3800: http://www.dell.com/us/business/p/preci ... station/pd . I don't know whether the M3800 has sold well, but Lenovo probably believes it has and decided to jump on the bandwagon.

[bit_twiddler]

I'm glad that they are experimenting, and I'm sure that there
is a market for a thin and light 15" notebook.

With only 2 memory slots, though, they should have called it the "T550s."

[Ibthink]

Its really just a 15" version of the T450s, with 3K screen, nVidia GPU and numblock - also more RAM and a much bigger battery.

Thinking about getting it to replace my T440s (which I sold)...there is a very nice offer here in Germany: http://www.campuspoint.de/lenovo-campus ... 00n00.html

[jdrou]

We won't see any real workstation-class machines at least until the full power Broadwells become available.

[bit_twiddler]

In case you did not read the fine print, you are obligated as a forum member
to make a full report on your purchase as soon as you get it in your
hot little hands - and treat it as a Christmas present and your favorite
toy for a least a week.

[ajkula66]

there is a very nice offer here in Germany: http://www.campuspoint.de/lenovo-campus ... 00n00.html

That's some type of a "student's special" price, correct? Very good offer for a brand new machine, no questions asked.

[600X]

Doesn't the US also have a campus program? I believe it's called Barnes and Nobles Gold.

[ajkula66]

Doesn't the US also have a campus program? I believe it's called Barnes and Nobles Gold.

B&N Gold is really not a campus program the in way that you'd have one in Europe. It does help, though, from what I'm to understand.

[Saucey]

We won't see any real workstation-class machines at least until the full power Broadwells become available.

I am curious when that will be, I wonder if Lenovo will release a W550 and sell the W541 at the same time but at a lower price.

I hope that the W550 (non s model) will have 4 ram slots, I am presuming the W550s doesnt have this feature due to having the internal battery for the Power Bridge technology.

Maybe Lenovo will add a second fan for discrete graphics to help further differentiate it from the W550s, so it can be pushed to the limits like like the M4800.

[laowai]

http://www.lenovo.com/psref/pdf/tabook.pdf

It's all kind of a joke to be honest. A cruel cruel joke. Right general direction (rather than going further with bad changes... but, still kinda meh.

[jdrou]

We won't see any real workstation-class machines at least until the full power Broadwells become available.

I am curious when that will be, I wonder if Lenovo will release a W550 and sell the W541 at the same time but at a lower price.

I hope that the W550 (non s model) will have 4 ram slots, I am presuming the W550s doesnt have this feature due to having the internal battery for the Power Bridge technology.

Maybe Lenovo will add a second fan for discrete graphics to help further differentiate it from the W550s, so it can be pushed to the limits like like the M4800.

From what I've read it's expected sometime in Q2. Not sure if laptop manufacturers will actually release anything then though since Skylake is expected in Q3. Unless Intel only releases the ultra-low-power chips first again.

[cf4470]

I definitely don't like the offset keyboard, as it forces me to sit off center from the screen. Who really uses a numeric keypad these days? Certainly the few who do could use an external USB keypad rather than force the rest of us to suffer.

[ZaZ]

However, an ultrabook workstation which is really none of the above...

I don't know about a workstation, but I'd like to see a 15" version of T450s with an ULV CPU and integrated card. I don't need a ton of mobility, but a light machine for around the house would be welcome. It's probably too small a market to pursue.

[lead_org]

T550s would make sense. Just have a lower end option for the W550s.

[Ibthink]

The T550 is the lower end option of the W550s - different from the W550s, it can be customized with integrated graphics, an low-low end HD panel and i3 CPUs. W550s always comes with i5 or i7, the nVidia GPU and FHD displays minimum.

[Ibthink]

Noted down my early impressions of the W550s here: http://forum.notebookreview.com/threads ... st-9935678

[Larry2]

I am sharing my Lenovo W550s comparison with my Dell Precision M3800 in this posting...

My Laptop Configurations:

Lenovo W550s with Intel dual core 17-5600 CPU @2.60GHz, 16 GB RAM, NVIDIA Quadro K620M, 1TB Samsung 850 Pro SATA SSD (user upgrade from HDD) with RAPID enabled

Dell Precision M3800 with Intel quad core i7-4702HQ CPU @2.2GHz, 16 GB RAM, NVIDIA Quadro K1100M, 512 GB Samsung SM841 mSATA SSD

Applications Used for Performance Ratings/Testing:
• Windows 7 Performance Information and Tools
• Photoshop CS6 (Image Processor activated from Bridge)
• ATTO and CrystakDiskMark
• Samsung Magician
• Core Temp 1.0 RC6
• Vendor’s diagnostics applications

Applications Used for Work Testing:
- PTC MathCAD for structural engineering calculations (some over 200 pages long)
- Adobe Photoshop CS6 for photography image processing

My Computer Testing Experience:
I have owned, used and tested laptop computers since IBM announced their first model. I used IBM ThinkPads for a number of years until IBM sold the division to Lenovo. I owned and used Lenovo T-model laptop before switching to the Dell M3800 in January 2014. I bought a Lenovo W550s when my Dell failed, and it took Dell over a month to successfully repair the unit. The Dell is now working fine and allowed me to do the tests and get the results you see below. I upgraded the Lenovo from a 500 GB HDD to a Samsung 850 Pro 1TB and Samsung Magician (RAPID enabled), and that is the configuration I used to do the following tests.

Windows 7 Performance Ratings:

Let’s get right to it and admit the Lenovo is not as powerful a work machine as the Dell when it comes to pure calculations. Windows rates the Dell processor at 7.6, whereas, it rates the Lenovo at 6.5 calculations per second. I did not feel that difference when using the two computers and most people will not, but for intense calculations with applications that actually use quad core processors to their max, Dell will win the day. I felt no difference in image processing nor MathCAD calculation manipulation when working on one image or modifying a computer model because human intervention and decisions were almost always the limiting factors. However, running batch processes shows a difference in the laptops. Lenovo took 34 minutes batch processing 1215 images (converting to smaller size) and Dell took 31 minutes. This tells me that disk I/O bottlenecks can actually make the Lenovo perform almost at the same level with the Dell but with half of the CPU cores and thus, lower internal temperatures. Samsung RAPID was turned on for the Lenovo, but not available for the Dell which makes a big difference in I/O speed. Without RAPID, the Dell would run circles around the Lenovo.

Dell also won on graphics at 7.0 compared with 6.7 for Lenovo (Lenovo Turbo Boost enabled makes an improvement from 5.9). While processing photo images, I could not feel any speed difference between the two computers while using Photoshop. There are often delays when going to and from plugin filters such as Nik and OnOne when using any processor. Those delays felt the same with both Dell and Lenovo.

Windows rates the Dell at 7.8 for memory but the Lenovo at 7.6. Since both of my machines have 16GB of RAM, the access speed for the Dell must be a little faster.

Display:

I use the Intel built-in Intel HD graphics adapter for both laptops because my applications do not play well with the NVDIA adapters in the units, and I do no gaming. I disable the NVDIA adapter in the Lenovo to get longer battery life and lower internal temperatures. Disabling the NVDIA adapter in the Dell seemed to make no difference in internal temperature nor battery life.
I use both computers in 1920x1200 pixel resolution so I can see the Photoshop and MathCAD icons and controls well enough to not make mistakes. Even though both Dell and Lenovo provide higher resolutions, they both work well scaled to 1920 pixels. Although both screens have excellent contrast and color saturation, the Lenovo screen has less glare than the Dell and, as a result, is easier to use for image processing using Photoshop when there are unshaded windows nearby.
I did notice a color and contrast shift when viewing the Dell screen off center by just 15-20 degrees. The Lenovo contrast shifts also but not as much and the colors do not appear to shift even with large viewing angle changes. More care has to be taken to view the Dell straight on when processing photo images.
I calibrated the screen for both computers using Spyder3 Elite and got results that were comparable. After calibration, Dell provides close to 100% sRGB gamut while the Lenovo is about 90% and the brightness of both work well for photo editing and production. The Dell was slightly better for color control, but the screen glare can be an issue when working in a building that has windows nearby.

Keyboard:

Both keyboards are excellent, but I like the Dell keyboard a little better. However, I have used Lenovo TrackPoints for many years, and I like that feature. It find it much easier to use than a scratch pad and it works well as a pointer control.

The Dell keyboard backlighting turns on as soon as you start to type and illuminates the keys well. The Lenovo keyboard backlighting has three optional settings, but the brightest setting does not produce the same level of lighting the Dell produces. The Dell keyboard is thus easier to use in low light.

I will not address the Numeric Key pad. Lenovo has one and Dell does not. I don’t use numeric keypads, so it makes no difference to me.

Connectivity:

USB Ports: Dell has two USB ports on each side. One on each side is powered (always on) and one is USB 2.0. Lenovo has two USB 3.0 ports on the right side and one USB 3.0 port on the left. Only one of those ports is always on. In both cases, you have to look careful to see which port is always on.

Video Output: Dell has an HDMI port in addition to a Thunderbolt port. Lenovo only provides a Thunderbolt port; you have to use an HDMI converter to get HDMI output.

Ethernet: Dell has no Ethernet port; you have to use an Ethernet dongle to get the conversion from USB. Lenovo has an Ethernet port. I seldom use Ethernet ports anymore since most motels have wifi, so the lack of an Ethernet port is not an issue for me.

Battery Power:

Dell has one internal batter. You can get it with a 91Wh or 61Wh, but you cannot easily change the configuration—you have to take the computer apart. I have the 91Wh version, and it lasts about 3 hours for me on an airplane. The Lenovo has one internal 44Wh battery and three optional rear batteries: 23, 48 and 72 Wh. You can swap out those rear batteries in the Lenovo without shutting the unit down. The Lenovo also provides an excellent power management application that enables you to select the performance level you wish to use and predicts the remaining battery time that you will get based on that selection. So, if you plan to be in a base camp in the Serengeti where you have limited access to charging stations, the Lenovo with extra batteries is the machine for you. I seldom have that type of scenario, but it is good to know I have the option.

Heat Emission:

The Dell has two internal fans that blow out the bottom of the unit. You can get a hot lap or do damage to the computer if you actually use it in your lap or block that vent in any way. The Lenovo has one internal fan, and it blows out the side of the unit. The Lenovo does not get as hot on the bottom. The Core Temp application indicated the Lenovo CPUs ran about 12C cooler than those in the Dell (72C versus 84C) under stress diagnostic testing at 90-100% CPU load using the vendor’s own diagnostic application. In my own experience while using the Dell for a year, heat can be an issue and probably contributed to a system board failure in my unit.

Size and Weight:

Dell wins the day in both categories. It is about ¼ inch thinner (not counting the height of the feet) than the Lenovo with the 23 Wh battery attached and about 0.25 pounds lighter including the batteries. Both the size and weight make the Dell feel more like an iPad than a workstation. The aluminum top and carbon-fiber base are both high tech, look good and keep the weight down. However, the lack of heat conduction in the base may contribute to over-heating issues…as it did in my case.

Conclusions:

There is no doubt that the Dell laptop has sex appeal with the thinner body and lighter weight. It also packs a lot of power. However, my own experience has shown that the Dell can be a high-maintenance machine. The Lenovo may have warts as well…only time will tell. However, it feels more like a reliable work horse while the Dell feels like a temperamental race horse. It will be difficult picking just one of them for treks that limit me to one laptop, but the Lenovo will probably win the day. I will take both with me when I can so I have a backup computer in my bag. Maybe I will get my wife to lug the Dell on long international trips, and I will take the Lenovo in my bag. That would be a win-win…but at a price of course.

[Worzyl]

I've been looking into both of these laptops as I travel quite a bit and need something lighter than the T60p I've been carrying. However, more importantly is that I need to upgrade to a new laptop due to the animation software I use such as 3Dsmax 2016 which doesn't run on my T60p(found that out after installing the trial). I wasn't freelancing for awhile so I had no need to install these, but now that I am...

I have a desktop at home which also needs replacing, but instead of upgrading both, I'd rather just upgrade the laptop as my desktop hardly ever gets turned on.

@Larry2: Any further conclusions on these 2 laptops on your preference? Have you tried any of the 3d software at all to measure the performance?
Also - in regards to weight, is the difference large enough to be noticeable when carrying them around for a length of time?

[jdrou]

So Intel finally announced quad-core Broadwell CPUs at Computex. Now to see if anyone uses them. Hopefully we'll see Thinkpad W550, T550p, and T450p soon.

[Worzyl]

That's interesting. Any info on speed etc?

[jdrou]

http://www.intel.com/newsroom/kits/comp ... tSheet.pdf
No "MQ" or "MX" parts, only "HQ" and no 57W TDP mobile parts.
Unfortunately base speeds don't seem to be significantly better than Haswell but the new integrated GPUs are supposed to be much better.

[Worzyl]

http://www.intel.com/newsroom/kits/comp ... tSheet.pdf
No "MQ" or "MX" parts, only "HQ" and no 57W TDP mobile parts.
Unfortunately base speeds don't seem to be significantly better than Haswell but the new integrated GPUs are supposed to be much better.

Also to add at the same show

http://www.digitaltrends.com/computing/ ... 5-release/

[fb1996]

Hopefully we'll see Thinkpad W550, T550p, and T450p soon.

I assume we won't see any Broadwell-H based ThinkPad, instead we'll see W560, T560p and T460p soon after the Skylake-H release.

[jdrou]

Hopefully we'll see Thinkpad W550, T550p, and T450p soon.

I assume we won't see any Broadwell-H based ThinkPad, instead we'll see W560, T560p and T460p soon after the Skylake-H release.

Wouldn't surprise me, especially considering the small number of models. I notice the laptops I've seen so far with Broadwell-H are ones that were already using Haswell HQ processors (some MSI gaming laptops); they just dropped the 5700HQ into their existing design with the same HM87 chipset and added some USB 3.1 ports.

Unfortunately Skylake will probably be at least another 3 months.

[SafeHarbor]

Hi, folks,

Mucking around in an old thread here. Just got a W550s and so far I'm not disappointed. It's just what I wanted - a big, thin ThinkPad with a touch Flexview screen, possibility of dual SSD, and hot-swap-able battery.

But I wanted it for a specific purpose - to run Hauptwerk virtual pipe organs so I can pretend, in my old age, to be a mad organist. At my maddest, it's using about 20% of the CPU, which is great considering my 2010 4-core desktop was running around 50% and my T61p was slow as molasses. Also the W550s can take 32 GB RAM - presently has 8 GB. I have the 256 GB Samsung SSD in it and want to add the PCI M2 second drive, then upgrade the primary drive.

According to the Lenovo forum, the recent BIOS update enabled 4K through the DP port.

There are a few chintzy touches. I don't care for not having a drive activity light. The control LEDs that could have been above the keyboard light up around the key when they're active. That's picky, but it's tacky. A LATCH for the screen would have been nice, too.

Windows 10 actually has per-monitor scaling working now. I have an ancient Dell 1080p touch screen attached (so ancient it's infrared and has two touch points). I have the laptop set at 150% text and app scaling and the graphics are plenty fast enough to keep that sharp and do 1080p full screen on the laptop while the external monitor is at 100%.

I'm not an engineer or a video editor or a number-munching scientist (or rich enough for a P series), but the highly portable touch-enabled W550s I think is going to do FINE for me for the next five years or so. It runs Hauptwerk self-contained - just need a USB MIDI cable and a couple of powered speakers. (I have a couple of Behringer "Truth" 285-watt speakers I use.) I don't technically need to keep the actual organ files, which can be 2, 3 or more GB, on the SSD. They're read completely into memory for performance, so I might decide to put a really big spinning drive in and move the operating system and program files to the M2 drive.

I've read that the PCI M2 drive can be faster than the SATA-III main drive. I wonder if that's true?

[Ibthink]

I've read that the PCI M2 drive can be faster than the SATA-III main drive. I wonder if that's true?

Unfortunately, the W550s does not ability to accept PCIe M.2 SSDs - thats something its recently announced successor P50s can do.

[SafeHarbor]

Thanks, IBthink - I see now. They're not wildly expensive, I see. (Good.)