I am about to buy a used T42P but I read all those scaring threads about flexed MB or loose GPU so I am wondering :
Would you say that a used T42P is reliable ?
(Or should I go with R50P maybe ?)
Thanks !

PS :
Check the 3 very excellent posts by Johan about Things To Check before buying a used T42P : http://forum.thinkpads.com/viewtopic.ph ... 713#375713 (and the following post + his post on the next page)

And also the post by fkelly about extending the warranty on a used laptop : http://forum.thinkpads.com/viewtopic.ph ... 713#375713

I voted yes, but I suggest carrying it with 2 hands, or hanging vertically like a briefcase, rather than like a dinner plate. I use a T42p as my personal laptop, so I do like them, but the R50p has fewer GPU problems. If I were in the market now, I might think about a new R50p. There are a few new ones on eBay for $525 - $545, depending on wireless card. If you are in France, make sure it has an international warranty.

i trust IBM product

As long as it wasn't abused in the past, it's fine, if you continue to treat it with care. This really isn't too different than any expensive electronic equipment.

However, if you're concerned, you could look into T60's. They are coming down in price, getting close to the T4x's.

richk wrote:



There is no such thing as a new R50p, and all of these on eBay are refurbs with little or no IBM warranty behind them.

If the warranty is a big issue, T42p is the only way to go, because quite a few of them will have some warranty left.

My personal preference would be R50p, but by a very small margin, simply because it feels a little sturdier.

I also voted yet and whole heartedly agree with this statement.

I actually found some new R50p's here in Denmark - Warranty was out but they were new and unused. But at a price near a new T60 FlexView, it isnt interesting at all

I would go for the T42p, i think these have a better "feel" than the R series.

My T42p is going on its 5th year, and still running like new.

same as my T43.

Sorry to disagree. But I wouldn't call a machine that has the potential motherboard failure reliable. There's an eight-page thread on the forum: t42 shuts down when i remove it

Maybe that would mean none of the T4 series are reliable, so be it. T6 series are more reliable and so does the R50p. It's a desktop replacement machine which is not designed to be carried around like the T series. The T43 also seems to be more reliable than its brothers. A good choice if you can tolerate the heat/fan noise.

I always hold my T43 with one hand. I've been doing it for over 2 years and will continue doing it, even it means the motherboard failure someday. Then I'll be able to say: I put my trust in you but you failed me. and then move on with another ThinkPad. For me, abuse-resistance, appearance and keyboard/screen quality are the most important factors to purchase a laptop. Actually I decided to purchase my first ThinkPad (my first laptop) immediately after I had watched this ad

there are even more Thinkpad ad to impressed me too

When I took apart an R50p and a T42p or any 400fsb 128mb GPU ThinkPad they all appear to use the same motherboard.

Maybe there are less R50p's out there or their physical container is less prone to flexing that appears to bring on the GPU problem.

Brad

Brad wrote:



That would be my bet, since boards definitely are the same.

But what we're discussing here is somewhat a part of the world of statistics. I've had over a dozen T42p machines without a single motherboard issue. More than thirty R50p units turned in just one with a bad system board....generally, I have more trust in machines with a 128Mb GPU within this generation, as irrational as it may be...

Thats hard to say because the T6x series is relatively new compared to the T4x which has been able to stand the test of time at the moment (except for a few malfunctions here and there)

I manage a department of "Made In Japan" T42P 2373-KTU with warranties until 2010. (And have one myself) A few months back while servicing one of them. I somehow managed to loosen the ZIF processor screw from outside, (fiddling with wireless options) and suddenly no video and no nothing. I thought I had myself a flexed GPU board. Called Lenovo and T42P boards were backordered... Ended up disassembling the thing in preparation for motherboard delivery. When I relocked the ZIF screw just to double-check I realized my mistake. No damage done.

So in my honest opinion, after unnecessarily applying pressure on the GPU, (just to make sure) I would say that they are reliable.

How long there will still be parts just in case something happens, is another question? I recall hearing somewhere that they ran out of R40 motherboards a few months back?

How much would a T42P motherboard go these days anyway? Is it just my opinion or are NVIDIA graphics solutions on laptops just more durable like in the T6X)? My company use to use Toshiba Tecra S1 with the same ATI 9000 BGA on some T4X and unsurprisingly they met the same unlucky fate.

closersource wrote:



I wouldn't be too surprised if it were true for the R40 boards, since these machines had been a result of an outsourced contract to begin with. However, I can tell you that A31p and T30 boards are still available, so I'd expect that the T4x series parts should be around for quite a while.

I've had 6 T42 machines in the last 3 years. I had a bad DVD/CD in one. The rest are still operating daily. I carried a T42 around Daily in a good bag for that entire time.

There are always going to be problems with electronic equipment. Overall I think the T42 is way above average. As the resale prices continue to drop they are becoming and excellent value in portable notebooks.

Uncletoad,
why are you using so many T42s???

I think all Thinkpads are reliable if they have no electrical fault, such as the loose coil on the T23 or a badly ventilated GPU like on teh A31p series. Those are design errors.

In my experience the T4x series is very solid, unless they are abused. i.e. holding them with one hand at one corner. Don't do it and you don't get problems.
Our employees got that message from our CIO dept. when they got the notebooks. No problems so far.

I think the flexing problem was severely aggravated when Thinkpads started to have the batteries on the back side in which case you got a strong physical lever to bend the notebook. In addition the trend to slimmer and slimmer notebooks just contradicts statics. A bridge needs some physical width to cope with a load, that's why they have a lot of frames under or above the asphalt. A slim notebook has nothing.
No motherboard can handle physical stress for a longer time. They are not built for that.

My employees and I use 3 in the business, my wife has one she carries around with her and uses at home and I have a T42p flexview I carry around from work to home.

I like them. They all use interchangable parts including the docking stations at home and work.

I bought several at the same time and just stuck with that model.

Thank you all for the very good information you gave me (good information and people on this forum btw), now I feel much more confortable in buying my T42P (hopefully I'll have it in my hands next tuesday )

Alot of good points here.

I've had 3 T42s and one T43 in my family over the last 4 years. Unfortunately all the T42s experienced the motherboard failure and all of the problems occured post warranty (sucks for me). Granted, the wife and kid probably knocked them around a bit, but I treated mine oh so gently.

I love the T4x series for its solid look/feel, great road warrior strength. I hate the T4x series due to the serious motherboard failures which can occur in years 2-3 and beyond.

Try to find one that still has a valid warranty, get the warranty transferred, and then purchase an upgrade to extend it out a few more years and I would say go for it!

I know it's a bit late for you... My suggestion (since you already got it) is to be gentle with it. My T42p is almost 3.5 years old, and It is on it's 3rd mainboard, and 2nd LCD. (fortuanately, all under warranty). But for that reason I tell everyone I know to be wary of buying a laptop with no/little warranty. If you do, be gentle with it. I feel the LCD may have died because it got too hot in a car or something, and the mainboard was probably from walking the 2 miles to the lab and back every day with it in my backpack.

I'm much more careful with it now that I'm out of warranty.

This is so Bizzare. I've taken my T42's on planes, hauled them around god knows where in and out of the car every day. Always in a good bag with plenty of padding but all the same I'm not all that careful.

Does anyone have any stats about this?

I agree that it is really bizarre ...
However it looks like it is only 2 people having had these troubles out of 26, and I'll probably not stress my T42p much as I'll mainly use it as a desktop replacement so I think I am willing to take the risk (UXGA Thinkpads are not so easy to find in France and I haven't found an R50p yet ...)

Very Interesting

So you never had the MB issue on it ?
Thanks !

My general mode of operation is to buy a used machine and then get the extended warranty for the first year. It is kinda expensive so I generally nego hard when buying the machine considering I am going to have to add the additional expense of a warranty.

One of my T40's and T42 has needed no labor/parts with the exception of upgrading memory, extra battery and ac adapter.
but these upgrades have made these machines smoke. (thats a good thing).

The exception has been my other T40. It had the "motherboard moved and turns off issue", but my warranty covered the motherboard, new keyboard and a broken palmrest. So the warranty paid for itself. Actually it has paid for the cost of all 3 warranties that I have on the 3 machines.

Answering your question another way, I don't see why I need to spend the money on a brand new machine when the quality of the older stuff is solid in most cases. Three new lappies would be in the $3000+ range whereas I have spent probably less then $1500 for 3 near new machines.

Also when you are just browsing the "for sale" machines, you honestly never know what you will get (also in a good way). I really wasn't in the market, but stumbled on a T42 ad on Craigslist. Made contact and decided if this thing was better then average I would get it. Well I played hardball via email and we settled on $300. I met the guy and the machine was like brand new. The seller was a Dell guy and his Dad had won the machine at work and didn't need it so gave it to the son. The son used it sparingly and had it in his closet. He needed some extra dough and sold it to me.
I almost killed people on the drive home I was so excited with this purchase. Well with some extra ram, this machine has been a BEST BUY for me. ( this price was when T42's were in the $400-$500 range).

Thanks fkelly for the very good tip about the warranty.
Unfortunately the warranty on the T42P I am looking at has expired 3 months ago.
I have looked at "Post-warranty annual maintenance agreement (MA) - Mobile Products" on http://www-307.ibm.com/pc/support/site. ... =TPAD-PWMA but the T42 is not in there so I doubt that I can get some kind of warranty on mine ...
(PS : here is an excellent thread on warranty extension : http://forum.thinkpads.com/viewtopic.php?t=46947 - Thanks Johan BTW ! )

Anyway I think I am going to take my chances on this T42P as its current owner seems to be reliable ... any advise on some kind of test I could quickly run against this MB issue before I buy it ?

Pierre:

As just mentioned in my e-mail to you (but repeated here in the case other would be interested?):

1) Get the free, very good program: Dead Pixel Buddy, put it on an USB-memory key, and run it on the T42p (I mean, before paying!)

2) Run the IBM diagnostics program PC-Doctor on the T42p - it already ought to be there, otherwise get it from here. Alternatively, if downloading this program is not possible at the sellers place, owing to slow internet-access (or you could download it yourself well in advance, and burn it to a CD-ROM, and bring that?), there is an older version of this program, which runs from a bootable CD-ROM --> PC Doctor for DOS bootable CD - ThinkPad . RUN the PC-Doctor program (the full, comprehensive, extensive test) before paying!

3) Get the ltwbook (official title being: Personal Systems Reference Lenovo ThinkPad Notebooks 2005 to present - withdrawn, December 2007 - Version 332); it contain specification on most T42p's. If "your" T42p is not listed there, simply go to www.ibm.com and enter the MT (model/type - e.g. 2373-Q1U) in the Search field (upper, right corner), and choose the very first hit... that's the main specifications for "your" T42p. Having this "ltwbook" on your USB-key, you can check the specifications when you talk to the seller.

All set now, so as also already told: Get ready... to fall in love with your new hopefully soon-to-be FlexView/IPS UXGA T42p !

.. I mean, after all, you are French, aren't you, so it should be easy for you to fall in love; THAT much we all know!

Best regards - and, hey, remember to report back when you have arrived in the T42p-heaven; you know, Pierre, we all just LOVE French love-stories!

Johan

UPDATE to the above (I forgot to mention this yesterday); a few more tests to do before taking ownership of your new/used T42p

4. Verify that the Windows XP Pro COA-sticker (”Certificate of Authenticity”) is completely intact at the bottom of the ThinkPad. If you ever need to reinstall Windows XP from scratch (or from the R&R media), you will need this information.

5. Check that there are no pressure marks or scratches or light/black spots or areas on the display (easiest seen using Dead Pixel Buddy and with an all black or all white screen).

6. Check that no passwords of any kind are set, anywhere (or, if any, that they are known); including BIOS, harddisk or any other. To verify this, go to Start --> All Programs --> ThinkVantage --> and run the program ”ThinkPad-configuration”. Choose the ”Security Information” (bottom, left), and in the ”Codeword”-tab verify that all of the following BIOS-passwords are deactivated: a) Start, b) Harddrive, c) Administrator. Also verify in the ”Security”-tab verify that the Securitychip status is deactivated. The ThinkPad must come with information about the Windows administrator-password.

7. Check the battery state. To do this, go to Start --> All Programs --> ThinkVantage --> and run the program ”ThinkPad-configuration”. Choose the ”Function Control” menu (at top), select Battery Information, then Battery Condition. Status should preferably show up green.

8. Get the seller to make an invoice for you - this might be needed if the laptop should ever become stolen... then you need some kind of documentation to show to your insurance company.

Best regards,

Johan