eBay Seller ThinkPadWorld

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ThinkPadWorld · #1 Post by **ThinkPadWorld** » Thu Jul 19, 2007 1:36 am

Hello,

This is Maurice ; the owner of ThinkPadWorld. I have seen many doubts on this forum about our company's quality control, and negative experiences. I am here, well, to make my presence and let every one know that I am here to answer any questions any one may have about our products. I assure you that our company bends over backwards to make all of our customers happy.

When ever someone asks about ThinkPadWorld on this forum, they are always led away because of previous complaints about either the warranty, damage to the product, or lack of communication. Our employees work full business days responding all emails, and we take calls from 9:00am - 7:00pm EST Monday - Saturday @ 212-965-1420.

By looking at over 8,500 feedback and a positive rating of 99.1%, it is safe to say that you are dealing with honest people who are in fair practice and never will intend to fool anyone into a product that they are not intending to purchase. We also standby our sales. If there is damage to any products, we are there to replace/refund your purchase. If there is damage, it is out of our control, it is the way it was shipped to us by IBM. In any case, you will never be stuck with a broken or defective product.

Remember, if anyone is unhappy, just call us @ 212-965-1420 and we assure you that any issue you have will be fairly resolved.

Thank You,
Maurice
ThinkPadWorld

#2 Post by **KristianJ** » Thu Jul 19, 2007 1:56 am

Welcome to the forum! I'll most likely never deal with you due to me being in another country, but I'm sure your presence here will be of great benefit to both you and potential customers here at the forum!

#3 Post by **gator** » Thu Jul 19, 2007 2:15 am

Maurice, thanks for joining the forums. I have a quite a few questions about our ebay store, the answers for which many people might be interested to know

1. Are you an authorised IBM reseller?

2. What is the nature of warranty on your machines? AFAIK, it is 6 months IBM and the rest is mack warranty (which people hate) ... You say 'factory sealed, 3 year warranty' in most of your auctions, but I remember seeing somewhere inside that it is only a 6 month warranty from IBM. Some people might consider it misleading ... just a point to ponder.

3. Are your RAM upgrades done by you or do they come from IBM?

These are some of my questions, hopefully people will ask more later on ...

skitty4gzus · #4 Post by **skitty4gzus** » Thu Jul 19, 2007 2:31 am

I have also seen auctions listed at 15.4 screen on the listing and once inside the details say it is 14.1. We here look after one another and all we do is pass on the truth as we know it to be. so if somebody on here asks us what our opinion is on Thinkpadworld we tell them the truth from our own experiences. You can fix your reputation if you want, but it will take more than just words. Nobody said you are a horrible seller and you are out ripping people off intentionally, but some folks have had bad experiences and its hard to make all that go away.

sugo · #5 Post by **sugo** » Thu Jul 19, 2007 4:04 am

Isn't commercial thinkpad seller posting against interest of thinkpads.com?

"factory sealed, 3 year warranty" is down right false advertising when 2.5 out of 3 is the useless non-IBM/Lenovo warranty.

pianowizard · #6 Post by **pianowizard** » Thu Jul 19, 2007 7:18 am

ThinkPadWorld wrote:By looking at over 8,500 feedback and a positive rating of 99.1%

eBay feedbacks are virtually meaningless. Most people are hesitant to give negative feedbacks for fear of retaliation.

gator wrote:2. What is the nature of warranty on your machines? AFAIK, it is 6 months IBM

I bought my first R50p from Thinkpadworld and as usual, it was advertised to have 6-month IBM warranty. But I looked up the serial number on IBM's site and it didn't have any warranty left. I asked Thinkpadworld what's up and was told I should work it out with IBM myself. Thinkpadworld should have done that for me. But I left a positive feedback anyway.

Website · #7 Post by **tfflivemb2** » Thu Jul 19, 2007 7:24 am

sugo wrote:Isn't commercial thinkpad seller posting against interest of thinkpads.com?

"factory sealed, 3 year warranty" is down right false advertising when 2.5 out of 3 is the useless non-IBM/Lenovo warranty.

Yes, commercial selling is against the policy. However, thinkpadworld is simply responding to concerns about their company, because there are quite a few threads here, where people are asking about them. I'm really suprised that they took this long to register.

As for the question about the "mack" warranty....I'll let them tackle that.

#8 Post by **Harryc** » Thu Jul 19, 2007 8:14 am

If there is damage, it is out of our control, it is the way it was shipped to us by IBM.

I asked Thinkpadworld what's up and was told I should work it out with IBM myself.

It's statements like the above that I see most often associated with ThinkPadWorld. IMHO, a reseller as large as TPW should act as a liaison between the customer and IBM/Lenovo with any problem. If you're not willing to do this then what is the value add of your service except for cheap prices? To me, your telling a customer to go to IBM with problems out of the box is like telling a purchaser of a brand new Chevrolet to go the Chevy dealer down the street for problems because we don't want to deal with you. It just doesn't fly ... I will never buy from your company, and this is the reason. The only reason your company is able to exist is because of your prices, and because the folks who buy from you don't see the value of a 3 year factory warranty from IBM. It is worth it for me to pay more elsewhere to get it. I have a 3 year old T41 that has gotten the LCD (SXGA+), keyboard, and palm rest with ultranav replaced for free under warranty all within the last month...wow, now that's 'value'.

#9 Post by **tomh009** » Thu Jul 19, 2007 8:26 am

sugo wrote:"factory sealed, 3 year warranty" is down right false advertising when 2.5 out of 3 is the useless non-IBM/Lenovo warranty.

I have Mack warranties on some of my camera gear (gray-market and all that). It's all right, much better than no warranty, but it needs to be clear in the product description that it's not the IBM/Lenovo warranty.

#10 Post by **ryengineer** » Thu Jul 19, 2007 9:49 am

gator wrote:1. Are you an authorised IBM reseller?

Yes.

gator wrote:3. Are your RAM upgrades done by you or do they come from IBM?

I am certain he does it himself.

--------------------

I think he fears novice buyers will seldom buy if he starts mentioning IBM Factory Sealed - 6 Months IBM and 3 Year Mack Warranty! in the same clear big fonts.

ThinkPadWorld wrote:I assure you that our company bends over backwards to make all of our customers happy.

Does not completely seem to be the case from this:

pianowizard wrote:I bought my first R50p from Thinkpadworld and as usual, it was advertised to have 6-month IBM warranty. But I looked up the serial number on IBM's site and it didn't have any warranty left. I asked Thinkpadworld what's up and was told I should work it out with IBM myself. Thinkpadworld should have done that for me. But I left a positive feedback anyway.

-----------------------

I think you should also personally (pm) notify your other unhappy customers on this forum about your presence.

#11 Post by **gator** » Thu Jul 19, 2007 10:29 am

ryengineer wrote:
gator wrote:3. Are your RAM upgrades done by you or do they come from IBM?
I am certain he does it himself.

Then how can they be factory sealed? Or is the RAM shipped seperately? If so, what brand? Any warranty on the RAM? These were the points behind my orinigal question ...

#12 Post by **ryengineer** » Thu Jul 19, 2007 10:35 am

gator wrote:Then how can they be factory sealed? Or is the RAM shipped seperately? If so, what brand? Any warranty on the RAM? These were the points behind my orinigal question ...

In his auctions he states:

Please note: Item is received by us directly from IBM in sealed box. Box may be opened only to install upgrades.

#13 Post by **BillMorrow** » Thu Jul 19, 2007 11:41 am

when i used to resell new thinkpads and a customer wanted additional RAM I would put the RAM part in an envelope and slip it under the flaps, pushing with a ruler until it was inside the carton, thus NEVER opening the factory sealed box..

it can be done and this is how it should be done..

for those who wonder about new and bad memory, i would many times take a tested (in my own thinkpad of similar model) for a week or longer, and use that and replace the part in my machine with the new part..

scosgt1 · #14 Post by **scosgt1** » Thu Jul 19, 2007 12:50 pm

I don't know how anyone can say he sells cheap - I sell brand new sealed units with full warranty for hundreds less than he sells refurbs.

Now I admit that as a full time business he has to move a lot of hardware to pay the rent, but cheap he is NOT. Better deals can always be found by looking around.

scosgt1 · #15 Post by **scosgt1** » Thu Jul 19, 2007 12:57 pm

Just to clarify something about memory..

When I sell units with additional memory, the memory is separate. Once a box is opened, it is no longer new sealed, period.

And ThinkPads should always be shipped in a plain outer box for security reasons, sealed TP box inside.

#16 Post by **gator** » Thu Jul 19, 2007 1:27 pm

scosgt1 wrote:I don't know how anyone can say he sells cheap - I sell brand new sealed units with full warranty for hundreds less than he sells refurbs.

I fully agree with you - your prices are much better, and you have very good reputation here which I value a lot. I'd any day buy a new thinkpad from Bruce than from thinkpadworld.

dsigma6 · #17 Post by **dsigma6** » Thu Jul 19, 2007 1:39 pm

Maurice,

Now that even more negative attention has been brought to your business and its practices, I wish you luck in your endeavors.

ThinkPadWorld · #18 Post by **ThinkPadWorld** » Thu Jul 19, 2007 2:16 pm

OK, I had a feeling there would be a lot of people responding to my first posting on the forum:

Some questions you guys had were:

QUESTION: Are You an authorized IBM Reseller?

ANSWER: Yes We Are.

QUESTION: What is the story with the warranties? Are they from IBM/Lenovo?
ANSWER: The machines which we advertise with an L-Claim Classification are machines that are either : A) shipped to an IBM reseller or end user and then returned, in most cases unused, B) a custom ordered configuration which was cancelled or, C)brand new odd lot or overstocked inventory. This is all stated in our auctions at the bottom.

L-Claim Machines come with a 6 Month IBM Global Financing Warranty. This is another division of IBM which is why many people say that they checked the warranty status and it does not exist. Your 6 Month IBM Warranty is with IBM GLOBAL FINANCING.

The extended 3 Year Warranty is throgh MACK. Mack Warranty has an arrangement with IBM/Lenovo where IBM/Lenovo performs almost all necessary repairs for Mack Warranty claims. When you claim via Mack, your computer will be serviced by Lenovo/IBM 99% of the time. We advertise a 3 Year Warranty, but you are actually covered for 3 and 1/2 years. (6 Month IBM Global Financing, 3 Year MACK Extended).

QUESTION: It says "Factory Sealed" in the auction.. Is it?

ANSWER: All machines we received are Factory Sealed by IBM Global Financing. We receive them this way and ship them this way unless we need to install upgrades to the machine such as memory. We specify in our auctions "Please note: Item is received by us directly from IBM in sealed box. Box may be opened only to install upgrades."

It is the buyer's perogative whether they want us to install upgrades, or if they want us to ship the upgrade components outside the computer, which will leave your computer factory sealed as it was received by us. By default, we install all necessary upgrades, which requires the opening of the box.

QUESTION: 15.4 screen on the listing and once inside the details say it is 14.1....

ANSWER: That was a mistake. All of our auctions are done manually, one by one. We do not use any automated software for listing auctions. If you receive a product who's auction was misrepresented because of a typographical error, you are entitled to return the product for a full refund/exchange-- within 10 days of purchase.

QUESTION: factory sealed, 3 year warranty" is down right false advertising

ANSWER: We seperate these terms with a hyphen. The machine is Factory Sealed. and the machine has a 3 Year Warranty at least. Read the entire description please.

#19 Post by **tomh009** » Thu Jul 19, 2007 2:27 pm

ThinkPadWorld wrote:QUESTION: factory sealed, 3 year warranty" is down right false advertising

ANSWER: We seperate these terms with a hyphen. The machine is Factory Sealed. and the machine has a 3 Year Warranty at least. Read the entire description please.

Looking at a random ThinkPadWorld listing on eBay:
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?Vi ... 0141811659

The description specifies:

These remanufactured products are sold by IBM with a S-Claim classification, which means that they are in excellent near new condition. They are carefully tested and recertified by IBM and come in a IBM factory sealed box. Computers include the original factory software load including OS and have a Microsoft Certificate of Authenticity (COA).

Total 42 Month Warranty- Six Months IBM Global Financing Warranty plus 3 Year Mack Computer International Extended Warranty.

This seems like a very reasonable description, and at least I have no issue with this. Yes, if you only read the headline, you may get the wrong impression, but if you are spending several thousand dollars buying a system over the Internet, surely it should be necessary to read the description, too ...

Toine · #20 Post by **Toine** » Thu Jul 19, 2007 2:43 pm

Yeah, I bought my T41p from him I believe, not sure but like 90%.
It had like 2 years warranty, and the MACK thing (prob useless in the netherlands but still)

skitty4gzus · #21 Post by **skitty4gzus** » Thu Jul 19, 2007 2:47 pm

there is just a difference between someone being sly with their words and trying to pull the 'ole wool over someones eyes, than someone who is very descriptive and straight up. at least on this forum people tell you straight up what their selling. i appreciate honesty very much and honesty is worth a few more dollars to me as a buyer. i guess we will see which technique prevails; honesty or deception?

ThinkPadWorld · #22 Post by **ThinkPadWorld** » Thu Jul 19, 2007 2:49 pm

Yes I agree with you, being sly with words is not ethical, and it is deceptive. That is why we mention everything in our listings exactly as it is.

#23 Post by **JaneL** » Thu Jul 19, 2007 3:11 pm

Perhaps you need to review the wording in your ads to make them even more clear. As I told someone else today, perception is everything, and regardless of your good intentions, the perception appears to be that yours are deceptive.

#24 Post by **underclocker** » Thu Jul 19, 2007 3:50 pm

Maurice, thanks for coming on board and clarifying.

It's tough to bridge the gap between trying to keep your business thriving on eBay, among many competitors whose marketing quality exceeds their equipment quality, and meeting the expectation of a crowd as demanding as our own. As an occasional eBay seller, I do know how important it is to effectively use the one searchable line that eBay gives you to your advantage. Piquing interest equals sales.

I'd like to suggest that you consider being as straight forward and specific as possible in your ads about your machines and the terms for each. Including a Q & A section like you did for us would probably be very helpful to all.

At least you don't use a scantily clad woman as your gallery image for ThinkPads as some sellers do for their items!

Best of luck with your business.

ThinkPadWorld · #25 Post by **ThinkPadWorld** » Thu Jul 19, 2007 4:37 pm

I will do my best to soon put into affect some more emphasis.. Maybe I will make the part that says "IBM Factory Sealed - 3 Year Warranty" A link, which will scroll down to the area describing the warranty/condition of the product. Extremely rarely, do I ever have a customer who purchases something and doesnt recognize that. When buying an expensive item such as a ThinkPad, its important to thoroughly read the description--- especially on eBay!

scosgt1 · #26 Post by **scosgt1** » Thu Jul 19, 2007 6:14 pm

As I said, they are in business and need to make money, and they sell what they get from IBM as an authorized dealer (which in many cases is probably way more than one can find on the open market).

That being said, I once bought 5 AC adaptors from them. The price was good, but the shipping was like $15 each. Since I had to call them as to my tax number, I asked if I could get combined shipping, and was told "No, I need to charge each shipping to make money. I make money on shipping". So I paid the bill, and of course, all 5 adaptors came in the same box, with a Postal Stamp on it of maybe $7.00, and I paid $50 for shipping.

That was of course my last ever dealing with them. If I get fooled into looking at one of their ads, I immediately close it. I have no intereste whatsoever in what they are selling.

But as always, YMMV

tmkim80 · #27 Post by **tmkim80** » Thu Jul 19, 2007 7:18 pm

Looks like the verdict is out on this thinkpadworld.com seller and it isn't so good. This seems to be an excellent example of the powerful effect of word of mouth, even when it comes to internet retail sales. Really you have to wonder what value this service provides when the seller seems to attribute all product quality issues directly to the seller and all warranty information to the buyer. As far as price is concerned, I don't think he really offers a better deal because his products seem to have been stripped of their warranty. Come on guys.. Who would really pay thousands of dollars for their laptop and not pay a little extra for warranty knowing their is risk that he could be left helpless if his second-hand machine breaks down the next day. Three words of advice: Customer Relationship Management (CRM).

ccotenj · #28 Post by **ccotenj** » Thu Jul 19, 2007 7:37 pm

scosgt1 wrote:As I said, they are in business and need to make money, and they sell what they get from IBM as an authorized dealer (which in many cases is probably way more than one can find on the open market).

That being said, I once bought 5 AC adaptors from them. The price was good, but the shipping was like $15 each. Since I had to call them as to my tax number, I asked if I could get combined shipping, and was told "No, I need to charge each shipping to make money. I make money on shipping". So I paid the bill, and of course, all 5 adaptors came in the same box, with a Postal Stamp on it of maybe $7.00, and I paid $50 for shipping.

That was of course my last ever dealing with them. If I get fooled into looking at one of their ads, I immediately close it. I have no intereste whatsoever in what they are selling.

But as always, YMMV

i don't buy from ANYONE who "makes their money" on shipping... if someone is unwilling to combine shipping (like most ebay vendors of memory, for example), they can keep their product and rot and far as i'm concerned...

it's a deceptive way of doing business...

wearetheborg · #29 Post by **wearetheborg** » Thu Jul 19, 2007 7:43 pm

tmkim80 wrote:Looks like the verdict is out on this thinkpadworld.com seller and it isn't so good. This seems to be an excellent example of the powerful effect of word of mouth, even when it comes to internet retail sales. Really you have to wonder what value this service provides when the seller seems to attribute all product quality issues directly to the seller and all warranty information to the buyer. As far as price is concerned, I don't think he really offers a better deal because his products seem to have been stripped of their warranty. Come on guys.. Who would really pay thousands of dollars for their laptop and not pay a little extra for warranty knowing their is risk that he could be left helpless if his second-hand machine breaks down the next day. Three words of advice: Customer Relationship Management (CRM).

They provide warranty by mac (total 3.5 years).
Also, the laptops come from IBM/Lenovo, so if IBM/Lenovo is doing their job, then the confidence on these laptops should be greater than if bought froom an xyz seller.
I also dont have any problm with their wording on warranty. They clearly state in the description that 3 years is from mac. Anyone who does not read the full description should be buying from ebay.

Now the big questions are:
1.Is IBM/Lenovo doinig its job in checking the laptops before handing them over ?
2.Is the mac warranty any good ?

wearetheborg · #30 Post by **wearetheborg** » Thu Jul 19, 2007 7:47 pm

ccotenj wrote: i don't buy from ANYONE who "makes their money" on shipping... if someone is unwilling to combine shipping (like most ebay vendors of memory, for example), they can keep their product and rot and far as i'm concerned...

it's a deceptive way of doing business...

How is that deceptive ?

Total price you pay = ebay bid+shipping cost.
Its simple addition.

Now if they did not list the shipping fees, it would be different, but if someone clearly states the shipping fees, I see no problem.

eBay Seller ThinkPadWorld

eBay Seller ThinkPadWorld

Re: eBay Seller ThinkPadWorld

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Memory

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lll

hmm

Re: lll

Re: hmm

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