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T440p / T540p / W540 / L440 / L540 announcement

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Ibthink
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T440p / T540p / W540 / L440 / L540 announcement

#1 Post by Ibthink » Tue Sep 10, 2013 11:55 pm

See: http://news.lenovo.com/article_display. ... le_id=1717

High Resolution IPS screen can be found in the hole lineup. 8)
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Re: T440p / T540p / W540 / L440 / L540 announcement

#2 Post by ZaZ » Wed Sep 11, 2013 3:30 am

Ibthink wrote:High Resolution IPS screen can be found in the hole lineup.
I must have missed it.
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Re: T440p / T540p / W540 / L440 / L540 announcement

#3 Post by Ibthink » Wed Sep 11, 2013 7:58 am

T440s/T440p FHD screen is IPS, as well as the W540/T540p FHD++ screen (2880x1620) and the X240(s) FHD screen (the HD screen is also IPS for the X240). Only the budget L-Models and the T440 (which is a stripped-down T440s) won´t feature IPS.
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Re: T440p / T540p / W540 / L440 / L540 announcement

#4 Post by gaphic2 » Wed Sep 11, 2013 10:32 am

Awesome. We had to wait 8 years for it, but could the W540 finally be a worthy successor for the T60p? I certainly hope so.
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Re: T440p / T540p / W540 / L440 / L540 announcement

#5 Post by Utwig » Wed Sep 11, 2013 1:53 pm

Looking good.

Does anyone know if any of those Thinkpads could be fit with keyboard/palmrest with physical trackpad buttons?
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Re: T440p / T540p / W540 / L440 / L540 announcement

#6 Post by Puppy » Thu Sep 12, 2013 12:12 pm

Ibthink wrote:T440s/T440p FHD screen is IPS
Still not confirmed yet. The Lenovo press release does not mention it either.
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Re: T440p / T540p / W540 / L440 / L540 announcement

#7 Post by Ibthink » Thu Sep 12, 2013 12:56 pm

It is confirmed, it is IPS or AHVA (which does essentially the same thing). No TN screen has this good viewing-angles, see:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3j32cz2pBGE
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-eXZCo9OJCM
The viewing-angles are perfect (even better than X220 IPS). Also, the black-level is very low (so blacks look really deep and black) and the screen should cover sRGB.
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Re: T440p / T540p / W540 / L440 / L540 announcement

#8 Post by Puppy » Thu Sep 12, 2013 3:19 pm

Does the IPS goes with touch version only ? The added layer will make the screen quality worse then.
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Re: T440p / T540p / W540 / L440 / L540 announcement

#9 Post by Ibthink » Thu Sep 12, 2013 4:04 pm

No, every T440s with FHD (and every T440p with FHD) comes with IPS. It is the same screen.

The second link shows the non-Touch FHD IPS screen.
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Re: T440p / T540p / W540 / L440 / L540 announcement

#10 Post by StevenD » Thu Sep 12, 2013 4:19 pm

gaphic2 wrote:Awesome. We had to wait 8 years for it, but could the W540 finally be a worthy successor for the T60p? I certainly hope so.
Hi, gaphic2,
What an interesting post. I have a T60p that I use every day. It's rock steady with XP and a SSD HDD. It's been bounced around in my briefcase almost every day since it came out, and I've never upgraded. I tried a T61p, but the screen was terrible, and I just never tried another Thinkpad since then, waiting for IPS to come back. Looks like we might not only get IPS, but a screen that's more than 1080 pixels tall! How will I live without XP?!

--Steve D.

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Re: T440p / T540p / W540 / L440 / L540 announcement

#11 Post by Adda » Fri Sep 13, 2013 8:20 am

Oh yeah great celebration, but then I saw a picture of it, I don't care about the screen when the laptop it self is a POS.

http://www.pcper.com/news/General-Tech/ ... rkstations

The T60p replacement? no way!

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Re: T440p / T540p / W540 / L440 / L540 announcement

#12 Post by laowai » Tue Sep 17, 2013 9:15 am

Sigh... it seems every iteration is the same.
One step forward, three steps back.

It finally dawned on the monkeys that what everyone has been demanding for years (high res screens) is a good idea. Of course, the only reason why they bother now is because others did it first.

But, still a crap keyboard with a crap layout, no thinklight, and they kill off the thinklight while keeping with the cheap materials for the chassis.

My T60, which is 7 years old and I am using right now is all I want. Make a special edition, charge me $5000 for it, just upgrade the specs and touch nothing else. It doesn't even have to be perfect. I'll buy it in an instant. Why is this so hard for them to understand? :(

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Re: T440p / T540p / W540 / L440 / L540 announcement

#13 Post by StevenD » Tue Sep 17, 2013 10:36 am

May I add a new concern? I did the math on the W540 that I was hoping would replace my T60p.

The W540 is 15.5 inches and 2880 x 1620 pixels. That means that the screen is 13.5 inches wide and 7.6 inches tall. My T60p's screen is 9 inches tall. Yuk.

Also, the W540 is 213 pixels to the inch. My T60p is 133 pixels per inch. That means that a 133-pixel feature, picture, whatever, on my T60p will be one inch tall, but only 0.6 inches tall on the W540. What will happen, for example, to icons on programs that don't adjust well to high res screens? I think that's almost all programs, btw.

/SD

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Re: T440p / T540p / W540 / L440 / L540 announcement

#14 Post by Cigarguy » Tue Sep 17, 2013 11:14 am

laowai wrote:Sigh... it seems every iteration is the same.
One step forward, three steps back.

It finally dawned on the monkeys that what everyone has been demanding for years (high res screens) is a good idea. Of course, the only reason why they bother now is because others did it first.

But, still a crap keyboard with a crap layout, no thinklight, and they kill off the thinklight while keeping with the cheap materials for the chassis.

My T60, which is 7 years old and I am using right now is all I want. Make a special edition, charge me $5000 for it, just upgrade the specs and touch nothing else. It doesn't even have to be perfect. I'll buy it in an instant. Why is this so hard for them to understand? :(
My thoughts exactly!

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Re: T440p / T540p / W540 / L440 / L540 announcement

#15 Post by laowai » Wed Sep 18, 2013 2:27 am

Cigarguy wrote:
laowai wrote:Sigh... it seems every iteration is the same.
One step forward, three steps back.

It finally dawned on the monkeys that what everyone has been demanding for years (high res screens) is a good idea. Of course, the only reason why they bother now is because others did it first.

But, still a crap keyboard with a crap layout, no thinklight, and they kill off the thinklight while keeping with the cheap materials for the chassis.

My T60, which is 7 years old and I am using right now is all I want. Make a special edition, charge me $5000 for it, just upgrade the specs and touch nothing else. It doesn't even have to be perfect. I'll buy it in an instant. Why is this so hard for them to understand? :(
My thoughts exactly!

It's not like I'm "behind the times" or looking for any excuse to yell at Lenovo either. I'm willing to recognize my view is not aligned with their strategies anymore. They obviously want to shed the whole business image and appeal to the larger consumer base. Their blogs have said it over and over that business customers only care about costs. So ok, they want to skip out on that, and us who for some reason care about quality... we are outnumbered by the "why is this laptop $200 and that one is $1200?" crowd.

So, when they come out with new stuff, sure, I'm willing to give it a look. The Helix thing looked pretty interesting. But their docking interface is kinda crap, the build quality is lacking, some basic design issues, and the base... eh. I find it lacking. Then the price is just high for specs that might have commanded that price a year ago. I LOVE the concept, they are just being dumb about it.

I would be willing to go with that sort of setup, I might even be willing to accept the crappy keyboard because of the new convenience. Make the base larger to hold hard drives, RAM, a dedicated video card, real battery, ethernet and keep it serviceable and I'd pull the trigger. I'd grab a pair of bases, one for the office one for home and just lug the tablet portion around on the go or business trips. I'd be very happy with that compromise. I'd buy the little accessories, and it would mean that I could just use whatever real keyboard/mouse I wanted with it (because I'm sure as hell not using win8).

But no, they offer none of this, even though they could. 256GB of space ain't enough and SSD is impossible for me as the only option. Data recovery is nigh impossible and nothing is going to be going "to the cloud" for me ever.

When I buy, I get the newest, the best, because quite simply, I expect a laptop to live for 3 years minimum. The first year is a gimmie and after that, I start dumping $1k a year into the laptop fund. The longer it lives, the more that grows. Any repairs come out of that fund beyond warranty. It really kinda pisses me off what they've done because I want them to make a laptop or hybrid solution that I can take one look at and go "yep, that's it" and throw my money at it. But they just keep screwing around, and it's obvious that their designers are making changes for the hell of it, so they can claim that they did something that justifies their employment.

edit:
And the honestly stupid thing about their mentality is that it would be really easy to fix their problems, be the #1 in the market and provide an answer for the business question "why should we pay more for your laptops instead of getting dells?".

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Re: T440p / T540p / W540 / L440 / L540 announcement

#16 Post by bill bolton » Wed Sep 18, 2013 11:50 pm

laowai wrote:They obviously want to shed the whole business image and appeal to the larger consumer base.
The real situation is that what the corporate business purchasers are prepared to buy has changed, and Lenovo is serving the current business demand.
laowai wrote:And the honestly stupid thing about their mentality is that it would be really easy to fix their problems, be the #1 in the market and provide an answer for the business question "why should we pay more for your laptops instead of getting dells?".
How you really know that, as it sounds like just strongly held belief to me!

The world has changed (yet again), whether we like it or not, and business laptops will never again be what they once were :idea:

Cheers,

Bill B.

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Re: T440p / T540p / W540 / L440 / L540 announcement

#17 Post by laowai » Thu Sep 19, 2013 11:32 am

So apparently the business world has decided that physical buttons suck, function key groupings suck, logical layouts suck, thinklights are out and latches are just too hard or something. But the print screen button... oh that's a gift from god and needs to be slapped somewhere prominent.

Allow me to elaborate on my disgust.
Ever since the changes started becoming more severe, I would take one look at it, feel sick, and then spend a few days away. Mentally I decide that maybe, just maybe I might be able to accept it. But then it turns out there are even more small observations I missed the first time over and that's a deal killer. It's not a "thinkpad" anymore, it's a [censored] dell with an apple price tag. The only value left is "intangible value" based on the misconceived notion that they actually know what they are doing. Sure, they might be able to turn more of a profit or something, but that doesn't make it not crap.

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Re: T440p / T540p / W540 / L440 / L540 announcement

#18 Post by bill bolton » Sun Sep 22, 2013 1:19 am

laowai wrote:So apparently the business world has decided that physical buttons suck, function key groupings suck, logical layouts suck, thinklights are out and latches are just too hard or something. But the print screen button... oh that's a gift from god and needs to be slapped somewhere prominent.
OK, so definitely just strongly held belief then :roll:

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Re: T440p / T540p / W540 / L440 / L540 announcement

#19 Post by lophiomys » Wed Sep 25, 2013 8:35 am

instead of calling it a "strongly held belief",
we might alternatively call it "actual customer demand",
even if this might be a small one, Lenovo would benefit from a
strudy, quality prone Classic line by receiving lots and overwhelming good
feedback from the traditional customer base.
Only the marketing and advertisement value alone would be worth it.

Compare it to the 300+ complaintive replies concering keyboard and design on the Lenovo Blog.
There is a demand.

Besides, I fear that Lenovo have lost the engineering skills and supplier realations
to be able to produce a good old Thinkpad. Besides some of the customer base, who already wander off elsewhere.

So Long.
Lophiomys
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Re: T440p / T540p / W540 / L440 / L540 announcement

#20 Post by mrj47 » Fri Sep 27, 2013 3:08 am

laowai wrote:Sigh... it seems every iteration is the same.
One step forward, three steps back.
This is so true. High res screens, but at what compromise? No more trackpoint buttons, 1 dimm slot, no more thinklight, etc - putting more empasis on feedback from their 'consumer insights' (thin is in!), which leaves loyalists to adapt or die. What happened to 'no compromises'!

Steve Jobs respected the X300 (or so they claim), so I think Lenovo didn't need to sacriface utility for the sake of 'thinness', not everyone wants a friggin' ultrabook. I want a ultraportable. But you're seeing manufacturers like Intel push for ultrabooks as PC sales continue to decline, so I don't believe it is entirely Lenovo's fault. They're just trying to stay relevant.

I can't find the post, but I remember reading a Lenovo blog post about how they did a study on users reaction on thinness/weight and users didn't mind if the laptop was a little bit heavier if it had more features. Something like that, maybe I just imagined it. :?

It's just tough for folks who like the traditional Thinkpad, for its build quality, awesome keyboard, focus on getting things done over looking shiny. Honestly, I wouldn't even mind paying more... if I could just have a beefed up X201 for example, I think this shows the poor quality of notebook manufacturers, I don't think anyone is going to fill in this void (Elitebooks/Lattitudes are okay, but lets face it - they're never going to be like a Thinkpad). Maybe when the 3d printing revolution comes we can relive the glory days.
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Re: T440p / T540p / W540 / L440 / L540 announcement

#21 Post by cheetahdriver » Tue Oct 08, 2013 9:57 pm

Well, this just decided me on a new Surface Pro 2 in 512Gb. My W520 can continue service until I get everything changed over to the Surface, but I see no reason to shell out the money for a sub-average experience on W540. If I need a big, high powered machine I will go with a Dell.

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Re: T440p / T540p / W540 / L440 / L540 announcement

#22 Post by sir_synthsalot » Wed Oct 30, 2013 8:05 pm

bill bolton wrote:The world has changed (yet again), whether we like it or not, and business laptops will never again be what they once were :idea:
I don't think anyone is asking them to be overbuilt $3000 machines. They can still be inexpensive and retain common-sense features. For example just look at that keyboard layout. It looks like they are trying to compete with Apple, where aesthetics and "snazz" trump functionality. Apple is very popular in China, so I could see a reason why they are making Thinkpads this way.

Looking at Lenovo's confused product lineup, the term "business laptop" is now mostly a marketing term with little substance behind it.
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Re: T440p / T540p / W540 / L440 / L540 announcement

#23 Post by Utwig » Thu Dec 12, 2013 8:58 am

Got my hands on T540p with 3k display.

Dispay is awesome. More reflective than UXGA Flexviews but not shiny.

The rims are symmetric and about 13mm wide. Still not like 1cm on T40x and T60x series but not 25mm nearly 1 inch like on some widescreen ones.

The new trackpad is rubbish.

First it's flimsy, you can slide it around by 0,5 mm. Clicking on wobbly trackpad is uncomfortable.
2nd there is no more middle click. The center button does just scrolling, there is no way to choose neither and use center button to open new tabs in browser.

This is a killer for me.

They managed to muck up keyboard layout, removed scrl lock and mucked pg up pg down, removed volume keys, yet they added 4 keys which have no function at all above numeric pad with dravings of calculator, lock, world and folder. No average user knows what those keys do and will never use them.

Keyboard is good. I have no problem with chiclets, I have problem with layout.

The edge of palmrest is not sharp and will not cause uncomfort like the HPs 6xxx and 8xxx series from around 2007/8 did

The base is slightly (1mm) taller than 14" T60p. Display is less reinforced (goodbye roll cage) than 14 T60p which had roll cage only in base and not in display. You can skewer it. The hinges are good, you can still push back notebook by top of display. The base is very rigid and cannot be skewered.

The large thinkpad logo and lighted dot in i seem gaudy.

The optical drive seems flimsier and cheaper than Ultrabay slim.

It's like the thicker drive from R series. Like I said some time ago. They killed T series and rebranded R series as T series and introduced cheaper Edge and L series.

This seems to an extent like HP had a unlawful child with Apple. They took the stuff I didn't like on HPs (unreinforced display with no distance from keyboard, thick base of laptop and 7 shaped instead of > shaped edge of laptop and tacketd on apple's lousy keyboard layout with chepaer knockoff clickable trackpad which is not as firm as on apple.

They added bunch of useless key combos but dropped Fn F4 for standby, Fn F5 for wifi manager, and other fn combos which have been the same since my A21p from 2003 and probably before that.
T540p, T420s, T400, R61, X61t, T60p, T42p, A21p

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Re: T440p / T540p / W540 / L440 / L540 announcement

#24 Post by lophiomys » Wed Feb 26, 2014 8:38 am

Utwig wrote:Got my hands on T540p with 3k display.
...
This seems to an extent like HP had a unlawful child with Apple.
...
Well said, thank you for this useful report.

Friendly greetings from a neigbour,
Lo PHi
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Re: T440p / T540p / W540 / L440 / L540 announcement

#25 Post by ajkula66 » Wed Feb 26, 2014 10:44 am

It's quite interesting that some of us are seeing the "HP parallel" with the *40 generation...here's what I wrote on NBR regarding a T440p that I had a brief encounter with...

I had a chance to play with a T440p FHD a couple of weeks ago. A couple of quick impressions would include:

a) A great screen. No questions asked.

b) Even if I wanted to - which is not the case - I doubt that I could ever get used to the new TrackPoint setup. Pretty certain that the machine would end up smashed to pieces or returned to Lenovo first.

c) Keyboard feels more shallow than the ones on *30 series. It might have been just this particular piece and/or manufacturer, but I did sense a feeling of travel loss.

d) The laptop, generally speaking, doesn't feel like a ThinkPad at all when held. Something about it reminded me of an old business-grade HP that my daughter owned at one point, but that might just be my warped memory. While I wouldn't say it feels cheap, it most definitely does feel different, and in a way that I don't find attractive. Obviously, to each their own.

My $0.02 only...
So, Utwig, are you returning the T540p or keeping it?
...Knowledge is a deadly friend when no one sets the rules...(King Crimson)

Cheers,

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