Thinking of Replacing my 600E after 10 years...

[Nigellus]

For the past 10 years, my favorite (and primary) computer has been my trusty IBM ThinkPad 600E.

Well, the time has come. I've worn out yet another AC adapter, and it's time to start looking for spare parts again--either that, or to upgrade.

Since a lot of new web standards are really starting to impact my browsing experience on my 12 year old system, I'm thinking that it might be time to upgrade.

I'm looking for something with at least a Core 2 Duo processor. Beyond that, I'm interested in the keyboard, the size, and the weight.

Specifically, the best keyboard I've ever used is the 600E keyboard, and my work involves a lot of typing, so a good keyboard is the most important aspect.

As for weight, I'd like the machine to not be bigger than my 600E if it can be helped, and lighter would be better. I carry my laptop in my briefcase a lot and I really would prefer something less than 5 lbs.

It also has to be something I could conceivably get for under $250. I have a small budget.

Any recommendations?

[Harryc]

600e's, weighing in at 5.6 lbs are pretty heavy by today's standards, so something lighter is no issue. Dimensions are 300 mm (11.8 in) x 240 mm (9.4 in) x 36.5 mm (1.4 in) x 36.5 mm (1.4 in). So to get the same size and a Core 2 Duo machine, you're looking at an Ultraportable. I am thinking that an X61 is the machine for you. The X61's are 10.5 by 9.4 by 1.5, 3.8Lbs min weight. Much lighter than your 600e, but around the same size. You should be able to find one around your budget. Start on our marketplace forum with a WTB ad, or try EBay. The only caveat with the X61 is that it has no optical drive, so you'd need a USB optical drive or an X6 Ultrabase with a CDRW/DVD combo drive.
Maybe something like this - http://cgi.ebay.com/Lenovo-ThinkPad-X61 ... 1c1c3ed11e

[ssd_thinkpad]

Is the 600E keyboard a standard size keyboard? If you want a similar experience, get a T series. The X series has a slightly smaller keyboard which I noticed. You can get a T60 or T61 with standard display ratio (4:3) with some luck for less than 250 USD.

[Nigellus]

Is the 600E keyboard a standard size keyboard? If you want a similar experience, get a T series. The X series has a slightly smaller keyboard which I noticed. You can get a T60 or T61 with standard display ratio (4:3) with some luck for less than 250 USD.

It is a standard sized keyboard, though it feels slightly smaller under my fingers. I wonder if I could find something in the x series to test...? I think I saw one at Best Buy, but that was a couple of years ago now.

[Nigellus]

Thanks for the suggestions, folks. I really appreciate it.

For your amusement, this is from a review of the ThinkPad x61:

I was also surprised by how easy it was to upgrade the ram in the X61, by removing a access panel on the bottom of the laptop. This is the only ThinkPad that doesn’t require you to remove the palm rest for this upgrade.

http://www.notebookreview.com/default.asp?newsID=3765

(For the uninitiated, the way you access the RAM in a 600E is to remove an access panel on the bottom of the laptop.)

[pianowizard]

I wonder if I could find something in the x series to test...? I think I saw one at Best Buy, but that was a couple of years ago now.

I saw an X120e at Micro Center last week.

[ssd_thinkpad]

The actual x series has a full size keyboard because the widescreen allows it. The 4:3 display ratio x series notebooks have all smaller keys than the t series. Definitely check the keyboards out. I liked my x60 but I did not like typing on it, it's okay for internet, but definitely not for doing office work. If you only need a notebook for some time and have it the rest of the day in a docking station, an old x series is a nice tool to have.

[j-dawg]

I have an X61 tablet with the "ess than full size" keyboard, but I have small hands. It's pretty much my only computer. I love the keyboard.

[sir_synthsalot]

For your amusement, this is from a review of the ThinkPad x61:

Probably referring to Thinkpads in production at the time.

Using a 600E everyday in this day and age - that's impressive.

[Nigellus]

The actual x series has a full size keyboard because the widescreen allows it. The 4:3 display ratio x series notebooks have all smaller keys than the t series. Definitely check the keyboards out. I liked my x60 but I did not like typing on it, it's okay for internet, but definitely not for doing office work. If you only need a notebook for some time and have it the rest of the day in a docking station, an old x series is a nice tool to have.

That's definitely something to think about. A T60 or T61 is a little wider and deeper than my 600E, but it's thinner, which is a plus, and weighs at least 1/2 lb less... so it could be an acceptable option.

The x60 or 61, however, is less wide, less deep, thinner, and a lot lighter than my 600E. That sounds excellent my arm can get tired sometimes holding my heavy briefcase. But it will come down to the keyboard.

I was worried for a moment. I was looking at the x120e's keyboard on Lenovo's site, and it has the uncontoured keys that are so popular with laptop makers these days. It is especially a problem with the flat Caps Lock key that can lead to me missing the 'a' and suddenly finding myself typing in all caps before I realize what's happened.

Fortunately, the x60 and the x220 seem to have normal ThinkPad (contoured) keys.

I have an X61 tablet with the "less than full size" keyboard, but I have small hands. It's pretty much my only computer. I love the keyboard.

I have large hands, but I find myself hoping that my experience is, nonetheless like yours.

Thanks for the advice, everyone. It's very helpful.

[Nigellus]

Nigellus wrote: "For your amusement, this is from a review of the ThinkPad x61"

Probably referring to Thinkpads in production at the time.

Probably. I'm just showing my age.

Using a 600E everyday in this day and age - that's impressive.

Well, I cheat a bit. I use my NetVista for most of my heavy duty interactive web research tools. But my actual composition, typing, and editing is done on my 600E, which I also use for basic e-mail and forums like this one.

[Nigellus]

Slightly off topic... I'm pretty handy with ThinkPads (so long as I can get the parts), so to keep costs down, I haven't been ruling out damaged units that I might be able to repair.

I have one little complaint though.... Why is the HD caddy and the cover always missing. I mean, I can understand the HD being gone, and even the caddy, but the cover? Come on.

[rkawakami]

My guess would be that for many of the Thinkpad systems, the HD cover is either bolted to the sides of the drive/caddy or requires a hard drive to be installed in the system in order to fasten the cover in place (the screw holding the cover is threaded into the bottom of the drive). No drive = no way to secure the cover with a screw. Many systems I've purchased off of eBay that did not come with a hard drive but that did include the cover, were taped in place. Those were in the minority, as you have seen.

[pianowizard]

A T60 or T61 is a little wider and deeper than my 600E, but it's thinner, which is a plus, and weighs at least 1/2 lb less... so it could be an acceptable option.

The weight difference is 0.4 lb at most, and if you replace the 600E's original 12mm HDD with a 9mm one, the difference becomes even smaller. However, if you want to make the T60 as light as possible, you can shed 0.4 lb by replacing the optical drive with a travel bezel. I am not sure if there was a travel bezel for the 600 series.

I think the T60 would be the best laptop for you to upgrade to. I mentioned the X120e just because you had said you wanted to try an X series at a local store. It's a well-built Thinkpad but if you don't like its keyboard, then it's not for you.

[ssd_thinkpad]

If you have larger hands you will feel a difference between a T and a X series keyboard. The x series keyboard was at least too small for me.

The newer x series has a full size keyboard. But because of the newer form factor, the palm rest is much shorter that your larger hands can not rest on the palm "rest" any more.

[RealBlackStuff]

If you don't want too much of a change, I have a nice selection of T23 machines.
You'd feel straight at home on these!

I've also got a nice T60 with 14.1" XGA (4:3 aspect) and Intel graphics. (1951-44U)
A very cool running machine.
PM me if interested.

[Nigellus]

If you don't want too much of a change, I have a nice selection of T23 machines.
You'd feel straight at home on these!

Don't tempt me. I love the T23, but I won't be doing myself any favors in the long run getting attached to one (unless it's possible to upgrade to a modern motherboard and other components).

I've also got a nice T60 with 14.1" XGA (4:3 aspect) and Intel graphics. (1951-44U)
A very cool running machine.
PM me if interested.

That may be the way to go... though after budget negotiations, it turns out that price is a bigger issue to certain members of my household than I thought.

As such, I'm expanding my options to T42s and X41s, though I suppose the X41 keyboard would also be smaller?

[craigmontHunter]

The x41 keyboard is smaller, and I would reccomend against a T4* or R5* with ATI graphics - all you need to do is tell them a T60 will last for another 10 years, and it is a better investment then getting the cheapest one possible - it works all the time for me . on a related note, I have large hands (aka I get random people commenting on how big my hands are), and the keyboard on my T61 is perfect - IMHO the T60 is probably your best bet of the choices given.

[Nigellus]

all you need to do is tell them a T60 will last for another 10 years, and it is a better investment then getting the cheapest one possible

That's actually not a bad argument. I'll give it a shot, because I do want to avoid having to upgrade too quickly. Meanwhile, I'll keep my eye on junkers that I can repair (though they're not cheap, either... some of these bidders are crazy, unless they already own the missing or broken components)

I have large hands (aka I get random people commenting on how big my hands are), and the keyboard on my T61 is perfect - IMHO the T60 is probably your best bet of the choices given.

This seems to be the consensus... I guess I won't know what I'm missing in the weight department since I'm already used to my 5 & 3/4 lb 600E.

I like the travel bezel idea, I never use my cd drive anymore, anyway. I just wish I could get that weight down under 5lbs... but the slimmer profile will help with space issues.

[GomJabbar]

Wow!

I've got a 600E that still works, but it is just too slow for today's OS's IMO.

You might look into a 14.1" T4x/T6x series or X4x's/X6x's series ThinkPad. The T4x/T6x series has a larger display (14.1" or 15") than the 600E and the X series a smaller display (12.1"). I have a T42 (my favorite of the T4x series) that I am still quite happy with although I did just buy a new X220 to replace it.

[Nigellus]

Wow!

I've got a 600E that still works, but it is just too slow for today's OS's IMO.

I'm not running today's OS's. It's Windows 98 SE all the way! Of course, I'm finding that sites like myspace, yahoo, and youtube are too slow in their interactions with my OS... that is if they interact at all. I can't access myspace's new format at all.

You might look into a 14.1" T4x/T6x series or X4x's/X6x's series ThinkPad. The T4x/T6x series has a larger display (14.1" or 15") than the 600E and the X series a smaller display (12.1"). I have a T42 (my favorite of the T4x series) that I am still quite happy with although I did just buy a new X220 to replace it.

Thanks for the advice.

[ozzymud]

I'm not running today's OS's. It's Windows 98 SE all the way! Of course, I'm finding that sites like myspace, yahoo, and youtube are too slow in their interactions with my OS... that is if they interact at all. I can't access myspace's new format at all.

And with KernelEx you can run some software that "requires" XP

http://sourceforge.net/projects/kernelex/

Run Firefox 3.6.x instead fo Firefox 2.0.0.20

[Nigellus]

And with KernelEx you can run some software that "requires" XP

http://sourceforge.net/projects/kernelex/

Run Firefox 3.6.x instead fo Firefox 2.0.0.20

I'm trying that tonight!

[ozzymud]

It's awesome, even the Adobe Flash Player installer wont complain anymore

[Nigellus]

Run Firefox 3.6.x instead fo Firefox 2.0.0.20

I hate it when that happens... the new firefox ate my bookmarks. Too tired to look for/restore them.

[ozzymud]

Anytime before tring a major change in version, use MozBackup, this will backup EVERYTHING, the entire profile, plugins, settings, bookmarks... I put it on every persons machine I convert to Firefox/Thunderbird... I install Firefox, get all the essential plugins installed, get their bookmarks sorted, then do a full backup... Then when they play around(which i encourage) and muck up their profile... they are easily back with the backup (and hopefully learnt from their mistake ).

http://mozbackup.jasnapaka.com/

Works for:
* Firefox 1.0 - 4.0
* Thunderbird 1.0 - 3.3a
* Sunbird 0.3 - 0.9
* Flock 1.0 - 2.6
* Postbox (Express) 1.0 - 1.1
* SeaMonkey 1.0a - 2.0
* Mozilla Suite 1.7 - 1.7.x
* Spicebird 0.4 - 0.8
* Songbird 1.0 - 1.7
* Netscape 7.x, 9.x
* Wyzo

[Nigellus]

Well, I was able to restore my bookmarks. Not a lot of trouble, I just have to teach myself to do it each time because I tend to forget if I don't have to do it for a long time.

Thanks a lot, ozzymud. Now you've helped me restore my 600E to basic functionality. The goal was to buy a new ThinkPad. How are my budget negotiations going to look now that I have a computer that does pretty much what I need it to do again?

[Nigellus]

Look what I just failed to win:

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?Vi ... fresh=true

It's described as a Lenovo Thinkpad T61 Intel C2D 2GHz 14.1"

It was around $80 until one minute remained. It ended at $152.49--it looks like at least one other person had the same idea as me.

I know it was someone here who got it. Fess up. Who was it?

I'm going to be mad if you didn't even need a new laptop.

[Nigellus]

Can anyone tell me anything about the x301? I might have the opportunity to get one on the cheap.

[lead_org]

what do you want to know about the X301?