Bizarre Lenovo return experience - need advice

[FragrantHead]

I recently took delivery of a Thinkpad X220 that had a broken display lid sensor. Rather than get it repaired I chose to return the machine for a refund. As a consumer in Europe you may return online-bought goods within 7 days for a full refund, without giving a reason. This is enshrined in European legislation, the so-called "Distance Selling Directive". Wanting to keep things simple I chose to invoke that legislation, was issued an RMA and returned the machine in the original shipping carton. Lenovo / Digital River, the online processing company they use, even paid for the courier.

Their email said "my account will be credited within 7-10 business days". This hasn't happened. As a consumer I don't actually have an account, but paid with my credit card. Therefore, 2 1/2 weeks after the courier-confirmed return delivery date, I emailed Digital River asking what form the refund will take, e.g. credit card refund, cheque in the mail, whatever. Does anyone here, in Europe, have any experience in how that actually works for consumers ordering from the Lenovo web-site?

What happened next was very strange. Basically I think I'm on to people in India, always someone different, though always with a (fake?) European-sounding name. The first reply I got was: "As it shows in your order it is still not refunded. Unfortunately, we are unable to assist you regarding your concern because ther are no reasons given why you want to request for a refund."

In my next email I explained the Distance Selling Directive: no reason need be given. Never mind the fact the machine was already returned and this should be water under the bridge.

Today they have issued another RMA and asked me to return the machine to an address in the USA, not the return address in England that I already shipped the machine back to. I have emailed them back again, trying to explain, but have little faith they understand English nor that they are reading through the email history, contained in each email, that already detailed the previous RMA.

What to do? Try to get a refund from the credit card company? Take Digital River to court? There must be something before it comes to that. Should I just wait for the wheels on the original RMA to grind away and refund my credit card? I feel I should do something.

[killer]

Lenovo UK is based in Hook near Basingstoke in Hampshire. Call their head office by looking up the number on 'saynoto0870.com' and ask to speak to a senior manager. If that doesn't work then, if you are near the area, go and knock on their door. Also local trading standards officers will be pleased to help if you have all the evidence, which appears to be the case.

BTW, their sales number is 01256 741600. Ask to speak to the sales manager. Their warranty support number is 01475 897161. Their technical support number is 01475 555055 ... but this might take you to someone in India. If it does, just ask to speak to the supervisor. They will gladly do this and be very polite.

If all else fails send a letter to the Finance Director at Hook and ask for full compensation ... which includes recovery of all costs.

Let us know how you get on with your claim.

Good luck.

[j-dawg]

Did you keep the shipping receipt?

[schmaud]

did you consider asking your cc company to get the money back??

cheers

r.

[FragrantHead]

Thank you all for your advice and private message. To continue the story, I got another email saying my credit card would be refunded within 7 days, but of course nothing happened. I then went through the links in previous emails and located a phone number for Digital River in Ireland, where I live. I got on to a person who was completely on the ball and received the refund to my credit card today.

Everything worked out, but I wonder whether it's a sign of the times, everything seems to be sub-contracted. This made for a very confusing and at times confounding experience. The web-site says Lenovo, but purchases are processed by Digital River. Warranty servicing is still handled by IBM, but not returns. IBM wouldn't recognise Lenovo's order numbers/emails without a very specific invoice PDF. That was available online, looking hard enough, but IBM were no help in finding it. Shipment arrived via a Lenovo depot in Dublin, but returns were to a company called Ingram Micro in England. The courier was supposed to be City Link, but the van said Target Express, a subsidiary (thank God for Wikipedia). The tracking link indicated delivery in Northern Ireland, not in England as per the address label - worrying, but apparantly above board. The people you initially email and who generated the RMA were evidently based in India. They could not help in completing the return, e.g. by checking up on Ingram Micro, due to a language barrier for one thing. According to the very helpful guy on the phone, they were the wrong department for that.

[dr_st]

Everything worked out, but I wonder whether it's a sign of the times, everything seems to be sub-contracted. This made for a very confusing and at times confounding experience.

I can feel your frustration. Last year I bought a warranty extension from Lenovo, which apparently they weren't supposed to sell me (due to some stupid policy). They of course refused to apply it (without stating any reason or even admitting that there is a problem), and to find out why I had to talk to Mark on the Lenovo forums. Then they still couldn't get themselves around to refund me properly, and in the end I had to dispute the charge with AmEx to get the money back. The whole process took about 4 months, most of which was me waiting for about 5 different representatives to "inquire and get back to me".

Steadily decreasing quality of customer service is indeed the sign of times when everything is subcontracted.

[sammiking]

I tried to place an order with Lenovo from August and because we request the order to deliver to a different address (the children starting uni) and messed up with the order, after that every time the promotion returns I resubmit the order and could never get through the payment stage (I tried one card after another).
Eventually I made about 10 phone calls to digital rivers although each time they promise to lift the ban after 30 minutes I still can not buy a laptop for my sons.
Unfortunate in my case, my son really like the Lenovo model and need a laptop to start uni but digital rivers simply have no customer service and is not keen to resolve any problem arising from online purchase. They been questioning me like a fraudster! Now all my addresses are blocked (including business registered address and the grandparents! )

[killer]

@Sammiking: Which country are you in ... it doesn't show on your post?

[RealBlackStuff]

He's in Bucks. UK

(Click on somebody's Profile button to see where they are located).

[killer]

Thank you, RBS.

[buzzlight]

Hi folks,

I too have an odd story but with a happy ending. My wife's lenovo (U450p) starting having problems with both the LCD and the wifi (LCD was intermittant, and wifi just stopped working altogether). I had the extended protection plan so I sent it back with an RMA for repair. Lenovo sent it back to us claiming the necessary repairs had been done, but the wifi still wouldn't work and the screen started having problems again weeks later. I suspected wire chafing in the lid joint to be the culprit ... and sent it back to Lenovo again under a new RMA. During the shipment to Lenovo, Fedex just plain lost the package (or someone stole it). 30 days later there was no sign of it. I called Lenovo support to find out what to do - while they were sympathetic, they claimed that since I shipped it, I needed to be the one to file the claim with Fedex, which I thought was odd, since Lenovo paid for the shipment through the RMA and suspected they should handle the claim, and by the way give me a new laptop or cash value for the old one.

I filed the claim with Fedex, and never heard back. I called for an update, found out that they immediately had settled the claim, but sent it to Lenovo since they were the payer of shipment on record. So now I'm out a laptop, AND compensation from the settled claim. A few more calls to Fedex, and I finally get someone who could tell me the name and phone number at Lenovo who actually received the claim check. I called him, explained the situation, and he put me in touch with customer relations. They verified my story (RMA#, record of lost package, and the receipt of the claim check from Fedex). Turns out since Lenovo ships uninsured the claim check was only $100. That's ok, I didn't even have to ask - customer relations people let my wife pick out any ideapad currently on the TigerDirect website and order it for free. Now the owner of a slick new U400.

Now, that was a weird one.

[Mike77]

It looks like Lenovo / Digital River hasn't changed its habits from so many years ago. Below is my experience with Digital River. I've posted it in the Lenovo forums, but the moderators keep deleting it.

Almost a week ago I've tried to buy a Thinkpad on Lenovo's website in UK which is not in fact Lenovo, but another company called Digital River with a dubious and fraudulent behaviour. After I place the order I receive an email claiming that the order has been received. However, the email did not specify the amount paid, the configuration of the laptop, the estimated delivary date, etc. Several hours later I received an email stating that my order was cancelled because I did not provide a "verifiable email address and phone number".

In the meantime, the transaction had been initiated on my credit card. I then tried to contact Lenovo / Digital River countless times using any conceivable avenue but they never answered my calls or emails. One week after this ordeal the transaction still appears as if it is in progress, the amount I was supposed to pay initially still has the status blocked on my credit card and my bank says there is nothing they can do.

Moreover, it is impossible to contact the actual Lenovo in UK or anywhere in Europe. And to make things even worse, instead of solving my problem, they keep deleting my posts, rather than provide any support in solving this issue.

[BillMorrow]

the only thing I can say to this is lenovo isn't IBM..

not being in the UK I can't try it myself to see what's going on but if I were you I would start with Lenovo customer support and when they say "sorry Charlie, that's someone else's bit" I would escalate as far as I can..

OH! we won't delete your post here..
and welcome to THIS forum..

[Temetka]

I have had good RMA's with Thinkpads in the U.S., never had a problem like the ones described by the posters above me. That being said with millions of customers world-wide, a few slipping through the cracks is bound to happen. I do feel sorry for you guys who posted your stories and hope everything works(ed) out for you.

Just throwing this out there. I have never had any kind of problem with Dell. Orders for my clients go through fine, all verification communications are on the up and up, the machines are built and shipped quickly. I am very happy with them. They even help me with out of warranty machines. But I have only ever purchased Latitude's and Precision's from them. I avoid the Inspiron's and Vostro's as they are, IMO, utter junk.