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X3100 / 965 express Intel graphics webGL-enabled driver

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tecmes
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X3100 / 965 express Intel graphics webGL-enabled driver

#1 Post by tecmes » Mon Feb 01, 2021 6:32 pm

According to the WebGL help page, the X3100/i965 intel graphics that's used in some older TP (X61 in my case, and some other of similar gen) COULD be compatible, but requires the Intel driver version 8.15.10.1930, while Lenovo offers only .1867 for the X61S. I've found the .1930 driver here but it says the computer is not listed as authorized for this version.

Anyone has tried / had more luck? Or knows a trick there?
Typer: X61s. Drawer: X31. Office: T560. First crush: X20. Nostalgia: SXGA+ 770 (one busted power card too many)
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Re: X3100 / 965 express Intel graphics webGL-enabled driver

#2 Post by kfzhu1229 » Mon Feb 01, 2021 7:14 pm

From my brief experience with the X3100 graphics in Windows 10, the experience was horrible. Lots of tiny graphical glitches here and there and crappy image quality on higher resolution panels (X61 should be fine). Install directly using the device manager?
Also on a side note I am curious about your 770 with dead power board as I have a 770ED with the exact same problem and it would be nice if I can find what's actually the culprit.
I imagine it's the 3.3V power supply chip that's dead as 3.3V is not found while only 16V is.
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Re: X3100 / 965 express Intel graphics webGL-enabled driver

#3 Post by tecmes » Tue Feb 02, 2021 11:22 am

kfzhu1229 wrote:
Mon Feb 01, 2021 7:14 pm
Also on a side note I am curious about your 770 with dead power board as I have a 770ED with the exact same problem and it would be nice if I can find what's actually the culprit
Sorry that was a long time ago, I don't have it anymore!
Typer: X61s. Drawer: X31. Office: T560. First crush: X20. Nostalgia: SXGA+ 770 (one busted power card too many)
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Re: X3100 / 965 express Intel graphics webGL-enabled driver

#4 Post by kfzhu1229 » Tue Feb 02, 2021 9:54 pm

tecmes wrote:
Tue Feb 02, 2021 11:22 am
Sorry that was a long time ago, I don't have it anymore!
Ah okay well I found it rather baffling that the power board gave up and I was not able to get it fixed thanks to pretty much all laptops from that era having no schematics.
For now I put my suspicion on a potentially dead max1631ea1 chip as it receives 16V but outputs no 3.3V or 5V, and that I remembered plugging in a USB that sends power through the USB port made it turn on somewhat.
Anyway have you tried forcing Windows to install the drivers?
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Re: X3100 / 965 express Intel graphics webGL-enabled driver

#5 Post by axur-delmeria » Wed Feb 03, 2021 6:48 am

I doubt you'll be able to get webGL on the GMA X3100. Why? webGL 1.0 is based on OpenGL ES 2.0, which in turn is based on OpenGL 2.0. The Windows driver for the GMA X3100 only has OpenGL 1.4 support.
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Re: X3100 / 965 express Intel graphics webGL-enabled driver

#6 Post by tecmes » Wed Feb 03, 2021 1:32 pm

axur-delmeria wrote:
Wed Feb 03, 2021 6:48 am
I doubt you'll be able to get webGL on the GMA X3100. Why? webGL 1.0 is based on OpenGL ES 2.0, which in turn is based on OpenGL 2.0. The Windows driver for the GMA X3100 only has OpenGL 1.4 support.
But it's possible that the .1931 driver somehow has better support? OK, I doubt it, but I got the info from the WebGL mozilla.org page which list driver versions which are supposed to work (here), and it seems like a rather good source.
Anyway.. if the driver is not installable (I tried unzipping and installing from the device manager, too), the point is moot! Also if it worked it would likely be very slow.
Typer: X61s. Drawer: X31. Office: T560. First crush: X20. Nostalgia: SXGA+ 770 (one busted power card too many)
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Re: X3100 / 965 express Intel graphics webGL-enabled driver

#7 Post by kfzhu1229 » Wed Feb 03, 2021 4:06 pm

tecmes wrote:
Wed Feb 03, 2021 1:32 pm
Anyway.. if the driver is not installable (I tried unzipping and installing from the device manager, too), the point is moot! Also if it worked it would likely be very slow.
Actually slow isn't even gonna be the biggest problem. The biggest problem with Intel iGPU's is that sometimes they have poor compatibility and causes graphical glitches! that's especially apparent with X3100 in Windows 10 where practically no UWP apps will work properly. The NVidia chip simply has far better driver support, and the latest drivers for NVS 140M are a whole 6 years newer! But yeah it's a X61 so you don't have that option.
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Re: X3100 / 965 express Intel graphics webGL-enabled driver

#8 Post by iamdmc » Tue Sep 14, 2021 6:31 am

kfzhu1229 wrote:
Wed Feb 03, 2021 4:06 pm
tecmes wrote:
Wed Feb 03, 2021 1:32 pm
Anyway.. if the driver is not installable (I tried unzipping and installing from the device manager, too), the point is moot! Also if it worked it would likely be very slow.
Actually slow isn't even gonna be the biggest problem. The biggest problem with Intel iGPU's is that sometimes they have poor compatibility and causes graphical glitches! that's especially apparent with X3100 in Windows 10 where practically no UWP apps will work properly. The NVidia chip simply has far better driver support, and the latest drivers for NVS 140M are a whole 6 years newer! But yeah it's a X61 so you don't have that option.
Hello fellow Canadians and X61 lovers

Did you ever get the X61 X3100 to play nice with Windows 10? I'm trying to drive an external 1080P LCD (connected to an eDP board, and active VGA out from X61 to HDMI into the eDP board) at 1920x1080 but I get black bars on the sides -likely due to hsync or vsync issues but I can't figure out how to fix

Strangely, it outputs correctly when viewing the Windows 10 desktop through a remote desktop (Anydesk) so it's definitely a VGA-related issue, but a software one rather than hardware because... It works perfectly on Ubuntu 20.04 - no config needed.

I've tried every 965/945 express and X3100 driver that I could find and nothing has worked in Windows 10. Any ideas?
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Re: X3100 / 965 express Intel graphics webGL-enabled driver

#9 Post by mikemex » Tue Sep 14, 2021 10:37 am

kfzhu1229 wrote:
Wed Feb 03, 2021 4:06 pm
The biggest problem with Intel iGPU's is that sometimes they have poor compatibility and causes graphical glitches! that's especially apparent with X3100 in Windows 10 where practically no UWP apps will work properly. The NVidia chip simply has far better driver support.
It's the other way around. It's software (such as games) what ships broken and creates the artifacts. nVidia just got good at embedding workarounds to make broken software to run "properly".

Users usually don't really know what's going on and simply assume that, if it "looks good" then "works fine". But it's not the case. And a big part of the reason why alternate OSes such as Linux find it hard to support features normally available in Windows: sometimes the hardware itself is faulty, and it doesn't work as it is supposed to, but this is hidden from the user via a series of workarounds (starting by the upgradeable CPU microcode).
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Re: X3100 / 965 express Intel graphics webGL-enabled driver

#10 Post by kfzhu1229 » Tue Sep 14, 2021 1:07 pm

iamdmc wrote:
Tue Sep 14, 2021 6:31 am
Hello fellow Canadians and X61 lovers

Did you ever get the X61 X3100 to play nice with Windows 10? I'm trying to drive an external 1080P LCD (connected to an eDP board, and active VGA out from X61 to HDMI into the eDP board) at 1920x1080 but I get black bars on the sides -likely due to hsync or vsync issues but I can't figure out how to fix

Strangely, it outputs correctly when viewing the Windows 10 desktop through a remote desktop (Anydesk) so it's definitely a VGA-related issue, but a software one rather than hardware because... It works perfectly on Ubuntu 20.04 - no config needed.

I've tried every 965/945 express and X3100 driver that I could find and nothing has worked in Windows 10. Any ideas?
You should just get an older 1080p or WUXGA monitor that supports VGA instead of fiddling with the chain of converters that you have.
Does the 965GM support DVI output? I know the older 915 series don't. If you can get DVI working, just use DVI to HDMI through the dock and that would be a world better.
Besides, the 965GM struggles really badly with WUXGA resolution anyway
mikemex wrote:
Tue Sep 14, 2021 10:37 am
It's the other way around. It's software (such as games) what ships broken and creates the artifacts. nVidia just got good at embedding workarounds to make broken software to run "properly".
As far as running Windows 10 is concerned, the fact that the 140M has Windows 10 drivers and also has full DX10 support makes it much more usable than the 965, which is still stuck with Windows 7 drivers and doesn't have DX10 support.
If you have ever tried the earlier generation of NVidia GPU's, like the NVS 130M and the Quadro FX 350M, 3500M, it is just as sketchy in Windows 10 as the 965GM is. It's strange that those don't even have proper Windows 7 drivers while the NVS 140M has Windows 10 drivers.
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Re: X3100 / 965 express Intel graphics webGL-enabled driver

#11 Post by iamdmc » Tue Sep 14, 2021 2:34 pm

kfzhu1229 wrote:
Tue Sep 14, 2021 1:07 pm
iamdmc wrote:
Tue Sep 14, 2021 6:31 am
Hello fellow Canadians and X61 lovers

Did you ever get the X61 X3100 to play nice with Windows 10? I'm trying to drive an external 1080P LCD (connected to an eDP board, and active VGA out from X61 to HDMI into the eDP board) at 1920x1080 but I get black bars on the sides -likely due to hsync or vsync issues but I can't figure out how to fix

Strangely, it outputs correctly when viewing the Windows 10 desktop through a remote desktop (Anydesk) so it's definitely a VGA-related issue, but a software one rather than hardware because... It works perfectly on Ubuntu 20.04 - no config needed.

I've tried every 965/945 express and X3100 driver that I could find and nothing has worked in Windows 10. Any ideas?
You should just get an older 1080p or WUXGA monitor that supports VGA instead of fiddling with the chain of converters that you have.
Does the 965GM support DVI output? I know the older 915 series don't. If you can get DVI working, just use DVI to HDMI through the dock and that would be a world better.
Besides, the 965GM struggles really badly with WUXGA resolution anyway
mikemex wrote:
Tue Sep 14, 2021 10:37 am
It's the other way around. It's software (such as games) what ships broken and creates the artifacts. nVidia just got good at embedding workarounds to make broken software to run "properly".
As far as running Windows 10 is concerned, the fact that the 140M has Windows 10 drivers and also has full DX10 support makes it much more usable than the 965, which is still stuck with Windows 7 drivers and doesn't have DX10 support.
If you have ever tried the earlier generation of NVidia GPU's, like the NVS 130M and the Quadro FX 350M, 3500M, it is just as sketchy in Windows 10 as the 965GM is. It's strange that those don't even have proper Windows 7 drivers while the NVS 140M has Windows 10 drivers.
thanks for the reply

I don't think the 965 has any problems with 1080p - just with poor drivers (the most recent being a 2009 file) in Windows 10/8/7/Vista

Since it works in Ubuntu 20.04, it should work in Windows 10 with the right drivers (or settings through the intel graphics utility which allow editing of hsynch, vsynch, resolution, refresh, etc. - I just haven't cracked it)

the real reason to do this is because I'm trying to use a modern IPS/LED 1080p LCD panel with an eDP to HDMI driver board, and wire up the VGA port to connect with the VGA-to-HDMI active adapter.
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Re: X3100 / 965 express Intel graphics webGL-enabled driver

#12 Post by Fierelier » Tue Sep 28, 2021 2:00 am

@kfzhu1229 I don't think you should be going around basically recommending the NVS140. That's NVIDIA 8000-series, they are notorious for dying. While you can get a way higher OGL level, I think even OGL 3.X, I don't think it's worth the risk, especially since used devices with that chip could have already went through a death without the buyer's knowledge, which could reduce the GPU's life by quite a lot, on top of the additional potentially short life. Not to mention the worse Linux support in case the device ever has to migrate there, which with Microshaft's bad practices is not unlikely.

And also, if I remember correctly, the newest Intel driver for the X3100 actually does support OpenGL 2.0, if what I did here is anything to go by: https://user-images.githubusercontent.c ... 5fc115.png. That's using the newest driver for this GPU from Intel's website. But your application has to be the same architecture as your Windows system, this is 64-bit. On the left is what happens if you use a 32-bit OpenGL application on 64-bit Windows with this driver.

Note that Windows 10 is a horrible choice for anything this hardware, though. You will likely need to explore this at the very least to even get a chance at any OpenGL on W10: https://github.com/pal1000/save-legacy-intel-graphics

As other people have already said, you will get better OpenGL either way on Linux.
Last edited by Fierelier on Tue Sep 28, 2021 2:13 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: X3100 / 965 express Intel graphics webGL-enabled driver

#13 Post by RealBlackStuff » Tue Sep 28, 2021 2:12 am

Fierelier wrote:
Tue Sep 28, 2021 2:00 am
@kfzhu1229 I don't think you should be going around basically recommending the NVS140. That's NVIDIA 8000-series, they are notorious for dying.
You obviously never heard of these 'new old stock' T61 motherboards with a perfect NVS140M: https://theboardroom.info/t61mobo.html
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Re: X3100 / 965 express Intel graphics webGL-enabled driver

#14 Post by Fierelier » Tue Sep 28, 2021 2:16 am

I have not! That's neat, nevermind if you're buying one of those I suppose.
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