Thinkpads Forum

X220 (i3, 4GB, 6-cell, TN) is doing very well, except having build quality issues. However, the main problem is sceen. It's is just too small (just 12'' and those huge bezels) and the resolution is unacceptable. Since I do a lot of programming, vertical space is important to me.

Why a thinkpad older than X220?
* To save money
* I prefer the traditional 7-row keyboard
* I don't like 16:9

I'm looking at T61, T400 and X301. Can you perhaps suggest some other models?

What do I need?
* At least 1440x900
* Fast CPU is a plus, but not a necessity
* Reliable machine
* Battery lasting at least 5-6 hours
* EDIT: Reasonable battery life (X220 is fantastic in that regard, but I almost never need it)
* Some portability - 15'' is not an option, low weight is a plus
* Screen size: 13'' or 14''

X201s might be a good choice (nice resolution), but the screen is too small.
X301 is difficult to find and expensive. The CPU is slow but I guess it's not that bad.
T61 looks pretty good, but I heard bad things about the NVidia graphics card. T61 with Intel is apparently difficult to find.
T400 has the new keyboard model (some people say it's worse, but I'm happy with mine on X220).

Anything else I'm missing? Do you have any advice on what to choose?
I have never bought a used laptop before. What should I look for when buying? Any caveats like the one with NVidia? Where to buy it, what websites can you suggest?
How about Amazon? I find the specs and information about wear are often lacking there.

Oh, and I really like the Frankenpads you guys are making.

Some more questions:
* Why did a new X301 use to be so expensive while having pretty low specs? Something must be very different from other thinkpads, right?
* How can this be such a ridiculously good deal? http://forum.thinkpads.com/viewtopic.php?f=11&t=110383

pazo wrote:Anything else I'm missing? Do you have any advice on what to choose?

Requiring the battery to last "at least 5-6 hours" is a bit unrealistic, since battery duration decreases over time, and all the models you are looking at are quite old. You might still get so many hours from an extended battery, but that would add half a pound.

I don't think any of the four models you listed satisfy all your requirements. For that reason, I am going to recommend you to look into something quite different: the Panasonic Toughbook CF-Y7. It doesn't meet all your requirements either, but it does satisfy two of them brilliantly: vertical space and light weight. Its screen is 14.1" 1400x1050, but the whole laptop weighs only 3.38 lbs, which includes an internal optical drive! Build quality is roughly the same as the typical Thinkpad, and all the three Y-series Toughbooks I've owned have been very reliable. The keyboard is not as good as a Thinkpad keyboard though, and while the battery was designed to last for over 6 hours when new, it can no longer do that.

BTW, the X201s is one of the best Thinkpads from the past several years IMO. Unfortunately, its rarity has made it unusually expensive. Since you want to save money, the X201s is certainly not for you. It's even more expensive than your X220.

If you stay with the Thinkpads, and 7-row keyboards,
I'd recommend a 14.1" T61 with Intel graphics and SXGA+ screen (1400x1050).
If not to be found, a T400/T410 with WXGA+ (1440x900).
T400 uses the same keyboards as T60/T61.
T400 still has Core 2 Duo CPUs.
The newer model T410 has i5 CPUs.
Both T400 and T410 use cheaper DDR3 and still have 16:10 screens.
Any newer models are on 16:9.
I have such a T410 for sale, as well as several other models.

pianowizard wrote:Requiring the battery to last "at least 5-6 hours" is a bit unrealistic, since battery duration decreases over time, and all the models you are looking at are quite old. You might still get so many hours from an extended battery, but that would add half a pound.

Well, then let's just say I want reasonable battery life, it's not that important. Notebook Review says they got almost 10 hours with T400. Even if we divide that number by two it's still good. However, T61 lasted for less than 4 hours, though. Okay, T400 is newer, but any idea why is the difference so large?

pianowizard wrote:For that reason, I am going to recommend you to look into something quite different: the Panasonic Toughbook CF-Y7.

Thanks. This one looks interesting, but I want a TP keyboard and trackpoint (btw, I used trackpoint on an HP Elitebook and found it very imprecise and difficult to navigate). What about the X301 for sale posted in these forums? I can sacrifice some CPU power.

pianowizard wrote:BTW, the X201s is one of the best Thinkpads from the past several years IMO. Unfortunately, its rarity has made it unusually expensive. Since you want to save money, the X201s is certainly not for you. It's even more expensive than your X220.

Probably. I only found used X201s's priced more than $500.

One machine missing from your list that could possibly fulfill all the requirements: T410/s. Faster than T400, and you might find one with warranty remaining.

BTW, I've owned a T400 when they were brand new and never got anywhere close to 10 hours. You *might* get that with a lower-end CPU, extended battery and wireless off in a typewriter mode.

X200s/X201s are reasonably rare. The former will have a better battery life, the latter better performance.

Happy shopping.

Okay, T400 is newer, but any idea why is the difference so large?

Many models of the T400 series were equipped with P8xxx series Core 2 Duo CPUs.
These were 25-watt TDP CPUs, better than the 35-watt T7xxx, T8xxx, and T9xxx CPUs found in T61's.

The T400's GM45 chipset has a lower max TDP (12w) compared to the T61's GM965 (13.5w). Furthermore, the GM45 is manufactured at 65nm compared to the GM965's older 90nm process.
Usually the newer, smaller process results in lower power consumption from idle to full power.

The lower voltage of DDR3 RAM could also add to the power savings.

If you need vertical real estate, I'd vote for the SXGA+ T61. Toss in a SSD and it'll run plenty fast.

I used to be in a similar situation. Had an X220 (even with IPS), but it never really grew on me. Last Christmas a good offer for an X301 rose up, and I took it. I've always wanted an X301 because it's one of the most high end notebooks and even ThinkPad you can buy. I can confirm the X301 is top-notch in terms of build quality. The X220 is no comparison whatsoever.

It pretty much covers all your need as far as I can tell. Sure, CPU speed is not fast, keep that in mind, but it isn't slow either and with an SSD, you won't even notice it. The X301 is a real premium machine. Price doesn't usually matter because people who buy such a unit know exactly what they want and appreciate the X301 for what it is.

I think if you're looking for quality, the X301 is the best way to go. Battery life is decent at 3-4h, screen is not bad either, keyboard is one the best I have ever typed on and build quality, as I have mentioned before, is superb.