How hard can TP be squeezed safely without damaging screen and keyboard? (incl my experience w my TP)

[bwsb]

I just got some experience with my Thinkpad Yoga.

When sleeping at an airport a couple of times, I would use it very carefully as a cushion, while in its Burnoaa neoprene bag.

And, some times I needed to squeeze my laptop bag, into a heavily packed backpack.

Those are the only stressful events that I caused the laptop, and, incredibly enough, it got..

Screen issues:

* 2 micro-cracks in screen, looking like stuck hairs (random locations, middle right),

* 1 place where screen has a particularly bright color (looks like at upper left corner of enter key),

* 2 places with so bad rubbing of the screen material, that color distortions can be seen, like, rainbowy (located to the upper left and right of the trackpad, i.e. where the lower part of laptop are the highest),

Keyboard issues:

* enter key's upper corner's plastic coating was corrupted, and last,

* 2 weeks ago the "N" key cap dropped because its upper mounts had, each on one side.


For this time, this was fine, but it made me ask this question:

How resilient is a Thinkpad really? -

What pressure can you expose it to, and what can you not?


And, would you buy a cotton towel to put between keyboard and screen while travelling, as "cheap insurance"? If so, any product recommendation?


I asked a Lenovo technician today, and he said it's OK to put a book on top of a Thinkpad, but that it's not OK to use it as a pillow.


What do you say? Experiences, thoughts?


Thanks!!

Admin note: Do NOT crosspost. I removed your other two posts.

[brchan]

I have tested out a few Thinkpad Yogas and would say that they can take some punishment, but not as much as its T/W/X brothers. That being said, most of the things you listed should be OK to do anyway. The only real concern is cracking the screen if too much preassure is put on, but I can only see this happening in extreme cases. As for the cotton towel in between the keyboard and screen, I do not think it is necessary, though if it were a paper towel, it would scratch the screen.

[bwsb]

brchan,

I would love to know how the X1 Carbon 2015=3:rd ed. is with regard to these questions!

Next, as you can see, I had an incident with a Yoga already, and that one should not have gotten too much pressure. Perhaps that backpack was like 12kg and I pushed it a liitle. Do you see a problem, why did I experience this?

Thanks!

[dr_st]

You know that old Arcade/DOS game - WWF Wrestlemania, and there The Undertaker has this move: Forward - Forward - Power Kick to smash opponent's head with a tombstone? And if you continue tapping Kick real quick, you can score a total of 4 tombstone hits?

Well, this is what I do with my Thinkpads regularly to random folks at work. If it doesn't survive that without a scratch, it's not a Thinkpad.

[brchan]

I haven't touched the the new X1 carbon, or any of the older ones, but knowing that your Thinkpad Yoga has experienced problems like yours, it may have been a bad batch, or you may have been treating it too rough, and I am misunderstanding. Have you considered getting one of the new T/W/X series Thinkpads, or an old T520 with FHD (95% color gamut)?

[bwsb]

Brchan,

Should not have been a bad batch.

What are your personal do:s and don't:s with your Thinkpad, to get things done while being confident it'll be in a perfect tomorrow too?

[ajkula66]

Let's make this simple, shall we?

Every single question that you've asked requires an "It's NOT OK" answer.

Cotton towel? Seriously?

If you need a machine that can take a beating, get a ToughBook.

[precip9]

Everyone knows that parachutes work, but why jump to test one?

[rkawakami]

For the thrill of it? And that 1-in-a-hundred thousand chance that whoever packed the chute did it wrong.

Putting a towel between the screen and keyboard is just going to put pressure on the LCD, which is something that should NOT be done. Most laptops have next to zero clearance between the keycaps and screen; witness numerous citations of the Trackpoint cap leaving a ring or mark on the screen.

[Khipata]

Depends on the model...
New ones (except Carbon) are a bit flimsier.
Old classics are tough, especially 600 series.
As for real antiques, this is how I keep them (especially my 700T, Type 2521):

Battery out, floppy out, all the cards out, plastic sheet on tablets-> plastic bag->Pelican 1450 case with foam+silica gel package->more foam around that case->Samsonite travel case+a lot of locks

I know this is overkill but they are WAY too valuable to me

[bwsb]

(A) How much pressure is OK:

ajkula86:
] Let's make this simple, shall we? Every single question that you've asked requires an "It's NOT OK" answer.

precip9:
] Everyone knows that parachutes work, but why jump to test one?

Khipata:
] plastic bag->Pelican 1450 case with foam+silica gel package->more foam around that case->Samsonite travel case+a lot of locks


Seriously, my head puts a pressure of maybe 10kg, so if i'm slightly on the side of the laptop then my pressure on it should have been approx 5kg - this can't be too bad.. or???

So then, what really damaged must be when I packed it when in a neoprene bag, into fully packed 10kg backpack.

Do you advise packing the laptop in a thicker laptop bag, for putting it in a backpack??

What's the issue here, primarily *pushing* the laptop, or somehow coincidental *bending* of it?




(B) Put a towel:

ajkula86:
] Cotton towel? Seriously?

rkawakami:
] Putting a towel between the screen and keyboard is just going to put pressure on the LCD, which is something that should NOT be done. Most laptops have next to zero clearance between the keycaps and screen; witness numerous citations of the Trackpoint cap leaving a ring or mark on the screen.


Well, the rainbowy scratches on the screen would clearly have been omitted with some kind of textile, because it came from horizontal rubbing toward the magnesium!

Maybe there's some thinner textile I could put, like, a big eyeglasses rubber cloth all over!?


Thank you - looking forward to your further thoughts on both!

[600X]

ThinkPad Yoga is more durable than other X, T or W series due to it's exclusive magnesium-alloy construction. I have dropped it on the corner from 1.5m and it survived with hardly any damage. Nothing that couldn't be easily fixed that is.

You can read up on it here: http://blog.lenovo.com/en/blog/thinkpad ... s-asphalt/

As for squeezing, a person can easily stand on a ThinkPad. IIRC they are certified for 140Kg spread across the entire lid.

[bwsb]

600x, it seems that my focal torturing the Thinkpad Yoga had a relatively speaking worse effect than the asphalt -

By, I suppose, squeezing particular areas of the outer cover under which the screen are, or, I guess applying pressure from the top while also applying pressure to the side, so that the screen surface is rubbed to the magnesium, causing scratches.

What would you (guys) assume as proper precautions while carrying your Thinkpad with you in various conditions, such as backpacking, biking, sleeping on airport, running to train etc.?

[ajkula66]

Seriously, my head puts a pressure of maybe 10kg, so if i'm slightly on the side of the laptop then my pressure on it should have been approx 5kg - this can't be too bad.. or???

I'm confused about one thing: why would you want to use your ThinkPad - or any laptop for that fact - as a pillow in the first place?

Well, the rainbowy scratches on the screen would clearly have been omitted with some kind of textile, because it came from horizontal rubbing toward the magnesium!

Maybe there's some thinner textile I could put, like, a big eyeglasses rubber cloth all over!?

The only kind of screen/keyboard protector that I've ever used, and was quite happy with it - obviously YMMV - can be found here:

http://www.shaggymax.com/15-standard-swiper.html

Needless to say, your machine would call for a different size, but there are many various ones available.

[600X]

This guy must be a wizard. How else did he manage to scratch a display that is behind Dragontrail glass?

[ajkula66]

This guy must be a wizard. How else did he manage to scratch a display that is behind Dragontrail glass?

Unlike you, I've never owned any of these machines...so I'll simply refrain from guessing...

[pianowizard]

It's time to remember some middle/high school physics! Pressure is force divided by area. 140 kg spread evenly and carefully over the entire laptop may actually induce a lower pressure than applying 10 kg to a local area. (Yes, I understand that the kilogram is a unit for mass, but it's proportional to force so we can pretend it is force for our purpose.) If you are unlucky and apply the 10 kg to the weakest spot of the laptop, it's possible to cause some pretty serious damage.

ThinkPad Yoga is more durable than other X, T or W series due to it's exclusive magnesium-alloy construction.

Durability is not just about the material a laptop is made of. For example, a thin laptop made of strong material may still be more fragile than a thicker laptop made of weaker material. Lenovo picked stronger material for the Yoga so that it's possible to make it thinner.

In addition, how well the screen survives pressure applied to the display lid partly depends on how much space separates the screen from the keyboard.

[bwsb]

Ajkula66,

You're sleeping at airport or other unsafe public place and you need a tight hold of your Thinkpad anyhow, in a place where you'd wake up if someone was trying to take it from you. So just putting it under neck makes good sense.


Ooh an actual product that solves it, SumiTex fabric - awesome!!

How do you find this fabric's feel? Being 0.6mm thick, is it robust enough to protect the screen from rubbing damage? Do you see any more damage it could protect you from?

Seriously, my head puts a pressure of maybe 10kg, so if i'm slightly on the side of the laptop then my pressure on it should have been approx 5kg - this can't be too bad.. or???

I'm confused about one thing: why would you want to use your ThinkPad - or any laptop for that fact - as a pillow in the first place?

Well, the rainbowy scratches on the screen would clearly have been omitted with some kind of textile, because it came from horizontal rubbing toward the magnesium!

Maybe there's some thinner textile I could put, like, a big eyeglasses rubber cloth all over!?

The only kind of screen/keyboard protector that I've ever used, and was quite happy with it - obviously YMMV - can be found here:

http://www.shaggymax.com/15-standard-swiper.html

Needless to say, your machine would call for a different size, but there are many various ones available.

[bwsb]

600x, thanks for the compliment )

I'm a pretty intense user and I think I'm on my.. 6:th or 7:th Thinkpad LCD now, across all my Thinkpads up to now. Apart from dust in fan, I think the LCD has been the most sensitive component in my eperience.

Of course it's the outermost material that was both fatally rubbed giving focal rainbowy discolorations *and* got a two micro cracks, looking like stuck hairs.

This guy must be a wizard. How else did he manage to scratch a display that is behind Dragontrail glass?

[bwsb]

) Thanks.

This guy must be a wizard. How else did he manage to scratch a display that is behind Dragontrail glass?

Unlike you, I've never owned any of these machines...so I'll simply refrain from guessing...

[ajkula66]

Ajkula66,

You're sleeping at airport or other unsafe public place and you need a tight hold of your Thinkpad anyhow, in a place where you'd wake up if someone was trying to take it from you. So just putting it under neck makes good sense.

Here's the problem:

I hear what you're saying.

With that being said, I'm not a young guy and really can't recall when I've last slept in an airport - probably never - or an unsafe public place. As for people trying to take my ThinkPad away...I'm in possession of both "open carry" and "concealed carry" licenses...

How do you find this fabric's feel? Being 0.6mm thick, is it robust enough to protect the screen from rubbing damage? Do you see any more damage it could protect you from?

I love the feel of the fabric. Whether it's "robust enough" would depend on what one does with their ThinkPad...my uses are fairly conventional, and when these machines travel with me, they are in a very thick laptop case on top of everything else...

[brchan]

600x, thanks for the compliment )

I'm a pretty intense user and I think I'm on my.. 6:th or 7:th Thinkpad LCD now, across all my Thinkpads up to now. Apart from dust in fan, I think the LCD has been the most sensitive component in my eperience.

Of course it's the outermost material that was both fatally rubbed giving focal rainbowy discolorations *and* got a two micro cracks, looking like stuck hairs.

This makes me think that you are too rough on the thinkpads and laptops in general (or at least the LCD assembly). Even under slightly rougher-than-normal conditions, it is very unlikely that you would go through 6 or 7 screens. I would recommend: getting a pelican case for your laptop, or a used semi-rugged/fully-rugged toughbook, or better yet, treat your laptops more carefully.

[bwsb]

Brchan,

Ah no, the X61 Tablets had a "bubbles leak" problem that just appeared out of nowhere, it was well documented. On 7 laptops, apart from 2 X61T leaks, I damaged only I think 2 or maybe 3 laptop LCD:s up to now ever, that's really fine.


I wish to be clear about my purpose with creating this forum thread, which is to clarify how to take care of a Thinkpad the best way for it to last really long. This is simply because I was a bit surprised to see the Yoga take a hit of such a relatively speaking mild treatment. I thought neoprene and magnesium alloy would do just a bit more.


Thanks for mentioning Pelican, that may be too extreme but I'll check it out. Are there any pelican-strength (or stronger!) 13-14" plastic panel/-s that I could put in my Burnoaa neoprene laptop case on top of the LCD, to make the bag more stiff and thus the LCD more protected?


Thanks!

600x, thanks for the compliment )

I'm a pretty intense user and I think I'm on my.. 6:th or 7:th Thinkpad LCD now, across all my Thinkpads up to now. Apart from dust in fan, I think the LCD has been the most sensitive component in my eperience.

Of course it's the outermost material that was both fatally rubbed giving focal rainbowy discolorations *and* got a two micro cracks, looking like stuck hairs.

This makes me think that you are too rough on the thinkpads and laptops in general (or at least the LCD assembly). Even under slightly rougher-than-normal conditions, it is very unlikely that you would go through 6 or 7 screens. I would recommend: getting a pelican case for your laptop, or a used semi-rugged/fully-rugged toughbook, or better yet, treat your laptops more carefully.

[QWERTY Andreas]

As for squeezing, a person can easily stand on a ThinkPad. IIRC they are certified for 140Kg spread across the entire lid.

I have never used a Yoga. But i have standed upon on my W500. Which is now near 6y old. Still going strong. Why did i do it? Because people didn't understand i would pay such a high Price for a laptop
Did it take any damage? Nope. Would i do it Again? Nope. Was it stupid? Yes.

[axur-delmeria]

But i have standed upon on my W500. Which is now near 6y old. Still going strong. Why did i do it? Because people didn't understand i would pay such a high Price for a laptop
Did it take any damage? Nope. Would i do it Again? Nope. Was it stupid? Yes.

We salute you for your bravery.
I wouldn't try this with any of my Thinkpads.

[600X]

There was a thread about this on the NBR Forum. A few users posted Pictures of them standing on their ThinkPad. All of them survived, from the T400 right up to the T440s.

[pianowizard]

There was a thread about this on the NBR Forum. A few users posted Pictures of them standing on their ThinkPad. All of them survived, from the T400 right up to the T440s.

In conclusion, all Thinkpads are safe for people to stand on...

[precip9]

These people are not familiar with the concept of "fatigue strength."

Every time a person stands on his Thinkpad, microcracks are created, and existing ones extended. Since case damage is a cosmetic issue, consider the motherboard. Circuit boards have always been vulnerable to flex damage, because the copper traces are deposited as a colloid, a wet mass of copper grains and water, that when dries cements into what appears to be solid metal. But it is not. The solder joints are made of particularly brittle alloys, forced by the EU ROHS regulations.

All the nonferrous metals have finite fatigue strength. An aluminum bar will snap after a finite number of flexes. Only certain ferrous alloys are considered by metallurgists to be exceptions.

Every time a Thinikpad receives a minor impact or flex, microscopic damage is created. If the damage does not lead to failure before the device is discarded, the design is called a success. In fact, a large portion of motherboard failures are due to problems that, when examined at a sufficiently microscopic level, reveal themselves to be mechanical.

In a world where all things perish eventually, there is a very natural human desire to have a touchstone of durability, a reliable companion. Some people have invested much emotion in their Thinkpads, a bonding of human and machine that, in a minor way, presages the Singularity.

Those of you who are tempted to test the reliability of their companion Thinkpads should resist the temptation. It is a need that resides entirely in you. The Thinkpad gets no benefit from the urge. Try to give weight to the other aspect of owning a Thinkpad: it is a gadget that will eventually fail, at a time and a place that is significantly influenced by the way you treat it.
Standing or sitting on a Thinkpad challenges the man-machine relationship in an unproductive way. In return for a temporary emotional lift, the chances increase of being inconvenienced at a time and a place not of your own choosing, with the financial loss determined by the Fates.

[dr_st]

Standing or sitting on a Thinkpad challenges the man-machine relationship in an unproductive way. In return for a temporary emotional lift, the chances increase of being inconvenienced at a time and a place not of your own choosing, with the financial loss determined by the Fates.

Well, what if I need to get to that box of macaroni & cheese in the cupboard that's just a little bit out of reach?

[precip9]

Standing or sitting on a Thinkpad challenges the man-machine relationship in an unproductive way. In return for a temporary emotional lift, the chances increase of being inconvenienced at a time and a place not of your own choosing, with the financial loss determined by the Fates.

Well, what if I need to get to that box of macaroni & cheese in the cupboard that's just a little bit out of reach?

This is what you do:
https://www.google.com/search?q=sarah+p ... B620%3B508