why not changeable graphics cards?

[donking!]

Why don't notebook manufactuers design systems with interchangeable graphics cards, like desktops? Wouldn't something along the lines of a PCMIA card in size and usability be possible?

It seems like this would go a long way to resolving the lag notebooks have behind desktops with graphics. And it would make notebooks configurable in a much more usable manner.

It's crazy to think that the new T60 series laptops that aren't even available yet are going to be outdated as soon as DirectX 10 comes out and there will be no recourse but to replace the entire computer. Especially with Vista on the horizon and it's 3D needs, it doesn't make much sense.

Of course, I guess that makes for lots of great planned obsolesence for notebook manufactuers! Sell, sell, sell.

[christopher_wolf]

Some Dells already have removable graphics cards; these, however, are found on the larger, heavier, and hotter desktop replacement models. It would be nice, but one has to think of the benefit; most laptops get used for a few years before something else the user wants comes out, this is nearly the same time that an upgrade to the GPU would be a good idea. That, however, doesn't make much sense considering you could just go out and buy a new laptop without having to mess with keeping the old one with a new GPU, the added cost, etc. It also complicates things from the standpoint of IBM/Lenovo; if you could swap in an out other GPUs, they would have to test, re-test, and support every single possbile mix of Laptop+GPU. Again, that cost is rather large compared to the benefit; in this case, this only increases the consumer utility without any benefit for the corporation.

[DIGITALgimpus]

Alienware has done that for a while.

It's a cost issue partially too.

Not to mention, the lack of a clear standard.

[donking!]

It also complicates things from the standpoint of IBM/Lenovo; if you could swap in an out other GPUs, they would have to test, re-test, and support every single possbile mix of Laptop+GPU.

If it's done with desktop computers, why is it so forboading to do with notebooks? I understand a current standard doesn't exist. But again, somehow it's been worked out with desktop computers.

I think the benefit to Lenovo would be they don't have to make so many different models of their computers. They would have a more straightforward product to market that customers would understand more readily.

Also, they could sell the graphics cards as options with the notebooks and charge a premium, like they currently do with memory, etc. So they could make money on the deal.

And if the greater configurability made their computers more desirable, they could charge more for that too. I might pay more for a notebook that doesn't even have a graphics card in it, so I can choosed the card myself and be assured that I can replace it in the future. How good a deal is that for Lenovo! Charge more for taking a component out of the computer!

[bill bolton]

If it's done with desktop computers, why is it so forboading to do with notebooks?

The screen is built into a laptop, while it's not for a desktop. That is a very significance difference in terms of overall "presentation" issues.

How good a deal is that for Lenovo! Charge more for taking a component out of the computer!

I strongly recommend that you don't pursue a career in marketing!

[beeblebrox]

All ATI graphics chips are inter-changeable. They use the so-called flexfit socket. i.e. dump your Radeon 7500 and put in a 9600.
Flexfit allows the manufacturer to use one mainboard with different graphics options.

Unfortunately, the chips are cheap enough to be soldered directly onto the mainboard. The Pentium chip is expensive enough to justify the few cents for the socket.

Therefore you can upgrade the CPU, but not the GPU. What is most annoying however, is the fact, that the Radeon 7500 and 9600 are very similar in price and power consumption.

I assume, it is the same with the X300-X600 series.

Bummer!

[Aroc]

[censored] good question. For a case study on this topic, look to how Dell implemented swappable video adapters in their inspiron line a few years back. Short answer seems to be the market just doesn't like the solutions available (e.g., makes the units too bulky to accomodate the sockets). Also generally depending on what else is included in the design (not only graphics, but also CPU, etc) there may be overheating issues. Because now what else are you including in the design to make these things more desirable in the market place? There has to be a trade off somewhere.

I would suspect if this were just as simple as putting it on some sort of daughter card (ala, wireless or bluetooth, etc) we would see in the Copal or Clevo OEM units (think Big-Fat-Fscking-Sager, et al.) first. Then as the technology matured we'd see lenovo and other business class lines adopt the technology. I suspect there will be cooling problems, but I have no evidence of that. I suggest you study the Dells and why that implementation seemed to flounder. You may find your answers there.

One thing I'm surprised we haven't seen are PC Card (32-bit PCMCIA) or new Express Card video adapters. But again here I suspect two problems. One economic who would buy them at a price work producing the for / supporting them for. And two would there be eingeering problems with cooling or bandwidth / throughput?

But a [censored] good question though. It is definetely something worth asking even if the answer is still "not feasible" ort "not worth while ...yet."

[Aroc]

It seems like this would go a long way to resolving the lag notebooks have behind desktops with graphics. (...) Especially with Vista on the horizon and it's 3D needs, it doesn't make much sense.

I think you could examine what the CPU and notebook vendors did to eliminate the lag between CPU and mobo chipsets between notebooks and desktops about 5-10 years ago. It used to be that notebooks severely lagged behind their desktop cousins in both generations of chips and also (more importantly) in performance. But such isn't the case any more. And I don't think its necessarily due to swappable or field replacable parts. I think the market simply demanded it. Look at the development of mobile processors, particularly the Pentium M. The same evolution/revolution will likely occur with obile graphics adapters. Windows Vista may actually help spur that.

Of course, I guess that makes for lots of great planned obsolesence for notebook manufactuers! Sell, sell, sell.

Well, as others have mentioned, usually by time you want better graphics, you'll also want some of the better enhancements of current models (e.g., USB 2.0, express card, 6-pin firewire, DVI out, SATA, faster processrosw families, support for more total RAM, etc, etc) so it could make sense to swap out your chassis. [/img]

And for the moment the market needs of graphics power as served by units like the p-models (T43p ,etc) for professionals needing the 3D grunt or college students needing to game. But sadly that requires one upgrade their whole chassis in order to update their graphics.

[donking!]

Hey Aroc, and others, thanks for the thoughtful responses.