Thinkpads Forum

hi, i need a laptop for school and as a desktop replacement (games like bf2 need to run) for school i need autodesk 2006/2007 to run




i have 3 options to chose:



hp nc8430(2ghz core duo, x1600,100gb hdd,15.4", 2gb ram for ~1700€(dont know USD price)

i think widescreen is not useful for me, so i dont want to take the hp

t60(2ghz core duo,x1400,2gb ram,100gb hdd, 14.1") also about ~1700€

or the special

t60p(2,16ghz core duo,fire gl v5200,100gb 7200rpm,15", 2gb ram) for ~2300€


price/power is hp best, but i dont like hp/compaq laptops

so which i need to choose

i prefer 15" laptops

I would also skip the HP. I tried their NC8230 about a year ago and didn't like anything about it. LaptopLogic.com has a review on the previous model.

I prefer the size and weight of the 14" T60, but if you are accustomed to 15" then stick with that. people seem very happy with the flexview screens on those model - check notebookreview.com for some pictures.

keep in mind that the T60p has a higher resolution than the standard T60, which is available with a max of 1400 x 1050.

kumi wrote: price/power is hp best, but i dont like hp/compaq laptops

so which i need to choose

i prefer 15" laptops

If you don't like HP, then you don' need to consider them...

kumi wrote: t60p(2,16ghz core duo,fire gl v5200,100gb 7200rpm,15", 2gb ram) for ~2300€

...and, if you can get this T60p spec for that price, I'd go for it. I paid much more for that spec here.

If you can tell me where you can get this T60 with those spec at this price, I'd buy one!

Please PM me

Do you even have to ask?
[heretic!]

Check your school. you can probably get a lenovo student discount. For my school it was like XX% off. Which puts it at the smae level as any hp out there only it won't die after 2 years. HP WILL break before you graduate from school. So compare the cost of an extra $200-300 for a thinkpad compared to the $1000 you're gonna have to pay to get a new laptop.

Note from Moderator: Student price discount discussions are not allowed here. Read the Rules of the Road.

GomJabbar wrote:Do you even have to ask?
[heretic!]

Yeah....

kulivontot wrote:HP WILL break before you graduate from school.

That may or may not be true. He's not considering a notebook from HP's consumer line, and their business line (typing this on one now) is as sturdy as the TPs. The keyboard is... not good IMO, but that's a matter of what suits him.

Oh, yes, and read the Rules of the Road. Price discussions of programs like student discounts or EPP are not not allowed here.

cakos wrote:If you can tell me where you can get this T60 with those spec at this price, I'd buy one!

Please PM me

Of course, you come here then get from BillMorrow. If you don't like your TP when it was delivered to you, you can make a complain to him and he will change it for you.

He won't sell and run away or vanish. His website is still here & forever it will be here.

I have faith and confidence in him. I am saving up some cash to get the latest R60 from him if he ever has that model.

HP is absolutely awful. My buddy bought an HP and I spent the course of several days fiddling with it before it was acting properly. Spyware, odd config, proprietary crap, general nuisanceware, and other issues that made me want to heave the computer out onto the lawn.

Even with Lenovo owning the Thinkpad marque, I'd still consider one...

I am not going to buy another HP notebook again (search the forums for the posts I have made about my old HP laptops, one of them a ze5170, to see my POV on them); I have had several and they have been as bad, if not worse, then the Dells I had. They overheated despite having three fans, the keyboards were far inferior to the Thinkpad keyboard, plus they somehow managed to be sluggish even with 2.0GHz and the same amount of memory and treatment that my Thinkpad (smooth and fast as silk, by the way). HP's "business" line is slightly better than HP's consumer offerings, but that is primarily because they are almost copies of the Thinkpads with some roundings similar to the old Omnibooks. Why buy a copy of the Thinkpad when you can actually get a real Thinkpad?

nonny wrote:[...] typing this on one [HP] now[...]

*blank stare*
Who are you, and what have you done with our moderator?

doppelfish wrote:

nonny wrote:[...] typing this on one [HP] now[...]

*blank stare*
Who are you, and what have you done with our moderator?

It's the notebook I was issued at work. I never said I would actually buy one myself; all my personal notebooks are TPs. All is as it should be in the ThinkPad universe!

I just wanted to point out that there is a lot of difference in HP's consumer line and their business line and that the OP was looking at one from their business line. Looking at what HP puts out for the consumer market and comparing that to the business line, IME, is like comparing apples to oranges.

The one I have from work is an HP Compaq nc6220, and I've said before that it's a good, solid system. I just think the keyboard doesn't feel right - keys are too flat, travels not quite right, something.

I agree with Nonny.

usually, the business lines are much better than consumers lines and people cannot judge a brand by its lowest end.

I have been using dell 8100, 8000 and 8500 for a long time. Other than that they are heavy and the keyboard does not feel as good ad TP's, they are sturdy and reliable and nevery got a problem.

I agree that Toshiba shipped out many crappy laptops. And there are issues like overheating. But their top end models (made in Japan) are pretty good and very pricey. I saw some Japanese use top end Toshiba around 2 lbs and very very good and reliable. But can you see Toshiba is a crappy brand? Maybe not.

bigtiger wrote:But their top end models (made in Japan) are pretty good and very pricey. I saw some Japanese use top end Toshiba around 2 lbs and very very good and reliable. But can you see Toshiba is a crappy brand? Maybe not.

Well, I do, but it's as much because of their slimy sales force and their equally slimy ways as it is their hardware. Even thinking about the turd that was assigned as my sales rep still raises my blood pressure after 4 years of no contact.

nonny wrote:
Well, I do, but it's as much because of their slimy sales force and their equally slimy ways as it is their hardware. Even thinking about the turd that was assigned as my sales rep still raises my blood pressure after 4 years of no contact.

do you mean Toshiba? I have no experience with them as I do not like their US (versus Japanese) models.

As far as customer service is concerned, I have to say I dislike all Japanese companies. They are stingy and not trained to serve consumers. Those at least include: Sony, Casio and Olympus, which I had personal experience with. Sony is the worst.

By the way, compaq (not HP as a whole), is the last company that I want to deal with, as far as computer as is concered.

bigtiger wrote:do you mean Toshiba? I have no experience with them as I do not like their US (versus Japanese) models.

Yes, Toshiba. Bunch of scumballs.

Pre-HP Compaq wasn't too bad to deal with. No direct experience with their sales force and engineering people since the HP takeover since I'm not in that end of IT anymore. From purely a user perspective, though, the business line notebooks are still the same.

Im a student attending UNC-CH next year and I have a t60 I got through their Lenovo partnership. To answer one of your original questions, although the x1600 would definitely be better for games, I am able to run BF2 on mine at decent quality levels (which was really surprising to me, knowing how it runs on my desktop). Hope that helps.

As a chinese student, I'd like to give you some information.

In my dorm, a partner use HP n6320, I use Thinkpad t43. Although they are different from yours, I still want to send my feelings.

In my view, if you want to use more in your computer, such as power managent, access connection etc. in thinkVantage, I think IBM is the best chioce; If you only want to use the computer itself, a HP is enough.

too many things are different from IBM and HP, you will find convenience when you use a Thinkpad. Anyhow, the price is higher.

zhoubin5371 wrote:As a chinese student, I'd like to give you some information.

In my dorm, a partner use HP n6320, I use Thinkpad t43. Although they are different from yours, I still want to send my feelings.

In my view, if you want to use more in your computer, such as power managent, access connection etc. in thinkVantage, I think IBM is the best chioce; If you only want to use the computer itself, a HP is enough.

too many things are different from IBM and HP, you will find convenience when you use a Thinkpad. Anyhow, the price is higher.

Well, I think the power management, access connection etc. is a customized program from Lenovo/IBM for users. That doesn't really differentiate the advantage of choosing HP over IBM thou. The reason I choose Thinkpad is because of the services and online software updates.....and of course the quality of the keyboards.

ambientscape wrote:

zhoubin5371 wrote:As a chinese student, I'd like to give you some information.

In my dorm, a partner use HP n6320, I use Thinkpad t43. Although they are different from yours, I still want to send my feelings.

In my view, if you want to use more in your computer, such as power managent, access connection etc. in thinkVantage, I think IBM is the best chioce; If you only want to use the computer itself, a HP is enough.

too many things are different from IBM and HP, you will find convenience when you use a Thinkpad. Anyhow, the price is higher.

Well, I think the power management, access connection etc. is a customized program from Lenovo/IBM for users. That doesn't really differentiate the advantage of choosing HP over IBM thou. The reason I choose Thinkpad is because of the services and online software updates.....and of course the quality of the keyboards.

Thinkpad Keyboards, yes...Awesomeness; closest thing you will find to a full Model M in a laptop.

I was also suprised at how the HP keyboard quality went down. It was good on the OmniBook I had, still have, then it went to absolute rubbish, with cheap plastic backing, when I got my ze5170, neither did it get better on the nc HP/Compaq business models I tried either.

christopher_wolf wrote:

ambientscape wrote: Well, I think the power management, access connection etc. is a customized program from Lenovo/IBM for users. That doesn't really differentiate the advantage of choosing HP over IBM thou. The reason I choose Thinkpad is because of the services and online software updates.....and of course the quality of the keyboards.

Thinkpad Keyboards, yes...Awesomeness; closest thing you will find to a full Model M in a laptop.

I was also suprised at how the HP keyboard quality went down. It was good on the OmniBook I had, still have, then it went to absolute rubbish, with cheap plastic backing, when I got my ze5170, neither did it get better on the nc HP/Compaq business models I tried either.

A friend of mine bought an IBM Thinkpad even thou she doesn't like the ALL BLACK design because she's addicted with the keyboard!!. SHould I use the word ADDICTED?

zhoubin5371 wrote:As a chinese student, I'd like to give you some information.

In my dorm, a partner use HP n6320, I use Thinkpad t43. Although they are different from yours, I still want to send my feelings.

In my view, if you want to use more in your computer, such as power managent, access connection etc. in thinkVantage, I think IBM is the best chioce; If you only want to use the computer itself, a HP is enough.

too many things are different from IBM and HP, you will find convenience when you use a Thinkpad. Anyhow, the price is higher.

@zhoubin Welcome to forum.thinkpads.com

^Another IBM/Lenovo fan. Yayyy!!!

Price is higher. --> i agree...

But why the price is soooo much higher.

I use IBM notebooks because i like the classic black colour. Looks cool for a wild boar like me.

What part of Stop Quoting Entire Messages are you guys not getting? Trim your quotes.

nonny wrote:[...] It's the notebook I was issued at work. [...] comparing apples to oranges.

The one I have from work is an HP Compaq nc6220, and I've said before that it's a good, solid system. [...]

It's reassuring to know that (even?) a confessing IBM addict is able to stick to the facts. Go, nonny! :-)

cheers,
-- fish

doppelfish wrote:

nonny wrote:[...] It's the notebook I was issued at work. [...] comparing apples to oranges.

The one I have from work is an HP Compaq nc6220, and I've said before that it's a good, solid system. [...]

It's reassuring to know that (even?) a confessing IBM addict is able to stick to the facts. Go, nonny!

cheers,
-- fish

It is also good to see that the practice of selective quoting to make things look better than they actually are is still alive and healthy too.

I wouldn't be raving mad if, as part of a corporation, I got an nc6220; I would, however, not have the nc6220 in the running for a personal system. If the corporate IT wants to deal with it, fine; that is their decision and their job (provided they do it correctly, that is). I will still go with the superior keyboard on the Thinkpads and better pointing devices as I want the best physical UI I can get in the system.

Oh, yes; if a post is really huge and contains a quote of a quote of a quote...Don't quote the entire thing. Just reference it and break it into smaller code blocks, we can get the picture.

christopher_wolf wrote:It is also good to see that the practice of selective quoting to make things look better than they actually are is still alive and healthy too.

<puzzled look>

nonny wrote:

christopher_wolf wrote:It is also good to see that the practice of selective quoting to make things look better than they actually are is still alive and healthy too.

<puzzled look>

*sly grin* (Hmm, that emoticon doesn't *quite* do it justice; does it?)