Weird Standby/Keyboard glitch...

[Bg357]

I have a T30 running Win2K and am having an odd recurring problem with the keyboard.
Periodically, after coming off standby, the keyboard keys all type the wrong characters, no rhyme or reason to it, every key just does something other than what it's supposed to.
Restarting the system takes care of the problem but it's very odd & annoying, plus it seems to be happening more often now. It only happens when the system comes off standby and not every time.

Anyone have any ideas?

[christopher_wolf]

Do you have the latest BIOS? That could cause a problem.

Also, do you have loaded, as a process in the background or as a new keyboard layout file, a program or data for changing the keyboard?

[Bg357]

Do you have the latest BIOS? That could cause a problem.

I don't have the latest BIOS but I've been somewhat reticent to update because I've read some posts discussing problems developing from a BIOS update. You know what they say, if it ain't broke don't fix it.

How "safe" is a BIOS update and how is it done? If problems materialize, is there a way to revert to the previous BIOS?

[christopher_wolf]

Yes there is a way, fairly simple, to reert to the old BIOS as they are entire re-flashes and not just temp increments.

Some BIOS problems can fix issues with both the internal and external keyboards; case in point, some BIOS updates to the T4X Series and T6X Series had, at least in part, slight changes to work out bugs with external/internal keyboards, mice, and other UI devices.

[rkawakami]

<snip>... the keyboard keys all type the wrong characters, no rhyme or reason to it, every key just does something other than what it's supposed to.

Can you give us a short table of just what characters are being displayed when you hit certain keys?

i.e. hitting the "Q" key gives "A"

It's possible that Win2K is getting confused as to what you have defined as the keyboard type (locale). The swapping of characters could be due to either software or hardware. With Win2K you can check the Keyboard entry under Control Panel. Click on the Input Locales tab to see what keyboard layout is currently defined.

(P.S. I like puzzles... )

[christopher_wolf]

Ray is right; first off, I would try look for a software cause....only move to BIOS if it is *really* necessary. I have seen systems that suffered from this via software and some that wouldn't get fixed until a new BIOS was applied. With luck, this should be the former.

[rkawakami]

I'm guessing (hoping) that it's something as simple as a DVORAK keyboard mapping getting enabled. Now that would really be interesting!

[KristianJ]

I have a similar problem with my external Labtec wireless keyboard and bringing my T40 out of standby - for me it simply misses characters. Originally when it started happening I simply thought its batteries were almost dead, but it happens semi-regularly now. I've had the latest BIOS, no keyboard management programs or the like, and I can't put a finger on why it does this. So I'll be keeping a close eye on this thread as well as keeping on trying to identify the source of the problem.

[Bg357]

Can you give us a short table of just what characters are being displayed when you hit certain keys?

It's possible that Win2K is getting confused as to what you have defined as the keyboard type (locale). The swapping of characters could be due to either software or hardware. With Win2K you can check the Keyboard entry under Control Panel. Click on the Input Locales tab to see what keyboard layout is currently defined.

(P.S. I like puzzles... )

Thanks for the assistance, this is quite the mystery!

The next time it occurs I will make a table showing what it's doing. It's happened twice already this weekend but now that I'm waiting for it it'll probably never happen again. Murphy's law and all that...

Anyway, it's not Dvorak, I checked that. Just from memory, I believe the T key displays a Z and the Y was a bracket symbol. It seemed like a lot of keys were displaying punctuation symbols rather than letters; ie. slashes, brackets, and some odd symbols I haven't seen before (not foreign characters though)

I checked the Input Locales and there are no other keyboard layout profiles available to enable but I will also check that again the next time it happens.

Thanks again,

[Bg357]

Ray is right; first off, I would try look for a software cause....only move to BIOS if it is *really* necessary. I have seen systems that suffered from this via software and some that wouldn't get fixed until a new BIOS was applied. With luck, this should be the former.

This is what I'm talking about. I'm not the only one who doesn't want to mess with the BIOS. Nobody really talks about it but reading between the lines, it sounds like it can really open up a can of worms...
Maybe you could explain why that is, what is the concern, why wouldn't I want to flash this puppy to the latest BIOS?? I think it only causes more trepidation when no one really says why, they just sort of intimate that maybe it should be a last resort, even though it's often the first thing mentioned when some sort of glitch materializes. Very Curious...

Another question, would it be problematic to update a particular device driver to the latest while running an older BIOS version?? I was considering an update for the Synaptics UltraNav driver because it has given me a couple of error messages and I also read that it has some fixes for problems occurring off standby. It didn't mention my specific problem but I thought it was worth a shot.
I can't conclusively link this SynTPEnh.exe error to my current problem but it did pop up after I last restarted the system to correct the keyboard jumble.
So I downloaded the latest UltraNav driver but due to the aforementioned "mystery BIOS fear" I have been loathe to actually install it. (That's a deer in the headlights look, there doesn't seem to be an emoticon for 'paralyzed by fear'.

Thanks for the help

[rkawakami]

This is what I'm talking about. I'm not the only one who doesn't want to mess with the BIOS. Nobody really talks about it but reading between the lines, it sounds like it can really open up a can of worms...

I think the problem with saying a BIOS update may cure a particular problem, and then in the next breath, cautioning that it's a "last ditch" solution is that there is a small possibility that the BIOS update will go wrong and leave your laptop a doorstop. The procedure to update the firmware (BIOS) in a system opens up a tiny window for something to go wrong. That's mainly the reason why you have to have a fully charged battery when performing the update. If, during the data transfer, the laptop should lose power, the update will fail and most likely, render the system inoperable. Also, I would say the average computer user has NEVER performed this type of update before and therefore does not appreicate the danger in doing it the "wrong" way. Probably explains the multiple pages of warning messages you should read through before finally saying YES to the BIOS update .

I believe this hesitation falls under the heading of: "if it ain't broken, don't fix it". Conventional wisdom says that if you are experiencing some fault/error which has been PROVEN to be fixed by a BIOS update, then by all means go ahead and upgrade. By the same token, if you have a problem which has not been directly addressed in the supporting documentation provided with the firmware upgrade (i.e. revision XYZ of T99z system fixes the known problem of...), then you probably shouldn't mess with the system. As you see in my .sig, all of my 600X systems, except one, have been upgraded to the latest BIOS (ITET55WW). Really the only reason why the last one has not been done is because I can't pry the laptop out of my daughter's hands long enough to do the upgrade . The T23s have FIVE different BIOS revisions. They all seem to be running without any problems so I've taking the stance that whatever IBM has decided to fix in the those BIOS changes, I don't need at the moment.

Driver updates are not as "bad" to deal with as you usually can "roll back" to the previous version if something doesn't work right (assuming you are using WinXP or 2000). For example, if you update a video driver and it leaves you stuck at 640x480x16 resolution, you should be able to boot into Safe Mode and fix the problem. No "Safe Mode" exists for a BIOS update gone wrong as far as I know.

Hope this makes it clearer.

[Bg357]

I think the problem with saying a BIOS update may cure a particular problem, and then in the next breath, cautioning that it's a "last ditch" solution is that there is a small possibility that the BIOS update will go wrong and leave your laptop a doorstop.

Thank you for the clarification, that is exactly what I've been seeing between the lines.
Amazing how large a post can just hang out there...in between the lines.

So, there shouldn't be any problem with updating this UltraNav driver, even though my BIOS is much older??

I've discovered something else regarding the UltraNav error, if not my keyboard jumble. When I last restarted to fix the keyboard error, I got an error referencing "SynTPEnh.exe'. That had to do with the Synaptics UltraNav system which was shut down at that error.
Well, as it happens, since that program was shut down and hasn't been restarted, the computer will automatically wake from standby when I open the LCD. Previously, when the UltraNav program was running, I had to push the Fn key or the Power button to bring it out of standby.
Obviously, this is rather minor but it demonstrates that the UltraNav program was having some effect on the system coming out of standby, which is also when the keyboard glitch occurs.
So there may be some correlation there, maybe??

[rkawakami]

So, there shouldn't be any problem with updating this UltraNav driver, even though my BIOS is much older??

I would say you should be safe, as long as the supporting documentation provided with the driver does not mention any minimum level of BIOS support. I think I have seen this before with some driver updates.

Obviously, this is rather minor but it demonstrates that the UltraNav program was having some effect on the system coming out of standby, which is also when the keyboard glitch occurs. So there may be some correlation there, maybe??

That may indeed be the source of your problem... sounds very logical to assume that.

[christopher_wolf]

Obviously, this is rather minor but it demonstrates that the UltraNav program was having some effect on the system coming out of standby, which is also when the keyboard glitch occurs. So there may be some correlation there, maybe??

Hmmm, you could try uninstalling UltraNav, reinstalling it later of course, and then try to see if that affects anything after the suspend. I don't know, though, usually the UltraNav and the Synaptics drivers don't really affect the keyboard although it could be that Windows is getting its inputs messed up.