Problem with hard drive in Ultrabay on T43

[ricard]

Recently got a hard drive caddy for my T43 so that I can put a large (-ish) drive there to use for video editing. Haven't bought the drive yet, currently testing with an older 20 GB Toshiba drive. I'm running Debian Linux (Lenny, which uses Linux 2.6.26).

Problem is, the computer doesn't seem to recognize the hard drive. Using the stock CD-RW/DVD drive in the Ultrabay slot is fine, and /var/log/messages correctly indicates it is recognized by the system when inserted. So the Ultrabay slot itself is fine. But when I insert the hard drive in the caddy, all I get in /var/log/messages is

"Aug 10 20:30:45 paddy kernel: [ 670.177875] ata2: soft resetting link
Aug 10 20:30:45 paddy kernel: [ 670.332136] ata2: EH complete"

At one point I got some stuff about "Failing to IDENTIFY, err_mask=0x01".

But no messages indicating that it has recognized the device (such as what happens when the optical drive is inserted).

I've tried a couple of drives in the caddy, including the 40 GB one that originally came with the T43, as well as a 40 GB that normally sits in a HP laptop and works fine there, same result. Same also when I boot into Windows XP; the optical drive comes up fine, but the hard drive in its caddy goes completely unnoticed.

Have scanned the 'net and this board for hints but have not really come up with anything, which leads me to think that the caddy is faulty. Still I thought I'd give it a bounce here in case I'm missing something (either something obvious, or some obscure kernel parameter or setting).

/Ricard

[RealBlackStuff]

This is probably a Linux problem, rather than a hardware problem.

[Mike Blake]

I think I agree with RBS; a quick Google of the error you quoted in part showed many hits from Linux users sites. One user changed what version he used; booting from a live CD of Puppy Linux, it saw the drives, but not when he used the installed Ubuntu.

[ricard]

Yes, I googled too, but the hits I got indicated cases where people were having general problems getting communication with IDE devices to work, not one specific device.

I don't think it is a Linux problem; as mentioned above, I booted into Windows XP, and removing and inserting my optical drive correctly brings it up under the listed devices in My Computer, whereas inserting the hard drive caddy (with hard drive mounted) doesn't provoke any reaction whatsoever. This includes an NTFS formatted drive that I temporarily removed from an HP laptop and which is the main drive on that machine, which I thought Windows would be sure to pick up.

The only hint I got was that some drives may respond too slowly, and might work when used in a USB external drive, but not as an IDE drive. Sounds questionable to me though.

/Ricard

[andyP]

With the drive inserted in the bay when you start the system and enter BIOS, or press F12, is the drive in recognised in the boot menu?
Do the drives you are using have hard drive passwords set on them?

[RealBlackStuff]

Let's get more specific here.
A caddy is the metal cover that goes around the bottom and sides of the hard disk itself.
You can put a second hard drive adapter in the Ultrabay.
The hard disk IN the adapter can also have a caddy.

Now, inside the T43 itself, the main hard disk goes in upside down (label at the bottom).
But in the Ultrabay adapter it goes in with the label on top.
Are you perhaps trying the adapter-HD upside down?

[ricard]

With the drive inserted in the bay when you start the system and enter BIOS, or press F12, is the drive in recognised in the boot menu?

No. The main drive (HDD0:) is recognized and it's type number comes up in the boot menu, as is the optical drive when it is inserted. But with the second hard drive in the Ultrabay slot, there is nothing after HDD1: in the boot menu, so as you are suggesting it seems the drive is not recognized at all.

Do the drives you are using have hard drive passwords set on them?

No.

Sorry about the terminology confusion. The HDD Ultrabay adapter I have doesn't seem to use a caddy, you basically just put the drive in the adapter and put the adapter in the T43. The drive label side is up, and it does look like the connectors mate properly with the one in the adapter. I can hear the drive spin up when it is inserted, so it seems it is getting power anyway.

/Ricard

[RealBlackStuff]

Try and put a piece of plastic foil, the size of the hard disk, between hard disk and adapter, perhaps there is a false contact?
What happens if you put the new HD (with a caddy) upside down in the main bay, is it then recognized via F12 or in BIOS?

[ricard]

Try and put a piece of plastic foil, the size of the hard disk, between hard disk and adapter, perhaps there is a false contact?

I'm not sure how you mean, you mean that the metal case of the disk should not be in contact with the adapter?

Actually, when I got the adapter there was a blue plastic foil on the underside. It was partly torn, so I removed it completely, thinking it was more of a cosmetic protection than anything else.

What happens if you put the new HD (with a caddy) upside down in the main bay, is it then recognized via F12 or in BIOS?

Well, I haven't tried exactly that, however, I did try putting a 40 GB disk in the adapter that I had previously used as the main drive, with the same results (drive is not recognized).

I'm thinking there's something wrong with the adapter connector; there's not much to go wrong in the adapter as it is basically electrically a pass-through device, but there could still be a bad solder joint somewhere.

/Ricard

[RealBlackStuff]

The foil will work as a protection to prevent a short between HD electronics and adapter-bottom.

Well, it looks now that you do have a hardware problem.
Try this adapter in another Thinkpad to see if it works there (probably not).
But most likely you need to return it for another one, yours seems to be defective.

[ricard]

The foil will work as a protection to prevent a short between HD electronics and adapter-bottom.

Hadn't thought of that. Well, tried it now and it didn't make a difference.

Well, it looks now that you do have a hardware problem.
Try this adapter in another Thinkpad to see if it works there (probably not).
But most likely you need to return it for another one, yours seems to be defective.

While testing with the plastic foil I noticed that sometimes the drive registered (and even automounted) when I fiddled with the lever that pops out of the Ultrabay slot, i.e. when I press the lever in, the drive seems to make a connection just before the lever clicks into place. Sometimes putting pressure on the HDD adapter in one direction or another would help. So yes, it must be a hardware problem. The adapter doesn't look like an original IBM to me (it's made in China, but doesn't say Lenovo, and the IBM logo doesn't have a trademark symbol as on the optical drive; also, looking at the connector with mates with the computer, on my optical drive some pins are longer than others, whereas on the adapter they are all the same length).

Thanks all for the help.

/Ricard