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Graphics performance for T4x range

T40/T41/T42/T43 Series
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nfraser01
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Joined: Sat Jul 09, 2022 5:01 pm
Location: Bristol, UK

Graphics performance for T4x range

#1 Post by nfraser01 » Sun Jan 15, 2023 5:02 pm

Hi All

I've ended up with a three T42's - one with Intel graphics, one with the Mobility Radeon 7500 and one with the Fire GL T2 (same(ish) as Mobility Radeon 9600). I've run 3DMark2000, 3DMark2001 and 3DMark03 on each of them, if anyone is interested...

Intel Graphics
3DMark2000 - 4056
3DMark2001 - 2428
3DMark03 - 117*

Mobility Radeon 7500
3DMark2000 - 4531
3DMark2001 - 3950
3DMark03 - 222*

Fire GL T2 (Modility Radeon 9600)
3DMark2000 - 10907
3DMark2001 - 9593
3DMark03 - 2619

They are all running a Pentium M at 1.7GHz with the stock IBM recovery OS (Windows XP professional SP2) and default drivers. Some performance gains might be made by using the most up to date drivers?
The Intel and 7500 could not run all of the 3DMark03 benchmark as they are not DirectX 9.x compatible (hence the *)
I couldn't get 3DMark99 to run on Windows XP.

Hope that's interesting to someone?

dr_st
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Re: Graphics performance for T4x range

#2 Post by dr_st » Sun Jan 15, 2023 5:36 pm

Oh yeah, the Radeon 9600 / FireGL T2 is a significant boost over the 7500. Of course, compared to modern offerings, all are beyond obsolete, but for contemporary games / rendering applications back in 2004-2005, it could have made a big difference.

What's interesting to me is how little benefit (seemingly) the Radeon 7500 offers over the Intel Graphics. Of course, back then it was not only about raw performance but also compatibility. Integrated Intel GPUs were missing some features that would make certain games/apps not run at all or experience glitches.

Thanks for running the benchmarks and sharing the results. :thumbs-UP:
Thinkpad 25 (20K7), T490 (20N3), Yoga 14 (20FY), T430s (IPS FHD + Classic Keyboard), X220 4291-4BG
X61 7673-V2V, T60 2007-QPG, T42 2373-F7G, X32 (IPS Screen), A31p w/ Ultrabay Numpad

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Re: Graphics performance for T4x range

#3 Post by TPFanatic » Sun Jan 15, 2023 6:12 pm

Back in the day I played Need For Speed World competitively on T42p with 1.8ghz and Fire Gl T2, as well as 3D modeling programs. World despite being released 7-8 years after T42p's release was optimized for low end PCs so the T42p could handle it.
lenovo T530 QHD, T430s QHD, T430 FHD, T420 QHD, X330 WQXGA
Otros: P71 Y260 W530 T520 T420s T510 W510 T410 T410s X201 T500 R500 W500 T400 X200 X200s T601F X601T R61 T60 T60p Z61m Z61t X60s Z60m T42p R50p A31p T30
2 finger scroll on old Synaptics touchpads.

kfzhu1229
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Re: Graphics performance for T4x range

#4 Post by kfzhu1229 » Sun Jan 15, 2023 7:36 pm

The thing with ThinkPad T41/T42 is that Mobile Radeon 7500 was already 2 years old graphical solution by then and by the warp speed of mobile GPU improvement back then, it lagged so much behind that an Intel Extreme graphics 2 would outperform that chip in 3DMark01 due to it being able to run DX8 tests. but it does allow high res internal LCD's and DVI outputs, both are missing on Extreme graphics 2.
Mobility Radeon 9000 should've been the standard option, like it is on the competitor Latitude D600. It is already a massive improvement and can actually do DX8 tasks.
Mobility Radeon 9600 (Or FireGL) is great though, makes that version of T42/T42p kinda the fastest Windows 98 14.1" laptop by GPU performance. T43 can be made to run Windows 98 but Win98 PCIe support is absolutely dreadful.
Sadly though, with me dealing with literally a dozen T41/T42 models I have not come across a single Radeon 9000 version and the only 9600 version I came across had severe water damage that melted 2 pins off the Super IO chip so totally useless.
And lastly IBM really should've cooled the 7500 and 9000 versions with a heatsink and/or put a support frame around this area.
Dell Lat CP MMX-233 64mb 40gb W2k
600 PII-266 416mb 40gb WXP
T23 PIII 1.13ghz 1gb W7
Precision M4300 X9000 8gb 160gb WUXGA Ultrasharp fp W10
T530i 15.6" i7 16gb fp W10
UXGA:
A30p PIII 1.2 1gb W7 (IDTech)
T43p 2.26 2gb fp W10 (Sharp)
Lat C840 P4-2.5 2gb 60gb W7 (Ultrasharp)

nfraser01
Posts: 31
Joined: Sat Jul 09, 2022 5:01 pm
Location: Bristol, UK

Re: Graphics performance for T4x range

#5 Post by nfraser01 » Sun Jan 22, 2023 5:34 pm

A quick update - added new machine (bottom)

Intel Graphics
3DMark2000 - 4056
3DMark2001 - 2428
3DMark03 - 117*

Mobility Radeon 7500
3DMark2000 - 4531
3DMark2001 - 3950
3DMark03 - 222*

Fire GL T2 (Modility Radeon 9600)
3DMark2000 - 10907
3DMark2001 - 9593
3DMark03 - 2619

Mobility Radeon X300**
3DMark2000 - 8943
3DMark2001 - 7488
3DMark03 - 2076


Notes:
They are all running a Pentium M at 1.7GHz (except T43 at 1.83GHz**) with the stock IBM recovery OS (Windows XP professional SP2) and default drivers. Some performance gains might be made by using the most up to date drivers?
The Intel and 7500 could not run all of the 3DMark03 benchmark as they are not DirectX 9.x compatible (hence the *)
I couldn't get 3DMark99 to run on Windows XP.

dr_st
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Re: Graphics performance for T4x range

#6 Post by dr_st » Mon Jan 23, 2023 2:59 am

nfraser01 wrote:
Sun Jan 22, 2023 5:34 pm
Fire GL T2 (Modility Radeon 9600)
3DMark2000 - 10907
3DMark2001 - 9593
3DMark03 - 2619

Mobility Radeon X300**
3DMark2000 - 8943
3DMark2001 - 7488
3DMark03 - 2076
Thanks for this comparison. I wonder if the T2 outperforming X300 is due to the extra 64MB of RAM or due to some basic advantage of 9600 core versus X300 core. I seemed to remember performance should be closer...
Thinkpad 25 (20K7), T490 (20N3), Yoga 14 (20FY), T430s (IPS FHD + Classic Keyboard), X220 4291-4BG
X61 7673-V2V, T60 2007-QPG, T42 2373-F7G, X32 (IPS Screen), A31p w/ Ultrabay Numpad

nfraser01
Posts: 31
Joined: Sat Jul 09, 2022 5:01 pm
Location: Bristol, UK

Re: Graphics performance for T4x range

#7 Post by nfraser01 » Mon Jan 23, 2023 6:01 am

dr_st wrote:
Mon Jan 23, 2023 2:59 am
Thanks for this comparison. I wonder if the T2 outperforming X300 is due to the extra 64MB of RAM or due to some basic advantage of 9600 core versus X300 core. I seemed to remember performance should be closer...
I havent checked but I think it's a 64-bit vs 128-bit memory interface thing...

nfraser01
Posts: 31
Joined: Sat Jul 09, 2022 5:01 pm
Location: Bristol, UK

Re: Graphics performance for T4x range

#8 Post by nfraser01 » Mon Jan 23, 2023 6:03 am

nfraser01 wrote:
Mon Jan 23, 2023 6:01 am
dr_st wrote:
Mon Jan 23, 2023 2:59 am
Thanks for this comparison. I wonder if the T2 outperforming X300 is due to the extra 64MB of RAM or due to some basic advantage of 9600 core versus X300 core. I seemed to remember performance should be closer...
I havent checked but I think it's a 64-bit vs 128-bit memory interface thing...
Looks like it might be:
https://www.notebookcheck.net/Mobility- ... 598.0.html

nfraser01
Posts: 31
Joined: Sat Jul 09, 2022 5:01 pm
Location: Bristol, UK

Re: Graphics performance for T4x range

#9 Post by nfraser01 » Mon Jan 23, 2023 9:49 am

For context I have a Dell D600 running a Pentium M 1.6GHz with Mobility Radeon 9000 giving:

Mobility Radeon 900
3DMark2000 - 5815
3DMark2001 - 4415
3DMark03 - 595

Interestingly installing SP3 on windows XP reduced the 3DMark 2000 score (but not the others) by about 15% on the ThinkPad T43...

kfzhu1229
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Re: Graphics performance for T4x range

#10 Post by kfzhu1229 » Wed Jan 25, 2023 12:22 am

nfraser01 wrote:
Mon Jan 23, 2023 9:49 am
For context I have a Dell D600 running a Pentium M 1.6GHz with Mobility Radeon 9000 giving:

Mobility Radeon 900
3DMark2000 - 5815
3DMark2001 - 4415
3DMark03 - 595

Interestingly installing SP3 on windows XP reduced the 3DMark 2000 score (but not the others) by about 15% on the ThinkPad T43...
Actually interestingly enough while D600 exclusively shipped with Mobility Radeon 9000, you have the choice of getting it with either 32MB of VRAM or 64MB. don't know how much that'd play a role here...
That's one of my go to Windows 98 gaming laptops for sale. Smaller 14.1" form factor but no Radeon 7500 rubbish and GPU has a separate actively cooled heatsink, which means GPU is highly unlikely to fail.
In Windows 98 SE, you DO, however, need some tweaks on D600 to get the IDE controller to work properly and out of MS-DOS compatibility mode plus an working optical drive!
Dell Lat CP MMX-233 64mb 40gb W2k
600 PII-266 416mb 40gb WXP
T23 PIII 1.13ghz 1gb W7
Precision M4300 X9000 8gb 160gb WUXGA Ultrasharp fp W10
T530i 15.6" i7 16gb fp W10
UXGA:
A30p PIII 1.2 1gb W7 (IDTech)
T43p 2.26 2gb fp W10 (Sharp)
Lat C840 P4-2.5 2gb 60gb W7 (Ultrasharp)

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