T43 1871-4BU -- USB 3 (*PICS*)

[CeeBee]

I have a StarTech ECUSB3S254F (2 Port) Flush Mounted USB 3 ExpressCard on my T43 1871-4BU (2GB memory) running Windows 7 Pro. The StarTech card has been updated with the latest drivers and firmware.

Using a WD My Passport Ultra 1TB external USB 3 drive to test the transfer speed, the StarTech USB 3 port is relatively much better:



However, when I copy files, the transfer speed of the T43 built-in USB 2 port is better:



What gives? Am I missing something here .. and can someone explain why? Thanks.

Moderator edit: Added a "PICS" warning to the thread title, as per forum rules.

[dr_st]

I'd say that your built-in drive (the one you're copying from) is the bottleneck here. Not sure why you are actually seeing lower speeds (is this consistent?), but it may have something to do with the way system resources are shared between your hard drive and the various USB controllers...

[Johan]

Interesting thread about using the StarTech ECUSB3S254F in a T43! In the T60 forum, another recent thread is also discussing USB 3.0 (in a T60!), using the FKU 54mm Express USB 3.0 PCMCIA card. There is a discussion about speed limits/bottlenecks in T4x's and T60x' in the thread Compatibil​ty of T42p and T60p for USB 3.0.

Johan

[CeeBee]

I'd say that your built-in drive (the one you're copying from) is the bottleneck here. Not sure why you are actually seeing lower speeds (is this consistent?), but it may have something to do with the way system resources are shared between your hard drive and the various USB controllers...

It's consistent when copying from built-in to external drive. However, you may be onto something as I just copied a 634MB file from the external to the built-in drive and the USB 3 port was substantially faster. Starting out at 130MB/sec, or more, it tapered off later during the transfer, to 50-60MB/sec.

The USB 2 port transfer stayed pretty much in the mid-30MB/sec range during the whole transfer.



Whereas the above is interesting and perhaps proves that the USB 3 port works okay, as most of my transfers are from the built-in drive to the external My Passport (backup), it would be nice to find a way to up the speed in that direction. Any thought?

[dr_st]

I assume it's a standard mechanical drive.

Start by defragmenting it. Does it help?

[CeeBee]

I assume it's a standard mechanical drive. Start by defragmenting it. Does it help?

A standard Fujitsu 100 GB ATA 'mechanical' drive, purchased from Lenovo. I defrag frequently so that's not an issue...

[dr_st]

A few questions:

What is the DMA mode of the ATA port of the hard drive? You can find out in the device manager, in the properties of the IDE channel the drive is connected to.

What are the interrupt resources (IRQ) assigned to the hard drive controller, the USB2 controller and the USB3 controller? You can find out in the device manager, in the properties of each, under the Resources tab.

[CeeBee]

HD ATA Channel 0 - Ultra DMA Mode 5
HD ATA Channel 0 = IRQ 14
USB 2 Host Controller = IRQ 19
USB 3 Host Controller = several (negative) entries:
IRQ -2
IRQ -3
IRQ -4
IRQ -5
IRQ -6
IRQ -7
IRQ -8
IRQ -9

All devices are working properly -- no conflicts.

[dr_st]

OK, so the USB3 controller uses MSI-X, so that's definitely not the culprit.

Last attempt to guessing - what about the PCIe root port that the ExpressCard is connected to? You will see the USB controller below it, if you select "View devices by connection". What IRQ is that on?

[CeeBee]

...what about the PCIe root port that the ExpressCard is connected to? You will see the USB controller below it, if you select "View devices by connection". What IRQ is that on?

Not sure I can find that one. I have a TI PCI-1510 CardBus Controller if that's what you mean? IRQ 16 and that device is working properly as well, no conflicts.

[dr_st]

The Cardbus controller is unrelated. The ExpressCard should be connected to one of the PCIe root ports of the chipset.

Let's try a simpler thing: When you view resources by connection - what other devices share IRQs 14 or 16?

[CeeBee]

IRQ 14 = not shared

IRQ 16 = shared by:

- Broadcom NetXtreme GigaBit Ethernet Network Adapter
- Intel 82801 FB/FBM USB Universal Host Controller - 2658
- Mobil Intel 915GM/GMS, 910GML Express Chipset family
- Texas Instruments PCI-1510 CardBus Controller

All devices work properly, no conflicts.

[dr_st]

Well, then interrupts probably have nothing to do with it. Puzzling...

[automobus]

Western Digital is the biggest player in USB HDD industry; they can afford the expense of certification. WD made more than fourteen My Book models, yet only fourteen are certified compliant USB. WD made several My Passport models, of which ZERO are certified compliant USB devices.

It is my opinion (this means SUBJECTIVE opinion), approximately two My Passport models are interesting. The rest are cheap junk.

How are you powering this HDD? Is it powered by ExpressCard? If yes, then that is double-wrong. To power a typical 2.5-inch HDD from USB is unwise. Exporting power from ExpressCard is very unwise.

[CeeBee]

Well, then interrupts probably have nothing to do with it. Puzzling...

A bit puzzling, but, at least I know that there are no IRQ conflicts and that all devices work okay. Trying to merge/use old hardware (T43) with new stuff (USB 3 drive/express card) is probably a game of luck, at best. But, as long as I know the limitations I'll try to work around the issues. Thanks for your efforts. Appreciated!

Another interesting observation is that 'moving' rather than copying files from the built-in drive to the external drive seems much faster .. using the USB 3 port. Need to do more testing (no time now), however, if that's consistent that would help.

[CeeBee]

...WD made several My Passport models, of which ZERO are certified compliant USB devices. It is my opinion (this means SUBJECTIVE opinion), approximately two My Passport models are interesting. The rest are cheap junk.

Not sure how important certification is, as, in view of WD's size/dominance in its field, if not 100% USB 3 compliant, someone would no doubt tell them (and the rest of the world too). So, in your subjective opinion, what two My Passport models are okay?

How are you powering this HDD? Is it powered by ExpressCard? If yes, then that is double-wrong. To power a typical 2.5-inch HDD from USB is unwise. Exporting power from ExpressCard is very unwise.

I power the external USB 3 drive (My Passport Ultra 1TB) from the ExpressCard. That's the whole idea/beauty of the portable drive concept .. not having a separate power source to 'schlepp' around. If need be, the StarTech card provides a separate power cable to add power the ExpressCard from the USB 2 port. In my case, I tried it (no difference), but, it's not needed.

[automobus]

WD makes throw-away products for our throw-away society. I have no doubt, customers did tell them. Customers probably say also "I have had it up to here! I am never buying anything from this company again!", and then buy a crummy product (cheap) from another company.

In my subjective opinion, no My Passport is okay. I do not take risks with inadequate power delivery to storage devices.

I suspect your Passport is underpowered: firmware is aware of this, so it runs with trepidation, perhaps write cache is limited to small amount.

You might consider connecting a decent powered hub to your ExpressCard.

[CeeBee]

I'd say that your built-in drive (the one you're copying from) is the bottleneck here. Not sure why you are actually seeing lower speeds (is this consistent?), but it may have something to do with the way system resources are shared between your hard drive and the various USB controllers...

Hello dr_st,

After 'sidetracking' on the good/bad of WD external drives, let me return to the core issue of using an USB 3 ExpressCard on my T43 1871-4BU. As the transfer speed (read) of my internal drive is around 38-40MB, maybe you are correct in saying that this drive is the bottleneck. Although, that doesn't explain why the USB 3 port - in my particular case - performs the way it does...

So, is there anyone out there with a T43 with an USB 3 ExpressCard that performs well, copying (or moving) files to/from an external USB 3 drive? If so, please let me hear from you with details. Thanks.

[RealBlackStuff]

Another option to consider:
T43/R52 (plus the X41) were originally planned for SATA drives.
When, at that time, the SATA drives were still too rare or expensive,
the motherboard's SATA Hard Disk connector was replaced with a PATA HD connector
and a SATA-PATA signal-converter chip was added.
All this data conversion does not add speed to the internal data-shuffling.
-->USB3-HD
-->USB3-card adapter
-->Express PCMCIA slot
weird and wonderful stuff going on in the Motherboard circuitry
-->SATA-PATA-chip
-->PATA-HD
and v.v.

The above would confirm, or even strengthen, dr_st's opinion of a bottleneck.

[ABuNeNe]

This is my transfer speed on my t43 using a esata express card over a gigabit lan.

http://i.imgur.com/PV1IuUa.png

[CeeBee]

I'd say that your built-in drive (the one you're copying from) is the bottleneck here...

Old thread, but, let me add this:

1) Using 'FreeFileSync' software to synchronize a 4TB WD My Book Duo (configured for RAID1) with a 2TB WD My Book (both external USB3 HDDs, powered externally), via the USB3 ports on my StarTech ExpressCard, I get transfer speeds ranging from 90 MB/sec to 110MB/sec. The same transfer speed is achieved with a simple file manager copy. I can live with that.

2) My internal hard drive is now a Hitachi 120GB (replacing the Fujitsu 100GB). Copying from the Hitachi to an external USB3 HDD has improved to 32-34 MB/sec. A slight improvement over the Fujitsu.

The above just to round of this (dead) thread...