Take a look at our
ThinkPads.com HOME PAGE
For those who might want to contribute to the blog, start here: Editors Alley Topic
Then contact Bill with a Private Message

New project: ThinkPad T40 mobo to work with 533MHz Dothan CPUs?

T4x series specific matters only
Post Reply
Message
Author
lukee
Junior Member
Junior Member
Posts: 460
Joined: Mon Oct 12, 2009 7:17 am
Location: CZ / Europe

New project: ThinkPad T40 mobo to work with 533MHz Dothan CPUs?

#1 Post by lukee » Tue Aug 25, 2015 4:05 am

I'm curious if T40's mobo (designed primarily for 400MHz FSB Dothans and Banias') will work with 533MHz Dothan CPU? I do remember times of my former Dell Latitude D600 which has had almost same HW as T40, that 533MHz Dothan CPU worked well there, even underperforming on 400MHz FSB. Is it going to work reliably? I know, that memory modules needs to be 400MHz.

I have these parts and I would like to build a nice setup from them:

- 14.1" SXGA+ LCD (damaged LCD cable after my experiments to make this LCD working with R52 Intel board, however I've bought a new one as replacement on eBay for 6 Euros yesterday)
- 14.1" T40 shell with T40 mobo (GPU Radeon 7500)
- 1.8GHz 400MHz FSB CPU, 1.8GHz 533MHz FSB CPU
- 2x 512MB 400MHz DDR modules
- DVD multi recorder for UltraBay slim
- multiple HDDs, 7K100, Fujitsu HDDs and some old 4k2 rpm Hitachis
Current: T420
Previous: T400, T43p Flexview, T40, R52, T43p 14"
My first ThinkPad was 570

ajkula66
SuperUserGeorge
SuperUserGeorge
Posts: 16662
Joined: Sun Feb 25, 2007 11:28 am
Location: Brodheadsville, Pennsylvania, USA

Re: New project: ThinkPad T40 mobo to work with 533MHz Dothan CPUs?

#2 Post by ajkula66 » Tue Aug 25, 2015 10:03 am

The board will work, but you need a pinmod - described *somewhere* on this forum - in order for the CPU to run at full speed.

Good luck.
...Knowledge is a deadly friend when no one sets the rules...(King Crimson)

Cheers,

George (your grouchy retired FlexView farmer)

FlexView AARP club members:A31p, T43pSF, X60T

Abused daily: T520, X200s


PMs requesting personal tech support will be ignored.

lukee
Junior Member
Junior Member
Posts: 460
Joined: Mon Oct 12, 2009 7:17 am
Location: CZ / Europe

Re: New project: ThinkPad T40 mobo to work with 533MHz Dothan CPUs?

#3 Post by lukee » Tue Aug 25, 2015 11:14 am

This one?
http://www.notebookreview.com/news/pin- ... m-m-guide/

Does it mean the T40 board will drive 533Mhz Dothan afterwards at full speed?
Current: T420
Previous: T400, T43p Flexview, T40, R52, T43p 14"
My first ThinkPad was 570

ajkula66
SuperUserGeorge
SuperUserGeorge
Posts: 16662
Joined: Sun Feb 25, 2007 11:28 am
Location: Brodheadsville, Pennsylvania, USA

Re: New project: ThinkPad T40 mobo to work with 533MHz Dothan CPUs?

#4 Post by ajkula66 » Tue Aug 25, 2015 11:55 am

I don't believe so. That one deals with overclocking a 400MHz Dothan to work at 533MHz. You need a 533MHz CPU running on 400MHz planar, and at full speed.
...Knowledge is a deadly friend when no one sets the rules...(King Crimson)

Cheers,

George (your grouchy retired FlexView farmer)

FlexView AARP club members:A31p, T43pSF, X60T

Abused daily: T520, X200s


PMs requesting personal tech support will be ignored.

axur-delmeria
Senior ThinkPadder
Senior ThinkPadder
Posts: 2356
Joined: Mon May 28, 2012 5:49 am
Location: Metro Manila, Philippines

Re: New project: ThinkPad T40 mobo to work with 533MHz Dothan CPUs?

#5 Post by axur-delmeria » Tue Aug 25, 2015 12:02 pm

Big questions:

1. How to force the Intel 855GM to run at 533MHz FSB? --> it may be more like a PLL mod than a socket pinmod.
2. Will it be stable?
Daily driver: X220 4291-C91 i7-2620M

Backup: X601 Core 2 Duo T8100
Toy: X60F Core Solo U1300
On loan: X220 4291-P79 i5-2520M
In pieces: two retired but working X61Ts
RIP: 760XD 9546-U9E; X61 7676-A24; and a BOE-Hydis HV121P01-100 in failed SXGA+ mod
:cry:

lukee
Junior Member
Junior Member
Posts: 460
Joined: Mon Oct 12, 2009 7:17 am
Location: CZ / Europe

Re: New project: ThinkPad T40 mobo to work with 533MHz Dothan CPUs?

#6 Post by lukee » Fri Aug 28, 2015 3:14 am

Why are the high-end Pentium Ms so expensive?
Looking at feebay, ie: Pentium M 765 (top processor for T40 - T42 series with Dothan core and 400MHz bus) is 4 times more expensive than Pentium M 755 (2GHz vs 2.1GHz). The same is for Pentium M 770 vs. 780 (2.13GHz vs 2.26GHz). For my T40 project, I currently have Pentium M 745 (Dothan 2MB, 400MHz, 1.8GHz) and considering $10 Pentium M 755. Is it worth upgrade?
Current: T420
Previous: T400, T43p Flexview, T40, R52, T43p 14"
My first ThinkPad was 570

sdfox7
Sophomore Member
Posts: 131
Joined: Mon Sep 01, 2014 10:06 pm
Location: Danbury, CT, United States of America

Re: New project: ThinkPad T40 mobo to work with 533MHz Dothan CPUs?

#7 Post by sdfox7 » Sat Aug 29, 2015 6:23 pm

lukee wrote:Why are the high-end Pentium Ms so expensive?
Supply and demand. These products are out of production and have been for nearly a decade.
ThinkPad 600E (Win98); T23 (WinNT 4.0); T41 (Win2000); T61p (WinXP)
My name is Stephen Fox. I am a '18 BBA and '20 MBA student at WCSU.
Disable Google Chrome End of Support Infobar on Windows XP/Vista

ajkula66
SuperUserGeorge
SuperUserGeorge
Posts: 16662
Joined: Sun Feb 25, 2007 11:28 am
Location: Brodheadsville, Pennsylvania, USA

Re: New project: ThinkPad T40 mobo to work with 533MHz Dothan CPUs?

#8 Post by ajkula66 » Sat Aug 29, 2015 7:46 pm

sdfox7 wrote:
lukee wrote:Why are the high-end Pentium Ms so expensive?
Supply and demand. These products are out of production and have been for nearly a decade.
The other part of the equation is that all "top-end" CPUs that enable one to max out a particular platform (T7600, X9000, 2960XM to name but a few) always carry a premium when it comes to the price even if their performance is quite similar to the next CPU in line.
...Knowledge is a deadly friend when no one sets the rules...(King Crimson)

Cheers,

George (your grouchy retired FlexView farmer)

FlexView AARP club members:A31p, T43pSF, X60T

Abused daily: T520, X200s


PMs requesting personal tech support will be ignored.

PuuFa
Posts: 45
Joined: Fri Feb 25, 2011 5:52 am
Location: Seinäjoki, Finland

Re: New project: ThinkPad T40 mobo to work with 533MHz Dothan CPUs?

#9 Post by PuuFa » Sat Sep 05, 2015 9:23 am

Nice to see someone still messing with these great old dinosaurs. :) I've actually done this thing many times in the past on several T40 units and never had an issue with stability or reliability if only the CPU can handle 533MHz FSB.

To make the board run at 533MHz FSB you will need to short the second and third leg of the PLL chip, counting from up left corner. I have used a fine tip soldering iron and a tiny ball of solder but there are other methods to do it as well.

As for the CPU I've used the cheap 400MHz FSB Dothans of 1.5GHz, 1.6GHz and 1.7GHz which will work after the mod at 2GHz, 2.13GHz and 2.26GHz respectively. The success rate varies though. With the 1.5GHz my success rate has been full 100 percent, 1.6GHz something between 80-90 percent but 1.7GHz only about 40 percent. With the success rate I mean that they run perfectly stable without overvolting. Overvolting is easy to do but I'd rather avoid it because it affects the heat and battery life. I've never tried a 1.8GHz chip but you'd definitely need some serious overvolting to make it run stable at 533FSB.

Of course you can also use a real 533FSB Dothan which, besides being guaranteed to work, would give you PAE support and usually better undervolting results.

With T40 you don't need to worry about the RAM at all; I've had 100 percent success rate even with the original "Mosel vitec" 256/512MB sticks. After the mod they will run at 177MHz (DDR-354) if my memory serves...

For the operating system I'd recommend a stripped down Windows 7 with ati display driver version 6.14.10.6606. I've tried many light weight Linux distros on T40 and many of them do beat Windows in boot times but once the system is up and running it's surprisingly almost always been Win7 which offers the smoothest overall operation and most notably the best video performance. However don't forget to flash the latest BIOS and embedded controller first, I recall having some strange issues with Win7 and an older BIOS version...

A speedy hard drive does make a big difference too. As far as I know Samsung HM160HC is the fastest IDE drive and I've used it with good results. Despite being only 5400RPM drive it actually outperforms most of the 7200RPM IDE drives. I also use PerfectDisk under Windows to defrag the drive and it does make a noticeable difference in performance, especially with these old and slow drives.

Hope this was helpful :)

Hans Gruber
Senior Member
Senior Member
Posts: 815
Joined: Thu Sep 29, 2005 6:18 am
Location: Seattle, WA

Re: New project: ThinkPad T40 mobo to work with 533MHz Dothan CPUs?

#10 Post by Hans Gruber » Sat Sep 05, 2015 9:48 am

lukee wrote:Why are the high-end Pentium Ms so expensive?
Looking at feebay, ie: Pentium M 765 (top processor for T40 - T42 series with Dothan core and 400MHz bus) is 4 times more expensive than Pentium M 755 (2GHz vs 2.1GHz). The same is for Pentium M 770 vs. 780 (2.13GHz vs 2.26GHz). For my T40 project, I currently have Pentium M 745 (Dothan 2MB, 400MHz, 1.8GHz) and considering $10 Pentium M 755. Is it worth upgrade?
This is why I $ cost average everything I purchase. It comes down to how badly you want to have the fastest processor of that generation. I would call it good at 2ghz myself, but that is just me. The performance increase between 2ghz and 2.26ghz is not a big boost. Going from 1.5-1.6ghz to 2ghz+ is a significant difference.
:beer: T43p,T61,X200,X200s,x201,T500,W500,T510,T410,T410s,T420s,T430,T430s :parrot:

sdfox7
Sophomore Member
Posts: 131
Joined: Mon Sep 01, 2014 10:06 pm
Location: Danbury, CT, United States of America

Re: New project: ThinkPad T40 mobo to work with 533MHz Dothan CPUs?

#11 Post by sdfox7 » Sat Sep 05, 2015 12:21 pm

lukee wrote:Why are the high-end Pentium Ms so expensive?
Looking at feebay, ie: Pentium M 765 (top processor for T40 - T42 series with Dothan core and 400MHz bus) is 4 times more expensive than Pentium M 755 (2GHz vs 2.1GHz). The same is for Pentium M 770 vs. 780 (2.13GHz vs 2.26GHz). For my T40 project, I currently have Pentium M 745 (Dothan 2MB, 400MHz, 1.8GHz) and considering $10 Pentium M 755. Is it worth upgrade?
Lately I have been buying more goods on Amazon than eBay. It just seems like eBay has gotten ridiculous, and of course the seller has to charge higher prices because of the eBay fees.

Here's a new Pentium M 765 on Amazon for only $10: http://www.amazon.com/gp/offer-listing/ ... dition=new

You can get a Pentium 780 on Amazon for around $30: http://www.amazon.com/s/ref=nb_sb_noss_ ... tium+m+780
ThinkPad 600E (Win98); T23 (WinNT 4.0); T41 (Win2000); T61p (WinXP)
My name is Stephen Fox. I am a '18 BBA and '20 MBA student at WCSU.
Disable Google Chrome End of Support Infobar on Windows XP/Vista

lukee
Junior Member
Junior Member
Posts: 460
Joined: Mon Oct 12, 2009 7:17 am
Location: CZ / Europe

Re: New project: ThinkPad T40 mobo to work with 533MHz Dothan CPUs?

#12 Post by lukee » Sat Sep 05, 2015 1:21 pm

PuuFa wrote: For the operating system I'd recommend a stripped down Windows 7 with ati display driver version 6.14.10.6606. I've tried many light weight Linux distros on T40 and many of them do beat Windows in boot times but once the system is up and running it's surprisingly almost always been Win7 which offers the smoothest overall operation and most notably the best video performance. However don't forget to flash the latest BIOS and embedded controller first, I recall having some strange issues with Win7 and an older BIOS version...

A speedy hard drive does make a big difference too. As far as I know Samsung HM160HC is the fastest IDE drive and I've used it with good results. Despite being only 5400RPM drive it actually outperforms most of the 7200RPM IDE drives. I also use PerfectDisk under Windows to defrag the drive and it does make a noticeable difference in performance, especially with these old and slow drives.

Hope this was helpful :)
Problem in Linux are graphics drivers. As there is no support for legacy GPUs in current fglrx (proprietary) AMD driver, we mostly rely on opensource driver which provides only 10-20% performance in compare with the proprietary driver. This is the reason why Windows 7 works better. However, Windows systems are usually getting slower over the time - Linux systems don't.

HDD: I know that HM160HC is the fastest 2.5" IDE HDD thanks to the single platter design with high density. As I have a source of the free Fujitsu and 7K100 80GB hard drives, I will not go to purchase that Samsung. Also, I have had this HM160HC in my old T43p which is serving to friend of mine currently, I wouldn't buy this one as the HDD got some bad sectors after ~2 years of the service (HDD bought as new). I believe that classic HDDs (Fujitsus, Hitachis, Toshibas) are more reliable.
Current: T420
Previous: T400, T43p Flexview, T40, R52, T43p 14"
My first ThinkPad was 570

PuuFa
Posts: 45
Joined: Fri Feb 25, 2011 5:52 am
Location: Seinäjoki, Finland

Re: New project: ThinkPad T40 mobo to work with 533MHz Dothan CPUs?

#13 Post by PuuFa » Sat Sep 05, 2015 2:06 pm

Problem in Linux are graphics drivers. As there is no support for legacy GPUs in current fglrx (proprietary) AMD driver, we mostly rely on opensource driver which provides only 10-20% performance in compare with the proprietary driver. This is the reason why Windows 7 works better. However, Windows systems are usually getting slower over the time - Linux systems don't.
I agree. Graphics driver is indeed the culprit here which makes Win7 to run better on T40. Apparently Radeon 7500 is just too old and poorly supported even by the opensource driver nowadays. Maybe an older driver version would work better but my experience and knowledge in Linux is not even nearly enough to mess with those things. However on slightly newer systems such as T43 and some T42 models (with a better graphics chip) Linux actually runs better than Win7 does.
HDD: I know that HM160HC is the fastest 2.5" IDE HDD thanks to the single platter design with high density. As I have a source of the free Fujitsu and 7K100 80GB hard drives, I will not go to purchase that Samsung. Also, I have had this HM160HC in my old T43p which is serving to friend of mine currently, I wouldn't buy this one as the HDD got some bad sectors after ~2 years of the service (HDD bought as new). I believe that classic HDDs (Fujitsus, Hitachis, Toshibas) are more reliable.
Lucky man, you got a free source of such decent hard drives? :) Anyway, I just thought to mention about this drive in case if you were not aware of it. Sorry to hear that you've got a bad one. I've actually encountered several bad Fujitsus but to be honest I don't know if they were abused by the previous owner. Hitachis on the other hand seem to be very reliable, never seen a bad one yet.

ajkula66
SuperUserGeorge
SuperUserGeorge
Posts: 16662
Joined: Sun Feb 25, 2007 11:28 am
Location: Brodheadsville, Pennsylvania, USA

Re: New project: ThinkPad T40 mobo to work with 533MHz Dothan CPUs?

#14 Post by ajkula66 » Sat Sep 05, 2015 2:14 pm

sdfox7 wrote: Here's a new Pentium M 765 on Amazon for only $10: http://www.amazon.com/gp/offer-listing/ ... dition=new
If you look at the actual listing, it's a 755 and not a 765...
...Knowledge is a deadly friend when no one sets the rules...(King Crimson)

Cheers,

George (your grouchy retired FlexView farmer)

FlexView AARP club members:A31p, T43pSF, X60T

Abused daily: T520, X200s


PMs requesting personal tech support will be ignored.

sdfox7
Sophomore Member
Posts: 131
Joined: Mon Sep 01, 2014 10:06 pm
Location: Danbury, CT, United States of America

Re: New project: ThinkPad T40 mobo to work with 533MHz Dothan CPUs?

#15 Post by sdfox7 » Sat Sep 05, 2015 4:17 pm

ajkula66 wrote:
sdfox7 wrote: Here's a new Pentium M 765 on Amazon for only $10: http://www.amazon.com/gp/offer-listing/ ... dition=new
If you look at the actual listing, it's a 755 and not a 765...
George

A typo on my part, but most of those are in China so you'd have to wait longer to receive if if you live in the States. :thumbs-UP:

Here's a nice 2.13GHz Pentium M 770 from OH, only $15.49: http://www.amazon.com/gp/offer-listing/ ... tium+m+770

Amazon seems more competitive lately. Or I am just now realizing it.
ThinkPad 600E (Win98); T23 (WinNT 4.0); T41 (Win2000); T61p (WinXP)
My name is Stephen Fox. I am a '18 BBA and '20 MBA student at WCSU.
Disable Google Chrome End of Support Infobar on Windows XP/Vista

lukee
Junior Member
Junior Member
Posts: 460
Joined: Mon Oct 12, 2009 7:17 am
Location: CZ / Europe

Re: New project: ThinkPad T40 mobo to work with 533MHz Dothan CPUs?

#16 Post by lukee » Wed Sep 09, 2015 4:22 am

Project is completed.
Final configuration is:

Pentium M Dothan 1.8GHz 400MHz FSB
T40-based motherboard with Radeon 7k5 GPU
Long fan/heatsink is also covering the GPU
1GB DDR RAM (awaiting 2x 1GB kit from China)
80GB Fujitsu MHV2080AH (very silent & relatively fast drive)
802.11b/g Atheros WiFi card (thanks for the no-1802 hack)
14.1" XGA screen with "T41" sticker
DVD-RW drive
Debian 8 Jessie operating system
9-cells extended battery (unfortunately only with Sanyo cells)

Almost in the mint condition, only shine is visible slightly on the keyboard and in the LCD lid corners.
The system runs perfectly cool and fan is being engaged only under heavier load.
Current: T420
Previous: T400, T43p Flexview, T40, R52, T43p 14"
My first ThinkPad was 570

Post Reply
  • Similar Topics
    Replies
    Views
    Last post

Return to “ThinkPad T4x Series”

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 22 guests