Please tell me this is NOT typical of IBM Service!

[makai]

Sorry but this might turn into a rant as I'm quite upset!

Ok... I sent my T41 back to IBM because I'm having a Powerplay issue. Here's part of the letter I sent to IBM ACCOMPANING the machine... (I sent 2 copies just in case they lost one!)

Hello IBM Engineer,

I will attempt to explain the problems I’m seeing involving Powerplay on this T41.

Whenever Powerplay is enabled (Battery mode), the menu area of “certain” windows appear to be displayed in 16bit color mode, although 32bit desktop is selected. This corruption is seen regardless of the fact that the ATI Display Properties/Battery Maximizer “Allow Automatic Color Depth Reduction” is deselected. The affected menus look pixilated and unevenly colored and if you open Windows Explorer and look across the entire gray menu area, you will see what I mean. The reason I mention only “certain” windows is because although this corruption shows up in some windows, it doesn’t show up in all. For instance, the problem is NOT apparent in the MS Word 2000 menu, which has about the same sized menu area as Windows Explorer but is not “shaded” the same. I can only guess the problem has to do with the amount of color rendering required by the different programs/windows. Note that you can also see the problem while browsing the Internet using IE and/or Firefox… which is where it gets very bothersome since browsing is all about looking at the screen. Also note that although the corruption appears in the menu area, it isn’t apparent elsewhere in the opened window… at least it isn’t as easily distinguishable to me.

A strange occurrence can also be seen if you do the following. Power up the laptop under Battery power… “Enable” Powerplay… then shut down the machine. Now plug in the AC adapter, and restart the machine. After the machine has restarted, open Windows Explorer, or any affected window, and the menu area will “still” be corrupted. If you remove the AC cable (w/o shutting down), the menu will “remain” corrupted regardless if you manually enable or disable Powerplay. Since Powerplay is “supposed to be” disabled while on AC, the menu corruption occurrence should have disappeared once the laptop was restarted on AC.

The entire letter is actually longer with other information not related to the problem. So why am I upset??? Well, I called IBM this morning because the Service Information center has the status as "HF" Hold For Customer information. The Custormer service person who answers the phone tells me I need to give more information about what the problem is! What??? Can't these people read???

I ask her if the tech read the letter I sent, and she tells me "oh, they don't read that stuff." WHAT??!!! She says, "since they don't unpack the machines, they never get that kind of information". WTF is wrong with this picture? Someone please tell me this is NOT the way IBM handles repairs!

So next, she asks me to explain the problem to her and she will pass it along to the technician. Right here is where I start to get upset! I take the time to write an entire descriptive letter of the problem (which apparrently no one read!), and then I have to try to explain the problem to a non-tecnical person who can't understand anything technical... (this is her description of herself, not mine). So... being a bit [censored], I start reading the letter word for word and she then interupts me and says she just needs a "short" description! This is where she tells me she isn't technical and can't understand what I'm describing????????? What good is having her there in the fisrt place then if she can't understand anything someone is telling her??? I then ask to speak to someone in charge and she says "not available". Ok, then can I have a number to call of the person in charge... "not available"... and... "anyways, she would tell you the same thing". Ok, can I speak to someone technical? She says "no, the only thing you can do is wait for someone to call you".

You know, I'm an engineer working for a major Aerospace company in California who among other things, handles customer field returns. We read everything that comes in with any return! All information is moved with the hardware so "technical" people can stay informed of what's going on. In fact, it's very welcomed when a customer sends in any kind of written description of the problem they're seeing. So what the hell is IBM's problem besides NOT being my company!

I'm so sick of companies that handle custormer serivice repairs in IBMs "manner". They think customers have nothing better to do than wait around for them. I'm sure this is not how IBM started out in it's beginnings, but sadly this is what they are now! It's really so unfortunate that companies as large as IBM forget where the hell they came from!

Ok, sorry about the rant! There is much more to the story, but I'll leave that out. I am now awaiting a call from an IBM tech so I can explain "verbally" what the problem is. Hopefully he has an email account and is willing to let me send "another" copy of the letter I wrote to him. By the way, the tech wrote in his log that "no problems can be seen". No BIG surprise here! Supposedly, he ran the video diagnostics, which by the way disables Powerplay, and runs the machine full bore! Well yah... if you don't know "what" you're looking for and you don't know "how" to look for it, then how the hell can you "find" it?!!!


makai

[Thinker]

Yeah, I would be [censored] off too. What branch of IBM did you deal with?

One of the things to consider is that since IBM is not in the PC business anymore, maybe they are outsourcing the service of the legacy units that were sold before the transfer to Lenovo and are still within warranty to another party, so they might have relaxed (or there might be some transitory problems due to the change in the situation).

I don't think IBM used to be like this, but that is probably irrelevant to you.

Incidentally, I recently had some problems with another big company (UPS), where a package was first damaged due to negligence, and then lost when they picked it up to have it inspected. After almost 4 months the issue got resolved, but it was like pulling teeth. I am sure many people give up under similar circumstances, and that is probably their objective in the way they handle things.

Good luck with your T41!

[makai]

Thinker,

My T41 was manufactured Feb 2005. It's basically new! The branch is in Memphis and I really don't know if this is their "main" US branch or not. We'll see what happens when/if IBM calls today. I'm home, so they better call!!!!

I can relate to your UPS experience, although mine was with FEDEX. Don't you just hate how these people take care of their customers?!!

Thanks for the sympathy, it helps knowing people understand!

makai

[Thinker]

We'll see what happens when/if IBM calls today. I'm home, so they better call!!!!

I can relate to your UPS experience, although mine was with FEDEX. Don't you just hate how these people take care of their customers?!!

Thanks for the sympathy, it helps knowing people understand!

makai

makai,

Don't get too upset if IBM doesn't call. They might need some extra help, don't despair.

When this thing happened with UPS I promised myself that I would try to only receive things from FEDEX whenever this depended on me. From what you tell me, I guess it doesn't make the slightest bit of difference who you deal with.

I knows it makes a difference when people can relate to your situation and sympathize with you. At about the same time I had this UPS catastrophe I got screwed by someone in eBay who offered a "like new" T23. I shared my woes with the folks here, and many people sympathized with my problem. It does make a difference. It makes you feel that it's not you vs. the world.

Take it easy and persevere, I'm sure everything will be fine.

[makai]

When this thing happened with UPS I promised myself that I would try to only receive things from FEDEX whenever this depended on me. From what you tell me, I guess it doesn't make the slightest bit of difference who you deal with.

That's so funny! I did the same thing with FEDEX. I would stop buying things online from stores that used FEDEX and only go with stores that used UPS! lol!! I guess it really comes down to only one thing... You just can't depend on anything! lol!

Ok Thinker, I'm feeling better after I've laughed a little! Thanks for cheering me up! I won't forget this conversation in all my time to come on this forum!
And yes... I shall persevere!

makai

[K. Eng]

When I sent my machine in for repairs, I always included a letter as well, describing symptoms and anything else a repair person might need to know. All I gotta say is wtf... I wasted my time if what makai wrote is true.

Hope your issue is resolved though. IBM always repaired my machine within 48 hours.

[makai]

Well, I just spoke to custormer service from "Memphis". Apparrently the first customer service person I spoke to is from somewhere else and not even in Memphis!

The Memphis person was very cordial, nice, and patient, and basically called to tell me they needed to re-image my drive as it was not loaded with an OS. I told her I know that because I wiped it before I sent it. Our conversation reasserted that the tech didn't get to see my letter as the following was also included in the letter I sent... (note the bolded text... this was also bolded in my letter)

Note that prior to sending you my laptop, the hard disk will be completely low-level formatted (zeroed) for security reasons. Please reload it as required with your factory load.

In any case, the customer service woman allowed me to send a copy of my letter to her so she could forward it to the technician. She seemed very happy that she could help resolve the problem in any way she could. Hopefully, the tech will get to read it this time.

By the way, I asked the CS woman if it's typical that any letters sent in from customers are reviewed by the technicians. She said that probably 80-90% are NOT, but it depends case to case. Basically, I guess if you want to send something in writing, don't waste your time until Memphis calls you, then email the CS person your letter. It would then probably have a better chance of getting to someone who could use the information.

makai

[JaneL]

The Memphis person was very cordial, nice, and patient, and basically called to tell me they needed to re-image my drive as it was not loaded with an OS. I told her I know that because I wiped it before I sent it. Our conversation reasserted that the tech didn't get to see my letter as the following was also included in the letter I sent... (note the bolded text... this was also bolded in my letter)

Note that prior to sending you my laptop, the hard disk will be completely low-level formatted (zeroed) for security reasons. Please reload it as required with your factory load.

Why did you send them your HDD?

[makai]

Why did you send them your HDD?

I had several reasons...

I didn't know if the load (or should I say- reload) coming off the factory recovery CDs was any good. Software being the way it is, can be corrupted coming off a CD even though it seems to load ok. By IBM having to re-image the drive with their load, it would ensure the machine would be returned to me the way it was first built.

Secondly, I didn't want IBM to tell me that they can't verify the problem and they would need my hard drive, thus delaying the fix. I just didn't want any delay to occur for any reason.

It's really no problem for me ghosting the drive after the machine gets back repaired. But first, I want to make sure it works with the IBM "factory" load!

makai

[atlacatl]

You know, I've seen this in my computer also. I.e. The pixelated and obvious gradient changes in the window frames.

I ignore

Good luck with the fixes in your machine. I doubt there is anything phisically wrong with it. It's probably a video driver issue.

[makai]

atlacatl

You know, I've seen this in my computer also. I.e. The pixelated and obvious gradient changes in the window frames.

Do you also experience the second problem I see when plugging/unplugging the AC adapter?

makai

[ruykava]

i can most definitely say that IBM does NOT ever read letters sent in by customers! being a newbie, i made the silly mistake of sending in my power adapter to IBM while sending my T42p for repairs (USB port burnt out). i included a Shipping List listing the serial number and description of everything i sent. guess what, when the PC came back a week later, the power adapter was not there! the tech people had NO IDEA that it was ever sent in -- they hadn't seen any letter of any sort. so i've wasted a lot of time calling CS and getting them to find it. they still haven't done so. and it's been over 2 weeks now.

[JaneL]

You know, we really ought to have a FAQ that mentions sending thing to Easyserv...

[makai]

nonny wrote

You know, we really ought to have a FAQ that mentions sending thing to Easyserv...

I was actually thinking about running a "poll" on this problem I'm seeing. I have created 3 posts regarding it, and so far, this particular post has had 485 hits. In all the posts combined, there have only been 2 people that said they see the same thing showing up. I wonder how many people actually see this and think it's normal? I wonder if people seeing this just disregard it and don't worry about it, or don't even realize that it "may" be a problem... whether hardware, driver, etc. I would be curious if this only affects the high res screens or is it seen with all screen types. If this is a hardware problem, it could even be a design issue if it only affects high res screens. If it's software, then maybe we could get IBM to update.

After I get my machine back, (which according to the Easy serv status says it's "repaired"), I will see if they actually did fix something. Their website status report is vauge. It goes from "machine being repaired" to "repair complete, shipped to customer", with nothing in between and nothing stating what was done to the machine.

A FAQ would be good so people can know what to expect when they send their machine in... what to send/not send, who to contact, who NOT to contact, etc. The CS woman I spoke to in Memphis allowed me to email her directly. I am not sure this is common practice with all Memphis CS, but I could ask her.

By the way, I just remembered something... the CS contact phone number showing up on my EasyServ status page was for someone in Atlanta Georgia. The depot is in Memphis, TN. The second time I called CS, I simply told them I was trying to contact Memphis and was quickly forwarded there. This might be a good FAQ entry as speaking to Atlanta will get you nowhere soon!

makai

[JaneL]

A FAQ would be good so people can know what to expect when they send their machine in... what to send/not send

Well, that was supposed to be a gentle hint for people to actually READ the existing FAQ since item #5 has been in it for years.

[makai]

Well it's back! It's still mucked up, and IBM didn't do a [censored] thing! IBM is no different than any other big corp when it comes down to the bottom line. That's really too bad!

Thanks to all who gave support. It's very much appreciated!!!

See yah,
makai

[sugo]

Time to jog down all the facts with names and dates. Call IBM tech support and explain your situation. Last resort: prepare a polite complaint letter and send it to Sam.

[makai]

prepare a polite complaint letter and send it to Sam.

Sam??? Who is Sam?


makai

[JaneL]

Sam??? Who is Sam?

http://www.ibm.com/ibm/sjp/

although I wonder if this still works after the sale to Lenovo. Whose responsibility is the warranty on previously sold TPs now?

[andyli]

nonny,

The form still works. The people who reply are part of the "Lenovo Executive Relations" team. Maybe they also shuffled some corporate staff employees with the sale of the PC division?

[makai]

Thanks guys! I will craft my letter to Sam and see what happens. I'll try to be tactful, and hopefully my dismay with IBM will not show through too much!

By the way, I took a few days to cool down after my T41 got back from IBM before posting. I didn't want to go off the ledge!!!!

regards to all,
makai

[JaneL]

I'll try to be tactful

Don't just try. Be tactful, factual (paragraphs and bullets make it easier to read), and firm about what you want.

[brewt]

I personally don't think it's gotten to the point where you should be contacting such people. You've sent it in once for a problem that's just one of those strange problems that is probably hard to replicate and possibly a driver issue - ie. it's not just a simple my x part is not working problem. I've done my fair share of product support for software that we've written (as well as doing hardware support in a previous job), and issues like this can be a problem since they are often passed off the first time as "nothing's wrong".

With such weird problems, you have to convince the tech working on your machine that there is a problem and it isn't just another customer nitpicking about non-existent problems. I'm guessing all the tech is given is what's entered by the telephone support and the notebook itself. So in this case, you need to be able to give the telephone support a short summary of the problem, a description of how to make the problem happen (must do it every time, or then it's just a pain to debug), and possibly a list of things that you've done that you think are relevant.

If descriptions of problems get too long winded, often people just don't want to read them (I know I hate it when customers go on and on in their support tickets), or skim through them quickly and miss the important parts. However, if you don't describe the problem properly, they can't fix it since they don't know what to fix.

If there isn't a reliable way to duplicate a problem, it's a little hard to fix since:
1) They can't reliably see the problem occuring in the first place
2) They can't fix it and reliably test to see if the problem has been corrected or not

Unfortunately, that's just how things are. The techs probably have a constant stream of machines to fix (and probably a quota) and so if they can't see the problem immediately, they're probably going to just pass it on.

[makai]

brewt....

if you don't describe the problem properly, they can't fix it since they don't know what to fix

Did you read what I wrote?

Whenever Powerplay is enabled (Battery mode), the menu area of “certain” windows appear to be displayed in 16bit color mode, although 32bit desktop is selected. This corruption is seen regardless of the fact that the ATI Display Properties/Battery Maximizer “Allow Automatic Color Depth Reduction” is deselected. The affected menus look pixilated and unevenly colored and if you open Windows Explorer and look across the entire gray menu area, you will see what I mean. The reason I mention only “certain” windows is because although this corruption shows up in some windows, it doesn’t show up in all. For instance, the problem is NOT apparent in the MS Word 2000 menu, which has about the same sized menu area as Windows Explorer but is not “shaded” the same. I can only guess the problem has to do with the amount of color rendering required by the different programs/windows. Note that you can also see the problem while browsing the Internet using IE and/or Firefox… which is where it gets very bothersome since browsing is all about looking at the screen. Also note that although the corruption appears in the menu area, it isn’t apparent elsewhere in the opened window… at least it isn’t as easily distinguishable to me.

A strange occurrence can also be seen if you do the following. Power up the laptop under Battery power… “Enable” Powerplay… then shut down the machine. Now plug in the AC adapter, and restart the machine. After the machine has restarted, open Windows Explorer, or any affected window, and the menu area will “still” be corrupted. If you remove the AC cable (w/o shutting down), the menu will “remain” corrupted regardless if you manually enable or disable Powerplay. Since Powerplay is “supposed to be” disabled while on AC, the menu corruption occurrence should have disappeared once the laptop was restarted on AC.

If this isn't clear enough, I don't know what is!

Let me tell you what happened..

1) the IBM tech didn't receive my letter even though I sent 2 copies
2) On the second call to CS, I was able to email another copy of the letter to the CS woman.
3) I emailed the CS woman again and asked her if the tech got the letter... her reply said she hand carried it to the tech.
4) When I got my machine back, it was cleanly reloaded, but there was no log on by the tech... I know this because the create user screen XP throws up right after a clean install came up. This tells me the tech probably verified the load, but didn't even power it up to try to see the problem.

What do you think? Do you think I haven't gone through the steps required to get this thing resolved?

Do me a favor, go through the second paragraph of what I wrote in my letter, and do what it says. Let me know what you see.

Thanks,
makai

[IAmTheEvilest]

Next time, just write a shorter note. Most likely, the people fixing the machines don't have enough time to read your letter.

Just put something on the lines of:
Graphics card won't go into 32-bit mode when PowerPlay is enabled. Although the 32 bit mode can be set, it does not work.

Try putting it on a Post-it and stick it onto the inside of the machine. That way, it won't get lost in the unpacking.

[makai]

Next time, just write a shorter note. Most likely, the people fixing the machines don't have enough time to read your letter.

You're kidding, right! IBM had the machine for 5 days. The tech worked on the machine for 2 and a half days! He didn't have time to read a one page letter?

This is becoming a joke! If I wrote only a short note, someone would tell me to write a more discriptive one. I write a descriptive one, and someone tells me to write a short note! Sheesh!


makai

[IAmTheEvilest]

Just because IBM had your computer for so long, doesn't mean that they were working exclusively on your machine for all that time.

I would still consider yourself lucky, I know of people who set their computer to Dell and the machine that they got back actually had less RAM in it than when they sent it in...

[JaneL]

This is becoming a joke! If I wrote only a short note, someone would tell me to write a more discriptive one. I write a descriptive one, and someone tells me to write a short note!

No, we're trying to help you write the problem up so that the techs can understand it. Quite frankly, when I read your letter in the original message, my eyes glazed over. It's hard to gather details from long paragraphs with no white space and non-essential information.

Short paragraphs. Bullets. Just the facts.

[makai]

Forgive my obvious frustration! This is why I didn't post for a few days after I got my machine back.

I DO APPRECIATE everyones help, but it's hard taking advice when no one will even do a test of what I describe and let me know what they see.

I need to know if this is an inherent problem with the T-series and everyone sees it, or if this is just my machine.

If I can't find this out, how do I convince IBM my machine has a problem?

SOMEONE PLEASE DO THE TEST and let me know your results.

Thanks,
makai

[brewt]

I don't seem to have that problem on my T42 2378FVU, but to be honest I'm not completely sure what area is supposed to be corrupted looking.

The point of my last post was really to say, give them another chance before going higher up. You've got a not so simple problem and the tech not initially having a proper description of the problem, combined with other factors like receiving it without an OS on it make it hard for a tech to warrant spending a whole lot of time on a machine.