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T43 shuts down 15 minutes into XP install

T40/T41/T42/T43 Series
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solidpro
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T43 shuts down 15 minutes into XP install

#1 Post by solidpro » Tue Sep 12, 2023 10:17 pm

Hi Everyone

I've got a really nice T43p which just turns off (no warning or anything) after about 15 minutes....

Any ideas!?

Thanks

Alex
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Re: T43 shuts down 15 minutes into XP install

#2 Post by RealBlackStuff » Tue Sep 12, 2023 11:49 pm

Overheating of the Southbridge comes to mind!
Big chip under the wifi-card.
Thanks to that stupid RoHS agreement, this was one of the first uses of lead-free solder, which they 'applied' in a very poor way.
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Re: T43 shuts down 15 minutes into XP install

#3 Post by thewaywardgeek » Tue Sep 12, 2023 11:51 pm

RealBlackStuff wrote:
Tue Sep 12, 2023 11:49 pm
Overheating of the Southbridge comes to mind!
Big chip under the wifi-card.
Thanks to that stupid RoHS agreement, this was one of the first uses of lead-free solder, which they 'applied' in a very poor way.
I second this, in any case, just repaste the CPU also as you're already opening the system.

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Re: T43 shuts down 15 minutes into XP install

#4 Post by solidpro » Wed Sep 13, 2023 7:08 am

It's very hot underneath and I think the 120Gb Seagate drives I use get very hot during the initial install due to all the fast reading and writing.

I have done it before but could do with a memory jog, once I get into the motherboard, can I just clean with IPA and re-thermal paste the CPU and the Southbridge?

Thanks
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Re: T43 shuts down 15 minutes into XP install

#5 Post by RealBlackStuff » Wed Sep 13, 2023 7:29 am

CPU is normal paste refresh.
Southbridge does not have any means of cooling, other than permanently removing the wifi-card and attaching cooling ribs on that big Intel chip.
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Re: T43 shuts down 15 minutes into XP install

#6 Post by Gonzaleitor » Wed Sep 13, 2023 10:06 am

solidpro wrote:
Wed Sep 13, 2023 7:08 am
It's very hot underneath and I think the 120Gb Seagate drives I use get very hot during the initial install due to all the fast reading and writing.

I have done it before but could do with a memory jog, once I get into the motherboard, can I just clean with IPA and re-thermal paste the CPU and the Southbridge?

Thanks
Why don't You try putting a thermal pad or a Cooper shim making contact with a metal part of the heatsink so it can disipate the heat? A little frankensteiny but may work. I'll also recommend repasting the GPU and CPU. Other thing You can try is getting the hdd drive out and install XP from another computer. Then, after You finish the installation put it back in the T43 and install all the drivers.

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Re: T43 shuts down 15 minutes into XP install

#7 Post by solidpro » Wed Sep 13, 2023 11:47 am

Image

I'm assuming, 1) CPU, 2) Forgotten what this is, but seem to remember if the machine won't boot it could be because this one's solder joints have failed, 3) GPU, 4) Southbridge?

Only 1 and 3 have a built -in heatsink.

4 just sits there, under the wifi card, baking. I'll see if anything copper will attached to it...

I cleaned and put new MX-4 paste on both the CPU and the GPU, even though the GPU wasn't meant to have any (it has one of those rubbery pads). I'm running it with the palmrest off and it still seems to be a bit doggy.

I think the whole thing is flawed. What a lovely, terrible machine!
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Re: T43 shuts down 15 minutes into XP install

#8 Post by solidpro » Wed Sep 13, 2023 1:20 pm

Oh BTW I ran the machine just in BIOS and it didn't shut down so I knew it was something about higher load.

I have 'fabricated' some makeshift shims/bits of copper to try and help absorb just a little bit more heat than before:

Image

Seems chip 2 can take a pad and a bit of metal on it to more firmly touch with something-or-other on the base of the keyboard.

The gap between the southbridge and the wifi card is slender, so I folded over a piece of copper and put a pad under that and then the wifi card holds it in place.

I think actually some of the slowdown was to do with a very slow optical drive. It's all working OK now, but I dread to think how it would work in more heat.
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Re: T43 shuts down 15 minutes into XP install

#9 Post by Gonzaleitor » Wed Sep 13, 2023 7:49 pm

solidpro wrote:
Wed Sep 13, 2023 1:20 pm
Oh BTW I ran the machine just in BIOS and it didn't shut down so I knew it was something about higher load.

I have 'fabricated' some makeshift shims/bits of copper to try and help absorb just a little bit more heat than before:

Seems chip 2 can take a pad and a bit of metal on it to more firmly touch with something-or-other on the base of the keyboard.

The gap between the southbridge and the wifi card is slender, so I folded over a piece of copper and put a pad under that and then the wifi card holds it in place.

I think actually some of the slowdown was to do with a very slow optical drive. It's all working OK now, but I dread to think how it would work in more heat.
Nice to see that i'm not the only crazy one making bizarre cooling solutions... :lol: :lol: :lol:
Maybe you can connect a copper pipe to the card bus slot so it disipates through that. IIRC it was a "solution" for the T60 ATI GPU chip overheating, and they are in similar places.

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Re: T43 shuts down 15 minutes into XP install

#10 Post by solidpro » Thu Sep 14, 2023 7:07 am

Hmmm. Although it's a lovely machine I'm kinda regretting getting into it now. The machine took an install of XP no problems, and by default went to it's own native high resolution and then I plugged in a USB stick to copy over the drivers, had to reboot and it bluescreens now with or without the USB key plugged in.

It's like the XP has committed suicide. A version I've used over and over without issues.

The machine has gone back into a parking bay for when I have more patience.
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Re: T43 shuts down 15 minutes into XP install

#11 Post by TPFanatic » Thu Sep 14, 2023 9:48 am

I had success using the XP install CD to do a repair of my T60p's XP when it self-destructed.

It was more effective than Win 10's UEFI "startup repair". :)
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Re: T43 shuts down 15 minutes into XP install

#12 Post by Gonzaleitor » Thu Sep 14, 2023 10:24 am

solidpro wrote:
Thu Sep 14, 2023 7:07 am
Hmmm. Although it's a lovely machine I'm kinda regretting getting into it now. The machine took an install of XP no problems, and by default went to it's own native high resolution and then I plugged in a USB stick to copy over the drivers, had to reboot and it bluescreens now with or without the USB key plugged in.

It's like the XP has committed suicide. A version I've used over and over without issues.

The machine has gone back into a parking bay for when I have more patience.
Did you try to reinstall the whole OS? Maybe you can try with EasytoBoot vía USB. It's the method I use and it's been very effective. Is your T43 SATA modded?

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Re: T43 shuts down 15 minutes into XP install

#13 Post by solidpro » Fri Sep 15, 2023 2:31 am

It's completely original IDE. It won't even stay on long enough to run the initial setup of XP again now.... These machines seem very flaky nowadays....
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Re: T43 shuts down 15 minutes into XP install

#14 Post by astral » Fri Sep 15, 2023 7:37 am

i've never seen another laptop with 4 big, hot running chips all placed in a cluster like that. they'd have to have made it way larger to fit proper cooling in, shame really. that combined with the early lead free days is not gonna go well on a laptop like that one. i just hope that mine doesn't die on me.
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Re: T43 shuts down 15 minutes into XP install

#15 Post by kfzhu1229 » Sun Sep 17, 2023 11:37 pm

Gonzaleitor wrote:
Wed Sep 13, 2023 7:49 pm
Nice to see that i'm not the only crazy one making bizarre cooling solutions... :lol: :lol: :lol:
Maybe you can connect a copper pipe to the card bus slot so it disipates through that. IIRC it was a "solution" for the T60 ATI GPU chip overheating, and they are in similar places.
When I used to use the ThinkPad T43p daily, what I end up doing was using custom Chinese flattened copper pipes and one thin copper shim and then epoxy that on, bend the pipe into shape and dissipate heat onto the PCMCIA cage. It was effective for sure because after that mod the left palmrest plate gets much hotter than before. But again, what end up happening instead was the GPU solder balls giving up the ghost (screen goes blank until I push on the GPU)
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Re: T43 shuts down 15 minutes into XP install

#16 Post by solidpro » Mon Sep 18, 2023 12:06 pm

Do the other T4Xp models suffer the same problems?
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Re: T43 shuts down 15 minutes into XP install

#17 Post by kfzhu1229 » Mon Sep 18, 2023 4:02 pm

solidpro wrote:
Mon Sep 18, 2023 12:06 pm
Do the other T4Xp models suffer the same problems?
Yes and no. earlier T4x models suffer from graphics issues as a result of insufficient cooling on the graphics chip (and flexing again)!
You can transplant everything inside an R5x chassis if you don't mind some extra bulk, it would come with a much more rigid bottom chassis (and better cooling).
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Re: T43 shuts down 15 minutes into XP install

#18 Post by RealBlackStuff » Tue Sep 19, 2023 8:54 am

In the past I worked on well over 150 of those (dGPU only) T43/R52 mobo's to SATA-mod them.
For that (among other things) I removed the square IC left of your No. 4 (Southbridge).
FYI: that square IC is not a heat-source.
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Re: T43 shuts down 15 minutes into XP install

#19 Post by TPFanatic » Tue Sep 19, 2023 2:51 pm

Is the R chassis really better? I thought the T40 chassis is CFRP while the R50 feels a lower grade of plastic. I have an R50p suffering from Southbridge detachment and a newer Lenovo-branded unit that died from GPU failure.
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Re: T43 shuts down 15 minutes into XP install

#20 Post by axur-delmeria » Tue Sep 19, 2023 10:39 pm

TPFanatic wrote:
Tue Sep 19, 2023 2:51 pm
Is the R chassis really better? I thought the T40 chassis is CFRP while the R50 feels a lower grade of plastic. I have an R50p suffering from Southbridge detachment and a newer Lenovo-branded unit that died from GPU failure.
Having seen an R52 with broken chassis and lid plastics, it's a hard sell. But the taller/thicker bottom chassis does result in a beefier cooler.
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Re: T43 shuts down 15 minutes into XP install

#21 Post by kfzhu1229 » Wed Sep 20, 2023 11:42 am

TPFanatic wrote:
Tue Sep 19, 2023 2:51 pm
Is the R chassis really better? I thought the T40 chassis is CFRP while the R50 feels a lower grade of plastic. I have an R50p suffering from Southbridge detachment and a newer Lenovo-branded unit that died from GPU failure.
yeah that is true but I thought from my experience with R51 the bottom chassis does flex a bit less so maybe that would help some?
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Re: T43 shuts down 15 minutes into XP install

#22 Post by TPFanatic » Wed Sep 20, 2023 12:15 pm

My idea is more that flex cannot and should not be totally eliminated, and a reasonable amount of flex must be anticipated, accepted, and tolerated in a laptop. Even magnesium frame has some give. Skyscrapers are engineered to bend, rather than break.

My opinion is the fault is entirely in the bad solder that fails to withstand normal flex and normal heat. I always felt like T40 series with CFRP base and high grade palmrest and metal lid is incredibly sturdy feeling, actually with a better feel than my T500 with its internal structure frames also in CFRP base but topped in cheap plastics (R500 is a little thinner plastic). But T500 is the more reliable laptop.

I'm not sure why the popular opinion is to blame flex. Everything flexes.
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Re: T43 shuts down 15 minutes into XP install

#23 Post by nfraser01 » Wed Sep 20, 2023 1:46 pm

RealBlackStuff wrote:
Tue Sep 12, 2023 11:49 pm
Overheating of the Southbridge comes to mind!
Big chip under the wifi-card.
Thanks to that stupid RoHS agreement, this was one of the first uses of lead-free solder, which they 'applied' in a very poor way.
Leave out the Wifi card - you won't need it for the install?

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Re: T43 shuts down 15 minutes into XP install

#24 Post by Tom81 » Fri Sep 22, 2023 6:15 pm

I once had a similar problem installing WinXP on a Thinkpad R50E. When trying to install, it would hang at a random time.
It turned out that one RAM chip is defective. I installed the system correctly on one working RAM.
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Re: T43 shuts down 15 minutes into XP install

#25 Post by Tom81 » Fri Sep 22, 2023 6:24 pm

TPFanatic wrote:
Tue Sep 19, 2023 2:51 pm
Is the R chassis really better? I thought the T40 chassis is CFRP while the R50 feels a lower grade of plastic. I have an R50p suffering from Southbridge detachment and a newer Lenovo-branded unit that died from GPU failure.
The R Series has stood the test of time better. They are larger, thanks to which they give off heat better, and they do not have the sticky cover like the T series.
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Re: T43 shuts down 15 minutes into XP install

#26 Post by Gonzaleitor » Tue Nov 14, 2023 8:26 pm

Hey, has anyone tried putting a thermal pad in the southbridge to disipate through the wifi card? It's too crazy to think that?

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Re: T43 shuts down 15 minutes into XP install

#27 Post by kfzhu1229 » Wed Nov 15, 2023 1:50 am

Gonzaleitor wrote:
Tue Nov 14, 2023 8:26 pm
Hey, has anyone tried putting a thermal pad in the southbridge to disipate through the wifi card? It's too crazy to think that?
Back when I dailied a T43p, I went all out and put some flat copper heatpipes inbetween them and wick the heat to the PCMCIA cage. That definitely did its job well in my case because the GPU was the one that failed instead.
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Re: T43 shuts down 15 minutes into XP install

#28 Post by Gonzaleitor » Wed Nov 15, 2023 6:04 pm

I was thinking that, But meanwhile i use the mini pci Card as a heatsink with a 2mm thermal pad

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Re: T43 shuts down 15 minutes into XP install

#29 Post by kfzhu1229 » Wed Nov 15, 2023 10:52 pm

Gonzaleitor wrote:
Wed Nov 15, 2023 6:04 pm
I was thinking that, But meanwhile i use the mini pci Card as a heatsink with a 2mm thermal pad
Yeah that is definitely better than having nothing indeed.
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Re: T43 shuts down 15 minutes into XP install

#30 Post by astral » Thu Nov 16, 2023 3:08 pm

Is that better or is that worse? the card itself gets hot, wouldn't that just move more heat onto the southbridge?
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