T42p fan always on problem/normal?

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luppio · #1 Post by **luppio** » Mon Oct 31, 2005 9:36 am

I apologize if my question appeared on this forum before...

Two weeks ago I purchased T42p from Lenovo and it works flawlessly except that the fan is almost always on(medium speed)...

The case is not even warm...except the hard drive (which is normal for 7200rpm) and the left side where the fan is installed.

Is this a driver problem? I run XP PRO SP2 with all current windows updates with the newest BIOS update 3.19.

Thank you,
Matt

vpn-user · #2 Post by **vpn-user** » Tue Nov 01, 2005 3:45 pm

All new IBM/Lenovo Thinkpads >= T40 & R50 Series have that "feature". Don' t buy one if thats a problem for you.

Funny enough, the cheapest series, the R50e, does not have that problem. Even with a much hotter CPU (Celeron M has no speedstep!).

christopher_wolf · #3 Post by **christopher_wolf** » Tue Nov 01, 2005 3:49 pm

You can use the Power Manager to actually throttle back the Fan Noise Level, and hence the Speed. Just click on the Green Battery Icon on the Taskbar and create a new Profile with the "Fan Noise Level" Parameter set to "Balance all Parameters"

HTH

BrandonRouth.com · | BrandonRouth.com | | Superman Returns June 30, 2006 |

christopher_wolf wrote:You can use the Power Manager to actually throttle back the Fan Noise Level, and hence the Speed. Just click on the Green Battery Icon on the Taskbar and create a new Profile with the "Fan Noise Level" Parameter set to "Balance all Parameters"

HTH

I don't see any kind of Fan Noise Level option in the Battery MaxMiser Gauge.

christopher_wolf · #5 Post by **christopher_wolf** » Wed Nov 02, 2005 12:26 am

It is under the IBM Power Manager; either the big green battery at the right hand corner of the task bar, or under Program Files>Access IBM> Power Manager; there you can create a new profile to reduce the fan noise level

BrandonRouth.com · | BrandonRouth.com | | Superman Returns June 30, 2006 |

christopher_wolf wrote:It is under the IBM Power Manager; either the big green battery at the right hand corner of the task bar, or under Program Files>Access IBM> Power Manager; there you can create a new profile to reduce the fan noise level

Hmm, I tried looking for Power Manager in both places. Couldn't find it.

Strange.

#7 Post by **GomJabbar** » Wed Nov 02, 2005 12:49 am

BrandonRouth.com wrote:I don't see any kind of Fan Noise Level option in the Battery MaxMiser Gauge.

AFAIK this feature is only available on the T43 in the T-series.

BrandonRouth.com · | BrandonRouth.com | | Superman Returns June 30, 2006 |

GomJabbar wrote:
BrandonRouth.com wrote:I don't see any kind of Fan Noise Level option in the Battery MaxMiser Gauge.
AFAIK this feature is only available on the T43 in the T-series.

All righty then, that'll do it. I have a T42.

christopher_wolf · #9 Post by **christopher_wolf** » Wed Nov 02, 2005 2:14 am

Thanks for the Correction GomJabber ; I really didn't know about this until now

I have a few questions though:

1.) Conceptual; Why didn't the T42 have this feature in the Power Manager?

2.) Is it possible to take a Power Manger designed for a T43 and put it on a T42 via a simple software download? (I am guessing it would not be possible)

3.) Aren't there Third Party Programs out there that let you control the Fan Speed on a Thinkpad? (I am kind of sure I heard of some; but I think those are for Linux and not WinXP)

Thanks

#10 Post by **GomJabbar** » Wed Nov 02, 2005 6:48 am

1. IMHO it is because the T43 is newer, so they added some features to make it more attractive. In fact, the T42 has power management features that are not available on the T41.

2. You can download Power Manager from the T43 driver matrix page. Try it if you dare. I don't know of anyone that has tried it yet.

3. I don't know. I haven't looked into it.

vpn-user · #11 Post by **vpn-user** » Wed Nov 02, 2005 7:23 am

Even PowerManager will not help here. In fact its the same as the old Battery Maximizer with a new look. It does not change fan behaviour. It runs fine on a T41p BTW. Nothing special.

You can force the CPU and GPU to lowest speed but the fan still keeps running all the time (at low speed). It' s the software of the embedded controller to blame for this problem but IBM(Lenovo refuses tu fix it.

With linux, you can actually control FAN behaviour and write your own script that enables the fan based on temperature. There is no tool available for windows, yet.

luppio · #12 Post by **luppio** » Wed Nov 02, 2005 9:23 am

Has anyone tried to use the Power Manger designed for a T43 on T42p?

I might be wrong but can the video driver/card cause this fan 'problem'?

The fan doesn't increase its rpm when I use CPU intensive programs (when the CPU reaches 100%) but speeds up when I try to play a simple 3d game.

Excuse my newbie question but how can I check my CPU/GPU temperature?

Thank you,
Matt

vpn-user · #13 Post by **vpn-user** » Wed Nov 02, 2005 12:21 pm

Yes, PowerManager runs on a T42p (it does on my T41p!) and I guess it even runs on every other Thinkpad.

No, it' s not the GPU that causes the FAN to run. Thare are other Notebooks out there with even more powerful graphics and a FAN that stops spinning when it' s not needed. It is defenitly a bug in the Embedded Controller Firmware. Just one temperature sensor treshold must be level upo a few degrees and everything would be fixed. But IBM/Lenovo won' t do it (who knows why). So we either have to patch it or need a program that can control the FAN which is already possible in linux using the ibm_acpi kernel module in experimental mode.

luppio · #14 Post by **luppio** » Wed Nov 02, 2005 12:25 pm

Does PowerManager work* on your T42p?

*turns the fan on/off when necessary

#15 Post by **GomJabbar** » Wed Nov 02, 2005 1:26 pm

We have to be careful that we are not getting into a semantics issue here.

vpn-user wrote:Yes, PowerManager runs on a T42p (it does on my T41p!) and I guess it even runs on every other Thinkpad.

Is this the Power Manager that vpn-user is discussing? Because this is what has the extra features discussed here, I do believe.

Power manager driver for Windows 2000/XP - ThinkPad R52, T43/p, X32, X41, X41 Tablet

This package provides power management support to the following ThinkPad computers for Microsoft Windows only under the following configurations:

- Windows 2000
- Windows XP

This package enables or updates the utility programs of the following ThinkPad systems:

- ThinkPad R52
- ThinkPad T43, T43p
- ThinkPad X32, X41, X41 Tablet
File details
Version: 1.01
Release Date: 2005/04/22
File link File size File description
75u702aw.exe 3,398,944 Power Manager

75u702aw.txt 3,608 README for Power Manager

luppio · #16 Post by **luppio** » Wed Nov 02, 2005 1:55 pm

Power Manager - runs on t42p - but doesn't solve the fan issue
or
Power Manager - works on t42p - and solves the fan issue

Details not semantics:)

#17 Post by **GomJabbar** » Wed Nov 02, 2005 2:56 pm

I was referring to the term "Power Manager" not the words works or runs. Power Manager and Power Management software are not the same things. Look at the driver matrix page for the T42 and the T43. The "Power Manager" I am referring to is only listed for these models:

- ThinkPad R52
- ThinkPad T43, T43p
- ThinkPad X32, X41, X41 Tablet

luppio · #18 Post by **luppio** » Wed Nov 02, 2005 3:13 pm

Just to make it simple:

1. What software can control the fan on T42p (XP)

2. According to vpn-user "PowerManager runs on a T42p" but does it allow to alter fan settings?

Thanks

beeblebrox · #19 Post by **beeblebrox** » Wed Nov 02, 2005 3:40 pm

I use a T40p with 1GB Ram.

1.) Install Centrino hardware Control, set adaptive speed

2.) Lower your core voltages (see thread)

3.) Turn ATI graphics on Autoenable clockdown or clockdown to e.g. 80 Mhz (more than sufficient for office work)

4.) Enable spin-down of hard drive

5.) Read an Adobe eBook or work on Word.

And be suprised that the notebook turns DEAD SILENT after a few minutes !!!!!!

luppio · #20 Post by **luppio** » Wed Nov 02, 2005 4:17 pm

Thank you, Beeblebrox.

How does the fan behave when you do more process intensive tasks? Is it always on or does it cool the thinkpad from time to time to maintain optimal temperature?

With my old Dell I was able to run Dreamwever, Photoshop, Flash, Firefox, IE, Skype at the same time and the fan was running every 10 or so minutes for 2-3minutes.

vpn-user · #21 Post by **vpn-user** » Wed Nov 02, 2005 4:34 pm

To clarify things:

It is _NOT_ (!!!) yet possible to control the FAN in Windows XP. It' s possible in Linux using kernel module "ibm_acpi" in experimental mode.

"IBM/Lenovo Power Manager software" is the same as "IBM/Lenovo Battery Maximiser". Difference is only the look and some nice green status bars which tell you everything except the truth. It may help to get the notebook cooler, but using power from the mains the FAN still always stays ON.

CHC/NHC may also help, but is not _the_ solution. It' s not able to control the FAN based on temperature on Thinkpads like its possible on some Asus and Samsung notebooks. So it does not change FAN behaviour. It only changes CPU/GPU/HDD behaviour which are NOT the problem. They don' t get too hot. In fact, 42° is rather cool for a CPU so the FAN should be off.

#22 Post by **GomJabbar** » Wed Nov 02, 2005 5:48 pm

vpn-user wrote:Even PowerManager will not help here. In fact its the same as the old Battery Maximizer with a new look. It does not change fan behaviour. It runs fine on a T41p BTW. Nothing special.

"IBM/Lenovo Power Manager software" is the same as "IBM/Lenovo Battery Maximiser". Difference is only the look and some nice green status bars which tell you everything except the truth. It may help to get the notebook cooler, but using power from the mains the FAN still always stays ON.

christopher_wolf wrote:You can use the Power Manager to actually throttle back the Fan Noise Level, and hence the Speed. Just click on the Green Battery Icon on the Taskbar and create a new Profile with the "Fan Noise Level" Parameter set to "Balance all Parameters"

I have a T42, not a T43. I can say that my T42 does not have the features shown in the graphic of the following link. I have no fan issues with my T42. I have not used or even personally seen a T43. But unless christopher_wolf is mistaken, it does seem that you do have at least a small measure of fan control in Windows XP with the T43. The screen shot seems to back this up.

******IBM Thinkpad T43 Review******

EDIT: Note also that the T42 and the T43 both use the same version of Battery MaxiMiser and Power Management Features version 1.38.

vpn-user · #23 Post by **vpn-user** » Wed Nov 02, 2005 6:03 pm

GomJabbar wrote:I have a T42, not a T43. I can say that my T42 does not have the features shown in the graphic of the following link. I have no fan issues with my T42. I have not used or even personally seen a T43. But unless christopher_wolf is mistaken, it does seem that you do have at least a small measure of fan control in Windows XP with the T43. The screen shot seems to back this up.

Man, you just don' t get it! Go to the T43 download page, uninstall your BatteryMaximizer and therefore install PowerManager you just downloaded from the T43 page. Presto! You will notice that you' ll get the same on your T42 screen shown at your posted link.

The screen doesn' t "back off" anything. There are just some green bars. They don' t mean anything. They change depending on your chosen CPU/Display/etc settings. Of course, if you set CPU to static max performance, the FAN will get louder. But it will never turn off (when on the mains), if you choose static max battery (lowest speed). THAT' s the bug we are talking about in this thread. The FAN blows out cool air which is just nonsense.

#24 Post by **GomJabbar** » Wed Nov 02, 2005 7:30 pm

vpn-user wrote:Man, you just don' t get it!

Back up Jack!

I've been reading the threads about fan issues with the T43 ad nauseam. I never claimed Power Manager was a panacea for this. Christopher_wolf claimed it helped on his T43. He never said that it fixed the issue entirely. Since he owns a T43, I would tend to give his experience more weight than a non-T43 owner. I have also read in these threads that different T43 owners have differing experiences with the fan noise issue. Why this is, I haven't seen the definitive answer yet.

Since my T42 is dead quiet, I wouldn't be able to tell if it made any difference or not on my laptop. My point was I didn't know of users that have used Power Manager on T-series ThinkPads other than the T43. You say you got it installed on your T41p. That's good info. But even so, can we be sure it works the same on your T41p as it does on the T43? Your experience may be different than that of a T43 user. Have you been testing this on a T43 so that you can speak with authority?

luppio · #25 Post by **luppio** » Wed Nov 02, 2005 10:18 pm

I tried both:

1. PowerManager for T43 on T42p
2. Centrino Hardware Control

No change. The fan is always on and blows cold air.

CPU:600MHz
CPU load: 5%
CPU voltage: 0.988v
CPU temp: 38C
HD temp: 37C
ATI core:111.38MHz

#26 Post by **GomJabbar** » Wed Nov 02, 2005 11:08 pm

luppio wrote:I tried both:

1. PowerManager for T43 on T42p
2. Centrino Hardware Control

No change. The fan is always on and blows cold air.

It's a shame Lenovo can't seem to get a handle on this and get it fixed. I hope you sufferers see a resolution soon. My wife's nephew came recently to stay a few weeks with us (hurricane victim). He has a Sony laptop that has a quite noisy fan. If the T43 is like that Sony, I can see why you are looking for a solution.

EDIT: It dawned on me a few minutes after posting this that you have a T42p. Since the T43 and the T42p have different chipsets, it is hard to know what the effect of the T43 Power Manager would be on the T42p. Even though it seems to install OK, it's possible that some of the controls may not function as designed.

T42p - i855PM (ODEM) chipset
T43 - i915PM (ALVISO) chipset

p0ser · #27 Post by **p0ser** » Thu Nov 03, 2005 7:15 am

I have a T42p that I purchased 1 yr ago. I never had any fan issues whatsoever until last week when i ran the ThinkVantage software installer. I probably had at least 20 different updates including a BIOS update. Now my fan stays on always (AC and battery) at about medium speed. My guess is that the BIOS update is the cause. Does anyone know if I can get previous BIOS versions? I'd like to try backing out of my current BIOS version to see if that solves the problem.

#28 Post by **GomJabbar** » Thu Nov 03, 2005 7:36 am

p0ser wrote:Does anyone know if I can get previous BIOS versions?

Go to the chart near the bottom of the page of the following link. There are links in the chart to older BIOS versions.

BIOS Update (Non-Diskette) - ThinkPad R50/p, R51 (1829, 1830, 1831, 1836), T40/p, T41/p, T42/p

luppio · #29 Post by **luppio** » Thu Nov 03, 2005 11:58 am

p0ser,

Let me know what happened after the downgrade. I am thinking about reinstalling xp pro without any updates from IBM to see if their drivers are causing the fan to run all the time.

Matt

beeblebrox · #30 Post by **beeblebrox** » Wed Nov 09, 2005 5:30 am

It seems to me that a lot of people have not realized how the Thinkpad works.

There is 1 fan and 1 heat pipe, but a lot of chips underneath.
If any of those chips produces a lot of heat, the fan turns on.

So there are, except the CPU, the graphics chips, the chips of the WLAN and Bluetooth.

There are at least 4 thermal sensors. You can read only the CPU sensor.

So, go figure, reading only the CPU sensor is useless, if the other sensor of the WLAn reads 70°C, then the fan turns on, although the CPU is cool.

So easy. Turn off WLAN, reduce the graphics core voltage (Powerplay) and use CHC. And the notebook will turn silent after a few minutes. Enable HDD spin down, and the Thinkpad is dead silent. So easy...

I configured a few T4x that way, and my friends are more than happy now.

T42p fan always on problem/normal?

T42p fan always on problem/normal?

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