BIOS / Boot problems... Help!

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vadarfone · #1 Post by **vadarfone** » Wed Jul 30, 2008 10:29 am

Hi,

My problem is a bit confusing.

OK, so my setup; I have an IBM T42. 1gb RAM.

I installed Ubuntu on a 5400RPM 2.5inch drive which I installed in the computer, replacing the original.

The original had XP on it. The new one just has Ubuntu.

Yesterday the system seemed pretty sluggish... Nothing too bad, but slower than usual.

I decided to try to install Ubuntu onto my original XP drive as a dual boot (my XP drive is 7200rpm).

I tried this, but was told there was an error during partitioning and it would not install.

I put the Ubuntu drive back in and now I cant get past the IBM intro screen.

I dont even get a blinking cursor; In the place of the blinking cursor is a load of jumbled symbols.

If I hit ENTER, the symbols vanish and appear again immediately.

In an attempt to get back online, I used the Ubuntu live CD to install Ubuntu on my external 640gb 7200rpm USB drive.

This worked, but when I restart my computer I get a sign saying there is no operating system (after a really long wait).

I have to turn the computer off, turn it back on and go into the BIOS, to tell the computer to boot from USB drive first (even though the order has not changed from before)

I am running Ubuntu off my USB drive now, with no drive INSIDE the computer. It is working as usual, but I am terrified that it is not going to boot at all one day.

Do any of you have any ideas about why this is happening.

Both the XP and Ubuntu internal drives suffer from the same problem, so I am thinking it is something to do with the connections inside the computer, or the BIOS..

Any help would be SO good.

Thanks!

vadarfone · #2 Post by **vadarfone** » Wed Jul 30, 2008 6:40 pm

No one?

This is a pretty major problem for me!

Any ideas at all would be great!

makai · #3 Post by **makai** » Wed Jul 30, 2008 7:34 pm

I guess no one is posting back because they never saw the problem. From the sound of it, it sounds like a bad harddrive interface... probably the motherboard connector since two drives show the same problem. Can't say for sure though. The fact that you can boot to/change Bios settings and even get past the IBM splash screen seems to indicate the Bios is ok. Of course, no guarantees there either.

I really have no advice other than the usual... start pulling ram modules in case one of them is bad, pull the audio card out in case a polling thing is going on and it's intefering, then reseat one of your hard drives and try again. Don't know what other thing you can do. When you boot up, do you hear any beeps at all? A single beep will indicate that bios has polled everything (ram, harddrive, vid) and everything has replied/present and good to go. Here's the beep codes for reference... http://www-307.ibm.com/pc/support/site. ... MIGR-46018

vadarfone · #4 Post by **vadarfone** » Wed Jul 30, 2008 7:59 pm

Thanks a lot for your reply!

Yeah, I figured it would most likely be at the HD end, considering I had the same isssue both times...

I dont mind running from USB HD (my laptop is cooler, if anything, and I am using less electricity), but I wouldnt mind figuring out what is causing the issue and fixing it if at all possible.

The question about the curious BIOS selection thing still remains though, so if anyone has any idea about that, please help!

Thanks a lot, anyway!

makai · #5 Post by **makai** » Wed Jul 30, 2008 8:42 pm

I've also experienced the bios selection not executing on some of my machines. While I don't know what causes it, it could just be a bug or something due to time-out during boot up. I don't worry about it and just change the boot device positions as required.

Temetka · #6 Post by **Temetka** » Thu Jul 31, 2008 4:25 pm

During POST you can hit F12 and bring up a boot list. This will allow you to choose a device to boot off.

Hit F12 when the big IBM logo is on the screen.

Let us know how it goes.

sojourner · #7 Post by **sojourner** » Thu Jul 31, 2008 10:27 pm

vadarfone wrote:No one?
This is a pretty major problem for me!
Any ideas at all would be great!

vadarfone, you said something in one of the posts about different HDD's for XP & Ubuntu and swapping them in and out. I am assuming you are swapping them out of the main drive bay not the ultrabay, is this correct?

If correct, how are you swapping them out? What I'm getting at is do you have a cage for both drives, attached to the drives? Are you using a cage for both drives? Reason for asking this is, without the drive cage it is VERY difficult to properly insert a HDD into the main bay and have the IDE connector pins engage properly! Without a drive cage I've found one has to put the TP upside down on the desk then insert the HDD, although I do not recommend this. I recommend always inserting the drive with the cage attached. Using the cage insures proper alignment of the IDE connector pins. A MISalignment would cause the problem you are experiencing!

Regarding the BIOS issue, not sure I understand what you think the problem is. If your BIOS is setup to boot from HDD0 (F1, Startup, Boot; be sure IDE HDD0: is listed in the Boot priority order) then the BIOS is not causing your boot error. If you are asking why F12 does not work be sure BIOS is setup to allow F12 functionality (F1, Startup) be sure the selection that says "Boot device List F12 Option" is ENABLED; you may also need "Option Keys Display" (same screen) to be enabled (but not sure). But F12 functionality has nothing to do with the boot error you describe.

I'd be sure to check for correct pin alignment when you insert a HDD ... MISalignment is likely causing the problem.

Let us know how you make out!

vadarfone · #8 Post by **vadarfone** » Fri Aug 01, 2008 6:46 am

Hi guys

Thanks again for taking the time to reply!

OK, here is what I have so far...

@Temetka; thanks for the info, but I am already aware of this, hence I have been able to run Ubuntu from a USB HD.

@sojourner; thanks for the lengthy post!

OK, in answer to your questions...

1. Yes, I have a different drive for each OS. And yes, I am swapping them out of the main bay INSIDE the thinkpad, not a USB device.

When I use a USB caddy for the drives, the drive with Ubuntu on it loads ok. The drive with XP on doesn't (I am wondering if this is something to do with the extra partition on the original XP install that came with the computer causing a problem. Of course, the drive with just Ubuntu on it has no such hidden partition).

2. As for the cages, I have tried with and without, and both times it didnt work. I was originally getting a garbled message, but now, after the BIOS screen finishes (which is taking a hell of a long time now), I just get the Intel screen searching for an OS, and eventually telling me I dont have one, despite there being a Hard Drive in the computer with an OS on.

3. As for the BIOS, I thnk you are right now... It is not the issue with the drive ordering. It is an issue with the drives themselves, in some way or another. The BIOS functions as it should, albeit very slowly (which again may have something to do with the Drives)

Now, to add some more info...

I am currently running Ubuntu off of my very new 640GB 7200RPM external USB hard disk. This works ok (I am typing this message using said OS).

The issue with the very slow BIOS remains though, even with this recently purchased drive.

Well, if anyone can shed any more light on this, I will be grateful. At the moment I am stuck with a laptop that is not portable!!

sojourner · #9 Post by **sojourner** » Fri Aug 01, 2008 8:27 am

vadarfone wrote:1. Yes, I have a different drive for each OS. And yes, I am swapping them out of the main bay INSIDE the thinkpad, not a USB device.
When I use a USB caddy for the drives, the drive with Ubuntu on it loads ok.

I'm confused, what do you mean by USB caddy? Noticed that description in your signature also. Are you referring to a USB enclosure? There are also USB thumb drives (goes into a USB port), is that what you mean? There is a HDD caddy which is used in the ultrabay, is that what you mean? And just for clarification of terms, here is what I mean:

CADDY: holds a HDD, used in Ultrabay
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?Vi ... 0241916564

CAGE: a thin sheet metal cover with lots of holes, needs to be attached to HDD with screws
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?Vi ... 0252633434

ENCLOSURE: a HDD slips inside case, plugs into USB port
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?Vi ... 0263023247

So is Ubuntu loaded on a HDD, the HDD in a CAGE and inserted in the HDD0 (main) port? If this is the case (I suspect it is) then there is nothing wrong with the physical IDE port because Ubuntu boots! (an earlier post mentioned the physical port may be damaged)

The drive with XP on doesn't [boot?] (I am wondering if this is something to do with the extra partition on the original XP install that came with the computer causing a problem. Of course, the drive with just Ubuntu on it has no such hidden partition).

The hidden partition mentioned is a factory install partition. Don't touch it until you are certain you know what you are doing! That partition should contain files you need to do a complete NEW reinstall of the supplied OS. It is not causing the boot error.

2. As for the cages, I have tried with and without, and both times it didnt work. I was originally getting a garbled message, but now, after the BIOS screen finishes (which is taking a hell of a long time now), I just get the Intel screen searching for an OS, and eventually telling me I dont have one, despite there being a Hard Drive in the computer with an OS on.

Well, it seems we are getting down to resolving this problem. The garbled screen was caused by NOT using the HDD cage. I recommend always using it. The l-o-n-g boot initialization process is caused by a toasted MBR (your master boot record is no good), thus the TP cannot boot. Considering all that's gone on, don't know if your XP OS is any good any more but here is what you need to do to get the drive to boot; in order:

1) if you have access to a USB floppy use this utility to make a MBR recovery diskette and use it. If your OS is still intact clap your hands

OR

2) if you have a backup of XP and/or you don't mind overwriting your existing XP installation, press the blue Access IBM button at boot and follow the prompts to completely (WIPE OUT and) reinstall the OS. (considering the MBR is bad I don't know if Access IBM will work, I don't use the hidden partition!)

FYI: I've run into this MBR issue many times, quite a headache. And because IBM uses a NON-STANDARD MBR there are not too many options for repair! If you are lucky, and knowledgeable of repair installs from an XP CD, try repairing the MBR from an XP CD. This method will work if IBM's MBR data is intact.

Lastly, if both HDD's do not boot in the main HDD0 port either BOTH drives MBR's are bad or the IDE port is in fact bad. Hope it's not the latter.

Let us know how you make out!

vadarfone · #10 Post by **vadarfone** » Mon Aug 04, 2008 10:20 am

Hi,

Sorry for the confusion in my previous posts regarding terminology.

By "USB Caddy", I mean "Enclosure". I am not familiar with all the correct names for things like this, so apologies for confusing things.

I am running my OS from one of these, with a 2.5 laptop HD in it.

As for the MBR, I will look into it!

Thanks a lot for all your help. I will post up any findings I make!

#11 Post by **Harryc** » Mon Aug 04, 2008 2:23 pm

Swapping drives into and out of a Thinkpad hard drive cage constantly is not recommended. It will ruin your IDE interface eventually. Get an Ultrabay 2ND HDD adapter and leave the thing in the machine until you absolutely need to use an optical drive.

vadarfone · #12 Post by **vadarfone** » Tue Aug 05, 2008 12:53 pm

OK, a bit of an update.

Well, I finally shut down Ubuntu on my USB Enclosure (yes, Enclosure) and decided to see what if windows would boot with the caddy screwed onto the drive.

It worked!

So, hopefully I can use Ubuntu from my USB Enclosure and also my USB drive from now on and keep XP in the computer for projector work / XP compatibility...

If I get any more issues, I will be be sure to post up!

You guys are awesome. Thanks for the HEAVY HEAVY knowledge. Brilliant assistance.

Thanks so much.

BIOS / Boot problems... Help!

BIOS / Boot problems... Help!

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