t41 fails to post 9 out of 10 times

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check · #1 Post by **check** » Tue Aug 12, 2008 7:34 pm

Symptoms:
About nine times out of ten the following happens.
When I power on the laptop the fans spin up, but the screen stays blank. There are no beeps at all. The battery light stays on, as does the power light (the circle with the Z inscribed in it).
Occasionally the laptop will post and start up normally as if nothing happened. The computer will run flawlessly. Once I shut it down it will fail to post again.

Attempts to fix the laptop, none have had any effect what so ever (remember it boots occasionally):
1) started the computer with an external monitor (in hops of it being a broken lcd)
2) ran memtest86+ (no errors found)
3) pulled out one memory stick
4) pulled out the other memory stick
5) pulled out both memory sticks (no beeps when powered on without memory)
6) pressed down on the ATi GPU (indirectly through keyboard and directly on chip)
7) reseated the CPU
8) disabled the wifi card in the bios
9) removed the wifi card from the laptop
10) removed the hard drive
11) removed the battery
12) removed the cmos battery
13) started up the laptop without the AC adapter plugged in

Other information:
The wireless card is an Atheros and I had to run the no-1802 utility for it to work. Installed the card in March.
The computer dual boots Kubuntu (Ubuntu distribution with KDE) and Windows XP.
I have recieved two BSOD recently. The first August 5th I opened the lid to the laptop while unplugging the power. The second August 8 after entering my username and password at the windows login screen.

#2 Post by **underclocker** » Tue Aug 12, 2008 8:01 pm

Sounds like a typical loose GPU to me, see this looong thread --> http://forum.thinkpads.com/viewtopic.php?t=33952

Also, try pressing <really hard> on the bar between the mouse buttons and the space bar when booting (or directly on the GPU).

P.S. Welcome to the forum!

#3 Post by **rkawakami** » Tue Aug 12, 2008 8:04 pm

Welcome to thinkpads.com!

Sorry that you are having problems with your system. Have you tried going into hibernation when shutting down the laptop? I think I remember reading something in the last few weeks about an intermittent boot problem disappearing when the system was hibernated, as opposed to a full power shutdown.

Even if this seems to solve the boot inconsistency, I think it's time to look around for a new motherboard if you decide to keep the system.

check · #4 Post by **check** » Tue Aug 12, 2008 8:57 pm

underclocker wrote:Sounds like a typical loose GPU to me, see this looong thread --> http://forum.thinkpads.com/viewtopic.php?t=33952

Also, try pressing <really hard> on the bar between the mouse buttons and the space bar when booting (or directly on the GPU).

P.S. Welcome to the forum!

#6

and once the computer is up and running it will go for 8 hours without issue and I move it around and stuff.

rkawakami wrote:Welcome to thinkpads.com!

Sorry that you are having problems with your system. Have you tried going into hibernation when shutting down the laptop? I think I remember reading something in the last few weeks about an intermittent boot problem disappearing when the system was hibernated, as opposed to a full power shutdown.

Even if this seems to solve the boot inconsistency, I think it's time to look around for a new motherboard if you decide to keep the system.

I think I've tried this already and there was no effect. I can't get the laptop to post right now so I can't test. I'll mess with it more tomorrow.

#5 Post by **underclocker** » Tue Aug 12, 2008 9:21 pm

I've also seen some with GPU problems that only fail (or start) with a slight twist. Sort of flex the palmrest in different directions.

If not the GPU, I can't think of much else that you haven't tried. It may be a not too common failing motherboard component.

At least you have a few choices for a fix, none should be more than $150; 1) replace mobo with eBay unit, 2) fix via forum member jamiphar, 3) replace with R51 Intel GPU mobo from eBay.

check · #6 Post by **check** » Tue Aug 12, 2008 9:29 pm

yeah I was checking prices on ebay hoping to find a replacement motherboard.

I think it may be time to upgrade to something in the 6x series.

Nick Y · #7 Post by **Nick Y** » Tue Aug 12, 2008 11:56 pm

Just a thought -have you checked the boot order in the bios or tried booting from a CD/ USB stick with system on it?

check · #8 Post by **check** » Wed Aug 13, 2008 2:52 pm

Nick Y wrote:Just a thought -have you checked the boot order in the bios or tried booting from a CD/ USB stick with system on it?

It's not posting so it doesn't matter what the boot order is.
I've also pulled the hard drive (#10) which did nothing.

check · #9 Post by **check** » Wed Aug 13, 2008 3:06 pm

I let the laptop sit overnight plugged in, after giving up on it yesterday and it turned on first try today. Unfortunately removing the cmos battery reset the no 1802 work around and it told me to remove my wifi card. I put the bootable cd in the drive with the workaround on it and it didn't boot of the cd...

powered off and the machine wouldn't come back on.

really starting to hate this machine.

more once I can get it to post again.

edit:

something I noticed when putting the laptop back together today:

"This product is refurbished and contains used parts"

>_<
I've had this thing for two years and this is the first time I've seen that. haha.

Nick Y · #10 Post by **Nick Y** » Wed Aug 13, 2008 3:38 pm

check wrote:It's not posting so it doesn't matter what the boot order is. I've also pulled the hard drive (#10) which did nothing.

**
My thoughts were that these were two things you did not appear to have tried and it was just possible that you may be able to boot externally. (I see that you have tried the ext. CD now.)

There have been a few times when my T43 just stuck and did not boot. Actually, in view of a comment above, I think it was when I used to use hibernation or sleep. After about 18 months I have started using them again and it has improved now, a few bios updates and a complete clean install later, although still not completely trustworthy. -Nothing like your experience, though.

The alternative, from my experience, is the GPU, which went on the T41p. I found that lifting the left hand corner by a couple of mm was enough to get it to boot. Any more or less and it was dead weight.

Edit:
** I meant to quote'
Nick Y wrote:
Just a thought -have you checked the boot order in the bios or tried booting from a CD/ USB stick with system on it?

sarbin · #11 Post by **sarbin** » Wed Aug 13, 2008 3:48 pm

@check...
you get a

for your perseverance.
i think i'd have pulled the hd and parted out the rest by now. then i'd be off to find a nice, used t42/p t43/p or t60/p.

check · #12 Post by **check** » Wed Aug 13, 2008 5:52 pm

sarbin wrote:@check...
you get a for your perseverance.
i think i'd have pulled the hd and parted out the rest by now. then i'd be off to find a nice, used t42/p t43/p or t60/p.

This is the first time I haven't been able to fix (or at least diagnose) a computer problem. If it just completely died one day and wouldn't turn on I would have given up, but since I can get the stupid thing to work some of the time (for no apparent reason) I'm not going to give up on it yet.

Plus I'm heading back to college which means
A) moving into my apartment next week so I don't feel like shipping anything before I arrive
B) Between food, bills, and the $500 a semester I spend on text books, I don't feel like making any major purchases before I get a job at college
and
C) I live in Maine until I go back, there is nothing else to do

t41 fails to post 9 out of 10 times

Is it time to get a new laptop?

t41 fails to post 9 out of 10 times

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