T40 only one with integrated graphics? Lowest Power?

[dozer]

hi folks,

I'm looking to set up a solar-powered 'connnection and file server' using a TP; and could use some advice from the expert 'historians'...

I just had a really clean T42 offered to me for $200, but I'm very leery of all the mobo problems with those (and it was a poor config anyway....dvd-rom drive, small ram, no wifi, etc).

Is the T40 the only one that had some versions made with the Intel "integrated into the chipset" graphics?

That should eliminate the mobo-failure worry; and perhaps (hopefully) use less power as well?

Has anyone ever done or seen a careful comparison of otherwise identical machines' battery life or internal temps?

I'm assuming that the older CPU's in a T40 may well eat up a fair bit of any power-savings given by the Intel graphics; but a CPU can be easily changed.

The reason I'm only looking at T40 and newer is that I need USB 2.0 and easy-to-find internal faster 'g' Wifi; and I'd also like to make sure I can get a v.92 modem (vs. older v.90).

There is also a possibility that I'll be able to eventually get cell-broadband here; with the addition of a tower and antenna; so again I prefer a 'newer' TP that's likely to accept a WWAN card or pcmcia version with least problems.

Easy availability and 'fit' of DVD-RW also steers me towards T4x or newer; as this 'server' will also be used to store audio/video files and burn discs occasionally.

I'd be grateful for any info on selecting the lowest possible power-consumption T40 or other model; preferably the ones with fewest known mobo heat/bga failures, ready availability, and low cost (14" XGA etc. is perfectly fine....this TP will sit untouched with screen off 99% of the time).

thanks much,

Richard

[rkawakami]

My understanding is that the Intel integrated graphics is available on some T43 systems. The T40s appear to have been made with ATI Radeon chips.

ref: ftp://ftp.software.ibm.com/pc/pcinstitu ... twbook.pdf
ftp://ftp.software.ibm.com/pc/pcinstitu ... awbook.pdf

[ajkula66]

Ray is correct, only T43s have been offered with Intel graphics.

However, there's a bunch of different R5x units that are Intel-based in the GPU respect.

Hope this helps.

[dozer]

George, thanks.

Ray, thanks for those links. I'd lost my tawbook file since changing to this T60p....nice to have it again.

Well that's interesting....I could've sworn I'd read that some T40's had the Intel integrated graphics; but you're right, it doesn't look like it.

Has anyone ever noticed whether the 7500 or 9000 based mobos have a lower failure rate?
Or are they pretty much the same?

EDIT: whups....just now saw that other current thread, wherein 'underclocker' says:

" It doesn't seem to matter which ATI GPU you have (7500, 9000, 9600, GL, GL T2, X300), it happens to them all. "

Although, if anyone has other data, I'd love to hear it.


T43: I've always thought of these as 'hot runners'....but then, the only ones I've looked at were T43p versions...

Any evidence that a 'plain' T43 uses more, less, or the same power as a T41?

(my only personal T4x experience is with my wife's T41, which runs pretty cool, at least with win2k)

thanks again.

[ajkula66]

In my experience, base T40/1/2 with 14" LCDs and Radeon 7500 have the highest failure rate.

As for Intel-based T43s, they run cooler than their ATi-based siblings, but are likely to draw more power than older T4x due to a faster FSB and stronger CPUs. FWIW, my Intel-based T43 with 2.0 CPU never went over 50 degrees C in normal use with ThinkPad Fan Control, and was idling anywhere from 38-43 C.

Hope this helps.

[dozer]

Thanks for the personal experience George.

Interesting that the failure-rate drops with the newer models; even though they seem to draw more and more power as one goes from 40, to 41, to 42, to 43.

Must be the improvements in soldering etc. I guess.

I've also studied this page of course...

http://www.thinkwiki.org/wiki/Idle_consumptions

But for some bizarre reason, everyone there used totally different setups! ...instead of everyone testing to the same configuration so that the results would be directly comparable.

Anyway, one thing that caught my eye was that T40/41 had several entries in the 7-8 watt range......whereas all the T43's are 10-15 watt.

Since not all of the entries give enough model-info to determine hdw config, we move into even more 'fuzziness' in comparing 40's to 43's....but I did notice that the T43-1871 (the integrated graphics version) was the low-end of the 43's own range (10 watts).

I just measured the old HP6000 that's running the 'server' app now, and it's drawing a surprisingly low 750ma at the 12v input of the PS (per Fluke 36 DC clamp-on meter)

So, about 8 watts...and that's not with power-twitched Linux and most hdw shut down....it's with stock win2k running, without any special power-saving twitching done.....and with both the HD and an old wifi-b pcmcia card running, and serving an active (internal-modem) dialup link to 2 other wifi laptops.

I wonder how much 'power optimization' is possible with win2k? I've not had a chance to do any serious research in that regard yet.

[underclocker]

You received some accurate information above. However, I can offer a few more opitons.

The T43 was the first T4x with integrated Intel video, however, as mentioned, the R51, which was released when the T42's were released, did offer the Intel video variant.

The R51 with Intel video runs cool and quiet and is available in 14" or 15" LCD models.

You could also do what I did (I'm typing on it now) and create your own T4x with Intel video by buying a parts T4x with a bad mobo and a parts R51 with Intel video and a bad LCD. The R51 mobo fits perfectly in the T4x case and runs much more quiet than a T43. (Although, the T43 or R52 with Intel isn't a bad choice, they just have more fan noise.) Link here for more details about building your own T4x with an R51 mobo --> http://forum.thinkpads.com/viewtopic.php?t=65505

Also, since you mentioned WWAN as an option, you should definitely look at the Z60t and Z60m machines (equipped with 14" & 15.4" widescreens only). These were the last two machines released before Core CPU models and they included nice advanced features found in the future Core models, like SATA drives (cheap with higher capacity upgrade options), the new 20V AC adapter, and WWAN options! I am currently using a Z60m as my music/home server and it is working out very well. The fan is not as loud as in T43 models but the mobo/chipset/CPU are about the same.

Finally, depending upon budget, your best bet may be either an Intel video R60 or T60. These are modern and fast. I've certainly seen the R60's sell in the $300 range and the T60's in the $400 (or less) range. Many with warranties remaining.

Bottom line, on the low pricing end, you can build your own T4x with R51 mobo or buy a complete R51 for about $200, find a T43, R52, Z60t, Z60m or R60 for around $300, or find a T60 for a little more.

OK, one more note...there were Celeron based R52, Z60t, Z60m and R60's. These are often even less expensive than the Pentium or Core based versions. For about $20 you can upgrade any Celeron R52, Z60t or Z60m to a Pentium M CPU or any Celeron R60 to a Core Solo or Duo. Very economical.

(Sorry I don't have power consumption information on any model.)

[dozer]

hi UC, and thanks for an excellent post....lots of good info there.

huh....I hadn't even considered a z60....my subconcious must've lumped them into the big pile known as "way too expensive, don't even think about it"...

But you're right.....the SATA would let me put 100's of Gb internally....so saving the power of a big USB drive hanging off a T41 etc..

And the inherent compatibility with WWAN could be a plus (if I ever get the tower-project finished).

I didn't realize they had the same cpu/chipset as a T43....I always assumed they were T60 variants....because of the ''60" I suppose.

I'll hunt around a bit and see just how cheap I can get one. With the whole world econ crashing into the toilet, they oughta be down to 20 bucks in a few months...