60GB SSD 41W0736 WTF?

[MisterDNA]

I just barely received my X41 Tablet today, but since winning the auction I've researched the Kingspec SSDs (which brought me her) and recently found this supposedly Lenovo-made 60GB SSD I can't find a [censored] thing about in terms of official data.

Based on the data I've scrounged up from other sites, it's slower than the Kingspec drive, but not by much down low in the 4KB range. What I'd like to find out is whether the Flash is SLC or, like Kingspec, MLC. Has Lenovo released anything about these?

[guanghua19]

I just barely received my X41 Tablet today, but since winning the auction I've researched the Kingspec SSDs (which brought me her) and recently found this supposedly Lenovo-made 60GB SSD I can't find a *****Expletives removed by Moderator***** thing about in terms of official data.

Based on the data I've scrounged up from other sites, it's slower than the Kingspec drive, but not by much down low in the 4KB range. What I'd like to find out is whether the Flash is SLC or, like Kingspec, MLC. Has Lenovo released anything about these?

This is not a SSD at all. It is a traditional 1.8'' hard drive 60GB zif interface inside the metal box. Speed is similar to the original 1.8'' IDE hard drive

[bananaman]

If this is a traditional hard drive, then I'm a banana!

The Lenovo 60GB 1.8" SSD 41W0737 was mentioned by a member of the Lenovo User Community a few days ago, so I bought one, and published some results.

It's an SSD, made in Korea and Taiwan, quite a few Samsung parts.

[MisterDNA]

That's one of the pages I visited while gathering info.

So does this SSD still trigger the HDD compatibility warning. If not, maybe taking the hit on speed versus the Kingspec drive is a good tradeoff to stop the freaking beeping?

[bananaman]

No it does not trigger the HDD compatibility warning.

[guanghua19]

I did see the new SSD
http://cgi.ebay.com/IBM-Lenovo-Thinkpad ... tsupported

[bananaman]

Yes, that's it.

[MisterDNA]

That guy is going to make a lot of money.

*grumbles at prices of shiny things*

Eh, screw it. I can afford that. And after hearing the loud beeps from my X41T when I put it on standby and imagining the same beeps from a Kingspec drive being installed, that drive is looking mighty tempting... though I'd like to know MLC vs SLC status to see if it would outlast the Kingspec 64GB drive.

[loyukfai]

Wow... No 2100... Very tempting...

But with only one available on eBay and Lenovo charging over a grand for it, oh well...

[K0LO]

..after hearing the loud beeps from my X41T when I put it on standby....

You can go into the BIOS setup and turn off those beeps. Whoever designed these things to beep so loudly should be locked in a dungeon for 24 hours with one set to beep at random intervals.

[WojtekO]

Lenovo wants $1,331.00 for one?
It must be good, so I bought one, off eBay

Benchmarks might be a bit slower for the lenovo one then the Kingspec, but on the other hand I don't think Lenovo would be selling a jmicron ssd.
Could they have used something a bit better to get rid of the stuttering?

I'll be getting mine in about 2 weeks, I'll find out then.

[bananaman]

It's actually a repackaged Samsung MCCOE64GEMPP.

[loyukfai]

Can the Samsung be found in the retail channel, and for how much...?

[bananaman]

When I said "repackaged", I should have said with a ZIF to IDE adapter and an enclosure which matches the form factor of the spinning X40/X41 discs.

i.e. even if you find this Samsung SSD in retail, you have work to do.

Also I see that the official status of the MCCOE64GEMPP is "EOL".

[WojtekO]

The MCCOE64GEMPP was the SSD used in the first macbook air, about 1.5yrs ago.
http://www.anandtech.com/mac/showdoc.aspx?i=3226&p=14

And, it appears that it's an SLC (description of first result)
http://www.dvnation.com/results.html?do ... 3A11&hl=en


bananaman, how are you liking yours 2 months after purchasing?

[bananaman]

I'm chuffed to bits with the 41W0736 in my X41.

The SSD and Windows 7 (RC) literally resurrected my X41. I was planning its total retirement because it was really slow. I'm running Vista and looking forward to Windows 7 everywhere else. Just goes to show how much the hard drive was holding the X41 back. It is still such a cool machine, thin and light. Brought back to life for under $200 (oh plus $50 for a Windows 7 Biz preorder). Much better than a netbook!

I've had absolutely no issues with it.

The "long pole in the tent" performance-wise is now the graphics. Not good enough for Aero.

I had virtually stopped using the machine, but now I use it 20-30% of the time. It moves about the house, and with a little help from Live Mesh and Xmarks, stays in sync with my main laptop and desktop.

[sjthinkpader]

I have a 32GB Sandisk UATA 5000 (PN: SDU5B-032G) in a X40 running Win7. This is a SLC SSD and it yielded a 5.4 rating on WEI.

[loyukfai]

So out of the various SSD options, which do you think is better?

- Lenovo OEM (repackaged Samsung)
- Custom CF card + CF adapter
- Custom PATA drive with ZIF connector + ZIF-to-IDE adapter
- 3rd party PATA IDE drives (e.g. Kingspec, ASAX...)

[bananaman]

That's a really interesting question. They all have tradeoffs.

I like that the Lenovo SSD is totally plug and play. No errors, no beeps. It is easily fast enough to expose the X40/X41 next performance weakness - graphics. The Lenovo price is stratospheric but they have been trading at reasonable prices on eBay $200 +/-.

The custom CF card + CF adapter was the only X40/X41 upgrade solution for a quite a while. It is well understood, but definitely a hands-on hobbyist's solution. Performance and price obviously varies, but this can be the cheapest option.

Spinning disk ZIF-to-IDE adapter solutions don't seem worth the effort to me. Why do that when you could have an SSD?

The 3rd party SSD's like Kingspec seem to get the job done and give the highest performance. You still get the boot up error beep. Price is about the same as the Lenovo SSD. I'm a bit leery that these are vendors I never heard of before, selling only on eBay, but users here seem to be doing fine with them.

[bananaman]

FYI the Lenovo SSD has a 5.5 WEI.

I have a 32GB Sandisk UATA 5000 (PN: SDU5B-032G) in a X40 running Win7. This is a SLC SSD and it yielded a 5.4 rating on WEI.

[sjthinkpader]

Name branded SSD is the best solution if you can afford them or get lucky in the market place. Some have SSD history from the mid-nineties, e.g. M-System/Sandisk, intel.

CF card plus a CF-ZIF adapter is the lowest cost SSD like solution. Performance is acceptable. I haven't used it enough to know the long term results but I suspect one would need more frequent secure-erase to maintain the performance level.

Large real HDD plus a ZIF-IDE adapter is the solution if one needs the storage space. Some single platter drives' performance are impressive. They are the lowest in cost per GB.

At close to the cost of a X40/X41, off brand SSD is really too high to warrant the risk.

Currently, these are the solutions I have in use:

X40: Sandisk SSD 32GB
X41: RiDATA CF 32GB
X41: Samsung 120GB HDD
X41: Samsung 80GB HDD

[loyukfai]

I'm sorry cause I wasn't clear enough. For the option 3, I actually meant those SSD with PATA interface and ZIF connector.

I'm looking forward to upgrade an aging X41 Tablet with Windows 7 and a SSD someday, to give it maybe a few more years life.

Things to consider about the SSD in my mind: Price, longevity and warranty, the stuttering issue (random write) and availability.

Sequential speed is less of a concern if you ask me.

The stuttering issue can be mitigated by using FlashPoint. However, the future of the program is unclear as this moment.

Cheers.

[sjthinkpader]

The Lenovo offering is such a device, a ZIF SSD with a ZIF-IDE adapter. The drive itself is a standard ZIF PATA drive.

[bananaman]

There is no stuttering problem with the Lenovo SSD.

[sjthinkpader]

How do you test for stuttering problem?

[bananaman]

In my case I just used it for a couple of months. No stutters.

Does anyone know of a specific test?

[loyukfai]

I read that people usually use IOMeter. But I think one can do a rough test by copying a large number of small files to the SSD, or using Crystal Disk Mark's 4KB random write test too.

Becareful if you run such tests too much, it may degrade the performance of your SSD, and you'll have to wipe it clean to bring back the performance.

Cheers.

References:

http://mydellmini.com/forum/dell-mini-9 ... utter.html
http://www.hardwarecanucks.com/forum/ha ... ew-12.html
http://www.anandtech.com/storage/showdo ... =3531&p=17

[sjthinkpader]

You don't have to wipe it clean, just run a secure erase.

Because flash really only program zeros and not ones, and DOS/Windows just rename the file header and not truly erase; so typically if the storage location is not fill with all one's, the SSD does an erase before write. Erase time for MLC is really long thus cause delay in write operation, especially when the data to be written is larger than the controller write buffer. Secure erase does a write all one's in order to be rid of the data, it effectively does the same job as TRIM does but manually.

[loyukfai]

I may not be up-to-date, but isn't that doing a secure erase on a SSD is essentially wiping it clean (i.e. all data is gone)...?

[sjthinkpader]

Some secure-erase program the default is erase blank space only.