T43 advice

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Marten · #31 Post by **Marten** » Mon Sep 28, 2009 10:44 am

Thanks! IMHO, I don't see a big difference in temperatures. On my X61s CPU's and GPU's temps are over 60C, fan is off (I use TPFanControl, it starts at the temp above 65C). It's pretty hot on the bottom, but it's nearly acceptable. Can someone post some of his/her T43/p temps, please?

#32 Post by **underclocker** » Mon Sep 28, 2009 11:12 am

Marten wrote:Can someone post some of his/her T43/p temps, please?

OK, now you're getting crazy! Some people complain about fan noise on even the most basic T43's (Intel GPU, 1.73GHz CPU), but T43p's - fuggedaboutit!

A very good friend has two 14" 2.26GHz T43p's w/7200rpm drives that he's used for the last three years (he has extended warranties for five years). In addition to multiple failed motherboards due to the GPU, I've never come across a hotter running machine. With these T43p's, the fans never stop running and the bottoms are so hot they could burn your legs. They are just downright uncomfortable to use.

However, the owner likes them because they are fairly fast, compact and light, plus they are under warranty and he always has a spare. If I get a chance sometime, I'll check the temps - they've got to be off the charts.

(It'd be interesting to hear if there is a hotter or louder ThinkPad than a loaded 14" T43p.)

Marten · #33 Post by **Marten** » Mon Sep 28, 2009 11:36 am

Ok, ok, don't get angry

It was just out of curiosity

mpcook · #34 Post by **mpcook** » Mon Sep 28, 2009 12:08 pm

You can take a look at this post for some info on T43p temps.

http://forum.thinkpads.com/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=74304

Mike

sjthinkpader · #35 Post by **sjthinkpader** » Mon Sep 28, 2009 12:11 pm

underclocker wrote:...
(It'd be interesting to hear if there is a hotter or louder ThinkPad than a loaded 14" T43p.)

Yes, T22 1Ghz machines. These CPUs have 30W+ TDP and a wimpy fan. But they can somehow run in this state forever.

ajkula66 · #36 Post by **ajkula66** » Mon Sep 28, 2009 8:53 pm

The hottest-running ThinkPad I've ever owned was a 15.4" WUXGA T61p...remove the keyboard and make your breakfast on the planar, if you're in the mood for an omelette...

Truth be told, there was likely something wrong with it from the get-go, since the board died three months after I've sold it, Ez Serv swapped it, and the machine simmered down by quite a margin, although cool it's not by any stretch of imagination...

krayzie · #37 Post by **krayzie** » Tue Sep 29, 2009 8:34 am

I would have thought since the T6x have thicker chassis that it should have marginally better air circulation inside? Or that extra thickness is actually due to the rollcage?

My wacked T43 (PM @ 2.0Ghz with ATI X300) ran so hot when I got it used (watching DVDs can hit 95C and shuts down), even with all the dusts fully cleaned out it would still idle at CPU = 75C / GPU = 65C. Changing the fan and using Arctic Silver 5 made no difference. I had no choice (since too poor to replace the mobo) but to undervolt it and now it would idle at CPU = 45-50C / GPU = 60-65C. Also I found that the T42 long fan and T43 long fan made no temp difference, even tho the T42 GPU heatsink is smaller (made for Radeon 9000).

Once I get a hold of another PM cpu (probably at a slower speed like 1.83) I will post some temps again.

sjthinkpader · #38 Post by **sjthinkpader** » Tue Sep 29, 2009 12:38 pm

The T60 added a middle frame between the MB and KB bezel to correct the flex'ing in T4x 14 inch.This middle frame likely obstruct air flow to some extend.

The P-M Dothan 750 is really the sweet spot between reasonable performance, cool running and low cost. Reading thru the AS5 information, it needs a "curing" period to reach maximum thermal transfer quality.

#39 Post by **dorronto** » Tue Sep 29, 2009 12:54 pm

krayzie wrote:I would have thought since the T6x have thicker chassis that it should have marginally better air circulation inside? Or that extra thickness is actually due to the rollcage?

My wacked T43 (PM @ 2.0Ghz with ATI X300) ran so hot when I got it used (watching DVDs can hit 95C and shuts down), even with all the dusts fully cleaned out it would still idle at CPU = 75C / GPU = 65C. Changing the fan and using Arctic Silver 5 made no difference. I had no choice (since too poor to replace the mobo) but to undervolt it and now it would idle at CPU = 45-50C / GPU = 60-65C. Also I found that the T42 long fan and T43 long fan made no temp difference, even tho the T42 GPU heatsink is smaller (made for Radeon 9000).

Once I get a hold of another PM cpu (probably at a slower speed like 1.83) I will post some temps again.

That's funny......I have basically the same T43 and it runs relatively cool. Never higher than 60-65C when watching videos.......Normal idle at 45-50C...

Ron

Marten · #40 Post by **Marten** » Tue Sep 29, 2009 2:54 pm

I'll probably have to buy T43(not p) 15" IPS because I can't find any T42 15" IPS even on ebay

Binh · #41 Post by **Binh** » Tue Sep 29, 2009 6:04 pm

Marten wrote:I'll probably have to buy T43(not p) 15" IPS because I can't find any T42 15" IPS even on ebay

There is a T42p 15" for sale on Market Place

If you are from Russia, you can ask someone on ixbt.com -> notebook forum for help

Marten · #42 Post by **Marten** » Wed Sep 30, 2009 9:24 am

Thanks, I'll give it a shot!
And I have some questions again...
According to ThinkWiki all T42p models with resolution 1600x1200 have IPS displays, is that true?
Is 60ms response time noticeable?

#43 Post by **Harryc** » Wed Sep 30, 2009 9:29 am

Marten wrote:According to ThinkWiki all T42p models with resolution 1600x1200 have IPS displays, is that true?

That is true, in fact all Thinkpads with that resolution have IPS Flexview LCD's.

Marten · #44 Post by **Marten** » Wed Sep 30, 2009 9:33 am

Thanks! Thanks a lot everyone!
This forum is great!

Marten · #45 Post by **Marten** » Fri Oct 02, 2009 12:59 pm

I found some T42s 15" with 1400x1050, but I'm confused with the release date format, e.g. 04/06 means 2004 or 2006 year?
Also, as I can see here, there are two types of IPS display for T42 15" with 1400x1050: from LG-Philips(better) and from IDTech. How can I determine the manufacturer?
Thanks in advance.

ajkula66 · #46 Post by **ajkula66** » Fri Oct 02, 2009 2:02 pm

04/06 means June of 2004.

All IPS panels on T42 units were made by ID Tech, at least officially. LG came into the picture with T43.

If the LCD was replaced under warranty, it is possible that you might get to see a T42 with a LG LCD.

I've owned dozens of these machines and don't believe that a particular screen manufacturer matters much, if at all. It's the condition of the screen that is important.

LG screens are more likely to have small darkish dots than ID Tech in my experience. On ID Tech LCDs, shadowing in the lower corners might be slightly more prominent. But all of that varies from one LCD to another.

My $0.02 only...

irus · #47 Post by **irus** » Fri Oct 02, 2009 2:05 pm

i own a 14" t42 sxga+ ati 9600 1.8 dothan with finger print reader and windows 7 rtm and with n ssd it will be pretty good

room temp is 35. laptop temps are cpu 52 gpu 56 with aero on and comp running for 7-8 hours with heavy net browsing. fan is inaudible at 3702 rpm. i use a stiff cardboard under the base to avoid the mobo flex issue. its probably one of the good purchases i made back in 2005.

dr_st · #48 Post by **dr_st** » Fri Oct 02, 2009 2:05 pm

Late T42s (Spring 2005+) came with LG IPS LCDs out of the factory. Mine did. Eventually IDTech was phased out at least on SXGA+. I am pretty sure most, if not all, Flexview SXGA+ LCDs replaced after summer 2005 are LG or BOE-Hydis (with T60 only). The parts information for your unit (you can look it up online or through access IBM button) should tell you the manufacturer.

Marten · #49 Post by **Marten** » Fri Oct 02, 2009 5:00 pm

Thanks again for your replies! I have another option: T42 made in 2006 (as the seller says) but with one hook on the lid being broken off. I think it doesn't matter.

ajkula66 · #50 Post by **ajkula66** » Fri Oct 02, 2009 5:36 pm

I'd be very skeptical about anything but T43/p being made in 2006...at that time, T60/p were already rolling around in quantities...

If you ever decide to replace that lid latch, you'll find out that it's an absolute nightmare on any ThinkPad past T30 series, because both latches (hooks) are connected and you pretty much have to rip the whole lid apart to replace one...

Having said that, I have a spare T43 that has been sitting with a broken latch for well over a year now, and will likely continue to sit like that as long as I own it...

Marten · #51 Post by **Marten** » Sat Oct 03, 2009 5:18 am

at that time, T60/p were already rolling around in quantities...

Why is it related to T42/p?

Having said that, I have a spare T43 that has been sitting with a broken latch for well over a year now, and will likely continue to sit like that as long as I own it...

I don't see any problem with a broken latch as long as it holds the lid tightly. Yours works properly?

dr_st · #52 Post by **dr_st** » Sat Oct 03, 2009 8:31 am

Marten wrote:Why is it related to T42/p?

Because it is difficult to believe they were still manufacturing laptops two generations old at that time.

Binh · #53 Post by **Binh** » Sat Oct 03, 2009 9:53 am

dr_st wrote:Because it is difficult to believe they were still manufacturing laptops two generations old at that time.

It is possible that a T42 was manufactured in 2006. According to ltwbook, the last models (not one, but about 10 models, including T42p) were announced in November 15, 2005 and withdraw in October 2006.

My T42p, for example, was manufactured in October 2005.

dr_st · #54 Post by **dr_st** » Sat Oct 03, 2009 10:04 am

I guess you are right.

akitaen · #55 Post by **akitaen** » Sun Oct 04, 2009 2:27 am

I have T42p & T43p, I can comment on the differences. I only run Linux (Kunbuntu 804), I can't comment on the Windows experience. Both are excellent, like peas in a pod at first glance but every detail of mine are different.

My T43p is stock and loaded 2.1 GHz, the T42p is 1.8 GHz, 2Gig ram & WD 5400 160G drive. The T43p is noticeably faster, like they uncorked the architecture a bit. I don't have the fan under software control, but let the bios autospeed it. Much of the time it's somewhat quiet, but it gets a good bit more rambunctious under load when it is delivering the full crunch. The fan expels a moderate amount of heat, but my chassis stays cool to the touch, not like my T22, T60's, X6x's. This machine is one of my favorites.

My T42p is very quiet always. It's not a loaded unit (b-only radio with poor reception, no fingerprint, sort of barebones but with the right performance bits). Performance is adequate, but modest. But this is my favoritest machine, the pinnacle of Thinkpad elements and a real balanced peak of goodness. Earlier ones didn't fully rock like the T42, later machines lack the screen or quality, or pleasant user experience with attention to detail & balance. The whole 6 line (T6x, X6x) packed too much in before the technology was ready, they are crushing but for me not pleasant and not entirely reliable. My T4x's have been error free, but they get better treatment than most.

Analog screen output can be as perfect as digital if you well synchronize the display clock to the video output. I use an 'AutoPattern' program that displays an alternating black/white 50 percent gray checkerboard pattern (which is optimal for clocking), when the screen is synchronized to this pattern there will be no jitter even at 1920x1200, indistinguishable from DVI.

My recent experiences with Thinkpads on eBay is as bad as possible, rampant fraud seems to be the order of the day and when it happens eBay is complicit with the fraud and will not act. Majority of listings are for a few big shady operators with multiple aliases, mostly moving dodgy, misrepresented broken junk, the good stuff is becoming rare and is not the bulk of what is available on eBay. 'Refurb' doesn't mean refurbished or even fully functional, the common scam is to dump junk on you, try and get you to have it fixed under 3rd party warranty, then when you return broken junk they unwind the transaction by declaring you a non-paying bidder so they don't have to pay listing fees, then they dump the returned junk to the next guy. Ebay will claim they can't do anything since transaction is always 'satisfactorily resolved' when you call to tell them otherwise, but you will lose money or time to hassle with someone else's junk. This is with Thinkpad World, but they build up many aliases and discard if fraud report taints reputation. Multiple experiences show this is consistent tactic but they will claim your experience almost never happens.

Good luck

Binh · #56 Post by **Binh** » Sun Oct 04, 2009 7:35 am

A good comment, Akitaen

What cable do you use for connecting external monitor via VGA output ? I use a very thick, 1m long, cable taken from a 12-years old Samsung 20" CRT, but the image quality through VGA is still notably worse than DVI. I did a fine tuning of pixel clock and phase, but the image quality is still not good as DVI.
My monitor is Dell 2001FP, native resolution - 1600x1200. The same image quality is observed on T41 with Radeon 9000 and T42p with FireGL T2.

akitaen · #57 Post by **akitaen** » Sun Oct 04, 2009 6:05 pm

Cheers Binh, I do this with several different cables from thick stiff cables with magnets at one or both ends and I get perfect results from a thin soft one with no magnets, at 1920x1200, this on several Dell 24" widescreens. At 1600x1200 it's to a nice Samsung panel, this one is a beauty because the linux ATI drivers do dual head easily but resolutions must match for sanity. Dual head laptop FTW, I never dock.

Anyway, back on point the cable appearance hasn't mattered for me, but if it sucks it's because of interference (keep it away from AC, and if they must cross, cross at 90 degrees and don't make loops.) The biggest reason for failure in my experience is the connection. Sometimes you have to plug it a few times to scrape the surface of the connectors, or you have to pull the cable in a direction to establish good contact. Generally this is the only finicky part if there's a problem.

Then when you have an adequate signal (probably something like 50-60Hz) you run a checkerboard 50% black and white full screen pattern. I got a windows EXE from samsung called 'AutoPattern.exe'; it's small and trivial and it runs fine under Wine in linux. One of these days I'm going to rewrite it in GTK or QT, but I am lazy.

So every mid or high end monitor has a auto-sync button or at least a menu entry. This clock alignment test works best with an alternating clocked pattern, when it gets the perfect signal it should sync perfectly.

In the worst case, you might not get a stable sync when the laptop is cold, maybe the video clock needs to warm up 10 minutes. On the test pattern you'll see sync errors as unstable raster/pattern sync or color shifts or clocked dither. But if the clock is stable (and my thinkpad video clocks are great) you'll get a perfect sync on the pattern, and with any luck the clock will remain stable over time (mine do); if not, resync every hour. Really a perfect sync is easy to accomplish, and if you haven't seen the results, it's so much better than what you get when you just plug and go, same as digital really.

Binh · #58 Post by **Binh** » Sun Oct 04, 2009 6:42 pm

Thank you very much for extensive explanation, akitaen !
I will try to do what you recommended and report it here.

Marten · #59 Post by **Marten** » Tue Oct 13, 2009 10:44 am

Hi, everyone, it's been a while!
At last I bought it!

T42, 15", SXGA+, 1GB RAM (2*512), 60GB HDD, release date 05/05, good condition. One of the latch's hook is broken off, some minor screen defects (dead pixels, hardly seen). The keyboard and the keyboard bezel conditions are excellent, some minor scratches on the LCD cover. Good battery life - 92% of designed capacity. The price was pretty good too, so, I'm content

I have an idea of replacing the whole lid (with LCD and all) with 15"UXGA found on ebay(~155$ with shipping). What do you think?

sjthinkpader · #60 Post by **sjthinkpader** » Tue Oct 13, 2009 2:05 pm

Not worth the price. Spend it on an external monitor and get more usable desktop.

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