T43p SATA Guide (Beware pictures, 56k-ers)

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berrieds
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Re: T43p SATA Guide (Beware pictures, 56k-ers)

#151 Post by berrieds » Fri Nov 20, 2015 3:44 pm

Hello everybody,

I've registered an account just to try and ask a few questions specifically regarding this mobo mod.

I've recently purchased a really lovely T43p. Of course, I want to do the mod in order to make it live up to its full potential. I've got a lot of experience taking apart older TP 770's, which is a real toughy compared with taking apart the T43p.

I've read through a lot of posts online, so I'm ready to get started. I've bought as many of the necessary components as I can, but it is the procedures that are still a little confusing.

Has the HD LED light been definitely solved (i.e. working), and what is the preferred method for getting that running?

Do things like TRIM work with the SSD the way they should?

Specifically regarding a few materials... I've never really done much soldering. What type of solder do I need to use? What wires, or wire should I use/buy to make things easier? I have the SATA connector, so hopefully I can easily plug the drive in using bay as designed.

I'll have more questions as I go along, but it would be nice to get any feedback before I make any potential mistakes.

Cheers :)

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Re: T43p SATA Guide (Beware pictures, 56k-ers)

#152 Post by RealBlackStuff » Fri Nov 20, 2015 5:56 pm

Welcome to the forum.
For HD-LED wiring, see page 4, the rest is all fully described on page 5 of this thread.
Lovely day for a Guinness! (The Real Black Stuff)

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Re: T43p SATA Guide (Beware pictures, 56k-ers)

#153 Post by berrieds » Wed Dec 16, 2015 6:37 am

Hello again,

The confusing thing about the HDD led connection for me is the connection to the old IDE connector, pin 39 - where is that getting the signal from? That's the 'Activity' Pin as described in the IDE layout, but do I have to connect it to something on the SATA connector?

The University of Manchester have an Electronic hobby club on Wednesday afternoons that I'm planning to get most of the work done at. They have an infra-red solder rework station!!! Even still, I fashioned a metal shield from the bottom of a tin can just to be on the safe side ;)

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Re: T43p SATA Guide (Beware pictures, 56k-ers)

#154 Post by RealBlackStuff » Wed Dec 16, 2015 7:53 am

That one wire between pin 39 and the chip-bottom is all you need.
It's apparently the AUX_ON signal going to AUXPWRG on the docking connector.
Don't ask me how or why.
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Re: T43p SATA Guide (Beware pictures, 56k-ers)

#155 Post by berrieds » Thu Dec 17, 2015 6:49 am

I decided to have a look at Intel's datasheet for the SATALED#. section 5.17.5 p.~190 it says, "When SATALED# is low, the LED should be active. When SATALED# is high, the LED should be inactive."

I speculate that IDE pin-39 detects the change voltage with the adjacent 5v pin-40, thus when the HDD/SSD in inactive, the signal is high, and when it is drawing current the signal from pin-39 will be low.


Here's how the chip removal went :D

http://miasmcr.x10host.com/UpgradeProgr ... ework1.jpg

http://miasmcr.x10host.com/UpgradeProgr ... ework2.jpg

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Re: T43p SATA Guide (Beware pictures, 56k-ers)

#156 Post by RealBlackStuff » Thu Dec 17, 2015 7:19 am

It looks like you went a little too far with the HD-connector removal. :?
I'm missing the two solid pins that hold the black plastic connector-housing.
You'll need those pins again for mounting the SATA connector.
I put these 3.5mm (1/8") high glass beads between motherboard and SATA-connector, to give it the proper height.
http://www.firemountaingems.com/search/ ... h20-2647sb
That way a SATA-drive always fits in perfectly.

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Re: T43p SATA Guide (Beware pictures, 56k-ers)

#157 Post by berrieds » Fri Dec 18, 2015 11:31 am

Yeah, that was a mistake :( Only after re-reading the thread did I see the remark that these should be left in place. I was just looking at PCB through-hole pins to connect up the SATA connector with the mobo.

Another issue I had was that the connector I bought, which I think is identical to the HP AT368 suggested in this thread without the P/N stamped on it, was too long. I read that someone else had this same issue, so I've pretty much the same thing which is to drill a new hole in the long-arm to which I'll attempt to epoxy the nut in line with the PCB hole.

Thanks for the information though, I was just trying to find out how high I needed to mount the connector, and generally there isn't much information available. Had a quick look on Ebay and ordered some of the same brand beads. Once I find some through-hole pins to mount the connector, I think I'll be good to go with the rest of it.

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Re: T43p SATA Guide (Beware pictures, 56k-ers)

#158 Post by RealBlackStuff » Fri Dec 18, 2015 12:21 pm

Leave the short-arm as-is, drill a new hole in the long-arm, exactly 45mm from that short-arm hole, then shorten only the long-arm, so that the total connector length is 49mm.
Don't worry about the nut you remove from the long-arm.
Mount the connector with the short-arm to the front of the motherboard.
The new drive goes also in upside-down (label to the table), like before.

When finished the connector-contacts on the POWER-side should be like this:
12V..xxx..5V..gnd.3.3V.....x..B+B-..x..A+A-.x
/|\..|||../|\../|\../|\.....|..|..|..|..|..|..|

(where /|\ means: solder together, and x means: leave it)

You only connect to 5V and gnd, as well as the B and A contacts.

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Re: T43p SATA Guide (Beware pictures, 56k-ers)

#159 Post by berrieds » Sun Dec 20, 2015 7:55 am

I did wonder about everything being upside down, but I figured it would work out if I didn't ask too many questions ;)

One suggestion I got from the the guy running the guy running the hobby club at the university was to solder each of the gnd connectors on the power-side to separate gnd IDE pins. I believe this was to give a level of safety/redundancy, rather than just having a single gnd.

Regarding the data connectors, I was a little confused because Mike's blog gave this information for wiring the 88SA8040 pads: http://mikejmoffitt.com/sata/mahvel_baby.png

This suggests that:
32 (TX_P) -> PIN 6, B+ (Receive +ve)
31 (TX_M) -> PIN 5, B- (Receive -ve)
-
-
28 (RX_M) -> Pin 3 A+ (Transmit -ve)
27 (RX_P) -> Pin 2, A- (Transmit +ve)

However, reading over the start of this thread you gave the opposite configuration:
RealBlackStuff wrote:For those of you who have been looking everywhere (and I mean EVERYwhere), here is the pinout of the Marvel 88SA8040:

Image

The pins that we need are:
27 RX_P = Receiver POS (your B+)
28 RX_M = Receiver NEG (your B-)

32 TX_P = Transmitter POS (your A+)
31 TX_M = Transmitter NEG (your A-)

Correct me if I'm wrong.

When you look at the big black chip on the picture in Bibin's second post, where it says:
Marvell
88SA8040
Pin 1 is on the bottom left, then goes to the right, then up, then left, and then down.

63............................................ 18
64............................................ 17
...1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16
This left me unsure of whether I should connect receive to transmit, or connect like-to-like... Obviously I don't want to screw this bit up. From others' photos I seemed that 32->B+ but I thought it would probably be best to clarify the matter.

Thanks you ever so much for the information you've given so far, especially with regards to measurements that I would not have been able to work out (or just guess at) otherwise. I can feel this all becoming a lot clearer, the steps seeming more straightforward, although I probably won't be able to get it all done for another few weeks. You've been a great help :)

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Re: T43p SATA Guide (Beware pictures, 56k-ers)

#160 Post by berrieds » Sun Dec 20, 2015 9:33 am

Here's how the connector looks after a bit of shortening and epoxy:

http://miasmcr.x10host.com/UpgradeProgr ... ormod1.jpg

http://miasmcr.x10host.com/UpgradeProgr ... ormod2.jpg

After testing it all fits I've liberally applied epoxy to reinforce the whole thing.

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Re: T43p SATA Guide (Beware pictures, 56k-ers)

#161 Post by RealBlackStuff » Sun Dec 20, 2015 10:12 am

Oops: :oops:

http://forum.thinkpads.com/viewtopic.ph ... 07#p617507
The pins that we need are:
27 RX_P = Receiver POS (your A+)
28 RX_M = Receiver NEG (your A-)

32 TX_P = Transmitter POS (your B+)
31 TX_M = Transmitter NEG (your B-)

EDIT: 20 December 2015: finally corrected the above...
All those years I never (re)read my old post.
AFAIK the original Bibin-data had its info confused (with me following), but was later corrected: http://forum.thinkpads.com/viewtopic.ph ... 40#p627240
In the meantime I have done over 100 SATA-mods, but have discontinued doing them in July 2015.

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Re: T43p SATA Guide (Beware pictures, 56k-ers)

#162 Post by berrieds » Tue Dec 22, 2015 12:33 pm

Well, thanks for clarifying that anyway.

I'll post some pictures when it's all done, some time Mid-January.

Thanks for all the advice, RBS. It wouldn't have been possible without your help :)

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Re: T43p SATA Guide (Beware pictures, 56k-ers)

#163 Post by dandreye » Sun Dec 25, 2016 9:50 am

Hi All,

Writing to report yet another successful T43 SATA mod. The main difference in my case was the way I removed the bridge. Even though because of almost no soldering experience whatsoever I was uncomfortable with the heat gun method since the very beginning I still tried it a few times first, using SolderPro 120 gas iron with a cone shaped nose (RBS's know-how). Unfortunately the bridge didn't move even when I kept heat on for a couple of minutes, perhaps due to insufficient heat generated by this tool (strange though), so I gave up to avoid the risk of burning something around the bridge. I then tried my "multi rotary tool" (aka Dremel tool) with various bits:
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/ROTARY-MULTI- ... 1022281350

Starting with a ball shaped sanding bit, I destroyed the middle of the bridge down to the heat sink on the mobo, and then used other suitable sanding and cutting bits to split the remainder of the bridge into several pieces that could be safely removed one by one. The tool has to be applied extremely carefully, for a fraction of a second at a time followed by visual inspection of the effect. The sound of sanding or cutting bit touching the bridge also helps control the tool. It wasn't a quick job at all (probably something like a couple of hours) but definitely gave me more control over the process. If done carefully enough, this method leaves the mobo underneath the bridge absolutely intact.

When soldering SATA signalling cicruit wires it helps a lot to stick them into their respective holes in the mobo near the bridge seat first, so I used really thin single core wires cut off from IDE ribbon cable: their diameter is a perfect match for those holes. For SATA power circuits I took much thicker multi core wires.

Update: some pictures, as promised:
- half way through bridge removal: https://s29.postimg.org/krf1sfnd3/IMG_2 ... 124609.jpg
- completed: https://s29.postimg.org/3kt7g43if/IMG_2847.jpg
Last edited by dandreye on Mon Dec 26, 2016 12:08 pm, edited 3 times in total.
X1G1 3460-1F4, 2x X61s 7667-34G, X61s 7667-Y24, X61s 7667-WQ8, X61s 7666-AA5, X60s 1702-W96, T43 2669-YJ6, T42 2373-Q91

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Re: T43p SATA Guide (Beware pictures, 56k-ers)

#164 Post by RealBlackStuff » Sun Dec 25, 2016 12:06 pm

dandreye wrote: I was uncomfortable with the heat gun method since the very beginning I still tried it a few times first, using SolderPro 120 gas iron with a cone shaped nose (RBS's know-how).
Objection, Your Honor!
Never even heard of SolderPro till today!
All my SATA-chip removals were done with this El Cheapo heatgun: http://forum.thinkpads.com/viewtopic.ph ... 64#p725664
Time required: less than 2 minutes!
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Re: T43p SATA Guide (Beware pictures, 56k-ers)

#165 Post by dandreye » Sun Dec 25, 2016 12:35 pm

Hi RBS - Merry Christmas! (same to everyone actually)

Over the last couple of years I scrutinized everything you've ever posted on this subject and yes your method is probably the best... for anyone who is at least familiar with this hot air station soldering unlike me. I've seen someone's post here reporting how he inadvertently pushed a nearby resistor away from its seat while using heat gun and then had a lot of pain forcing it back into its seat. Perhaps had he insulated the surroundings from heat using foil like you (used to) do he wouldn't have run into that issue. I also tried putting foil around the bridge but it's such a precise action that I found it extremely difficult to permanently seat the square opening exactly where it needs to sit: it'd always move a millimeter one side or another, exposing one or another resistor to heat. I found mechanical method way less damaging for my poor nerves ))

> Never even heard of SolderPro till today! All my SATA-chip removals were done with this El Cheapo heatgun: viewtopic.php?p=725664#p725664

Apologies for what looks like my poor wording: I implied borrowing only the cone shaped nose idea from your heat gun and using it with my gas soldering iron. Btw I find both SolderPro 120 and that rotary multi tool quite handy for various household applications: highly recommended.


OK, here's a benchmark - I was hoping to see higher write figures but it's an almost 4-year old 1st gen Intel X25-M SSD, hence no TRIM support:

Image

Still at an almost zero cost of the mod (SATA connector has been my only expense so far) I can't be any happer )
X1G1 3460-1F4, 2x X61s 7667-34G, X61s 7667-Y24, X61s 7667-WQ8, X61s 7666-AA5, X60s 1702-W96, T43 2669-YJ6, T42 2373-Q91

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Re: T43p SATA Guide (Beware pictures, 56k-ers)

#166 Post by RealBlackStuff » Sun Dec 25, 2016 2:20 pm

A less messy (but very delicate) alternative would have been to individually cut all 64 legs with an extremely fine pair of wire-cutters and leave the "legless" chip in place.

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Re: T43p SATA Guide (Beware pictures, 56k-ers)

#167 Post by dandreye » Sun Dec 25, 2016 3:01 pm

I tried that too albeit in a bad way - using utility knife and without due care, which I much regretted afterwards as it resulted in several bridge contacts on the mobo getting torn off. Fortunately that didn't damage anything critical somehow. I also had an idea of passing a thin wire underneath all the legs at each side of it at a time to detach them (with the help of a fine tipped soldering iron) but couldn't find such thin wire: even the thinnest needle won't get in there.
X1G1 3460-1F4, 2x X61s 7667-34G, X61s 7667-Y24, X61s 7667-WQ8, X61s 7666-AA5, X60s 1702-W96, T43 2669-YJ6, T42 2373-Q91

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Re: T43p SATA Guide (Beware pictures, 56k-ers)

#168 Post by ajkula66 » Sun Dec 25, 2016 3:07 pm

dandreye wrote:
OK, here's a benchmark - I was hoping to see higher write figures but it's an almost 4-year old 1st gen Intel X25-M SSD, hence no TRIM support:
TRIM has really nothing to do with that particular issue.

X-25M is known for weak sequential writes, and there's nothing you can do about that fact. My X-25E - which also has no TRIM, obviously - gets almost double the write speeds that you're seeing.
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Re: T43p SATA Guide (Beware pictures, 56k-ers)

#169 Post by dandreye » Sun Dec 25, 2016 3:18 pm

ajkula66:

SSD design issue then... In fact even that fairly low sequential write speed is probably still good enough for this T43 platform: it's still well above 50MB/s seen with an HDD in it before. Meanwhile 4k QD=1 and QD=32 write figures are somewhat higher compared to those obtained earlier with it still in my X60s following a Secure Erase (perhaps because of different CDM versions though). Anyway my T43 is now clearly much faster than it's ever been before.
X1G1 3460-1F4, 2x X61s 7667-34G, X61s 7667-Y24, X61s 7667-WQ8, X61s 7666-AA5, X60s 1702-W96, T43 2669-YJ6, T42 2373-Q91

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