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non-ThinkPad ThinkPads
non-ThinkPad ThinkPads
Why exactly are all 2012 ThinkPads considered non-ThinkPad Lenovo hardware while X100 or Slate aren't?
Not that I think that's bad (maybe apart from the fact that it adds confusion to the already confusingly named sub-forums) but I'd like to know the motives.
Not that I think that's bad (maybe apart from the fact that it adds confusion to the already confusingly named sub-forums) but I'd like to know the motives.
ThinkPad™ X201 / AFFS-120
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Dell U2713HM (2560x1440, IPS), ExpressCard USB 3.0 (2 ports, flush), Nexus 7+10
Re: non-ThinkPad ThinkPads
The motives is that some administrators share the sentiments of some of the users and are very mad at the island keyboards. Since it seems to be impossible for any of us to actually influence Lenovo, this is the only way to get at least a little bit of "revenge".
Thinkpad 25 (20K7), T490 (20N3), Yoga 14 (20FY), T430s (IPS FHD + Classic Keyboard), X220 4291-4BG
X61 7673-V2V, T60 2007-QPG, T42 2373-F7G, X32 (IPS Screen), A31p w/ Ultrabay Numpad
X61 7673-V2V, T60 2007-QPG, T42 2373-F7G, X32 (IPS Screen), A31p w/ Ultrabay Numpad
Re: non-ThinkPad ThinkPads
Thanks, I thought so.
I wouldn't express my disappointment/anger in such a way but then it's not my forum.
I wouldn't express my disappointment/anger in such a way but then it's not my forum.
ThinkPad™ X201 / AFFS-120
i5-560M 2.67Ghz, 8GB RAM, Samsung 840 Pro 256GB SSD, Win 8 Pro 64-bit, UltraBase X200, ThinkPad Compact USB Keyboard,
Dell U2713HM (2560x1440, IPS), ExpressCard USB 3.0 (2 ports, flush), Nexus 7+10
i5-560M 2.67Ghz, 8GB RAM, Samsung 840 Pro 256GB SSD, Win 8 Pro 64-bit, UltraBase X200, ThinkPad Compact USB Keyboard,
Dell U2713HM (2560x1440, IPS), ExpressCard USB 3.0 (2 ports, flush), Nexus 7+10
Re: non-ThinkPad ThinkPads
Classifying the 2012 ThinkPads in the non-Thinkpad category totally makes sense to me, and I think that all the x1xxe should also be put in the same category since they sport chiclets and cheap plastics.
Re: non-ThinkPad ThinkPads
MY experience with an E420 wasn't bad. I could get used to the keyboard pretty quickly, but just didn't like it. I don't like the machine not having a latch for the LCD cover. The E420 didn't have a number of features I like on my T series (like ultrabay, dock utilization, etc.) but that's to be expected due to the price difference.
However, if the old style keyboard still physically fits, I don't see what the big deal would be to offer the consumer the choice. It's not like it's a hill of beans difference from assembly perspective - other than having two parts to source / inventory. Then if you saw that the vast majority chose the island style, simply don't offer the choice in the future.
However, if the old style keyboard still physically fits, I don't see what the big deal would be to offer the consumer the choice. It's not like it's a hill of beans difference from assembly perspective - other than having two parts to source / inventory. Then if you saw that the vast majority chose the island style, simply don't offer the choice in the future.
Thinkpad L14 gen 2 | AMD Ryzen 7 Pro 5850u | 64gb RAM | 1tb SK Hynix P31 Gold | Intel AX210
Desktop: AMD Threadripper 1950x | 64gb RAM | 512gb Samsung 970 Pro + 1tb Crucial SSD | Ubuntu 20.04 LTS | Dell S2721DGF
Previous Thinkpads: A21m, R40, X61, T410, T420, W520
Desktop: AMD Threadripper 1950x | 64gb RAM | 512gb Samsung 970 Pro + 1tb Crucial SSD | Ubuntu 20.04 LTS | Dell S2721DGF
Previous Thinkpads: A21m, R40, X61, T410, T420, W520
Re: non-ThinkPad ThinkPads
+ 1 and then some...Summilux wrote:Classifying the 2012 ThinkPads in the non-Thinkpad category totally makes sense to me, and I think that all the x1xxe should also be put in the same category since they sport chiclets and cheap plastics.
...Knowledge is a deadly friend when no one sets the rules...(King Crimson)
Cheers,
George (your grouchy retired FlexView farmer)
One FlexView to rule them all: A31p
Abused daily: T520, X200s
PMs requesting personal tech support will be ignored.
Cheers,
George (your grouchy retired FlexView farmer)
One FlexView to rule them all: A31p
Abused daily: T520, X200s
PMs requesting personal tech support will be ignored.
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Re: non-ThinkPad ThinkPads
It's kind of silly that we got thinkpads placed under lenovo non-thinkpad category. I can understand why people are upset about the keyboard, especially on bigger thinkpads. Perhaps we could rename lenovo non-thinkpads secion to lenovo thinkpads. That would make more sense.
Re: non-ThinkPad ThinkPads
Well, not really IMO since many of Lenovo-branded ThinkPads were *proper* ThinkPads...which is not the term I'd use to describe the new *30 palette...mattbiernat wrote: Perhaps we could rename lenovo non-thinkpads secion to lenovo thinkpads. That would make more sense.
...Knowledge is a deadly friend when no one sets the rules...(King Crimson)
Cheers,
George (your grouchy retired FlexView farmer)
One FlexView to rule them all: A31p
Abused daily: T520, X200s
PMs requesting personal tech support will be ignored.
Cheers,
George (your grouchy retired FlexView farmer)
One FlexView to rule them all: A31p
Abused daily: T520, X200s
PMs requesting personal tech support will be ignored.
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Re: non-ThinkPad ThinkPads
Then they should also draw the line a bit sharper and take the name "Thinkpad" out of that section altogether!
I.e. change "Thinkpad Edge" into "Lenovo Edge", change "ThinkPad T430/T530 Series" into "Lenovo T430/T530 Series" and so on.
That would make a heck of a lot more sense (and the [Sub]Forum naming much clearer)!
I.e. change "Thinkpad Edge" into "Lenovo Edge", change "ThinkPad T430/T530 Series" into "Lenovo T430/T530 Series" and so on.
That would make a heck of a lot more sense (and the [Sub]Forum naming much clearer)!
Lovely day for a Guinness! (The Real Black Stuff)
Lenovo: X240, X250, T440p, T480, M900 Tiny.
PS: the old Boardroom website is still available on the Wayback Machine.
Lenovo: X240, X250, T440p, T480, M900 Tiny.
PS: the old Boardroom website is still available on the Wayback Machine.
Re: non-ThinkPad ThinkPads
I didn't provide any input in reference to this decision making previously. However, I could see the point when there were only a couple of models that didn't stack up to the classic ThinkPad design. But now I think this doesn't seem like a good strategy going forward.
Perhaps there should be:
ThinkPads with classic keyboards (or Classic ThinkPads)
ThinkPads with non-classic keyboards (or Non-Classic ThinkPads)
Other Lenovo Laptops, Slates, and Hardware
Or some variation of the above.
My 2 cents worth...
Perhaps there should be:
ThinkPads with classic keyboards (or Classic ThinkPads)
ThinkPads with non-classic keyboards (or Non-Classic ThinkPads)
Other Lenovo Laptops, Slates, and Hardware
Or some variation of the above.
My 2 cents worth...
DKB
Re: non-ThinkPad ThinkPads
Or keep it simple and make a "Hardware discussions" forum for all machines that we want to discuss here. Simple is good.
The keyboard won't matter anyway when BIOS-mods arrive...
The keyboard won't matter anyway when BIOS-mods arrive...
ThinkPad™ X201 / AFFS-120
i5-560M 2.67Ghz, 8GB RAM, Samsung 840 Pro 256GB SSD, Win 8 Pro 64-bit, UltraBase X200, ThinkPad Compact USB Keyboard,
Dell U2713HM (2560x1440, IPS), ExpressCard USB 3.0 (2 ports, flush), Nexus 7+10
i5-560M 2.67Ghz, 8GB RAM, Samsung 840 Pro 256GB SSD, Win 8 Pro 64-bit, UltraBase X200, ThinkPad Compact USB Keyboard,
Dell U2713HM (2560x1440, IPS), ExpressCard USB 3.0 (2 ports, flush), Nexus 7+10
Re: non-ThinkPad ThinkPads
When I can put a proper 7-row keyboard in one of the *30 models, I'll consider moving or renaming the section. Until then...
Jane
2015 X1 Carbon, ThinkPad Slate, T410s, X301, X300, X200 Tablet, T60p, HP TouchPad, iPad Air 2, iPhone 5S, IdeaTab A2107A, Yoga 3 Pro
Bill Morrow's thinkpads.com Facebook group
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I do NOT respond to PM or e-mail requests for personal tech support.
2015 X1 Carbon, ThinkPad Slate, T410s, X301, X300, X200 Tablet, T60p, HP TouchPad, iPad Air 2, iPhone 5S, IdeaTab A2107A, Yoga 3 Pro
Bill Morrow's thinkpads.com Facebook group
I'm on Twitter
I do NOT respond to PM or e-mail requests for personal tech support.
Re: non-ThinkPad ThinkPads
Good deal, keep up the good fight.JaneL wrote:When I can put a proper 7-row keyboard in one of the *30 models, I'll consider moving or renaming the section. Until then...
Thinkpad L14 gen 2 | AMD Ryzen 7 Pro 5850u | 64gb RAM | 1tb SK Hynix P31 Gold | Intel AX210
Desktop: AMD Threadripper 1950x | 64gb RAM | 512gb Samsung 970 Pro + 1tb Crucial SSD | Ubuntu 20.04 LTS | Dell S2721DGF
Previous Thinkpads: A21m, R40, X61, T410, T420, W520
Desktop: AMD Threadripper 1950x | 64gb RAM | 512gb Samsung 970 Pro + 1tb Crucial SSD | Ubuntu 20.04 LTS | Dell S2721DGF
Previous Thinkpads: A21m, R40, X61, T410, T420, W520
Re: non-ThinkPad ThinkPads
I'll post my comments on whether I think putting the island keyboard machines in this section makes sense after I get my hands on my X230T that I ordered two days ago. I will really like the backlighting on the island keyboard. The convertible tablet didn't support the ThinkLight. Also, after I read the blog on the keyboards at blog.Lenovo.com I realized I have NEVER used the funny back and forward keys on to the left and right of the arrow up keys on my X201T. I've rarely used the three keys just to the left of the on off switch.
I'm really hoping the island keyboard is less prone to crumbs getting stuck under the keys. I've become expert and putting in new keyboards in the R50/51 series and the T520 series and I wouldn't mind a break from that.
I will say that putting the X230 down in the banned group meant that I didn't find good discussions about the X230 series for a couple months while I was making my decision. I kept checking the X2xx/X3xx forum thinking that the X230 discussions would be there. Overall the ban just made thinkpads.com less valuable for me, and I've been coming here for more than five years.
I'm really hoping the island keyboard is less prone to crumbs getting stuck under the keys. I've become expert and putting in new keyboards in the R50/51 series and the T520 series and I wouldn't mind a break from that.
I will say that putting the X230 down in the banned group meant that I didn't find good discussions about the X230 series for a couple months while I was making my decision. I kept checking the X2xx/X3xx forum thinking that the X230 discussions would be there. Overall the ban just made thinkpads.com less valuable for me, and I've been coming here for more than five years.
First Thinkpad 755CX in 1995. First IBM: PC 1982 8088 w 64K RAM, dual floppy. Currently in use:
X230T with Win8Pro x64, i7, 500gb ssd; W700 WUXGA RAID 1 Blu-Ray W7Pro x64, occasionally a T61p with Win7Pro x64
X230T with Win8Pro x64, i7, 500gb ssd; W700 WUXGA RAID 1 Blu-Ray W7Pro x64, occasionally a T61p with Win7Pro x64
Re: non-ThinkPad ThinkPads
That was my concern. In my opinion, showing the disappointment with the new keyboards by separating all discussions about the new machines is not the right way to do it. It creates confusion.barrywohl wrote:I will say that putting the X230 down in the banned group meant that I didn't find good discussions about the X230 series for a couple months while I was making my decision. I kept checking the X2xx/X3xx forum thinking that the X230 discussions would be there. Overall the ban just made thinkpads.com less valuable for me, and I've been coming here for more than five years.
ThinkPad™ X201 / AFFS-120
i5-560M 2.67Ghz, 8GB RAM, Samsung 840 Pro 256GB SSD, Win 8 Pro 64-bit, UltraBase X200, ThinkPad Compact USB Keyboard,
Dell U2713HM (2560x1440, IPS), ExpressCard USB 3.0 (2 ports, flush), Nexus 7+10
i5-560M 2.67Ghz, 8GB RAM, Samsung 840 Pro 256GB SSD, Win 8 Pro 64-bit, UltraBase X200, ThinkPad Compact USB Keyboard,
Dell U2713HM (2560x1440, IPS), ExpressCard USB 3.0 (2 ports, flush), Nexus 7+10
Re: non-ThinkPad ThinkPads
I agree with you yak. Then again it's not the first time confusion is created by the grouping of models in the forums, so I don't really care anymore. Particularly since I just read all threads through "view new posts".
The right way to show disappointment with the new keyboards is simply to stop buying new Thinkpads, as long as they sport these keyboards, in order to hurt Lenovo's business and show them that despite what their management might think, users will not take unlimited crap. I hope that this is the case and this is what happens in the end, but that may be some very wishful thinking on my part.
The right way to show disappointment with the new keyboards is simply to stop buying new Thinkpads, as long as they sport these keyboards, in order to hurt Lenovo's business and show them that despite what their management might think, users will not take unlimited crap. I hope that this is the case and this is what happens in the end, but that may be some very wishful thinking on my part.
Thinkpad 25 (20K7), T490 (20N3), Yoga 14 (20FY), T430s (IPS FHD + Classic Keyboard), X220 4291-4BG
X61 7673-V2V, T60 2007-QPG, T42 2373-F7G, X32 (IPS Screen), A31p w/ Ultrabay Numpad
X61 7673-V2V, T60 2007-QPG, T42 2373-F7G, X32 (IPS Screen), A31p w/ Ultrabay Numpad
Re: non-ThinkPad ThinkPads
I think it is very childish.
Thinkpads are thinkpads. Its just a brand owned by Lenovo, and previously owned by IBM. They may have options we don't like. But it has happened in every model of thinkpad history:
- Thinkpad being purchased by Lenovo
- First panoramic displays
- 16:9 displays
- IBM brand out
- New models by Lenovo
- AMD processor models
- Non serviceable battery
- No dock connector
etc...
Thinkpads are thinkpads. Its just a brand owned by Lenovo, and previously owned by IBM. They may have options we don't like. But it has happened in every model of thinkpad history:
- Thinkpad being purchased by Lenovo
- First panoramic displays
- 16:9 displays
- IBM brand out
- New models by Lenovo
- AMD processor models
- Non serviceable battery
- No dock connector
etc...
Thinkpad T42: PM1.7 2048M 14.1in
Thinkpad T23: PIII1.0 640M 14.1in
Thinkpad R61: C2D2.0 2048M 15in
Thinkpad T23: PIII1.0 640M 14.1in
Thinkpad R61: C2D2.0 2048M 15in
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Re: non-ThinkPad ThinkPads
At first I saluted the admins for putting unconventional Thinkpads in the "non-Thinkpads" section, but that's because I thought that was just a temporary protest. But now that it has been well over a year (or even two years?), I think this protest has lasted too long. It creates confusion for many people and makes this forum less helpful. At the very least, please consider changing the name of this subforum to something like "Thinkpads with non-traditional features".
Dell Latitude 7370 (QHD+, 2.84lb); HP Pavilion x2 12-b096ms (1920x1280, 3.14lb); Microsoft Surface 3 (1920x1280, 2.00lb);
Dell OptiPlex 5040 SFF (Core i5-6600); Acer ET322QK, T272HUL; Crossover 404K; QNIX QHD2410R; Seiki Pro SM40UNP
Dell OptiPlex 5040 SFF (Core i5-6600); Acer ET322QK, T272HUL; Crossover 404K; QNIX QHD2410R; Seiki Pro SM40UNP
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Re: non-ThinkPad ThinkPads
im glad admins got around renaming the sections into something more intuitive. and while I share your disdain to a lot of changes that lenovo did, I think that naming a section "non-thinkpad" and placing thinkpads underneath it would only confuse newcomers.
Re: non-ThinkPad ThinkPads
I'm also glad that the sections were renamed to something slightly more sensible, but I still disagree with the decision overall (I agree that it will likely only serve to confuse forum visitors). I also fail to see how the ThinkPad Tablet (Android slate) is "classic" ThinkPad hardwaremattbiernat wrote:im glad admins got around renaming the sections into something more intuitive. and while I share your disdain to a lot of changes that lenovo did, I think that naming a section "non-thinkpad" and placing thinkpads underneath it would only confuse newcomers.
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Re: non-ThinkPad ThinkPads
popping in here for the first time..
reading these remarks have reminded me of one or two of the arguments that raged when ibm sold out to Lenovo..
I archived that section and I have thought to put it back for the enjoyment of the forum membership..
somehow I think there will be some sharp comments coming my way but what the heck..
reading these remarks have reminded me of one or two of the arguments that raged when ibm sold out to Lenovo..
I archived that section and I have thought to put it back for the enjoyment of the forum membership..
somehow I think there will be some sharp comments coming my way but what the heck..
Bill Morrow, kept by parrots & cockatoos
Sysop - forum.thinkpads.com
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She was not what you would call refined,
She was not what you would call unrefined,
She was the type of person who kept a parrot.
~~~Mark Twain~~~
Sysop - forum.thinkpads.com
*
She was not what you would call refined,
She was not what you would call unrefined,
She was the type of person who kept a parrot.
~~~Mark Twain~~~
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