IBM_ECW : Power management tool for T4x/R5x

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IbmPad
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Re: IBM_ECW : Power management tool for T4x/R5x

#121 Post by IbmPad » Tue Sep 03, 2013 8:37 am

Hello Ollie,
Thanks for your feedback. To anwser your questions :
1. There are indeed bad readings sometimes. I don't know how to avoid them.
2. I cannot replicate the problem. I will look into the source to see if I find some buggy code.
3. This is not possible because the program does not control the fan speed per se but an index between 0 to 7. Modifying the predefinite speeds table would probably require patching the Embedded controller firmware...
4. Yes the program can be run as a service. Run the program with admin rights, tick 'Register as a service' and optionally 'Run at startup' and save the modifications. The program will now be running automatically in the background and you can launch a second instance of it without admin rights to see the window & icon.

@Adda:
You say temperature readings seem OK but is it with or without the 'NewSensors' option ?
Regarding CPU freq. control I tested it on a Core 2 Duo equipped computer with Windows 7 x64 and it seemed to work; I am going to review the Core i-related code...
Cur. : T61p (Win7 x64, C2D T9300 2.5GHz @ 950mV, 4GB RAM, QuadroFX 570m @ 900mV SXGA+ 15")
Prev. : T42p (Win 7 and XP, PM755 2.0GHz @ 700–1148mV, 1.5GB RAM, FireGL T2); T30 (Win 2000, P4M 1.8GHz, 256MB RAM, Radeon 7500); 390E (Win 3.11, Celeron 300MHz, 160MB RAM)
Please excuse my bad English.

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Re: IBM_ECW : Power management tool for T4x/R5x

#122 Post by Adda » Tue Sep 03, 2013 8:47 am

IbmPad wrote: @Adda:
You say temperature readings seem OK but is it with or without the 'NewSensors' option ?
Regarding CPU freq. control I tested it on a Core 2 Duo equipped computer with Windows 7 x64 and it seemed to work; I am going to review the Core i-related code...
Temp readings are with the "NewSensors" option.

I think CPU scaling does work, but I think both Windows and IBM_ECW are switching CPU frequencies at the same time.

Edit: Max CPU ID does work, I was getting interference from Win7's very buggy hotkey functionality, it seems to remember hotkeys that have been deleted, it's fixed now.

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Re: IBM_ECW : Power management tool for T4x/R5x

#123 Post by Ollie » Tue Sep 03, 2013 8:54 pm

Hi, IbmPad,

Thanks for your answer!

I did run it as a service in the background, but I do like to have the window showing me temps and fan speeds etc, so I quite often start the second instance, and that on my computer requires admin password. No big deal though, I do love this great piece of work, thanks!

The bad reading problem seems gone in the latest test version!

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Re: IBM_ECW : Power management tool for T4x/R5x

#124 Post by Adda » Thu Sep 12, 2013 1:42 pm

I'm starting to think the behavior I'm seeing, where the CPU speed is switching between min and max speed, when it's supposed to stay at max speed, is normal for a Core i7.

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Re: IBM_ECW : Power management tool for T4x/R5x

#125 Post by Adda » Fri Sep 13, 2013 7:53 am

Those random temp readings are getting annoying, and it seems to get much worse when running off battery.
Temp is ~48, but readings are sometimes 17C, then it jumps to 64C, then back to 48, then down to 17 etc. the result is a fan that spins up and down up and down, more or less constantly, and it's driving me nuts!

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Re: IBM_ECW : Power management tool for T4x/R5x

#126 Post by Ollie » Sun Sep 15, 2013 7:44 pm

I was thinking, just as a workaround, maybe the programme can use an if condition when checking the temperature, that is, if the temperature reading is, let's say, 5 or 10 degrees higher or lower than the last reading, then it won't change the fan status? This is to assume no heatsink can drop the temperature so much in a second. This of course isn't an elegant solution to the problem.

Also, to me, the main window doesn't need to sit on top of all windows, I like to give it a peep now and then, but I don't want to block my main working window all the time.

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Re: IBM_ECW : Power management tool for T4x/R5x

#127 Post by Thrakath » Mon Sep 16, 2013 2:42 am

Ollie wrote:I was thinking, just as a workaround, maybe the programme can use an if condition when checking the temperature, that is, if the temperature reading is, let's say, 5 or 10 degrees higher or lower than the last reading, then it won't change the fan status? This is to assume no heatsink can drop the temperature so much in a second. This of course isn't an elegant solution to the problem.

Also, to me, the main window doesn't need to sit on top of all windows, I like to give it a peep now and then, but I don't want to block my main working window all the time.
I like this idea, but let´s put it in the way that you need to have two readings going strongly up to make the higher temp being displayed and three for the alarm! 5-10 degress / sec increase are possible in a mobile environment!!!

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Re: IBM_ECW : Power management tool for T4x/R5x

#128 Post by IbmPad » Mon Sep 16, 2013 7:14 am

Hello, I think these are indeed good ideas. Previously when the program read a sensor, it checked whether the temp was lower than 15°C or higher than 110°C or equal to the last EC reading (eg. if the APS temp is equal to the CPU temp); in that case the temp was considered potentially invalid and queried a second time.
First attempt: if a temp is 5°C lower or higher than the previous reading, the temperature is queried a second time approximately 20 ms later. It seems to give good results on my T42; I don't know if it gives improvements when using 'NewSensors'.
You can download the updated version here.

@Ollie regarding the window being on top: if you run the program as a service, you can double click on the main window to get a small window that you can put on a corner of the screen, or you can enable the taskbar icon tooltip. If you prefer, I can add an option so that the main window doesn't stay on top.
Cur. : T61p (Win7 x64, C2D T9300 2.5GHz @ 950mV, 4GB RAM, QuadroFX 570m @ 900mV SXGA+ 15")
Prev. : T42p (Win 7 and XP, PM755 2.0GHz @ 700–1148mV, 1.5GB RAM, FireGL T2); T30 (Win 2000, P4M 1.8GHz, 256MB RAM, Radeon 7500); 390E (Win 3.11, Celeron 300MHz, 160MB RAM)
Please excuse my bad English.

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Re: IBM_ECW : Power management tool for T4x/R5x

#129 Post by Ollie » Tue Sep 17, 2013 6:21 am

Thanks, IbmPad, I am glad my 2c has its worth!

I actually accidentally found out the double-click trick myself!

I downloaded and the latest version and so far it's working great. The on-top thing is no big deal with the hover-on tooltip.

Thanks!

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Re: IBM_ECW : Power management tool for T4x/R5x

#130 Post by Adda » Wed Sep 18, 2013 11:25 am

Yup, it seems to work, no random fan behavior and temps seems stable, I have not detected any downsides.

Good idea and swift solution, thanks!

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Re: IBM_ECW : Power management tool for T4x/R5x

#131 Post by Adda » Fri Sep 20, 2013 7:21 am

Ok, the issue I have with clocks going from min to max clock, when it's supposed to run at max clock, seems to be a problem with the way IBM_ECW reads CPU clocks.
While IBM_ECW reports that clocks are constantly switching between 933MHz and 1733MHz, CPU-Z shows a stable rate of 1733MHz.

I find this quite baffling.

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Re: IBM_ECW : Power management tool for T4x/R5x

#132 Post by IbmPad » Fri Sep 20, 2013 2:17 pm

Basically clock/voltage status can be read in CPU MSR 0x198 and modified by writing in MSR 0x199. Intel's documentation states that on the Core i5 and i7 there is one MSR 0x199 per CPU thread and one MSR 0x198 per CPU core. For a clock switch to be effective, every core's MSR 0x199 must have been written the same value, so IBM_ECW writes to MSR 0x199 on every core, but reads MSR 0x198 on one single random core. Perhaps the value is not correct on all cores/threads, I don't know...

Perhaps you could set the CPU to run at max freq and then use Task Manager to restrict IBM_ECW to one single core at a time and see what IBM_ECW indicates. Disabling HyperThreading could also be something to try...
Cur. : T61p (Win7 x64, C2D T9300 2.5GHz @ 950mV, 4GB RAM, QuadroFX 570m @ 900mV SXGA+ 15")
Prev. : T42p (Win 7 and XP, PM755 2.0GHz @ 700–1148mV, 1.5GB RAM, FireGL T2); T30 (Win 2000, P4M 1.8GHz, 256MB RAM, Radeon 7500); 390E (Win 3.11, Celeron 300MHz, 160MB RAM)
Please excuse my bad English.

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Re: IBM_ECW : Power management tool for T4x/R5x

#133 Post by Adda » Fri Sep 20, 2013 3:51 pm

I disabled core parking, so all cores will always run the same freq, and no cores will be turned off if not in use.
By default, my 720QM can run 2.8GHz one one core with the three other parked.
Or 2.4GHz on two cores with two parked, or 1.73GHz on three or more cores.
But since core parking is disabled, I'm limited to 1.73Ghz max, as all cores are always running.
The 1.73Ghz is a turbo boosted freq, but having it run 1.6Ghz (no turbo boost) produces the same behavior.
I disabled Hyper Threading a long time ago, it doesn't improve performance, and causes high DPC latency.
Changing CPU scaling settings in Windows Power Manger has no effect.

I don't know if IBM_ECW will behave differently if core parking was enabled, to find out, I'll have to reinstall.
But I don't really want core parking enabled, the system seems more responsive without.
It kills the battery life though, I'm lucky if I get 1 hour out of a 6 cell, and it increases idle temps too.

Changing IBM_ECW core affinity has no effect.

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Re: IBM_ECW : Power management tool for T4x/R5x

#134 Post by IbmPad » Fri Sep 20, 2013 4:06 pm

Unfortunately I think I won't be able to help you further. As I have never had a CPU more recent than my Pentium M, I have nearly no idea what HyperThreading, core parking, Turbo Boost et al are, and it is difficult to figure out exactly just by reading documentation...
Cur. : T61p (Win7 x64, C2D T9300 2.5GHz @ 950mV, 4GB RAM, QuadroFX 570m @ 900mV SXGA+ 15")
Prev. : T42p (Win 7 and XP, PM755 2.0GHz @ 700–1148mV, 1.5GB RAM, FireGL T2); T30 (Win 2000, P4M 1.8GHz, 256MB RAM, Radeon 7500); 390E (Win 3.11, Celeron 300MHz, 160MB RAM)
Please excuse my bad English.

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Re: IBM_ECW : Power management tool for T4x/R5x

#135 Post by Adda » Fri Sep 20, 2013 4:22 pm

Well we can't even be sure there is a problem, CPU-Z shows stable clocks while IBM_ECW doesn't, but which one is telling the truth?

Right now, I have the CPU set to maximum in IBM_ECW, while running flash video, so there is a moderate load on one core correction, since core parking is disabled, flash is load balanced across all cores, so each core is under minimal load.
According to IBM_ECW, the CPU runs 933 about half the time, 1.73GHz the other half, but CPU-Z shows 1.73GHz no switching what so ever.

I'll look at more CPUID programs and see.

Edit:
CoreTemp reports 1.6-1.73Ghz (varies), and 1.53-1.6Ghz without TurboBoost.
Speccy reports a stable 1.73GHz and 1.6Ghz without Turbo Boost.

I think CoreTemp is the accurate one.

Edit2:
Forgot an important detail, FL Studio performs as good as ever, if the CPU was in fact switching from 933-1733Mhz while rendering a heavy weight project, I'd get buffer underruns all the time, it would be unlistenable, but that's not the case.

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Re: IBM_ECW : Power management tool for T4x/R5x

#136 Post by Adda » Fri Sep 20, 2013 4:56 pm

Maybe the problem is that IBM_ECW can't show some of the clocks the CPU is running, like 1.53 and 1.66GHz, so it shows 933Mhz in stead.

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Re: IBM_ECW : Power management tool for T4x/R5x

#137 Post by Ollie » Thu Sep 26, 2013 12:33 am

Hi, IbmPad,

Just an idea about the cosmetics -- how about make the display window "auto-hide"? Just like the Windows Taskbar when you set it to.

Cheers~

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Re: IBM_ECW : Power management tool for T4x/R5x

#138 Post by fakeraol » Sun Dec 08, 2013 9:17 am

Has it support for SuperLFM and IDA like RMClock?
For the older CPUs like Core Duo / Core 2 Duo is this the better solution or should i use RMClock?

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Re: IBM_ECW : Power management tool for T4x/R5x

#139 Post by IbmPad » Sun Dec 08, 2013 1:53 pm

Hello Fakeraol,

First of all I currently own nothing more recent than a Pentium M so I tried to implement some of these features but I cannot make tests.
SuperLFM should be supported (just enter the halved multiplier or frequency, eg. 3 for multiplier 6 in SLFM). I tried to implement Dual IDA (append a lowercase 'i' to the multiplier, eg. 13.5i); it seems to work for some people but not for others...
I just bought a ThinkPad with a Core 2 Duo T9300 that I will receive in a few days, so I will be able to make tests and hopefully improve the program.
I think the advantages over RMClock is that the program combines fan control with CPU freq/voltage control, is more lightweight, can work as a service and prevents Intel power management driver from interfering with CPU freq/voltage control. The main drawback is that it does not read the possible multipliers and the stock voltages ; I cannot find out how to read ACPI tables and get the info from them...
Cur. : T61p (Win7 x64, C2D T9300 2.5GHz @ 950mV, 4GB RAM, QuadroFX 570m @ 900mV SXGA+ 15")
Prev. : T42p (Win 7 and XP, PM755 2.0GHz @ 700–1148mV, 1.5GB RAM, FireGL T2); T30 (Win 2000, P4M 1.8GHz, 256MB RAM, Radeon 7500); 390E (Win 3.11, Celeron 300MHz, 160MB RAM)
Please excuse my bad English.

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Re: IBM_ECW : Power management tool for T4x/R5x

#140 Post by fakeraol » Thu Dec 12, 2013 10:29 pm


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Re: IBM_ECW : Power management tool for T4x/R5x

#141 Post by IbmPad » Sat Dec 14, 2013 2:21 pm

Thank you but this link shows an interface specific to Notebook Hardware Control. I think I have to issue IOCTL_ACPI_EVAL_METHOD but I don't understand to which device I shall send the IRP. Anyway I did not even try for now.

My current issue is that, according to the ACPI specifications, _PR.CPU._PSS should contain packages describing the SpeedStep states in the following form : {CoreFrequency, Power, Latency, BusMasterLatency, Control, Status}. The Control field is the interesting one. But when I use Intel's tool to extract and decode my ACPI tables I get the following :

Code: Select all

Name(_PSS, Package(0x08) {
  Package(0x06) {0x00, 0x00, 0x01F4, 0x00, 0xF6, 0x00}, 
  Package(0x06) {0x00, 0x00, 0x01F4, 0x00, 0xF7, 0x01}, 
  Package(0x06) {0x00, 0x00, 0x01F4, 0x00, 0xF8, 0x02}, 
  Package(0x06) {0x00, 0x00, 0x01F4, 0x00, 0xF9, 0x03}, 
  Package(0x06) {0x00, 0x00, 0x01F4, 0x00, 0xFA, 0x04}, 
  Package(0x06) {0x00, 0x00, 0x01F4, 0x00, 0xFB, 0x05}, 
  Package(0x06) {0x00, 0x00, 0x01F4, 0x00, 0xFC, 0x06}, 
  Package(0x06) {0x00, 0x00, 0x01F4, 0x00, 0xFD, 0x07}
})
which is completely inconsistent with what I would expect...
Cur. : T61p (Win7 x64, C2D T9300 2.5GHz @ 950mV, 4GB RAM, QuadroFX 570m @ 900mV SXGA+ 15")
Prev. : T42p (Win 7 and XP, PM755 2.0GHz @ 700–1148mV, 1.5GB RAM, FireGL T2); T30 (Win 2000, P4M 1.8GHz, 256MB RAM, Radeon 7500); 390E (Win 3.11, Celeron 300MHz, 160MB RAM)
Please excuse my bad English.

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Re: IBM_ECW : Power management tool for T4x/R5x

#142 Post by IbmPad » Sun Dec 29, 2013 4:39 pm

Minor update, nothing interesting (v. 1.0.5.2) :
- improved the test mode patch and fixed a few bugs ;
- updated the WinRing0 version which is now a native 64-bit executable (it is still recommended to use the standard version).
Cur. : T61p (Win7 x64, C2D T9300 2.5GHz @ 950mV, 4GB RAM, QuadroFX 570m @ 900mV SXGA+ 15")
Prev. : T42p (Win 7 and XP, PM755 2.0GHz @ 700–1148mV, 1.5GB RAM, FireGL T2); T30 (Win 2000, P4M 1.8GHz, 256MB RAM, Radeon 7500); 390E (Win 3.11, Celeron 300MHz, 160MB RAM)
Please excuse my bad English.

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Re: IBM_ECW : Power management tool for T4x/R5x

#143 Post by IbmPad » Sun Jan 19, 2014 5:03 pm

For the first time I just tested Dual IDA since I now have a C2D (T9300). It seems switching to Dual IDA mode only works when the CPU is inactive. I don't know whether it is the same for everyone or not...

So I tried something ugly (and perhaps even counterproductive) : when the program prepares to switch to Dual IDA mode, it scans the active processes list and suspends those using more than 20 % CPU for 500 ms to let the CPU go to IDA mode, then resumes them.

I will test that for the next days... If you want, you can try using the new version (1.0.5.3) and tell me your remarks, observations or ideas.

EDIT: Update (ver. 1.0.5.4) : fixed one bug related to this feature (the program could suspend itself :roll: or the Explorer process; I don't know why but when Explorer is suspended the client and the service are unable to communicate through the pipe) and one bug related to an overflow occuring when showing the battery power.
Cur. : T61p (Win7 x64, C2D T9300 2.5GHz @ 950mV, 4GB RAM, QuadroFX 570m @ 900mV SXGA+ 15")
Prev. : T42p (Win 7 and XP, PM755 2.0GHz @ 700–1148mV, 1.5GB RAM, FireGL T2); T30 (Win 2000, P4M 1.8GHz, 256MB RAM, Radeon 7500); 390E (Win 3.11, Celeron 300MHz, 160MB RAM)
Please excuse my bad English.

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Re: IBM_ECW : Power management tool for T4x/R5x

#144 Post by Adda » Tue Jan 28, 2014 8:45 am

Why is this thread not a sticky yet?

Moderator edit: Just made this thread to a sticky.

Adda edit: :thumbs-UP:

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NEC DVD+-RW ND-6650A
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Re: IBM_ECW : Power management tool for T4x/R5x

#145 Post by Thrakath » Wed Feb 05, 2014 12:04 pm

Report on the newest version (ver. 1.0.5.4): Youtube videos 720p stutter (not smooth and sound hangs) even if CPU is fixed at 2700Mhz and usage is low...must be something with your new routine i assume! Switching off ECW solves that!

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Re: IBM_ECW : Power management tool for T4x/R5x

#146 Post by IbmPad » Thu Feb 06, 2014 5:00 pm

Thank you for your report. I just made the new behavior optional (ver. 1.0.5.5) : in the frequency table, if you put '2700i' (lowercase i) the new behavior is disabled. It is enabled only if you put '2700I' (uppercase i). I hope it will work back as before for you.
Cur. : T61p (Win7 x64, C2D T9300 2.5GHz @ 950mV, 4GB RAM, QuadroFX 570m @ 900mV SXGA+ 15")
Prev. : T42p (Win 7 and XP, PM755 2.0GHz @ 700–1148mV, 1.5GB RAM, FireGL T2); T30 (Win 2000, P4M 1.8GHz, 256MB RAM, Radeon 7500); 390E (Win 3.11, Celeron 300MHz, 160MB RAM)
Please excuse my bad English.

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Re: IBM_ECW : Power management tool for T4x/R5x

#147 Post by Thrakath » Wed Feb 12, 2014 4:28 am

Maybe this can also help you:

Yesterday i recalibrated the battery using the power manager. During the discharging, which is with AC plugged but disabled, the CPU frequency in ECW stayed constant at 2700Mhz without changing. Just an observation...

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Re: IBM_ECW : Power management tool for T4x/R5x

#148 Post by Thrakath » Wed Feb 19, 2014 11:35 am

Hey IBMPad,

any progress? Busy with other things? Dont want to stress you...just curious...wanna get this DUALIDA up and running. So feel free to use me as a beta tester!

Bonne chance

IbmPad
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Re: IBM_ECW : Power management tool for T4x/R5x

#149 Post by IbmPad » Wed Feb 19, 2014 3:22 pm

Sorry for answering late... Unfortunately there is no progress; I thought disabling the new behavior (i.e. suspending processes) would make your system work back as before... If the problem persists with the latest version, I unfortunately don't the its cause...
I currently don't have another idea to make DualIDA working : on my system at least, the CPU seems to refuse transitioning to 2700 MHz when the system is at full charge, hence the idea of suspending the active processes for a short period. This is perhaps kind of related the C-states, I don't know... I will let you know if I find something new.
Cur. : T61p (Win7 x64, C2D T9300 2.5GHz @ 950mV, 4GB RAM, QuadroFX 570m @ 900mV SXGA+ 15")
Prev. : T42p (Win 7 and XP, PM755 2.0GHz @ 700–1148mV, 1.5GB RAM, FireGL T2); T30 (Win 2000, P4M 1.8GHz, 256MB RAM, Radeon 7500); 390E (Win 3.11, Celeron 300MHz, 160MB RAM)
Please excuse my bad English.

Thrakath
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Location: Germany

Re: IBM_ECW : Power management tool for T4x/R5x

#150 Post by Thrakath » Mon Feb 24, 2014 6:15 am

I always have mine fixed to maximum multiplier in plugged condition. Power consumption is the same thanks to C-states. Starting Prime like this keeps it at 2700MHz. When i set to automatic the maximum is 2500MHz as you said. As it stays around 74° (C) i think it´s not a temp problem. Even when i lower the Fan to Level 1 it stays around 83° and 2700MHz with maximum locked. So it must be related to the transitioning!

Another thing: Is it possible to include in the "no control" setting, that it also goes back to Original Bios Voltages for Battery mode? On my T61 the battery is a replica that cannot run stable with lowered voltages...

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