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T21 using w98, with dos-sound - sort of....

T20-T23 Series and T30. NOT for T25-Retro.
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my03
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T21 using w98, with dos-sound - sort of....

#1 Post by my03 » Sun Jan 09, 2022 12:22 pm

So i have been setting up my T21 using the W98 recovery CD and that worked out perfectly fine. As i wanted to, now and then, run some DOS games on it, i went searching for drivers that would let me have audio and i found these:

http://www.cirrus.com/en/software/drive ... PV2885.zip

That works somewhat nice (included is a small TSR that will enable SB mode in dos-mode). I have sound in games like wolf3d, etc but for some odd reason, i only hear the music when playing Doom2 (despite setting up the sound fx portion according to the proper configuration). Is this particular game known to be "difficult" in this sense?
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dr_st
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Re: T21 using w98, with dos-sound - sort of....

#2 Post by dr_st » Sun Jan 09, 2022 1:50 pm

I briefly tested DOS games on an A21m which I think has the same audio chipset and I don't recall any special SFX issues with any DOOM game. Make sure sound is not muted in the game itself.
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my03
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Re: T21 using w98, with dos-sound - sort of....

#3 Post by my03 » Sun Jan 09, 2022 3:59 pm

dr_st wrote:
Sun Jan 09, 2022 1:50 pm
I briefly tested DOS games on an A21m which I think has the same audio chipset and I don't recall any special SFX issues with any DOOM game. Make sure sound is not muted in the game itself.
This is very good to know :) Are you using xp or win98 dr_st?

I double-checked my settings and the sound (fx) is not muted. I tried all combinations of irq/dma (except the one that works normally for other games) but with the same result. Maybe i should try something else than the Cirrus (reference??) drivers, but i don't know which ones could work...

I will try the shareware version of Doom also (haven't done that yet), maybe it will behave differently.
W530 3940xm/32gb/520/240/240gb ssd, FHD
T410 w. I7-640m, 8GB, 240+128gb ssd hd, 1440x900
X61 w. T7500, 8GB, 240gb ssd, 1440x900
760E
365ed
360cs
701cs
T21
T590 (work machine)

dr_st
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Re: T21 using w98, with dos-sound - sort of....

#4 Post by dr_st » Mon Jan 10, 2022 12:15 am

I was using Win98 and also pure DOS mode on that machine. You can read about the drivers I used here:
viewtopic.php?p=823850#p823850

Are you running the games under pure DOS mode or from within Win98?

I think that trying Shareware Doom 1.9 is a good idea too.
Thinkpad 25 (20K7), T490 (20N3), Yoga 14 (20FY), T430s (IPS FHD + Classic Keyboard), X220 4291-4BG
X61 7673-V2V, T60 2007-QPG, T42 2373-F7G, X32 (IPS Screen), A31p w/ Ultrabay Numpad

my03
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Re: T21 using w98, with dos-sound - sort of....

#5 Post by my03 » Tue Jan 11, 2022 2:34 pm

I'm running them in pure dos mode (win98 v. 7 i believe).

I downloaded doom1.9s and tried it but it did not have any FX either. Did the same thing with Duke3D and that title worked flawlessly.

So i googled this a bit and found a weird pattern. Apparently, the Doom audio-engine is notoriously "bad" in the sense that it has certain issues. One thing that became clear was that it uses this "window" in memory that sometimes get masked by shadow ram, and most ppl who complained about this issue used Phoenix bios on their machine. I'm not sure what bios maker IBM used for the T20/1/2 but i wonder if it could be Phoenix there as well?

I ordered a floppy drive for my T21 (it came with the CD) and so i will try to see if i can upgrade the bios, if that makes any difference at all.
W530 3940xm/32gb/520/240/240gb ssd, FHD
T410 w. I7-640m, 8GB, 240+128gb ssd hd, 1440x900
X61 w. T7500, 8GB, 240gb ssd, 1440x900
760E
365ed
360cs
701cs
T21
T590 (work machine)

RealBlackStuff
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Re: T21 using w98, with dos-sound - sort of....

#6 Post by RealBlackStuff » Wed Jan 12, 2022 2:47 am

Yup, T21 BIOS was made by Phoenix.
https://www.wimsbios.com/biosupdates/ibm/PH69KIB4
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my03
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Re: T21 using w98, with dos-sound - sort of....

#7 Post by my03 » Wed Jan 12, 2022 12:55 pm

RealBlackStuff wrote:
Wed Jan 12, 2022 2:47 am
Yup, T21 BIOS was made by Phoenix.
https://www.wimsbios.com/biosupdates/ibm/PH69KIB4
That explains it imho :)

Saw this on Vogons recently:

"If found a posting on the net, from someone who had the same problem as me. This message is as follows, and it is written by Id tech support:

" The problem you are having seems to be related to a bug in the Phoenix PCI BIOS. It is a known problem. There seems to be an area of memory that the Phoenix BIOS is shadowing that cannot be turned off. In order for the sound to work this area cannot be shadowed. ""

https://www.vogons.org/viewtopic.php?t=20884

Thx for you input dr_st and RealBlackStuff. Much appreciated :)
W530 3940xm/32gb/520/240/240gb ssd, FHD
T410 w. I7-640m, 8GB, 240+128gb ssd hd, 1440x900
X61 w. T7500, 8GB, 240gb ssd, 1440x900
760E
365ed
360cs
701cs
T21
T590 (work machine)

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