New SXGA+ screen wavy in some circumstances (with pics)

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ZRotheohv · #1 Post by **ZRotheohv** » Mon Dec 11, 2006 9:51 am

Hi, I just got a nice seemingly new SXGA+ screen for my T30 off of eBay to replace my older XGA screen and also got a new inverter card and cable to fit. The screen seems to be working great right now (I'm typing this on that screen), but when there is a lot of activity on the screen (such as when watching a movie) or when it is plugged into an external monitor (using the S-Video port) it gets very wavy. It's a lot worse on the right side of the screen, also. But then after I disable the external monitor on the display settings and unplug it from the S-Video port, the screen remains wavy until either I restart it or put it through a hibernation.

This is supposed to be a vertical line toward the left side of the screen:
http://image59.webshots.com/159/8/31/23 ... gmA_ph.jpg

This is supposed to be a vertical line toward the right side of the screen:
http://image53.webshots.com/753/3/83/59 ... TjU_ph.jpg

Right now I am running the Omega driver 3.8.291 for the ATI Radeon 7500 after everything was the same with the ATI driver. Any help would be greatly appreciated, since I absolutely LOVE the SXGA+ screen but if I can't watch videos at all or use an external monitor, it wouldn't be so appealing. Thanks a lot!

Zachary Rothe

brooklynboy · #2 Post by **brooklynboy** » Mon Dec 11, 2006 11:29 am

Do a Google search on "Omega driver 3.8.291 for the ATI Radeon 7500." That version of the Omega drivers is no longer supposed to support the 7500 card.

ZRotheohv · #3 Post by **ZRotheohv** » Mon Dec 11, 2006 6:43 pm

Okay I now reinstalled the latest ATI driver (6.14.10.6546) and the symptoms are the same. It is not a hardware problem, since it's fine when it boots with the IBM symbol and also works well without an external monitor or when there's not a lot of screen activity, and it's also fine when the Windows icon with the little scrolling bar comes up. But once my desktop pops up with that external monitor plugged into the S-Video port the screen gets all wavy and full of static, as if each row of pixels doesn't always line up with the next. It gets worse with time, also. I found that when I grab a window and shake it around a lot, this temporarily fixes the problem (for a few seconds) and then the screen gradually gets more and more out of control. Also, for what it's worth, the external screen works flawlessly, no distortion at all. Beyond the drivers, I have NO clue what to do, so any help at all would be very much appreciated.

#4 Post by **rkawakami** » Mon Dec 11, 2006 7:25 pm

ZRotheohv wrote:It gets worse with time, also. I found that when I grab a window and shake it around a lot, this temporarily fixes the problem (for a few seconds) and then the screen gradually gets more and more out of control. Also, for what it's worth, the external screen works flawlessly, no distortion at all.

If, when your LCD shows scrambled video, does it return to normal if the external monitor is simply disconnected? Also, is the external monitor mirroring the image of your LCD or are you using the extended desktop feature? From your description of "shaking" a window around to fix the image, it could be a display memory problem. I know that the T2x version of PC Doctor contains several video memory diagnostics. You may want to grab a copy of the T30 version of PC Doctor from here:

PC Doctor for DOS - ThinkPad T30

ZRotheohv · #5 Post by **ZRotheohv** » Mon Dec 11, 2006 8:10 pm

If the external monitor is simply disconnected the screen is still garbled until either a restart or a hibernation. Just putting it on standby doesn't do anything, either, nor does unchecking "Extend my Windows desktop onto this monitor". Only a restart or hibernation will fix it. Also, it works the same whether I use a cloned screen or an extended desktop. Unfortunately I don't have a floppy drive so I can't run PC Doctor until tomorrow, probably, but if it is a display memory problem is there any way to fix it? Thanks very much for the help!

#6 Post by **rkawakami** » Mon Dec 11, 2006 8:25 pm

ZRotheohv wrote:<snip>... but if it is a display memory problem is there any way to fix it? Thanks very much for the help!

If it indeed is a video display memory problem, then I don't think there's any cure other than replacing the motherboard. From what I found out about the Radeon 7500 chip, 16MB of memory is built into the graphics chip:

http://www.rage3d.com/previews/video/mobility7500/?p=3

There apparently is a way of extending the memory space externally, but I don't know if this is done in the T30. I would assume that if it is, then a dedicated memory chip is being used, as opposed to sharing part of the main memory. If there are any video chipset experts out there, please chime in.

If you can, see if you can get PC Doctor loaded and running on the T30. I would assume that it will have the same type of video diagnostics used to check the S3 chipset inside the T23.

#7 Post by **tomh009** » Mon Dec 11, 2006 9:24 pm

Is there any chance that your video cable is bad? Does it look perfect on visual inspection?

ZRotheohv · #8 Post by **ZRotheohv** » Mon Dec 11, 2006 9:26 pm

Well that article was a huge help. It seems when on battery power there's no problems at all when watching videos. Also, when running on battery power with the POWERPLAY deactivated (running on full all the time) the problem arises again. So it's something to do with the POWERPLAY. But, the external monitor shenanigans aren't affected by power, unfortunately. Thanks for the help, though, I'll try to run PC Doctor tomorrow.

ZRotheohv · #9 Post by **ZRotheohv** » Mon Dec 11, 2006 9:28 pm

I would assume that I'd be having problems with the LCD all the time if the cable was bad, but I'll have another look...

ZRotheohv · #10 Post by **ZRotheohv** » Mon Dec 11, 2006 10:51 pm

If it's any consolation, when the screen was at its worst I hit the print screen button and pasted the image into paint. After a restart without the external monitor in, the screen was fine and when I opened the image, it had absolutely no indications of distortion. Whatever that's worth. Thanks for any help!

#11 Post by **rkawakami** » Mon Dec 11, 2006 11:17 pm

Now that's an interesting data point! That would seem to say that the video memory is working correctly. I don't know the exact workings of how the Print Screen function works under Windows, but if it's similar to DOS, then you should be saving the contents of the video memory in the clipboard. That may point towards your cable or LCD panel.

ZRotheohv · #12 Post by **ZRotheohv** » Mon Dec 11, 2006 11:36 pm

I did get the appropriate SXGA+ cable (27L0707, used) to replace the one that was on there before (27L0705), but is it possible to use the older one to somehow troubleshoot whether it's the cable or not? What are the differences between them? When comparing during the installation they appeared exactly the same. I would have a hard time believing it would be the cable, however, since it does run normally some of the time. But then again I have no idea how these screens and cables work. Maybe one controls some kind of refresh or sync or something. I'll have a look when I can pull the bezel off again.

#13 Post by **rkawakami** » Mon Dec 11, 2006 11:42 pm

I don't believe that you can use the XGA cable on the SXGA+ panel. You could try to re-install your original panel (I don't see anywhere in your posts that it's dead) to see if it does the same thing. If so, that would rule out the cable and LCD. Of course, that leaves the motherboard

.

ZRotheohv · #14 Post by **ZRotheohv** » Mon Dec 11, 2006 11:49 pm

The original panel is not dead, so I'll probably try that. Before I removed it, however, it was working flawlessly. I guess since it wasn't broke I shouldn't have fixed it! Oh well. I do like the SXGA+ screen though, for the few seconds that it does work!

#15 Post by **rkawakami** » Mon Dec 11, 2006 11:56 pm

I'm using a T23 (2647-HNU w/SXGA+) at the moment, and I know what you mean. It took me a little while to get used to the slightly smaller type/graphics on the screen, but the increased area more than makes up for it.

ZRotheohv · #16 Post by **ZRotheohv** » Wed Dec 13, 2006 1:17 am

So I finally had a chance to run PC Doctor and it came out with no errors at all. But when I ran the video diagnostics, the screen became worse and worse with each test, though they all passed. Also, just for grins, I plugged in the XGA cable into the SXGA+ screen and got an XGA image in the upper left corner of the screen (at 1024x768) and when I ran the tests again, it performed flawlessly. So I don't think the screen is bad, would the cable be responsible for all this heartache? It doesn't look damaged at all, but with all those little wires one might be broken I guess. Should I be looking for another cable and return the one I have? Thanks a lot!

#17 Post by **rkawakami** » Wed Dec 13, 2006 1:22 am

ZRotheohv wrote:So I don't think the screen is bad, would the cable be responsible for all this heartache? It doesn't look damaged at all, but with all those little wires one might be broken I guess.

It's possible that with some crosstalk (partial or false signals appearing on the adjacent wires) you could get those types of failures in the display. Hopefully a new cable will solve your problem.

ZRotheohv · #18 Post by **ZRotheohv** » Wed Dec 13, 2006 1:56 am

Is there any recommended way to have it professionally tested, such as taking it to Best Buy or some place like that? I'd like to know exactly what that problem is before I start buying more and more things for it! Would pretty much any respectable computer place be able to troubleshoot my problem and/or get me a new cable? Thanks again!

#19 Post by **rkawakami** » Wed Dec 13, 2006 2:19 am

"Professionally troubleshoot" and "Best Buy" do not go together (IMHO). You would do better to go to a shop that specializes in laptop repairs. Yes, the "geeks" at the Geek Squad may indeed be helpful, but if I couldn't fix my own systems, I would go to a place that exclusively deals with laptop computers. Again, that's just my opinion.

As far as getting parts, I don't know if IBM/Lenovo is still offering replacement parts such as what we are talking about here (LCD ribbon cable). With discontinued systems such as your T30, genuine factory parts will be harder and harder to come by.

By all means, please get a second (or third) opinion as to the possible problems (and fixes) that your system shows.

#20 Post by **tomh009** » Wed Dec 13, 2006 5:43 am

rkawakami wrote:It's possible that with some crosstalk (partial or false signals appearing on the adjacent wires) you could get those types of failures in the display. Hopefully a new cable will solve your problem.

That was exactly my thinking. You were getting the waviness etc when there was a lot of screen activity (like a movie), which means a lot of signaling on the cable.

But we are all guessing at this point -- if you do get a chance to test with another cable, you will know for sure whether our guesses were right or not.

danage · #21 Post by **danage** » Wed Dec 13, 2006 9:04 am

it could also be the logic inside of the lcd screen. there is some kind of controller in it to descramble the signals that come out of the cable.

New SXGA+ screen wavy in some circumstances (with pics)

New SXGA+ screen wavy in some circumstances (with pics)

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