T23 2647-8RG - BoD

T2x/T3x series specific matters only
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Speeder.dk
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T23 2647-8RG - BoD

#1 Post by Speeder.dk » Tue Sep 25, 2007 9:35 am

Hey

I know this is becoming a quite common topic in the forum, but I have read the previous posts, and done what could be done. Still nothing happens when i boot my T23 ...
I have stripped it down totally several times, checked loose parts on mobo, and checked connectors, and checked inverter card ... Everything seems to be as it should ?

When i boot my laptop, nothing happens on screen, HD doesn't do anything, the only button that is lit is the power button (and the charging button)... I tried with and w/o the battery in...

Still nothing works... I thought of resoldering some stuff as you guys mention, but haven't got the equipment / money to buy them...

Maybe someone in Denmark would repair it for me :P ? (since I live there...)

/Anders
X61s 7669-27G, L7300 C2D 1,4GHz, 4GB DDR2 RAM, X3100, 500GB@7200RPM, 2x4cells+8Cell, UltraBase, Xubuntu 14.04
T22 26474EG - 512MB Ram, 900MHz
370C 9545-T75
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T23, T41, T60 and R30.

Robbyrobot
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#2 Post by Robbyrobot » Tue Sep 25, 2007 12:43 pm

When i boot my laptop, nothing happens on screen, HD doesn't do anything, the only button that is lit is the power button (and the charging button)... I tried with and w/o the battery in...
Up to now, the consensus seems to be that the T23 is not affected by the BoD symptoms, and your description isn't detailed enough to tell whether you may have such a case.

The BoD Thinkpads I have, and have personally experienced, were/were T21 and T22 models. The symptoms were that the computer would - suddenly and for no apparent reason - cease to boot when the "on" button was pushed, and instead the LEDs for the HDD and power would flicker briefly (less than 1 sec). Often there would also be a soft "plop" noise when the "on" button was pushed. The computer would give no further response.

When the battery and AC adapter were removed and the computer left without power for a period of several days to several weeks, it might boot the next time the AC adapter was inserted and the "on" button pushed. If it did, this behavior (computer starts normally when switched on) would often continue for a week to ten days. Then, again for no apparent reason, the computer would again stop booting and the above symptoms recurred.

The cause of this problem is presently unknown, although it appears to be related to some problem with one or more capacitors on the mainboard, and therefore cannot be "fixed". The often-made suggestion to replace the mainboard gives a false sense of security, since unless the root cause is known, a "new" (used) mainboard can also develop the problem.

All that being said, the T23 doesn't appear to be affected and if you could provide a more detailed explanation of your difficulty, it might be possible to locate a remedy.

Speeder.dk
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#3 Post by Speeder.dk » Wed Sep 26, 2007 1:07 pm

Sry about that... Was not quite sure of what you needed to know...

When I got this T23 from the previous owner, I was told that it didn't work and I could have it for free. First time I did was to remove the battery and boot from AC, and yay, it worked... After two weeks of use the laptop sometimes didn't turn on the screen when I started it, LEDs were lit and so on, but nothing happens on the screen? Sometimes it helped booting only from battery, other times only from AC...
I disassembled it down to the mobo and checks connectors and loose components - everything seems ok... New thermal paste and assemble again. Still did not help...
Short after it never turned on the screen when booting - and that's where I am now... I checked if the inverter card was loose, but that did not help either...

I tried booting without RAM, HD, wireless and ethernet - still doesn't work ...

Tell me what else you need to know :)

/Anders
X61s 7669-27G, L7300 C2D 1,4GHz, 4GB DDR2 RAM, X3100, 500GB@7200RPM, 2x4cells+8Cell, UltraBase, Xubuntu 14.04
T22 26474EG - 512MB Ram, 900MHz
370C 9545-T75
Previous:
T23, T41, T60 and R30.

rkawakami
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#4 Post by rkawakami » Wed Sep 26, 2007 1:32 pm

Try my "Torque Assisted Boot" procedure (should get that trademarked, huh?):

http://forum.thinkpads.com/viewtopic.ph ... 956#274956

Sounds like the typical broken connection on the motherboard. Could be any number of components.

edit: Just noticed your type number. If the wireless card you removed is NOT a MiniPCI card, then also try removing the MiniPCI modem card. Those things can stop a system cold if/when they go bad.
Ray Kawakami
X22 X24 X31 X41 X41T X60 X60s X61 X61s X200 X200s X300 X301 Z60m Z61t Z61p 560 560Z 600 600E 600X T21 T22 T23 T41 T60p T410 T420 T520 W500 W520 R50 A21p A22p A31 A31p
NOTE: All links to PC-Doctor software hosted by me are dead. Files removed 8/28/12 by manufacturer's demand.

Speeder.dk
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#5 Post by Speeder.dk » Wed Sep 26, 2007 2:04 pm

Right you are Ray ... Originally there was a MiniPCI Modem and a Ethernet daughter card ... The modem was later swapped out with a 2200bg MiniPCI card ...
But as I posted earlier , i did try booting without wireless , ram , hd and ethernet. ...

But I'll try your TAB procedure now :D (like that name:p)

/Anders
X61s 7669-27G, L7300 C2D 1,4GHz, 4GB DDR2 RAM, X3100, 500GB@7200RPM, 2x4cells+8Cell, UltraBase, Xubuntu 14.04
T22 26474EG - 512MB Ram, 900MHz
370C 9545-T75
Previous:
T23, T41, T60 and R30.

Speeder.dk
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#6 Post by Speeder.dk » Wed Sep 26, 2007 2:20 pm

WTF ... It works ! ... Haha, you should have seen my face when it showed the IBM logo while I sat there pushing on all kinds of places on my T23 ...
But as it says in the post you sent - this isn't a permanent solution ... I have to solder some stuff now right ?

( I only have one of those normal big soldering irons - so I need to buy a ~25w iron ? ... )

Thanks!

/Anders
X61s 7669-27G, L7300 C2D 1,4GHz, 4GB DDR2 RAM, X3100, 500GB@7200RPM, 2x4cells+8Cell, UltraBase, Xubuntu 14.04
T22 26474EG - 512MB Ram, 900MHz
370C 9545-T75
Previous:
T23, T41, T60 and R30.

rkawakami
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#7 Post by rkawakami » Wed Sep 26, 2007 3:12 pm

Ah, another one lives again! :) You might have to change your .sig from "Nearly dead" to "Almost alive".

Right on the soldering comment. Maybe this post of mine will help:

http://forum.thinkpads.com/viewtopic.php?t=40648

I had a T23 that would sometimes boot fine then freeze or it would show no signs of powering up, besides a constantly spinning fan. No video, no beeps, nothing. I had found a crystal that was detached from the motherboard. It is located on the top side of the motherboard, just below the area where the trackpoint buttons are. Your problem could be that or it might simply be the usual two inductors on the bottom side of the motherboard. In either case, a small, 25 watt or so soldering iron would be best. Something that has the finest pointed tip since you will be working with small leads or in tight spots.

edit: BTW, if you have not already seen it, this thread has some pictures and information about the T23 motherboard:

http://forum.thinkpads.com/viewtopic.php?t=37956
Ray Kawakami
X22 X24 X31 X41 X41T X60 X60s X61 X61s X200 X200s X300 X301 Z60m Z61t Z61p 560 560Z 600 600E 600X T21 T22 T23 T41 T60p T410 T420 T520 W500 W520 R50 A21p A22p A31 A31p
NOTE: All links to PC-Doctor software hosted by me are dead. Files removed 8/28/12 by manufacturer's demand.

Speeder.dk
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#8 Post by Speeder.dk » Thu Sep 27, 2007 8:42 am

Sweet! ... I'll report back when I've made progress - First of all I need that soldering stuff :) ...

Thx for the links ...

- Just edited my profile as you said :P

/Anders
X61s 7669-27G, L7300 C2D 1,4GHz, 4GB DDR2 RAM, X3100, 500GB@7200RPM, 2x4cells+8Cell, UltraBase, Xubuntu 14.04
T22 26474EG - 512MB Ram, 900MHz
370C 9545-T75
Previous:
T23, T41, T60 and R30.

Speeder.dk
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#9 Post by Speeder.dk » Fri Sep 28, 2007 7:05 am

A friend of mine has an 15w soldering iron... Will that do?

/Anders
X61s 7669-27G, L7300 C2D 1,4GHz, 4GB DDR2 RAM, X3100, 500GB@7200RPM, 2x4cells+8Cell, UltraBase, Xubuntu 14.04
T22 26474EG - 512MB Ram, 900MHz
370C 9545-T75
Previous:
T23, T41, T60 and R30.

rkawakami
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#10 Post by rkawakami » Fri Sep 28, 2007 11:38 am

That might work although it will take a longer amount of time you need to hold the soldering iron tip against whatever you are soldering. The danger this involves is that you are allowing more heat to spread into/along the part. Larger junctions will require additional time to get to the proper temperature for the solder to melt. I would still recommend a 25 watt iron over the 15. Also, the tip needs to be as thin and pointed as possible. One that is about 2 or 3 mm in diameter before it finally sharpens to a point will be perfect. Larger diameter tips can still be used but that makes it tougher to get into some of the crowded places of the board.
Ray Kawakami
X22 X24 X31 X41 X41T X60 X60s X61 X61s X200 X200s X300 X301 Z60m Z61t Z61p 560 560Z 600 600E 600X T21 T22 T23 T41 T60p T410 T420 T520 W500 W520 R50 A21p A22p A31 A31p
NOTE: All links to PC-Doctor software hosted by me are dead. Files removed 8/28/12 by manufacturer's demand.

Speeder.dk
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#11 Post by Speeder.dk » Fri Sep 28, 2007 11:46 am

Thanks ... I've been soldering Y4 and Y6 for at least an hour now - still it only boots when putting pressure on Y6 ...
I looked at Y1 , and it seemed like it had a crack in the soldering, so fixed that one as well...

Funny thing is that it doesn't really matter where I put pressure on now - as long as it is close to the HD ... E.g. pushing the HD connector while booting works ...

? Is there more components that needs to be fixed then :S ?

/Anders
X61s 7669-27G, L7300 C2D 1,4GHz, 4GB DDR2 RAM, X3100, 500GB@7200RPM, 2x4cells+8Cell, UltraBase, Xubuntu 14.04
T22 26474EG - 512MB Ram, 900MHz
370C 9545-T75
Previous:
T23, T41, T60 and R30.

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#12 Post by rkawakami » Fri Sep 28, 2007 12:16 pm

The only confirmed fixed I've done on the T23 motherboard relating to a disconnected crystal is for Y6. Both of the legs on the HD connector side had cracks in the solder. The system showed a similar problem for intermittent booting, as well as for freezing in Windows and PC Doctor tests. If all of them look fine and continued pressing around the HD connector seems to still work, then it's possible that the Intel 82801CAM (I/O Controller Hub) has become part of the problem. It's the huge BGA package just above Y6. Fixing that would require the same sort of hot-air gun approach that some people have done with T4x video chips.

Before getting that far, look around the back side of the motherboard at the two rows of pins for the HD connector. It's only one of a couple of parts which still use through-hole mounting on the board. Make sure each pin of the connector is firmly soldered. After that, check some of the larger surface mount components such as C700 (to the left of Y4).
Ray Kawakami
X22 X24 X31 X41 X41T X60 X60s X61 X61s X200 X200s X300 X301 Z60m Z61t Z61p 560 560Z 600 600E 600X T21 T22 T23 T41 T60p T410 T420 T520 W500 W520 R50 A21p A22p A31 A31p
NOTE: All links to PC-Doctor software hosted by me are dead. Files removed 8/28/12 by manufacturer's demand.

Speeder.dk
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#13 Post by Speeder.dk » Fri Sep 28, 2007 3:45 pm

Uhm... Well... Now it won't start the screen at all :/ ... Even when I put pressure on the usual places , it still won't turn the backlight on in the screen...
I tried to put more soldering tin on the places I've been soldering - I have tried removing most of the tin ... Neither works ...
Heh :p ... Dunno if it's my fault , but I guess it is :s
X61s 7669-27G, L7300 C2D 1,4GHz, 4GB DDR2 RAM, X3100, 500GB@7200RPM, 2x4cells+8Cell, UltraBase, Xubuntu 14.04
T22 26474EG - 512MB Ram, 900MHz
370C 9545-T75
Previous:
T23, T41, T60 and R30.

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