Thinkpads Forum

Posted: **Tue Nov 29, 2011 3:41 am**

Hey everyone. Noob here trying to research on upgrading my laptop's LCD, but having trouble finding information.

A while ago I bought a used 15.4" T61 6459-CTO that apparently has a WXGA since the resolution is limited to 1280x800. It's been fine for a while, but now the lower resolution is starting to feel constraining. I decided to look into swapping out the LCD, checked IBM/Lenovo's website about it, and saw that my machine type can support both WSXGA+ and WUXGA, but each one as well as the listing for WXGA has a different set of 3 character codes next to them (i.e. DKx, 48x, 5Bx, etc) and I haven't been able to figure out what those stand for. Do those indicated some kind of hardware that would restrict my options or do they indicate something benign like a production batch ID?

WXGA
WSXGA+
WUXGA

Is there anything else I need to look at for compatibility? Aside from the LCD panel itself, what additional parts or other concerns should I be looking at?

Any information would be appreciated and thanks in advance.

Posted: **Tue Nov 29, 2011 3:51 am**

And I just saw the sticky LCD thread...

...Hopefully I find what I need there, but please respond if you can...

Posted: **Tue Nov 29, 2011 4:46 am**

thinkbui wrote:..., and saw that my machine type can support both WSXGA+ and WUXGA, but each one as well as the listing for WXGA has a different set of 3 character codes next to them (i.e. DKx, 48x, 5Bx, etc) and I haven't been able to figure out what those stand for. Do those indicated some kind of hardware that would restrict my options or do they indicate something benign like a production batch ID?

These "three character codes" just define which specific sub machine type was usually equipped with the given display panel. According to my not so humble experience this can be safely neglected.

thinkbui wrote:Is there anything else I need to look at for compatibility? Aside from the LCD panel itself, what additional parts or other concerns should I be looking at?

The display inverter might possibly have a different FRU number for the higher resolution panels due to varying power requirements, so this might be worth cross checking.

Also take note of the different DPI values for each of the mentioned resolutions:

Code: Select all

WXGA    15,4     16/10  1280   800    98
WSXGA+  15,4     16/10  1680   1050   128,65
UXGA    15       4/3    1600   1200   133,33
WUXGA+  15,4     16/10  1920   1200   147,02

(taken from http://www.thinkpad-wiki.org/Zoom/DPI_Einstellungen)

Depending on your eyes' visual capabilities, a step up from the WXGA 98 DPI to a whopping WUXGA+ 147 DPI might already be a step too far. I tried, and found the WUXGA+ resolution already far too fine grained and thus uncomfortable for my aging eyes, while WSXGA+ with 128 DPI has proven to be just right. The T60 4:3 15" UXGA 133 DPI resolution which i added for comparison purposes and which i use on my wonderful T61+ (see my signature) has proven to be just perfect, though.

Posted: **Tue Nov 29, 2011 11:50 am**

You can just swap the panel, the same LCD cable and inverter will work with any resolution panel. You should use a Lenovo panel since proper EDID information (panel firmware) is required to set the resolution.

Posted: **Tue Nov 29, 2011 3:21 pm**

I will also chime in and say WSXGA+ is Just Right for the 15.4" screen size. Makes using my girlfriend's MacBook Pro with its WXGA+ feels ridiculous now... other problem being that docking the T61p and using my old WUXGA 23" Apple Cinema Display as a secondary screen doesn't work too hot either as the DPI is so different! I feel like I have to move back and forth in my chair when dragging windows across. Not fun.

Hmm, can anyone recommend off the top of their heads a quality external display with a similar DPI to the WSXGA+ display in the T61p?

Gotta praise the ol' T61p for being able to play two full-screen'd HD x.264 movies at the same time, one on the internal display and one on the external...

Posted: **Tue Nov 29, 2011 4:51 pm**

Thanks for the info guys. I guess I'll start looking at budgeting for this.

rumbero, that's a good point about DPI. I'm pretty sure my previous T61 had a 14.1" WXGA+ before the thing crapped out on me (long story) and I bought the laptop I have now, so it probably would be a safe bet to get a WSXGA+ since I was already comfortable with 120 DPI, but given the experiences people here have, how different does WUXGA look when set at 1680x1050 compared to WSXGA+ or when both are set to any other resolution at the same time like, say, 1440x900?

Out of curiosity, where would I need to worry about LCD incompatibility? I've heard that some people have ruined their T60/T61's trying to upgrade when their machines couldn't handle the higher resolution. Does it have to do with just the machines with type numbers Lenovo's pages say can only support so much?

Posted: **Tue Nov 29, 2011 5:36 pm**

I have some wsxga+ complete lid assemblies if your interested. Swapping lids is a much easier job in my opinion. As for the wuxga screens, I installed one on my t61p, just because I was curious mostly, they are nice, but other then bragging rights and the feeling of knowing your not losing any pixels when watching 1080p hd movies, there really is no increased enjoyment to justify the cost... in my opinion, but some people want the best at any cost, while others want the most from every dollar. In my opinion, the wsxga is the way to go.

Posted: **Tue Nov 29, 2011 5:36 pm**

thinkbui wrote:how different does WUXGA look when set at 1680x1050 compared to WSXGA+ or when both are set to any other resolution at the same time like, say, 1440x900?

I tried out to operate a WUXGA+ screen with WSXGA+ resolution, but was not satisfied as the output appeared to be slightly blurred. I guess with LCD's it is best to run them at their native resolution for best results.

Posted: **Tue Nov 29, 2011 6:36 pm**

rumbero wrote: I tried out to operate a WUXGA+ screen with WSXGA+ resolution, but was not satisfied as the output appeared to be slightly blurred. I guess with LCD's it is best to run them at their native resolution for best results.

I agree. Running a lower resolution is the easiest way to deal with tiny fonts/icons, but for someone who really enjoys the quality enough to investigate to this level, you're probably not going to be happy running a 1920x1200 screen at 1680x1050, you'd be better running it in native resolution then adjusting the windows settings to make desktop and font items look bigger, but if you're going to use it with a lower external monitor, then you might want to setup seperate desktops in windows, so you can customize each to match that monitor.

Posted: **Wed Nov 30, 2011 2:50 pm**

thinkbui wrote:I've heard that some people have ruined their T60/T61's trying to upgrade when their machines couldn't handle the higher resolution

I've put a WUXGA screen from a T61p to an Intel based T61 some weeks ago and it rocks! It was quite easy as well. Personally I really really like WUXGA and have now trouble using lower resolutions in my other TPs or desktops

Which OS are you planning to use? Win7 is pretty good scaling fonts and icons so if you find them too bee to tiny you can still re-size them easily.

My two cents...

Posted: **Wed Nov 30, 2011 5:12 pm**

People who wreck their T60/T61 by just upgrading their LCD, don't know what they are doing.
It's a straight swap!

Posted: **Wed Nov 30, 2011 6:25 pm**

RealBlackStuff wrote:People who wreck their T60/T61 by just upgrading their LCD, don't know what they are doing.
It's a straight swap!

I'm starting to get that impression. I only heard the stories in one place and it looked like it was 1 or 2 people flying blind. Everything I read on Lenovo's technical pages only backs up what everyone here is saying.

Tasurinchi wrote:I've put a WUXGA screen from a T61p to an Intel based T61 some weeks ago and it rocks! It was quite easy as well. Personally I really really like WUXGA and have now trouble using lower resolutions in my other TPs or desktops

Which OS are you planning to use? Win7 is pretty good scaling fonts and icons so if you find them too bee to tiny you can still re-size them easily.

My two cents...

I already have Win XP Pro installed, so I'm probably going to stay with that. I did try XP Pro x64 to get the extra 1GB of RAM supported, but I gave up after running into too many driver headaches. Eventually I might go up to Win7, but I'm holding off on that for now. Icons I'm not as concerned about, but I suppose I could increase the font size in the Control Panel if that was an issue.

rumbero wrote: I tried out to operate a WUXGA+ screen with WSXGA+ resolution, but was not satisfied as the output appeared to be slightly blurred. I guess with LCD's it is best to run them at their native resolution for best results.

TuuS wrote:I agree. Running a lower resolution is the easiest way to deal with tiny fonts/icons, but for someone who really enjoys the quality enough to investigate to this level, you're probably not going to be happy running a 1920x1200 screen at 1680x1050, you'd be better running it in native resolution then adjusting the windows settings to make desktop and font items look bigger, but if you're going to use it with a lower external monitor, then you might want to setup seperate desktops in windows, so you can customize each to match that monitor.

When people say "grainy" or "blurry", do they mean aliasing?

How do graphics look at 1920x1200? I may not be watching a lot of HD videos on my laptop, but I certainly look at a lot of high resolution images.

And yeah I was thinking of replacing the lid as a unit first since I haven't been terribly successful in removing Thinkpad bezels without damaging them in the past. I haven't decided on which to upgrade to yet, but if I go for WSXGA+, how much would you be asking for one of yours, TuuS?

Posted: **Thu Dec 01, 2011 6:57 am**

thinkbui wrote:When people say "grainy" or "blurry", do they mean aliasing?

"Aliasing" only refers to font rendering, i guess. But when i say "blurred" i actually mean the overall display quality of the screen output. The sharpness of all display items is blurred, regardless of which type of graphical element. This includes everything shown on screen, including pictures. That's why i consider it best to run a screen at its native resolution only.

Posted: **Thu Dec 01, 2011 7:50 am**

thinkbui wrote:How do graphics look at 1920x1200?

They look great!

I have some pics in this thread here:click me, while I took them to check the brightness of the panel, it may give you a general idea.

Posted: **Fri Dec 02, 2011 3:23 pm**

I just ordered this one:

http://www.notebook-displaysdirekt.de/L ... hirm.shtml

for my T61p. (An upgrade for my current 1680x1040 panel).

I'll keep you informed of what happens, and how it goes.

Posted: **Fri Dec 02, 2011 3:59 pm**

haritak wrote:I just ordered this one:

I looked at that site. There's an old expression "It's Greek to me!" Then I observed that you're in Greece.

Anxious to hear how things work out.

Art

Posted: **Fri Dec 02, 2011 11:22 pm**

that site is actually German...

Posted: **Sat Dec 03, 2011 1:05 am**

JeffCullen wrote:that site is actually German...

I think he was just saying it was funny that he thought of the old saying "it's all Greek to me" right before noticing haritak is from Greece.

haritak wrote:I just ordered this one:

http://www.notebook-displaysdirekt.de/L ... hirm.shtml

for my T61p. (An upgrade for my current 1680x1040 panel).

I'll keep you informed of what happens, and how it goes.

Excellent. Thanks.

I'm leaning towards WUXGA right now, but one of the issues I'm running into is that the only genuine OEM panels I'm finding right now are around $200, which is outside my budget, so I've been looking at 3rd party on eBay until one comes along for less. One seller, screenaid, has a bunch that he/she assures me has all the firmware updated and ready for swapping it in (though not guaranteed by the seller to work in my case since it is an upgrade attempt). Anyone bought from this seller before?

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?Vi ... 895wt_1187

Posted: **Sat Dec 03, 2011 1:14 am**

thinkbui wrote: I think he was just saying it was funny that he thought of the old saying "it's all Greek to me" right before noticing haritak is from Greece.

Correct!

Anybody: would that eBay screen work on a "plain" (non-P) T61?

Art

Posted: **Sat Dec 03, 2011 2:32 am**

ArtShapiro wrote:I looked at that site. There's an old expression "It's Greek to me!" Then I observed that you're in Greece.

Anxious to hear how things work out.

Art

Well, I am quite confident I'm gone make it!

(I don't know how this sounds from a greek person these days

)

Despite the german guy calling me back *within half an hour* of my order and explaining to me for at least 10 minutes that I may encoder incompatibilities!
(please note that I placed my order on the internet at 20.00 local time which means 19.00 at Germany - on a FRIDAY! )
I must admit I was shocked by their customer support.
First ordered was cancelled, as advised by them, but then when I looked further and build up some confidence, I reordered (a different panel I must admit).

If everything works out well, I will inform you.
If not, I will be selling a brand new panel half price...

So, either way you will know.

Yannis

PS: I wouldn't expect the T61 to differ on the screen parts from T61p. I believe they use the same hardware there.

Posted: **Sat Dec 03, 2011 3:49 am**

haritak wrote:PS: I wouldn't expect the T61 to differ on the screen parts from T61p. I believe they use the same hardware there.

Based on everything I've seen so far, I think that's right. The three links to Lenovo's support pages in my original post seems to say that the hardware in the entire lid assembly (apart from maybe an extra WAN antenna and a couple of stickers) is the same.

Though I do hear that T61p's have slightly better video cards. Is that true? What are the other known differences between T6x's and T6xp's?

Also the eBay sellers screenaid and laptopz-outlet seem to be the same person or people. Has anyone bought from either?

Posted: **Sat Dec 03, 2011 9:45 am**

thinkbui wrote:Based on everything I've seen so far, I think that's right.

Remember my post above. I have a T61 with a T61p WUXGA screen, so yes, it works!

Posted: **Sat Dec 03, 2011 1:37 pm**

Guess I thought that'd be particularly funny if the website were actually in Greek :P

Posted: **Sat Dec 10, 2011 12:50 am**

But it is refreshing to see a German and a Greek doing business with each other given how tense Eurozone was before today.

Posted: **Sat Dec 10, 2011 1:59 am**

Though I do hear that T61p's have slightly better video cards. Is that true? What are the other known differences between T6x's and T6xp's?

You are exactly right. The T60p and T61p are the same *as the non "p" counterpart* except for the Video and the "p" series offers some higher end options for screens and cpu on standard configuration, but most of the other options could be special ordered in a non-p model.

The screens are identical, only the insert on the bezel indicates either T61 or T61p

*edit to clarify*

Posted: **Wed Dec 14, 2011 2:14 am**

Hmm, can anyone recommend off the top of their heads a quality external display with a similar DPI to the WSXGA+ display in the T61p?

The lenovo l220x is a neat 22" with an S-PVA panel and a small dot pitch, in fact its resolution is 1920x1200 (uncommon for a 22"). Still its DPI is about .25 compared to the .20 of the SWXGA+ 15,4". It's very expensive but there are a few on sale on eBay.

Hey everyone. Noob here trying to research on upgrading my laptop's LCD, but having trouble finding information.

I regret having switched from 1280x800 to 1680x1050 when migrating from the old T60 to my current T61: my eyes hurt and I got different DPIs than on the external monitor.

Posted: **Wed Dec 14, 2011 8:31 am**

I regret having switched from 1280x800 to 1680x1050 when migrating from the old T60 to my current T61: my eyes hurt and I got different DPIs than on the external monitor.

If you want to switch back to a 1280x800, I have a complete lid assembly, PM me if your interested. Additionally, your display is worth more in trade, if you're interested in swapping I could add something to the deal.

Posted: **Thu Dec 15, 2011 3:03 am**

enosdan wrote:The lenovo l220x is a neat 22" with an S-PVA panel and a small dot pitch, in fact its resolution is 1920x1200 (uncommon for a 22"). Still its DPI is about .25 compared to the .20 of the SWXGA+ 15,4". It's very expensive but there are a few on sale on eBay.

Thanks for the reco. Doesn't seem like enough of an "upgrade" compared to the 23" 1920x1200 Apple Cinema Displays I have already.

Posted: **Thu Dec 15, 2011 7:01 am**

I have a L220x (but no WSXGA+ display), and it is a very nice screen, great viewing angles and bright (which is as much as I judge my computer screens) - I got mine for 180CAD refurbished, and it was a great deal, however if you already have monitors, you may just have to adapt to the diffrent DPIs

.

Posted: **Thu Dec 15, 2011 11:14 am**

JeffCullen wrote:Hmm, can anyone recommend off the top of their heads a quality external display with a similar DPI to the WSXGA+ display in the T61p?

Your 23" Apple Cinema is 98.44 DPI. Your T61p is 128.65 DPI. The closest desktop monitor would be the IBM T210, with 20.8" 2048x1536 and 123 DPI, but it was discontinued long ago. For currently available monitors, the highest DPI is 27" 2560x1440 with 108.79 DPI (e.g. the Dell U2711), but to get this res you need dual-link DVI or DisplayPort.

I hate huge discrepancies in DPI as well, and so I almost never hook up laptops to external monitors.

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