Thinkpads Forum

Will the T61 work with PC2-6400 DDR-800 memory? I plan to upgrade this T61 that I acquired today to the T9300. They are all 800mhz bus processors. I currently have 667mhz memory. I have 3GB in right now. I figure I may buy 4GB 2GB X 2 so I should get the max speed the T61 will take. Also ACHI on the SATA HDD instead of compatability mode? I installed Windows 7 and realized I didn't go through the Bios before install. This unit came with the Intel 4965agn wifi card. I ordered a 4965agn thinking it wouldn't already come with a non dual band NIC card without N capability. It came with a 1280x800 panel and a 4 cell battery with only 40 cycles.

The T61 is a very nice Thinkpad. It was the only other older T series Thinkpad that I wanted to add to my collection. I am going to flash the Middleton bios mod shortly. I am going to keep this T61 for the long haul so I am probably going to add a SSD drive as well. I put on Windows 7 Premium 64 Bit.

I avoided the discrete graphics that was suggested by forum members.

Anything I should be aware of on the T61 or things I should modify or add to this machine?

CPU-Z says my motherboard is model 7659W8P. Is this a Mermon or Penryn board? The manufacture date is 8/2007 so I suspect it's a Mermon board. Does it make a difference with the Middleton Bios?

It's indeed a Merom board, Penryn wasn't shipped to OEMs until late January 2008. It won't matter with the Middleton BIOS though.

All T61s are limited to a maximum RAM speed of 667 MHz. You can install 800 MHz chips (in many cases they are actually cheaper and better than 667 MHz chips) and they'll throttle back to the speed supported by the system.

I agree, the T61 is a nice machine. I've got two T61p 15.4" WS and despite having my T420, I can't give up using them because of the screens.

I am thinking 4GB of ram, the T9300 processor and a 128GB SSD. Is there anything else I should add to the T61? I am not really interested in a hi res LCD because my eyes are not that good anymore. I like hi res for really big screens. I am typing on a 40" IPS LED 1080P right now.

i should note the T61 was upgraded to a Intel Wireless WiFi Link 4965AGN PCIe Mini Card. Under the laptop the T61 listed a wireless G card.

Hans Gruber wrote:I am thinking 4GB of ram, the T9300 processor and a 128GB SSD. Is there anything else I should add to the T61?

Personally, I'd just go for a larger SSD since they 256GB drives are usually notably faster than their 128GB siblings while not being all that more money, but that's about it. And definitely install the OS in the AHCI mode.

I went in the bios I saw compatibility mode and said to myself, I can't have that. Reinstalled the OS. I probably will get a 250/256GB drive. I have one for my gaming desktop. This T61 is a long term backup machine. I will probably get the T9300 first and the ram or SSD after. Do these T61 come with 4 cell batteries mostly or are they usually 6 cell?

Hans Gruber wrote: Do these T61 come with 4 cell batteries mostly or are they usually 6 cell?

The choices for WS T61/R61 - carried into R400/T400 lineup - were 4, 6, 7 and 9-cell options. Your current 4-cell is not likely to yield great battery life, although it's the only one that sits flush in the chassis and therefore the best looking - IMO - option...

It's an interesting machine. I always wanted A T6x series thinkpad. The ram beneath the palmrest. Kind of an unconventional way to remove the keyboard. The vertical USB ports.

The T400/500 is fairly similar to the T61, at least aesthetically. Same keyboard layout, almost the same palm rest as well (slightly larger touchpad on 400/500). DDR3, 1066 FSB, LED screens, SATA Ultrabay, native SATA-II, and ATI instead of nVidia as the discrete GPU provider are major changes from the T61.

theterminator93 wrote:The T400/500 is fairly similar to the T61, at least aesthetically.

Irreversibly ugly IMO...

Same keyboard layout, almost the same palm rest as well (slightly larger touchpad on 400/500). DDR3, 1066 FSB, LED screens, SATA Ultrabay, native SATA-II, and ATI instead of nVidia as the discrete GPU provider are major changes from the T61.

IDK...I always was a bit "meh" about the *00 generation. I've beta tested the W500 before it was officially released and liked it a lot - apart from the junk WUXGA LCD courtesy of Samsung - as a daily driver, but still found it challenged looks-wise. Bought a brand new T400 with all the toys directly from Lenovo and sold it after less than three weeks.

There is something about *61 generation that got lost in the transition to *00 machines - IMO - but I can't put my finger on what exactly that was. Other than that, they are fine systems.

Well let's see here. I've got about 20 14" T61s surrounding me right now and half a dozen T400s. What's different about them...

1) First use of the Lenovo logo on the LCD lid, lower left. T61: No Lenovo logo.
2) "ThinkPad" logo that doesn't fit the old "IBM ThinkPad" or "ThinkPad T-series" footprint. Angle of logo on T400 is greater (looks like a 45 compared to the usual 37).
3) Four screws/covers along the base of the LCD bezel. T61 has three.
4) Slightly larger trackpad area to match the width of the buttons. Buttons unchanged.
5) "UltraConnect" branding on LCD bezel under the ThinkLight on the T400.
6) 45 degree bevel on the right underside of the T400 - not present on T61. UltraBay devices are beveled as well (similar to the T4x line), as is the HDD slot cover. T6x UltraBay devices and HDD cover are flat.
7) Microphone slots in LCD bezel to the top right of the ribbon cable on the T400; T61 down by the right touchpad button.
8) "lenovo" logo on indicator LED strip on LCD bezel is to the right of the LEDs on the T400; T61 it's to the left of the T61 designation.

I've got a whole slew of photos with them side-by-side:

Top view: http://i60.photobucket.com/albums/h30/t ... hujyxr.jpg
Bottom view: http://i60.photobucket.com/albums/h30/t ... th9f5u.jpg
Back view: http://i60.photobucket.com/albums/h30/t ... gaav6w.jpg
Right side: http://i60.photobucket.com/albums/h30/t ... orsjz4.jpg
Left side: http://i60.photobucket.com/albums/h30/t ... rixyud.jpg
Front: http://i60.photobucket.com/albums/h30/t ... qzz72m.jpg
Top down: http://i60.photobucket.com/albums/h30/t ... n0f5xe.jpg
User perspective: http://i60.photobucket.com/albums/h30/t ... taiu5u.jpg



That's all I can find... they're otherwise identical to my eyes. They could've practically gotten away with calling it a T62.

I use a T61 and a T420 side by side.

The T61 advantages:

• Way better screen (bigger, less movie-shaped, clearer, and fills the physical space it's given...vs. T420 with its big blank bezel at bottom where they decided to not put in a 16:10 screen despite giving you a 16:10 case)
• Nicer keyboard (not so squishy, not as much effort needed to push keys)
• Nicer touchpad (feels smooth, easy to find edges of it by touch, small enough that it's easy to move all the way around in with less effort, vs. T420's bumpy surface that has no tactile edge, so forget about sliding along the right edge for scrolling, since you can't actually find the edge)
• Generally better port placement
• DVD drive doesn't accidentally pop open whenever you hold the machine
• F keys are where they've been for decades (vs. moving them all over one to the right on the T420), and insert key is where it should be
• Volume buttons are like real buttons, not creaky cheap flat things without tactile demarcation between up and down
• Indicator lights make sense (like a light for "suspended," vs. the T420 that you have to stare at for 5 seconds to see if the power light is in the midst of slowly fading in and out, ugh)
• Perhaps better speakers
• Protective clamshell lid keeps debris out when closed
• Minidock adds line-in port
• Just a pleasure to use!

The T420 advantages:

• Runs faster

So, I wish I could just stick with the T61. The T420 is disappointing in a lot of ways, but more future-ready, and at least has a normal keyboard (that and the T520 have the last ones!)

I thought the T41 had an even better-feeling keyboard than the T61...and, nice big ctrl & alt keys instead of annoying windows keys. And I still miss that 4:3 screen.

In addition to speed, there are a few things better on the T420 vs T61.

1. No snapping hinges like on the 14.1" 4:3 models or 15.4" widescreen models.
2. No snapping subframes like on 15.4" widescreen models
3. Better quality hinges (they can still get slightly loose, but not nearly as bad as some T61 hinges).
4. Webcam standard.
5. Much brighter thinklight.
6. In my experience, better fit and finish and less creaking. Plastics quality (palmrest) feels cheaper, and more prone to cracking, but is stiffer.
7. T61 Nvidia models defective with pre 08/08 models.

That being said, I still love my T61. Build quality seemed to vary a lot with these particular machines. I have seen some that are built nearly perfectly with no flex or creaking or variation in finish, while others have been the opposite... I believe this was also the time when Lenovo was switching their thinkpad manufacturing plant to a cheaper one that made dell inspirons. Maybe only during the T410 era did QC get more consistent.

The Lenovo System Update didn't update the fingerprint software or the Thinkpad bios. Are some of these normal updates not covered in the T61 update? On the T410 series, all of those updates are covered in the system update. Is this due to the T61 being an older model Thinkpad?

I was going to ask how I would know the Middleton bios flash worked. I had to do the .ISO disk instead of winflash because I have a 64 bit version of Windows 7. I left my computer on during the flashing process and rebooted after hearing a few beeps. I had bios 2.21 before the bios flash process and now have 2.29.

I got so frustrated with this small but free hard drive that came with this T61 because of it's 50mb read and write speeds that I ordered a 120GB SSD this morning.

I will write my musings and generic questions. Will I see a difference between 3GB of ram and 4GB of ram on a T61? I know it's only $20 but when you have a drawer full of DDR3 2GB sticks.

The screen doesn't go as bright on this 1280x800 screen as my T410 and T41s models. I do like this T61 though.

Hans Gruber wrote:I was going to ask how I would know the Middleton bios flash worked. I had to do the .ISO disk instead of winflash because I have a 64 bit version of Windows 7. I left my computer on during the flashing process and rebooted after hearing a few beeps. I had bios 2.21 before the bios flash process and now have 2.29.

Yep. It worked. Otherwise you'd be looking at a non-bootable brick.

I will write my musings and generic questions. Will I see a difference between 3GB of ram and 4GB of ram on a T61? I know it's only $20 but when you have a drawer full of DDR3 2GB sticks.

I don't see what DDR3 has to do with anything here since you can't use it on T61. If you're going to run a 64-bit OS I'd say 2x2GB is bare minimum.

The screen doesn't go as bright on this 1280x800 screen as my T410 and T41s models. I do like this T61 though.

Well, it's a CCFL-lit panel as opposed to the LED-lit ones used in T410/s...and the former were never all that bright to begin with.

George, I have probably close to 10 2gb sticks of DDR3 when I simply need one more stick of DDR2. That is what is frustrating, not to mention I have a couple of 1GB DDR2 sticks.

I am on the T43p and the colors and brightness are very similar to the T61.

Hans Gruber wrote:George, I have probably close to 10 2gb sticks of DDR3 when I simply need one more stick of DDR2. That is what is frustrating, not to mention I have a couple of 1GB DDR2 sticks.

LOL. Been there and done that...more times than I'd care to remember.

I am on the T43p and the colors and brightness are very similar to the T61.

There is a link somewhere on a bunch of default IBM/Lenovo monitor profiles. You may want to try and apply some of them. I'd say that the screen on the T43p has got to be better unless the CCFL is completely worn out.

The screen is good. Nothing is washed out it's just not as bright as the newer screens. The T43 looks very similar to the T61. The text and picture is sharp. I have the brightness turned up all they way.

It's just the idea of dumping money into the T61 with everything out of the order and sequence I had originally planned. The T9300 will probably be the last addition. The ram will probably come before the T9300. That extra 3MB of cache is probably more significant than the speed increase and it saves power like a SSD drive.

Why a T series CPU? Are you planning on doing anything intensive with the T61? If not, I'd recommend a P-Series CPU. They run a lot cooler have large caches and offer 95% of the performance of their T-Series counterparts. I am looking for a P8400 for my D630 to replace it's T7200. I think the T61 can handle a P9600.

Perhaps this will help:

http://ark.intel.com/products/family/79 ... essor#@All

Wouldn't a P-series processor require the 1066MHz FSB mod? This is a T61 and not a T400/500 we're talking about, after all.

Tmetka,
I am going off the T61 wiki list of compatible processors. http://t61.wikispaces.com
The T9300 is a Penryn processor. The processors you listed are a generation newer and 1066 fsb. If anybody else has used the P8400 processors in a T61 or any of the P series of Core 2 Duo, let me know if they work.

Hans Gruber wrote:If anybody else has used the P8400 processors in a T61 or any of the P series of Core 2 Duo, let me know if they work.

You can read Quadcore poem and find some ideas about installing 1066MHz penryns into T61. But this is hard way.

And yes - 1066MHz CPUs are not natively supported by 965 chipset on Thinkpad or Dell.

I put in a OCZ Trion 120GB drive. The Middleton bios seems to work well with SATA II speeds of 280mb read and 170MB write speeds.

Having troubles connecting to my 5ghz band. I have the Intel 4965AG wifi card. It doesn't want to connect when I put in the WPA2 key in for the 5ghz band. It shows up on my wifi network detection list. I have no problems connecting to the 2.4ghz band.

Anybody have suggestions? Windows 7 could not diagnose the connection problems.

Hans Gruber wrote:I put in a OCZ Trion 120GB drive. The Middleton bios seems to work well with SATA II speeds of 280mb read and 170MB write speeds.

So you're paying OCZ to be the beta tester of their first TLC offering? Good luck is all I'm going to say.

I have the Intel 4965AG wifi card. It doesn't want to connect when I put in the WPA2 key in for the 5ghz band. It shows up on my wifi network detection list. I have no problems connecting to the 2.4ghz band.

4965AG or 4965AGN? The former will not connect to a 5GHz band.

George it's (OCZ) Toshiba inside. It was $50 on newegg. I think it's similar to a Corsair SSD that I have. Very strong read speeds with weaker write speeds.

I forgot, I bought a 4965AGN for $3. I thought it already had a 4965AGN, It was a 4965AG. I will put in the 4965AGN. I should point out sees the 5Ghz band which is unusual. Went down to my work bench and pulled out the 4965AGN. Will install it now.

I planned ahead. The next project is the ram upgrade from 3GB to 4GB followed by the T9300 processor. I just ordered another tube of Arctic Silver 5.

This T61 is really a solid machine. I got a good one. It's the only 1280x800 screen I have in my Thinkpad collection.

Problem solved. When I first looked under the keyboard when I got this machine I saw 4965AG and saw the 3 MIMO wires and assumed it was an 4965AGN card. I am glad I ordered a 4965AGN card. 5ghz is now up and running.

This is a really clean T61 unit under the keyboard. There is no dust on anything.

Can I use 65w T410 power supplies with the T61?

Hans Gruber wrote:Can I use 65w T410 power supplies with the T61?

Yes, since yours is one with integrated graphics.

Hans Gruber wrote:Can I use 65w T410 power supplies with the T61?

Is that one supposed to be a significantly smaller than the included supply? I myself use a 90W supply off my old R61 for faster charging. By the way, does anyone know if the 65W supply will be sufficient for a T61 (Intel graphics) using the T9300 or even X9000?