Re 15.4" LCD's for T6x(p)'s - question relevant for LibreBoot

[DiagonalArg]

Hi all! I was overjoyed to find an intel integrated graphics T60, which I jumped on so I could experiment with libreboot. Sadly, I then took a longer look at the compatibility list (https://libreboot.org/docs/hcl/index.ht ... orted_list), and found that while the machine should work, no one has experimented enough to identify if any of the possible LCD's will work. The Samsung LTN154X3-L0A (15.4" 1280x800) that came with the machine is definitely a fail (well, my edid reports it as LTN154X3, and from the libreboot compatibility list, I assume it's the -L0A), and it seems the trouble there is the inverter. There are four other possible screens that may work, so what I'd like to know is if anyone has a clue whether the inverter for that Samsung is the same or different from the inverter for either/both of these (which I know have appeared on the T60p &T61p):

Samsung LTN154P2-L05 (42X4641 42T0329) (15.4" 1680x1050)
LG-Philips LP154W02-TL10 (13N7020 42T0423) (15.4" 1680x1050)
(I've got that latter on one machine. Any way to get linux or windows to identify the inverter without my having to open the machine?)

Also, would these screens work on a T60, and if so, does anyone know what kind of inverter they have?

LG-Philips LP154WU1-TLB1 (42T0361) (15.4" 1920x1200) (for T61p but it might work in T60. Unknown!)
Samsung LTN154U2-L05 (42T0408 42T0574) (15.4" 1920x1200) (for T61p but it might work in T60. Unknown!)

And finally, is any of this stuff still available?

Thanks! :^)

[rumbero]

Hi all! I was overjoyed to find an intel integrated graphics T61, which I jumped on so I could experiment with libreboot. Sadly, I then took a longer look at the compatibility list (https://libreboot.org/docs/hcl/index.ht ... orted_list), and found that while the machine should work, [..]

Have a look again at the compatibility list. The T61 is not supported at all, only the T60 is. Both machines may look similar from the outside but feature different chipsets and, last i heard, the one of the T61 is not supported, unfortunately.

No idea if it will ever be supported, but in my book this would be most desirable. Alas, there appears to be an unsurmountable documentation issue for the Santa Rosa chipset used on T61 machines.

[DiagonalArg]

... The T61 is not supported at all

That was a mistype, sorry ... fixed, above.

[RealBlackStuff]

All T60 (and T61) 15.4" screens use the same inverter 41W1338 made by Foxconn.
You can also use 13R1014/13R1015 made by Sumida.
And if you're stuck, you can also use these:
42T0078 / 42T0079 made by Hitachi, also has marking INVC753.
41W1012 / 39T5658 made by Hitachi, also has marking INVC753.

If you want a REALLY good screen, hunt around for a Sharp WUXGA (1920x1200) LQ154M1LW2A or LQ154M1LW02.
These are/were used in Dell laptops.
You'll need to cut off some brackets and remove the Dell inverter, but after that it's a drop-in replacement, using the same inverter(s).

[DiagonalArg]

@RealBlack... Well, that's bad news man, but it's good to have it clear.

And wow, you're really up on this stuff.

So am I right in understanding that those two WUXGA panels (LG-Philips & Samsung) will work on a T60, but that they also have the same inverter as the WSXGA+'s?

At one time I did look for that Sharp. The plan was to put it in a T500, but I couldn't find them on ebay - and I looked hard. They were advertised, but it wasn't the real thing. It might be a little overkill for the T60, but I suppose it depends on price - and I could fall back to putting it in the T500 if it didn't work. Do you know a source?

[Edit: oops. That Sharp uses the same Foxconn inverter, yes? So that wouldn't work, unless there's an alternative.]

Cheaper would be to try one of Sumida or Hitachi inverters. Should I look on ebay, or are there other sources you know of?

Thanks.

Edit#2: Oh, now I get your nic! Ya, I'm pretty partial to dark beers, myself.

[RealBlackStuff]

Like I said: All T60 (and T61) 15.4" screens use the same inverter...

Except for the 41W1338, I also used those same inverters for my 15" UXGA LED-mods, see http://theboardroom.info/led_mod.htm

Plenty of sources on eBay, easier than looking elsewhere.

[DiagonalArg]

Alright, thanks. Just trying to be sure.

I found sources of the Sumida & the first Hitachi on eBay, as you said (the Sumida being half the price). I also read your remarkable LED mod. Now I'm thinking that since what you do is remove the transformer from the inverter, the BIOS initialization of the LCD will be the same, whether it's CCFL or LED backlit. So probably your mod wouldn't apply to the libreboot question.

Still, I'll keep it in mind. I am attached to my T500s.

I'll report back here if I get any info from the libre- or core-boot people, and/or if my install works. It'll be a first for this 15.4" T60.

[DiagonalArg]

Ah, you're only doing that mod for the T60/p. Well. That is love!

[DiagonalArg]

I'm trying to get this conversation going here:
http://lists.gnu.org/archive/html/libre ... 00042.html

The T60 expert is apparently at a conference. Hopefully I'll get a response next week.

[RealBlackStuff]

From what I understand, your problem is your screen, NOT the inverter!

Provided these BoeHydis screens are accepted, my LED-mod should also work in Libreboot.
These models are available:
HV150UX1-100 and -101 (with CCFL), same LCD-cable connection and same inverter
HV150UX2-100 (with LED), reversed LCD-cable connection from above, same inverter as above (but modified).
Effectively they do the same.
The inverters used are also the same ones, except LED-screens don't need the transformer any more, so it gets removed.
These screens work on any T60/T61 and R60/R61 regardless whether they have ATI or Intel graphics.

Edit: they also work on nVidia T61/R61, and of course T601 FrankenPads.

[ajkula66]

I'm trying to get this conversation going here:

I'm not quite sure where you're going with all of this...but here's what I have to say:

1) It's the planar/chipset that is make or break for LibreBoot. My understanding is that you're in the clear here.

2) If you want to go with a higher resolution screen, make sure to get a LG Philips one, and not a Samsung. Although all of them will work OOTB presuming a genuine Lenovo-issued part, the latter are just...ugh. I haven't tried the aforementioned Sharp panel in a T60/p so I can't vouch whether it would require an EDID flash in order to work there. Nevertheless, it's by far the best 15.4" WUXGA LCD that I've ever encountered, have it in my custom RBS-built T500 and absolutely love it.

Hope this helps.

Happy upgrading.

[DiagonalArg]

From what I understand, your problem is your screen, NOT the inverter

@RBS, while I am trying to get this nailed down, and as you will see if you read the libreboot e-list post, a careful reading of the libreboot compatibility page (https://libreboot.org/docs/hcl/index.ht ... d_t60_list), where it says "It is unknown whether the 1680x1050 (15.4") and 1920x1200 (15.4") panels use a different inverter board than the 1280x800 panels", seems to indicate that it's the inverter. A discussion with @pehjota on #libreboot (Freenode) confirmed that my impression is correct, though he said that @fchmmr is the T60 expert. I too initially thought that the issue had to be the screen but so far am being led otherwise.

I haven't tried the aforementioned Sharp panel in a T60/p so I can't vouch whether it would require an EDID flash in order to work there. Nevertheless, it's by far the best 15.4" WUXGA LCD that I've ever encountered, have it in my custom RBS-built T500 and absolutely love it.

@ajkula - if I am changing the BIOS, then am I right in saying that the EDID flash would be unnecessary? This is a whitelist issue, isn't it? As for the Sharp, do you know of sources? I looked on ebay a couple of times, but by emailing the vendors I discerned that what I found there wasn't the real thing. (I do have a couple of T500's in addition to the T6x's.)

[RealBlackStuff]

I have answered: "It is unknown whether the 1680x1050 (15.4") and 1920x1200 (15.4") panels use a different inverter board than the 1280x800 panels".
So that is known now.
I can read, and almost everywhere it says: (P/N 42T0078 FRU 42T0079 or P/N 41W1338 recommended for the inverter board).
Which is what you have.
Which should settle any inverter dispute.

The apparent lack of experience with a number of screens is what's holding people back.
Either that or they have not updated their LCD lists.

I have no intention to use Libreboot, nor read all their related postings any further.

As for the Sharp screens, they work on 15.4" T6x/R6x (EDIT: and also on T500/R500) without changing ANYthing in BIOS or EDID.
I also did ajkula66's T500 (and a bunch of others) with (used) original ex-Dell screens from eBay.

[DiagonalArg]

@RBS - Yes, I've been very thankful for your help on the inverter issue. If one will work where others don't then I'll be golden. If my informants and reading are not right, and it's a screen issue rather than an inverter issue, then I am willing to do the work of swapping out screens from my other machines and seeing if I can get it to work; then I'll buy an extra screen. (If no one can clarify the issue at all, perhaps I'll just go with the 14.1" that we discussed via PM.)

I understand you do not intend to use libreboot or coreboot; I only posted in the advent someone else comes along with an interest.

Thanks for your wisdom on the EDID issue and that you've found Sharps by digging around for old Dell's on ebay. Perhaps that will come in handy.

[DiagonalArg]

So far what I have learned is that the problem is likely the inverter, specifically the settings that have to do with Pulse Width Modulation. This looks like something that may be correctable in software, rather than my needing to dig up a compatible inverter. Specifically the PWM frequency and duty cycle are set by the BIOS in a register which can be read using the inteltool available in the coreboot source. (More at the link I posted above.)

[ajkula66]

So far what I have learned is that the problem is likely the inverter

What problem are you referring to in the first place?

[DiagonalArg]

@ajukla - you've got to read the thread, man! It's just an update on the ongoing T60/libreboot story. Enjoy it only if you're interested!

[ajkula66]

@ajukla - you've got to read the thread, man!

I've read the linked thread and still can't figure what "problem" is supposed to be...

It's just an update on the ongoing T60/libreboot story. Enjoy it only if you're interested!

There are some members here - some of them unfortunately absent for quite a while now - who played a good deal with CB/LB but none of them was as mysterious as you. Not a good approach to getting answers from people who may not know much about CB/LB but have definitely forgotten more about TP hardware than anyone involved in your thread over there will ever know...

Your thread, your call.