Please give advice on purchasing a used IBM Thinkpad T60p in 2018

[wujstefan]

My T500 is still running fine and I like it. I'm not a frankenpad expert .

Well I do not feel a specialist neither. However, I have built ~20 frankenpads for me, family, friends and forum users here, and have my interest in T500 for around a year (thanks to jespen-meyer). I think that more than 100 T500s have flown through my hands. Pretty much for a non-IT, but I try to help local schools with their hardware. From what I have seen things like broken USB ports making a board freeze, failed graphic chips, dead mobos and burnt inverters are pretty common.

T500 is a very good system indeed. Not perfect, however, and has its typical issues not that different to those from T61 A well-built frankie keeps pace with both T500 and W500, with the biggest issue being expensive DDR2 RAM and bottlenecked graphics. T601 has a better build quality and superior screen - but that for a cost of being more outdated, and hence more expensive to upgrade.

How come Thinkpad4by3 uses a system with screen ratio 16:10?

[Thinkpad4by3]

Look at my signature. When I signed up 3 years ago, I held on to 4:3 like there was no tomorrow. I had a 2001FP and I wanted one of those QXGA medical monitors really badly. One day, I found a 1200p 24" Thinkvision monitor on the side of the road and I got it and I put it next to my 2001FP and I like it enough to get a second one. My 2001FP now resides with my Apple IIe. I actually prefer it because it gives a view for both the tool bar for photo editing and 3d modeling, gives a good picture for watching video, and to be honest, video editing on 4:3 just sucks. Having a nice wide clip editor is mandatory.

[jaspen-meyer]

...The one thing keeping from outright purchasing said laptop is that is it a good idea to purchase a T60p in 2018? I plan to use this as my daily laptop for libreoffice applications, watching 720p youtube, internet browsing, and I might change OS to Linux and put in a SSD. Or should I just give up the idea and buy a Thinkpad T420 or T420s?

I bought a T60 in 2018, from wujstefan, and now use it for the tasks you listed. It uses Linux, an SSD, and smtube to play youtube videos -- from a browser 720p playback may not be smooth. Additionally, it has a javascript-blocker added to the browser.

I prefer this T60 over my T60p because it runs cooler and I prefer the lower resolution screen (my t60p has 1600x1200). I prefer the T60 over my T420 because of the 4:3 screen and the firm keyboard.

For the work I do, the performance difference between a T60 (T7600) and a T420 is not very noticable. For many users, especially windows users, the difference will be unusable vs usable. With my setup the T60 takes 2 seconds to open libreoffice. As I am typing this post, on my T60, firefox is open, and libreoffice is open, and the machine is using 590 MB of ram.

[Self_Propelled_Crane]

After a week of searching through the local used laptop sellers, I have not found any 15-inch sized T60 or T60p. Can one make a frankenpad using the motherboard of a 14-inch T61 installed into a 14-inch T60p chassis? (Or does that defeat the entire point?)

[Thinkpad4by3]

Yes.

[axur-delmeria]

After a week of searching through the local used laptop sellers, I have not found any 15-inch sized T60 or T60p. Can one make a frankenpad using the motherboard of a 14-inch T61 installed into a 14-inch T60p chassis? (Or does that defeat the entire point?)

It can be done, but IMO the issue is "why bother", since one of the major reasons for getting a 15-inch chassis is the ability to install IPS screens.

Well, if you can live without the IPS screen, but want a faster CPU (up to Core 2 Duo T9500 without mods), higher max RAM (8GB vs 3GB), and SATA II (300MB/s) speed (after flashing modded BIOS), go ahead. I think you may still need to mod the magnesium frame, just like in a 15 inch T60 chassis.

[Self_Propelled_Crane]

What sort of modding does this require (like cutting of some metal from the magnesium frame)? I thought all the components were drop-in replacements? Also, I realized the T601 Frankenpad keyboards don't have a caps lock indicator light - which I want. Can I use a T410/T420 keyboard as replacement?

[axur-delmeria]

The Caps lock indicator LED is on the lid, below the LCD screen. It also has a Num lock indicator.

Regarding cutting/filing the magnesium frame, I'm not 100% sure. Let's wait for fellow Thinkpadders who've already transplanted a T61 board in 14.1" T60-- most T601's are done with T61 board in a 15 inch T60 chassis.

[wujstefan]

Well it is a kind of simple mod, really, and both ways.

I have done the "reverse-frankenpad" or, as German forum users name it "Schwabenpad" a few yeaqrs back and I can't remind any work on the frame.

Getting 14,1" is just BIOS modding (since you can get a T61 in any GPU config in 14,1" 4:3). However, just as axur wrote, main point of frankenpadding is getting a Flexview screen.
You can always ask here on the forum for parts and/or systems. Many of frankenpad-users either have a large stockpile of parts or complete systems they may be willng to sell or build for you. I have personally sold my "spare frankenpad" to a forum user lately, and a bunch of parts to another one.

[TPFanatic]

Just get 14.1" T61 and put 14.1" T60 lid on it! T61 also has increased ventilation.

[dr_st]

Just get 14.1" T61 and put 14.1" T60 lid on it! T61 also has increased ventilation.

I agree. The extra vents on the 14.1" T61 are a nice thing, which I was not aware of at first. I think the one downside is that the thinner plastic grilles on the side/back of the laptop are more likely to break if the laptop is banged (I've seen plenty of corporate T61s with broken grilles, but no broken grilles on T60s). Still, if you are careful and gentle with the machine - it shouldn't be a problem, and it's a cosmetic defect anyways, for the most part.

Putting the T60 lid gives you a clean symmetric look, but you lose the LCD rollcage.

[Self_Propelled_Crane]

The problem is most 14.1-inch T61s have that GPU which fails, right (which is the situation I'm trying to avoid by acquiring/building a Frankenpad)? And I lose the 4:3 IPS screen, and the tri-color IBM logo. XD Are T61 screens LED-backlit, or still CCFL?

I guess this is the T61 model you're suggesting that I acquire (still a 4:3 aspect ratio, good enough screen resolution): https://www.notebookcheck.net/Review-Le ... 190.0.html (I kinda dislike the other T61 models due to them having ALL their USB ports in a vertical position)

[Thinkpad4by3]

1: T61's with nVIDIA graphics will fail. Ones with Intel are just fine.

2: LED wasn't introduced until the xx10 series machines, so CCFL. Personally, I find CCFL easier on the eyes than LED.

3: Yes.

[wujstefan]

1: T61's with nVIDIA graphics will fail. Ones with Intel are just fine.

2: LED wasn't introduced until the xx10 series machines, so CCFL. Personally, I find CCFL easier on the eyes than LED.

3: Yes.

1. It may fail. Mine is super-abused for the least 4 years, and it didnt. I keep a spare mobo, just in case TuuS offers great deal of revised boards - they may fail, but their failure rate is considerably lower.
2. T400, T500 (some models) and X200s did carry LED backlight. Those displays are sheer junk in my opinion.

[Self_Propelled_Crane]

Update. I found two local 15.0-inch R60 chassis with the 1400x1050 screen resolution. Can that be used instead of a T60 chassis into a Frankenpad conversion?

[RealBlackStuff]

Check this R60 Frankenpad out: viewtopic.php?t=113413

[4uk4a]

Peak2Peak made such a mod:
viewtopic.php?f=5&t=117966

By the way, he sells the motherboard R61:
viewtopic.php?f=11&t=124898

[Self_Propelled_Crane]

And then I realized most R61 units here in the Philippines are either useless, or the widescreen type. *sigh* Here we go again. But the links posted above were informative. Thanks =)

[Self_Propelled_Crane]

A random question, when IBM/Lenovo says: "this is a 15-inch T60/T60p", does it mean the unit/chassis as a whole is 15 inches long when measured across the diagonal, but the actually screen might be diagonally slightly smaller than 15.0 inches even if the bezel is relatively thin?

Let's say I'm looking at a picture of a T60/T60p on Facebook. How do I confirm if it's really a 15.0-inch unit as the seller is advertising?

[Thinkpad4by3]

Here's how you can tell which the seller is talking about: http://www.notebookreview.com/assets/13234.jpg

14" machines will have tiny keyboard bezels on the sides.
15" machines will have significant keyboard bezels on the sides.

If you can get a clear bottom photo, we can use its MTM-code to look it up. It looks like this: (####-xxx)

[dr_st]

15-inch T60/p means the LCD is 15-inch diagonal.

[axur-delmeria]

A random question, when IBM/Lenovo says: "this is a 15-inch T60/T60p", does it mean the unit/chassis as a whole is 15 inches long when measured across the diagonal, but the actually screen might be diagonally slightly smaller than 15.0 inches even if the bezel is relatively thin?

It's the screen that's measured, not the chassis itself.

Let's say I'm looking at a picture of a T60/T60p on Facebook. How do I confirm if it's really a 15.0-inch unit as the seller is advertising?

Reminder: the T60/T60p was available in 3 sizes: 14.1" non-widescreen, 15.0" non-widescreen, and 15.4" widescreen.

One thing to look out for is the free space to the left and right of the keyboard.

On the 14.1 inch T60, notice that the free space is less than the width of the Fn key.

On the 15.0 inch T60, the free space is a bit wider than the Fn key.

On the 15.4 inch widescreen T60p, it's even wider than the Caps lock key.

[LyonAdmiral1981]

I don't see why not. I have a T61 with the high-res screen in the 4:3 package. The stickers are strange though; the LCD lid has the ThinkPad T-Series sticker but the palm rest has the IBM ThinkPad sticker. Go figure. It has 4 gigs installed, 3 usable running Windows XP SP3 and I use Google Chrome and Opera browsers.

[RealBlackStuff]

Welcome to the Forum.
Both IBM and Lenovo stickers are interchangeable, and available on e.g. eBay or elsewhere.
If you Install Middleton's BIOS, your HD/SSD speed doubles to SATA II.

I'm surprised you use good ol' XP to go online!
You could install e.g. W7 64-bit from Lenovo Recovery disks and use all 4GB or even 8GB of RAM.

[Self_Propelled_Crane]

What do I use the expansion slots (in particular the express card) for in the T60/T60p/T601 Frankenpad? Can I plug-and-play a USB 3.0 adapter and it'll work fine?

(Also, why is it so hard to find a UXGA Thinkpad T60/T60p?)

[Thinkpad4by3]

What do I use the expansion slots (in particular the express card) for in the T60/T60p/T601 Frankenpad? Can I plug-and-play a USB 3.0 adapter and it'll work fine?

(Also, why is it so hard to find a UXGA Thinkpad T60/T60p?)

Yes it should. And for your second question, for who has them, keeps them. They are the last of a breed, and a very good one, so people who have them value them a lot. They are bit easier to find in the states.

[Self_Propelled_Crane]

Update: found a 15-inch, 4:3 T60p chassis, but the seller said it doesn't have a Battery, RAM modules, Hard Drive (and therefore no OS), and power cord. How do I check the screen resolution if I don't have a spare HDD on hand (can I check via the BIOS)? Also, does the battery of a 4:3, 14-inch T60p fit into a 4:3, 15-inch T60p?

[axur-delmeria]

How do I check the screen resolution if I don't have a spare HDD on hand (can I check via the BIOS)?

You can boot from a live CD/USB of a Linux distro.

Also, does the battery of a 4:3, 14-inch T60p fit into a 4:3, 15-inch T60p?

Yes. The T60/T61 uses the same batteries for all sizes (14.1" 4:3, 14.1" 16:10, 15.0" 4:3, 15.4" 16:10)

[dr_st]

Also, does the battery of a 4:3, 14-inch T60p fit into a 4:3, 15-inch T60p?

Yes. The T60/T61 uses the same batteries for all sizes (14.1" 4:3, 14.1" 16:10, 15.0" 4:3, 15.4" 16:10)

The part in bold is incorrect - these batteries are different. However, the others are correct, so the answer to original question is still a 'yes'.

[Self_Propelled_Crane]

Just in case I come to this situation: I find a 15.0-inch T60 with the HDD removed. How will I check the screen resolution? I've read some solutions on reddit, and I want to clarify

1. Linux on USB? (How to do this? Also, what distro has drivers for the T60's GPU so it can display the max resolution?)
2. The Lenovo Bios Diagnostics? (Does this work on the T60 series?)

What else can I do?