T61 GPU acceleration win 10

[donli]

Mobile Intel(R) 965 Express Chipset Family (Microsoft Corporation - WDDM 1.1)

Wondering is there upgrades available if to use external monitor only?

[kfzhu1229]

Mobile Intel(R) 965 Express Chipset Family (Microsoft Corporation - WDDM 1.1)

Wondering is there upgrades available if to use external monitor only?

Unless you are talking about investing in the ThinkPad dock and plug in a PCI express graphics card in the dock and basically use it as a desktop, no without switching the motherboard and heatsink.
THAT said, I do believe if you attempt the FSB overclocking mod for running 1066mhz FSB, it overclocks the integrated GPU as well (and its VRAM of course since that's your system RAM) and can give you quite the improvement there as well.

[donli]

What are the options for T61 overclocking.
Clock gen: SLG8P564V K332001SVA 0732 TAIWAN
CPU T9500
Downloaded app SETFSB
I am not sure what ICs to chose from the list.
Please some advise.

[kfzhu1229]

What are the options for T61 overclocking.
Clock gen: SLG8P564V K332001SVA 0732 TAIWAN
CPU T9500
Downloaded app SETFSB
I am not sure what ICs to chose from the list.
Please some advise.

We do NOT do FSB overclocking via the SetFSB app, but rather you need to use a hard wired approach here instead.
See the mega thread of 1066Mhz FSB mod for detailed instructions on how to do it.
You do not wanna use a T9500 for this, as it is impossible for T9500 to take that 33% overclock and be anywhere near stability no matter the voltages.
You do however, wanna use either a native 1066mhz FSB processor (T9600 T9800 T9900 P8800 P9500 P9600 P9700) plus a microcode update (see thread), or my personal approach of having a Core 2 duo T6500, T66x0 or T8100 that would be stable and fast after the 1066mhz FSB overclock (I don't have luck with T8300 or T9300 with this).
If this works you might wanna consider selling T9500 CPU - that thing is worth quite the fortune.

[donli]

RAM DDR2 4gb DDR2 667mhz pc2-5300s.

Have read about RAM SPD problem.
Does 1066 mod needs spd flash?
Now there is 800 mhz ram available on the market.
Thinking about T8100 .
How much and which RAM is suitable.

[donli]

About Hynix SDRAM mentioned in the previous post.

CPU_Z-memory shows DRAM freq 332.5 MHz, FSB:DRAM 3:5, timing 5-5-5-15

SPDTool timing summary when Read installed module 4 (modules 4,5,6):
speed- tCL tRCD tRP tRAS tRC correspondingly
0 - 0.0 0 0 0 0
270 - -1.0 6 4 15 15
178 - -2.0 4 3 10 10
What does it mean?

Changeing voltage 1,8 to 1,9 -> fix checksum -> write module 4 -> exit
Without booting started up SPDTool again voltage unchanged.
Does it mean that SPD table is locked? Is it possible to unlock it?
Please advice.

[axur-delmeria]

IIRC you cannot change the SPD values on the T61 itself. You need a different laptop (probably non-Thinkpad)

[kfzhu1229]

About Hynix SDRAM mentioned in the previous post.

CPU_Z-memory shows DRAM freq 332.5 MHz, FSB:DRAM 3:5, timing 5-5-5-15

SPDTool timing summary when Read installed module 4 (modules 4,5,6):
speed- tCL tRCD tRP tRAS tRC correspondingly
0 - 0.0 0 0 0 0
270 - -1.0 6 4 15 15
178 - -2.0 4 3 10 10
What does it mean?

Changeing voltage 1,8 to 1,9 -> fix checksum -> write module 4 -> exit
Without booting started up SPDTool again voltage unchanged.
Does it mean that SPD table is locked? Is it possible to unlock it?
Please advice.

As far as I know changing the voltage via the SPD table doesn't do anything here. What you want to change is the SPD clock profile timings to force the RAM sticks to run on 266Mhz speed while using the slow timings of the 333mhz profile.
That takes quite the tinkering, you need to save a copy of the original SPD, make the speeds 266Mhz and maybe the other one as 200Mhz, and then change the timings so that it approximately matches the timings of the previous 333Mhz profile numbers (the SPD timings are all based on the RAM speed so changing the speed messes up all the timings and you have to fix manually)
If you are thoroughly confused about what to do there I do have some known good modified SPD profiles vs original to give you an idea of what to do.
if you get any verification errors by SPDTool after a write attempt, give up on those RAM sticks as they would be SPD locked.
Moreover, I had horrible luck with Samsung 2GB PC2-6400S sticks that even after working around the locked SPD they would not play nicely with this mod.

[donli]

I have looked your example from topic: 1066 CPU in T61 without BSEL mod
https://1drv.ms/u/s!AuILfFUnTy5chXPhyCe ... 1?e=xeHPJE

I have tried single Kingston 2G stick what was in use before and 2G+4G but BIOS refused boot.
SDRAM 2 speed profiles only is ok to keep third undefined. CPU T9500 win 10 64.
I would like to consult before SPD flash.

Have changed 270 and 178 to 333 and 266.
Result
333 - -1.0 8 4 19 19
266 - -2.0 6 4 15 15
and
266 - -1.0 6 4 15 15
200 - -2.0 5 3 11 11
It is needed
266 - -1.0 8 4 19 19
200 - -2.0 6 4 15 15
for 266 chosen the lowest possible ns value
Byte pos 29 21.25 -> 26.50ns
Byte pos 30 55 -> 68ns
Byte pos 41 54,50 -> 67.66ns

How to change 200?

[kfzhu1229]

Have changed 270 and 178 to 333 and 266.
Result
333 - -1.0 8 4 19 19
266 - -2.0 6 4 15 15
and
266 - -1.0 6 4 15 15
200 - -2.0 5 3 11 11
It is needed
266 - -1.0 8 4 19 19
200 - -2.0 6 4 15 15
for 266 chosen the lowest possible ns value
Byte pos 29 21.25 -> 26.50ns
Byte pos 30 55 -> 68ns
Byte pos 41 54,50 -> 67.66ns

How to change 200?

As far as I know for the 200Mhz timings you cannot change it independently. Everything is based off the timings set for the fastest profile and then divided by the clock speed difference.
Besides, you do not need any changes for the 200Mhz profile, or even need that 200Mhz profile at all. If you want to you can even just set the max clock cycle (and access time) at CLX-1 and CLX-2 to 0/undefined and the profiles will be gone entirely.
No 965 generation laptops can ever even use the 200Mhz (400Mhz) RAM speeds anyway and it will just be ignored.

[donli]

During SPD write popups message: Verify failed. Index... is... should be... Abort/Retry/Ignore. Even write, without changing spd table, fails pos (in hex) 3F is 30 should be B5. Actually in the table B5 is shown. Under CPU_Z SPD tab almost everything is grayed out. Please recommendations.

[donli]

Does it make sense to find another PC to hack DDR2-667 SPD?

[RealBlackStuff]

IMHO it would make more sense indeed to find another, more modern laptop and stop wasting time on SPD.
Make the jump to T440p or W541 (if you want bigger).
Both are eminently upgradable.
Or get a T480 if you want to go more modern and still affordable.

[TPFanatic]

For newer thinkpads I recommend P51 and P71, they have great keyboards better than all other 6-rows and are incredibly upgradable. On P70/P71 even the GPU is replaceable. Definitely consider P series of a 15.6" or bigger machine is desired. For 14", T480 for sure.

[axur-delmeria]

I spent an entire day wrangling a friend's Sony VAIO laptop of a similar vintage (Core 2 Duo T8100, DDR2 RAM, ATI graphics) back into shape, only for it to stop booting in the end (no POST, video, or response from keyboard). I'm not wasting any more time with it.

Personally, if you're experimenting on the T61 as a hobby, go ahead. But if you're seriously trying to use a 15-year old Thinkpad as your primary computer... well, I agree with RealBlackStuff that you should find a newer laptop instead.

[donli]

Thank you very much for your response. My T61 is in good shape and running without problems.
Although GPU can run faster on the given architecture by FSB mod from 4x200 to 4x266 MHz.
It needs also mixing DRAM memory speeds. Downshift to 533 by reprogramming DDR2-667.

Currently BIOS 7LETC9WW (2.29) is installed. Wondering does SPDTool spd tab info displayed depends on BIOS.
Why spd timing summary shows tCL -1.0 ? Actually I would like to know is there any PC that see DDR2-667 spd table always unlocked.

[kfzhu1229]

During SPD write popups message: Verify failed. Index... is... should be... Abort/Retry/Ignore. Even write, without changing spd table, fails pos (in hex) 3F is 30 should be B5. Actually in the table B5 is shown. Under CPU_Z SPD tab almost everything is grayed out. Please recommendations.

I think I mentioned already that means the SPD is locked. Get another RAM stick to try this with.
And no, most of the time the lock is actually from the SPD chip itself. So unless you are willing to spend the hassle of having a donor rubbish RAM stick, clone your 2GB stick's SPD data over, then transfer the SPD chip, you are out of luck. So doesn't matter if it's a ThinkPad or a Dell or HP or Acer it just won't flash.
Or if you really can't find suitable options, I do still sell those very Micron 4GB sticks that I posted the SPD timings of. I know for sure their timings are working on my FSB modded ThinkPad R61 (widescreen).
Again, you will also need either a 1066Mhz FSB CPU like Core 2 duo T9600 P8800 etc and have the microcode patched to allow those things, or you need a Core 2 duo T6xx0 or T8100 (nothing else will work) and some thin 32awg wires and overclock them 33% with this FSB mod.
Gotta say for first timers this may all seem pretty overwhelming. The whole point of me doing these is to save money on the overpriced Core 2 duo T9500 or X9000's and get cheap CPU's perform as well or outperform them, but yes it does give a speed boost to the iGPU.

[axur-delmeria]

The FSB mod improves overall performance even if you don't increase the CPU clock speed (e.g. run a T8100 @ 266MHz FSB but reduce the multiplier to keep it at ~2.1GHz).
This is due to the higher bandwidth of not only the RAM, but also the CPU bus.

That said, it won't solve the missing graphics acceleration features that the iGPU lacks (which is one reason why it's slow).

[kfzhu1229]

The FSB mod improves overall performance even if you don't increase the CPU clock speed (e.g. run a T8100 @ 266MHz FSB but reduce the multiplier to keep it at ~2.1GHz).

Yup, that said again for T8100 in my experience you don't need to downclock it - it runs at 2.8Ghz perfectly fine. T8300 however will have stability problems.

[kfzhu1229]

Just wanted to post an update for those who use T61's dGPU in Windows 10/11 and modern browsers and stuff, I think Chromium has now just killed the abilities of h264 decoding on Tesla cards completely.
If you still have such a T61 lying around with the latest chromium browsers and h264ify, try play a youtube video and let me know if there are any video engine usage (which is what's supposed to be utilised for h264 decoding).
For now this has affected my NVS 160M, Quadro FX 1600M and GeForce 9600M GT that I tried this on so it's safe to assume all Tesla cards are affected, and for now I am using an 8 months old build of Brave browser with auto update completely messed up to mitigate this problem. (:flags and software rendering override does not solve this problem - that solves the problem on Terascale Radeon HD graphics and GMA 4500MHD but not on these - hardware acceleration still works on these Teslas but h264 decoding is no more)

[TPFanatic]

Could be a good time to switch to Firefox and force h264 decoding using an extension. Remember when the United States sued Microsoft for their IE practices? Now everything is Chrome and congress is dumb.

[kfzhu1229]

Could be a good time to switch to Firefox and force h264 decoding using an extension. Remember when the United States sued Microsoft for their IE practices? Now everything is Chrome and congress is dumb.

The thing I find pretty evil about Chromium is that things like the hardware acceleration checkbox has a big "catch" saying that "when available". When it is not using hardware acceleration, even though h264ify/enhanced h264ify will indeed force h264 codecs on youtube, it will still be software rendered.
Chromium hid the real "hardware acceleration" thing under :flags menu called "Override software rendering list" and you need to override that, and the blacklist just keep on expanding without any legitimate reason other than wanting to sell more chromebooks.
While I understand if things like Radeon X300/Xpress 200M GMA 950 are under that blacklist, putting Terascale Radeon HD 5000 and 6000 series on that blacklist is just purely planned obsolescence as neither the drivers nor the DirectX API level would present any problems at all. They did that in 2021 I believe and none of the nvidia cards were under the blacklist until recently - in a different blacklist now that blocks just h264 decoding.
From my understanding, the Software rendering blacklist includes:
All Radeon cards up to the HD 6000 series
All Intel GMA cards (GMA 950 X3100 4500M/4500MHD)
All Geforce cards up to the 7000 series
h264 blacklist includes all the Tesla Nvidia cards
You'd be surprised when you override that list - even a GMA 950 from a ThinkPad T60 would get a massive browsing performance improvement and it will even play 720p youtube butter smooth (since GMA 950 will take some load off the CPU even though it doesn't have a full h264 decoder). Heck even the quirky GeForce 6150 Go IGP would get significantly better browsing experience.

[RealBlackStuff]

In Chrome, open a new tab and type in chrome://flags/ to find the Experiments section where you Enable the Override software rendering list.

[kfzhu1229]

In Chrome, open a new tab and type in chrome://flags/ to find the Experiments section where you Enable the Override software rendering list.

Yeah, that is what I found out that solves the issue - for Radeon graphics and for Intel GMA graphics.
For Tesla nvidia cards however it seems like they triggered an alternate blacklist that blocks just the h264 decoding function - page rendering and stuff are still done by hardware acceleration. And I was not able to find where they implemented that blacklist.

[dr_st]

Just wanted to post an update for those who use T61's dGPU in Windows 10/11 and modern browsers and stuff, I think Chromium has now just killed the abilities of h264 decoding on Tesla cards completely.

Do you know when it started and how far cards are affected? I could have sworn that in the past few months videos (not just on Youtube) started stuttering for me on my old Win7 desktop sporting a Core 2 QX9650 and a GTX 660 (Kepler). I noticed it after having had to replace my failed P45/ICH10R motherboard with a G41/ICH7 board, so I attributed it to the weaker chipset. Could have been a coincidence, though.

[kfzhu1229]

Just wanted to post an update for those who use T61's dGPU in Windows 10/11 and modern browsers and stuff, I think Chromium has now just killed the abilities of h264 decoding on Tesla cards completely.

Do you know when it started and how far cards are affected? I could have sworn that in the past few months videos (not just on Youtube) started stuttering for me on my old Win7 desktop sporting a Core 2 QX9650 and a GTX 660 (Kepler). I noticed it after having had to replace my failed P45/ICH10R motherboard with a G41/ICH7 board, so I attributed it to the weaker chipset. Could have been a coincidence, though.

I think this happened only within like the past 2-3 months or so. I end up using a Brave build that's from February 2023 and that solves the problem.
Not only that but the latest chromium builds give me annoying minor bugs like not displaying any webpages when I first open the browser (and need to restart the browser) and just display a solid screen.
I only know this is affecting Tesla cards. I have an Elitebook 8740w yet to test, that's got a Quadro FX 2800M so it's still Tesla and I think it should be affected as well.
One can test these with the ThinkPad T420/T520 with graphics set to discrete only, but those cards could still be blocked for favouring the Intel iGPU instead.

[astral]

does firefox have the same issue with tesla cards? if not then i'd just recommend using that. ff + some content blocker (such as ublock origin) will probably provide a much faster web experience on an older system than a bloated chromium browser anyway.