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T43 OR T60 WHICH IS BETTER?

T60/T61 series specific matters only
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santui
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Joined: Sun May 14, 2006 10:13 pm

T43 OR T60 WHICH IS BETTER?

#1 Post by santui » Mon May 15, 2006 3:20 am

HI
I just want use the notebook to develop. maybe i will install a IDE and a oracle .
now i have two choice.
1.t43 2g, 915pm64 vidwo memory, 1g memory, 80gdisk
2.t60 1.83g 945gm integerated video memory, 1g memory, 60gdisk

 I know that t43 is like a fly and nosiy around you all time. but i will use it for about 3 hour a day. i just appreciate it speed.
I have read any experience about t60(1.83), i can not aford the t60p
every guru may give me some advice???? :oops: :P

astro
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#2 Post by astro » Mon May 15, 2006 3:35 am

I'm not a guru, but I don't think u need to be to answer this.

Firstly, if you're going to be doing development work, what you want is multiple processors, fast memory and a fast hard disk. T60 wins. In either case I think you'll have to go aftermarket for the faster HD.

Secondly, if you're going to be doing coding work, you want as much screen real-estate as possible. SXGA+ (1400x1050) or UXGA (1600x1200) are preferable. T60 or T4x, they both come with same screens.

Thirdly, T60 is not much more expensive than T4x if you are buying new. Lenovo is having sales all the time. The 2623-##U (TopSeller) models are very cheap -- have you looked at these? There are many models around the $1500 mark that you seem to be looking at.
60-200763-2500-2.0-1024-1400-14.1-1400-1050-3945-100-5400

santui
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#3 Post by santui » Mon May 15, 2006 4:12 am

but for t60 the speed that cpu visit the L2 seem slow than t43 for duo lack of original memeroy controller.

astro
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#4 Post by astro » Mon May 15, 2006 4:21 am

Yes, perhaps the performance of each core on the T60 is not as fast as the T43 alone, but what about the benefits to multithreaded applications? I would hazard a guess that Oracle DB would take advantage of this. In any case, I think that DB performance is going to be limited by memory and disk more than CPU performance. I/O wait will consume CPU, but when you have 2, it should reduce the likelihood of everything grinding to a halt when Oracle hits the wall.
60-200763-2500-2.0-1024-1400-14.1-1400-1050-3945-100-5400

RonS
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#5 Post by RonS » Mon May 15, 2006 4:23 am

As a product line, the T60 is generally regarded as better built and better performing than the T4x line. The best T43 will outperform the lowest T60, but as a general rule the T60's are better.
Apathy is on the rise, but nobody seems to care.

santui
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#6 Post by santui » Mon May 15, 2006 5:32 am

1,
as concerning the multithread, i just think that the hardware in some degree realize the goal, however till now the os do real make full use of the technology?
the application software do support the technology?

if not, the possibility of hardware multithread can real make sense?

so how can you say that duo can distribute the load to different cpu effeciently,

from the view of cpu, all application are same, they are all portion of os.

maybe confusing, but this why i can not ignore the speed between cpu and L2.

astro
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#7 Post by astro » Mon May 15, 2006 7:41 am

Yes, the hardware does help realise the goal. As you pointed out, that is why the L2 cache is slower.

However, in terms of total CPU capacity, 1x 2GHz CPU is still going to be less than 2 x 1.86 GHz even if the Duo has some L2 cache sharing and impairment.

What are you trying to do?

If you are after outright speed, then of course, the 2GHz is going to be faster. But if you are running multiple applications, especially server apps, then 2x *slightly* slower CPUs is going to be better than 1x faster.

EDIT: I forgot to add that yes, multi-processor is supported in WinXP, easy way to see that is that if you re-image T60 with an image from T4x, it won't boot (like mentioned in other threads).
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vital-analitix
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#8 Post by vital-analitix » Mon May 15, 2006 9:40 am

santui wrote:1,
as concerning the multithread, i just think that the hardware in some degree realize the goal, however till now the os do real make full use of the technology?
the application software do support the technology?

if not, the possibility of hardware multithread can real make sense?

so how can you say that duo can distribute the load to different cpu effeciently,

from the view of cpu, all application are same, they are all portion of os.

maybe confusing, but this why i can not ignore the speed between cpu and L2.
if you have a database application and some other stuff then you can bind specific process to a core. Have a look at Mike Lin "SMPseesaw" or Tom's hardware guide's "taskassign".

Marinus
Z61m 94515CM with 2 Gb memory, T61p 6459A12 Windows 7 Prof 4 Gb memory, daughter 1: Lenovo N200, son: R61, retired:A31, 2652-M5M, A31, 2652-XKX, daugther 2: retired R60

vital-analitix
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#9 Post by vital-analitix » Mon May 15, 2006 9:41 am

RonS wrote:As a product line, the T60 is generally regarded as better built and better performing than the T4x line. The best T43 will outperform the lowest T60, but as a general rule the T60's are better.
Is there any hard proof for this that I can check up on? I have been holding off getting new laptops (need two). The ones that I have are getting towards the end of their lives and I am searching for suitable replacements.

Thanks
Marinus
Z61m 94515CM with 2 Gb memory, T61p 6459A12 Windows 7 Prof 4 Gb memory, daughter 1: Lenovo N200, son: R61, retired:A31, 2652-M5M, A31, 2652-XKX, daugther 2: retired R60

grimmster
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#10 Post by grimmster » Mon May 15, 2006 9:43 am

I have a T42 and a T60 for a bit to play around with. Technology wise the T60 is better with the duo core and the better graphics options (I just have the X1300 64mb in the T60 and a 9600 in the T42) but as you are going integrated, that option does not matter to you

Build wise my T42 beats the T60 hands down, for me anyway.

The T60 has a loose battery, the front cover does not close tight (there is a little play so I can push it down and it comes up)

I love the beveled front of the T4x line and hate the blunt square of the T60 line (easier to carry with that belveled front)

Wireless. If you have to relay on wireless DO NOT get a T60 with the 3945ABG card. Thing is horrid for signal strength. just do a search for more on that crappy wireless card.

As it stands right now, I think I would go with the fastest T43 you can get and be happy. Hopefully the build of the T61's will be better when they come out....

freakwave
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#11 Post by freakwave » Mon May 15, 2006 2:59 pm

Hi all,

in the meanwhile I also have my doubt if the T60p I have is better than my T40p.
The 60p is definitely faster when it comes to running high demanding applications. As I described in another post, I am using an oracle database in vmware with very demanding development environment. The whole startup process from pressing the button of vmware starting oracle and eclipse is significant faster on the T60p.
But then there is that behaviour what I really hate. The context switches seem to be much slower with the T60p.
Can anybody confirm this feeling? The overall handling, when you switch from one app to the other, do your emails start programs, change tasks, my T40p has ZERO delays. With the T60p there is always this short moment of doing nothing.

I really do not know what this is or could be. From a pure technical standpoint the T60p should be much faster.

santui
Posts: 11
Joined: Sun May 14, 2006 10:13 pm

upstair

#12 Post by santui » Mon May 15, 2006 8:00 pm

that is what i want. as you do, i want to run oracle in vmware to simulate a seperate node.

another reason is that oracle is haunting you even if it is uninstalled. it is not easy to uninstall oracle as do for applications. now in vmware you can get rid of all with a finger.

so i really care about if that t60 can reach such a goal.

it seem that t60 supply a functiont that can tie a application to a cpu.

have anyone test it fully?

Ervin
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Location: Connecticut, USA

#13 Post by Ervin » Mon May 15, 2006 11:27 pm

It's not a function of T60, but of Windows XP.

http://www.informit.com/articles/printe ... p?p=465310

freakwave
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#14 Post by freakwave » Tue May 16, 2006 12:06 am

Hi Santui,

when you run oracle in vmware, you do not need to tie anything to the CPU. Even if the vmware is at 100%, the host system is under 50% on the T60p. One suggestion: Use a second harddrive for your vmware disks. I have a second 100Gig 7200rpm drive in the ultrabay and put 2 Gig in your machine. I can work normally with my outher host apps even when vmware starts up.
Another hint, if you have a old ultrabay adapter and a normal ide drive from a T4x, just use it it works in the T60p. No need for any additional costs here (unfortunatley I did not know this and spent the bugs :-(

santui
Posts: 11
Joined: Sun May 14, 2006 10:13 pm

thanks upstairs

#15 Post by santui » Tue May 16, 2006 1:37 am

thanks for every gurus for advices

till now i think i can not choos t43p, even not t60p
base on the actual possible running load even if i plan to install esclipse and a vmware in which oracle is running. i will prefer t43 2.0g with seperate video card.

thanks! warm-hearted

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