90W AC Adapter or 120W AC Adapter

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Cassirer · #1 Post by **Cassirer** » Sun May 21, 2006 12:01 pm

what is the difference between the 65W, 90W and 120W AC Adapters ... which should be used with the T60?

and are old version of adapters compatable with the T60? or do you have buy a new one?

and has anyone any feedback on the Ultrabay Battery ...

thanks

steve

#2 Post by **archer6** » Sun May 21, 2006 1:55 pm

Cassirer wrote:what is the difference between the 65W, 90W and 120W AC Adapters ... which should be used with the T60?

and are old version of adapters compatable with the T60? or do you have buy a new one?

and has anyone any feedback on the Ultrabay Battery ...

thanks

steve

I looked it up since my X60 was shipped with the 65W adapter which is so nice and small. I checked carefully and found that I can use the lightweight 65w with my T, X or Z series ThinkPads no problem.
As far as the older versions they have a smaller plug on the end that inserts into the computer.

Regarding the Ultrabay Battery, I have one and it works really nicely.

Archer6

Cassirer · #3 Post by **Cassirer** » Sun May 21, 2006 1:58 pm

thanks

Steve

astro · #4 Post by **astro** » Sun May 21, 2006 6:58 pm

Cassirer, I believe that the 65W adaptors can only be used on the systems with integrated graphics (GMA950). At least, this is what the Lenovo site recommends when you click "Accessories" for the model type.

TPs with ATI graphics require the 90W adaptor.

#5 Post by **archer6** » Sun May 21, 2006 7:08 pm

astro wrote:Cassirer, I believe that the 65W adaptors can only be used on the systems with integrated graphics (GMA950). At least, this is what the Lenovo site recommends when you click "Accessories" for the model type.

TPs with ATI graphics require the 90W adaptor.

Not true, here is the link:

http://www5.pc.ibm.com/us/products.nsf/ ... novo#Power

As you can see all three adaptors are OK with ATI in T60/60p models.

Patrick B · #6 Post by **Patrick B** » Sun May 21, 2006 7:56 pm

archer6 wrote:
astro wrote:Cassirer, I believe that the 65W adaptors can only be used on the systems with integrated graphics (GMA950). At least, this is what the Lenovo site recommends when you click "Accessories" for the model type.

TPs with ATI graphics require the 90W adaptor.
Not true, here is the link:

http://www5.pc.ibm.com/us/products.nsf/ ... novo#Power

As you can see all three adaptors are OK with ATI in T60/60p models.

Actually, when you read the note in the listing you posted, it shows the 65w adapter as being compatible with 195x (ie, GMA equipped systems) only.

Any T60 with dedicated graphics requires the 90w adapter.

Patrick

#7 Post by **archer6** » Sun May 21, 2006 8:59 pm

Patrick B wrote:
archer6 wrote: Not true, here is the link:

http://www5.pc.ibm.com/us/products.nsf/ ... novo#Power

As you can see all three adaptors are OK with ATI in T60/60p models.
Actually, when you read the note in the listing you posted, it shows the 65w adapter as being compatible with 195x (ie, GMA equipped systems) only.

Any T60 with dedicated graphics requires the 90w adapter.

Patrick

Wrong again, it is listed as (also) supporting the 195x

Website · #8 Post by **tfflivemb2** » Sun May 21, 2006 9:05 pm

Actually, the exact phrase is:
25. Compatible with the 195x systems.

However, when you click on the link for the part it says:

Compatible with Lenovo 3000 notebooks, ThinkPad X60 Series notebooks, select ThinkPad T60 Series notebooks, and ThinkPad Essential Port Replicator.(emphasis added)

#9 Post by **archer6** » Sun May 21, 2006 10:32 pm

tfflivemb2 wrote:Actually, the exact phrase is:
25. Compatible with the 195x systems.

However, when you click on the link for the part it says:

Compatible with Lenovo 3000 notebooks, ThinkPad X60 Series notebooks, select ThinkPad T60 Series notebooks, and ThinkPad Essential Port Replicator.(emphasis added)

Actually the only reason I felt certain on the point here was last week (before looking it up on the site) I called tech support with a couple of questions one of which was, could I use the 65w with my T60 and the answer I got from them was yes. They were the ones that directed me to the accessories page, as I wanted to see all available accessories.

Regarding the "Rules of the Road" referral here. I had no intention of violating these. Just read them (again) and I'm a bit confused over which one it is that I failed to abide by. So please advise which area I was wrong in.

It is my intention to remain in good standing here, therefore your specific input is appreciated.

If you look at my other numerous posts here you will see that I always display a positive attitude and respect towards others.

Thanks in advance for your response.

Archer6

jhkaska · #10 Post by **jhkaska** » Mon May 22, 2006 1:40 am

Archer6

Page 69 of the recent TABOOK shows options that can be purchased for the T60. They show the 65w adaptor but state that it is "only compatible with the 195x types". I would be interested in getting this for my 200794U but have avoided it due to what the TABOOK says. I would like to be sure that the TABOOK is incorrect before I buy. Are you sure that the tech guy you spoke with is correct and that the TABOOK is incorrect?

#11 Post by **archer6** » Mon May 22, 2006 1:47 am

jhkaska wrote:Archer6

Page 69 of the recent TABOOK shows options that can be purchased for the T60. They show the 65w adaptor but state that it is "only compatible with the 195x types". I would be interested in getting this for my 200794U but have avoided it due to what the TABOOK says. I would like to be sure that the TABOOK is incorrect before I buy. Are you sure that the tech guy you spoke with is correct and that the TABOOK is incorrect?

It now appears as though I was given the wrong info by the tech support person. As I have consulted with a couple of other individuals on this they suggest that indeed I did get the wrong info by phone. Which now in retrospect, since I have reviewed the tabook, it seems to state clearly that it's not compatible with the T60.

turkington · #12 Post by **turkington** » Mon May 22, 2006 1:36 pm

I have a 2007-63U with the ATI 1400 dedicated adaper and the 65W power adaper works just fine, even with the notebook on and charging a dead battery.

Jeff

#13 Post by **archer6** » Mon May 22, 2006 2:35 pm

turkington wrote:I have a 2007-63U with the ATI 1400 dedicated adaper and the 65W power adaper works just fine, even with the notebook on and charging a dead battery.

Jeff

Interesting, technical data aside, my experience has been the same as yours. I have been using the 65w unit with my T60 no problem.

So at this point I'm wondering just what the difference (or problem) is?

Patrick B · #14 Post by **Patrick B** » Mon May 22, 2006 5:52 pm

archer6 wrote:
turkington wrote:I have a 2007-63U with the ATI 1400 dedicated adaper and the 65W power adaper works just fine, even with the notebook on and charging a dead battery.

Jeff
Interesting, technical data aside, my experience has been the same as yours. I have been using the 65w unit with my T60 no problem.

So at this point I'm wondering just what the difference (or problem) is?

I would suspect it's a case of load; ie, the 65w adapter may power 80% (or for that matter, 99%) of the uses that the computer may see, but that 20% (or 1% for that matter) would cause a blue screen etc due to a lack of available power.

So again, it *may* be working fine for most of what you're doing, and unless you need the machine to draw more than 65w of power, you'd never see a problem.

I'm just curious as to what maximum draw of the box might be, to merit the jump from 65w to 90w?

Patrick

#15 Post by **archer6** » Mon May 22, 2006 6:06 pm

Patrick B wrote:I would suspect it's a case of load; ie, the 65w adapter may power 80% (or for that matter, 99%) of the uses that the computer may see, but that 20% (or 1% for that matter) would cause a blue screen etc due to a lack of available power.

So again, it *may* be working fine for most of what you're doing, and unless you need the machine to draw more than 65w of power, you'd never see a problem.

I'm just curious as to what maximum draw of the box might be, to merit the jump from 65w to 90w?

Patrick

That's what has me quite curious, the tech support guy I spoke to today could not answer the question of what the maximum draw of the box is. I asked to have the case escalated, and the next person was also uncertain. I was left on hold for nearly 30 minutes while he went to look it up. Unfortunately by that time I had been on the phone for over an hour and had to hang up as I was out of time, having a meeting to attend.

I have looked everywhere for that info and cannot find it. Interestingly enough you and I are on the same page here regarding usage. I ran it hard yesterday with some modeling and rendering, some Autocad, etc. I truly thought it would run out of "steam" with the 65w adapter. It performed flawlessly and did not seem to run out of power, slow down or show the blue screen. Very interesting indeed

kulivontot · #16 Post by **kulivontot** » Mon May 22, 2006 7:19 pm

I don't think the notebook on full load comes anywhere near 65W. Maybe with a T60p, I don't know. I imagine it's just a matter of convenience at how quickly it will charge with a higher power rating.

#17 Post by **archer6** » Mon May 22, 2006 7:39 pm

kulivontot wrote:I don't think the notebook on full load comes anywhere near 65W. Maybe with a T60p, I don't know. I imagine it's just a matter of convenience at how quickly it will charge with a higher power rating.

I agree, that was certainly one of my initial thoughts. Especially after running it with the 65w adapter and not having a problem. That was the very reason I called Lenovo to get some confirmation or correction if the computer does indeed draw more than that.
Then with all the responses here it's really piqued my curiosity.

Patrick B · #18 Post by **Patrick B** » Mon May 22, 2006 10:15 pm

I'm beginning to think it may be related to how efficient the charging circuit is.

3.5 a at 20V is 70 watts, so I'm thinking there are only a few combinations during which one might exceed the 3.5a.

I'm not sure how 'smart' the charging circuit is, in terms of realizing that 3.5a is the max for the power brick (vs 4.5a at 20V for the 90w adapter). If it's smart enough, then it should simply be a case of charging the battery slower than with the 90w adapter.

This is all dependent upon how well designed the charging circuit / power management circuit is. If it is, then one shouldn't have any problems.

Patrick

#19 Post by **archer6** » Mon May 22, 2006 10:35 pm

Patrick B wrote:I'm beginning to think it may be related to how efficient the charging circuit is.

3.5 a at 20V is 70 watts, so I'm thinking there are only a few combinations during which one might exceed the 3.5a.

I'm not sure how 'smart' the charging circuit is, in terms of realizing that 3.5a is the max for the power brick (vs 4.5a at 20V for the 90w adapter). If it's smart enough, then it should simply be a case of charging the battery slower than with the 90w adapter.

This is all dependent upon how well designed the charging circuit / power management circuit is. If it is, then one shouldn't have any problems.

Patrick

This is certainly in line with my intial thinking on this topic.

It was pointed out that when carefully reading the accessories page (for the 65W adapter) on the Lenovo site that it says for "select ThinkPad systems". However I went back and looked at all pages that relate to the 90W as well as 65W and they all say "select ThinkPad systems".

So perhaps this is not as clear cut as was presented to me when one of the posters said that the 65W was not designed to be used with the T60.

It seems to me that it's open for interpretation. When I went back and reviewed the pages today it seems as though there is nothing wrong with using the 65W save for the considerations that you have pointed out here, which I agree with.

Thanks for the input,
Archer6

astro · #20 Post by **astro** » Tue May 23, 2006 1:56 am

This is the main reason I thought that I could only use the 90W adaptor with my 2007-63U: http://www-307.ibm.com/pc/support/site. ... MIGR-62473
Edit: I have reason to believe the information at the above link is old/incorrect...

Though your anecdotal evidence suggests otherwise. How much lighter/smaller is the 65W adapter?

ssimon · #21 Post by **ssimon** » Tue May 23, 2006 7:51 am

Well, I'll add my 2c to this discussion to say that I have tried the 65W adapter with my brand new T60P (specs in the sig) and all seems fine.

Interestingly enough, if you go to the Battery tool it correctly identifies the 65W adapter, same as it does when using the 90W, so in a sense the circuitry in the laptop is smart enough to differenciate and "see" what you are using and never complains. I assume that if this was a real problem there would some sort of warning. Now I feel even more confortable not to have to lug around the 90W brick

Cassirer · #22 Post by **Cassirer** » Tue May 23, 2006 8:54 am

if you customize a purchase of a T60 on the IBM website, you can purchase an adapter ... the 65W is one option ... more than anything, would this not indicate that IBM thinks that it works? I tried for three models of the T60 ... all offered the 65W adapter...

I guess the only question is how fast or how well it will charge ... which seems to have been answered

steve

#23 Post by **archer6** » Tue May 23, 2006 9:54 am

ssimon wrote:Well, I'll add my 2c to this discussion to say that I have tried the 65W adapter with my brand new T60P (specs in the sig) and all seems fine.

Interestingly enough, if you go to the Battery tool it correctly identifies the 65W adapter, same as it does when using the 90W, so in a sense the circuitry in the laptop is smart enough to differenciate and "see" what you are using and never complains. I assume that if this was a real problem there would some sort of warning. Now I feel even more confortable not to have to lug around the 90W brick

Good point, after reading your post here I remembered a situation where a friend used the adapter from his 2 yr old Dell, with his new Dell, and got a warning just like you suggested.

And yes, that's exactly what it's all about for me, is minimizing all the "stuff" I travel with.

#24 Post by **RonS** » Tue May 23, 2006 10:56 am

I believe that the difference falls largely with the graphics chip. T60p machines have the v5200, whos peak pwer requirement is about 11 watts more than the x1300. Figuring for worst-case, that 90w power supply has to keep up with a 15" screen, fans at maximum, the CPU and GPU running at full tilt, speakers going and the DVD and Hard drive drive spinning. Not to mention USB peripherals and the four possible wireless devices (IR, BT, Wi-Fi, Verizon), and on and on.

If you use a 65W power supply with a T60p (or maybe even a high-end T60) and put, say, Call of Duty in the CD/DVD drive, you may fry something, probably the power supply. Ohm's law is not just a good idea. It's a law.

#25 Post by **archer6** » Tue May 23, 2006 11:12 am

RonS wrote:If you use a 65W power supply with a T60p (or maybe even a high-end T60) and put, say, Call of Duty in the CD/DVD drive, you may fry something, probably the power supply. Ohm's law is not just a good idea. It's a law.

Thanks for the reminder (Ohm's law) you made me laugh at myself on that one!

I got so focused on the blah blah blah, that I drifted away from that very basic principle...

heyzeus123 · #26 Post by **heyzeus123** » Tue Jun 13, 2006 3:23 pm

I just order the lighter weight 65W AC adapter for our new Z60t (intergrated graphics). I think it should work since I think the extra amps/watts from the 90w adapter is for a Thinkpad Dock or Mini-Dock, neither of which we have.

I can easily see that a 90W adapter is REQUIRED for Thinkpad Dock and Mini-Dock that have built-in Video and Audio card! Not to mention the powered USB devices, 2nd ultrabay battery, and that some docks support a 2nd hard drive!!!

Michael

redburgundy · #27 Post by **redburgundy** » Tue Jun 13, 2006 3:58 pm

ssimon wrote: Interestingly enough, if you go to the Battery tool it correctly identifies the 65W adapter, same as it does when using the 90W

Can you explain what you mean by the "battery tool"?

90W AC Adapter or 120W AC Adapter

90W AC Adapter or 120W AC Adapter

Re: 90W AC Adapter or 120W AC Adapter

thanks

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