Thinkpads Forum

I read a bunch of posts about this. There was some discussion here in the T60 forum a while ago, and there's a lengthy discussion in the X60 forum.

Still, the question bears repeating because the new processor release seems to be so imminent.

Would you order a T60 today (August, 2006), or wait possibly just a couple of weeks for the Core2 Duo?

I actually did order a T60 today, but am debating whether to cancel the order now that I've read some stuff about the Core2.

Isn't it the case that Microsoft's new OS will run 64 bit?

Is there any way to tell when Lenovo plans to release Core2-based laptops? Some articles say August/September.

Is there any way to know whether the T60 will be upgradable? (Some posts here say yes, some say no) Most of the discussion is in the X60 forum, and it seems like they have a soldered processor in that model, whereas the T60 does not?

I know this is sort of a heated topic. Whenever people have asked me similar questions in the past, I've always told them to buy what they need now, and not to worry about what tiny incremental updates might be around the corner. I am worried though that it might just be a little dumb of me to lay out a significant amount of money for a new laptop when a major evolutionary change might be just a few days away.

Thanks for your thoughts on this.

I bought my $3000 T60p last week. I was stuggeling with the same issue. But I decided to get the T60p now. The reasons I decided to get the machine now were:
- I needed to get a new laptop for the new college year, preferably sooner, because I'm participating in a summer international design workshop.
- Vista isnt coming out any time soon.
- The Merom will be released in august. IBM/lenovo has to develop and test the new T61, the machine has to be produced and shipped all over the world etc. So I think before you, as a consumer, will be able to get the T61 it will be close to november.
- And I just cant stand waiting!

Yes the Merom is pincompatible with current Yonah motherboards, so there is a chance that Lenovo will create a BIOS update which will support the CPU upgrade. But my machine has 3 years of warranty, and I'm not going to void my warranty by upgrading the CPU. Plus I have my doubts Lenovo will release the BIOS upgrade, why would they?

I guess it comes down to if you need the machine now, this moment, if you can work on your old system for around 4 more months, I would wait. If you need it now, get the T60.

As you mentioned near the end of your post, the decision tree for this is pretty simple:

Do you need the machine NOW and will the machine suit your needs?
If yes, order machine.
If no, wait.

If you are in doubt as to whether you need the machine immediately, then you don't.

Of course, that's all contingent on you wanting to make a rational decision. Otherwise, buy what you want when you can afford it and be happy .

The CPU is NOT upgradeable because it is not socketed - it is soldered to the mobo. Perhaps you could change out the mobo for a new Merom-based mobo, but that's unlikely.

I agree with foodle....you only buy a computer when you need it. If you can wait a couple months, then wait for the Merom (Core 2 Duo). If you need one now, get the Core Duo.

As to rvacha, I was under the impression that the CPU in the T60 was socketed (i.e., removeable), whereas in the X60 series the CPU was soldered, and not removeable. Is my understanding correct?

NeoMatrix

rvacha wrote:The CPU is NOT upgradeable because it is not socketed - it is soldered to the mobo. Perhaps you could change out the mobo for a new Merom-based mobo, but that's unlikely.

Sorry to rock your boat, but the T60's CPU most certainly is socketed. The X60 is soldered.

I believe that I read that you might be able to upgrade to the Merom, but I will not stand behind that comment. I would try searching for T60 and Merom.

Could someone please summarize for me the advantages of the new Core 2 Duo (Merom) processors. I personally have no need for a more powerful processor -- I'm doing fine with my T42 Pentium M 1.8 GHz processor (which I understand is already two processor upgrades behind) -- but would be interested to learn about this much-hyped and apparently substantially advanced processor. Aside from more processing power, are there other useful atttributes, such as less heat, better battery life, better networking, etc? Thanks.

chrisnyc wrote:Could someone please summarize for me the advantages of the new Core 2 Duo (Merom) processors. I personally have no need for a more powerful processor -- I'm doing fine with my T42 Pentium M 1.8 GHz processor (which I understand is already two processor upgrades behind) -- but would be interested to learn about this much-hyped and apparently substantially advanced processor. Aside from more processing power, are there other useful atttributes, such as less heat, better battery life, better networking, etc? Thanks.

Those first two. Networking is in the chipset and the software, not the main processor.

1.) 64-bit extensions
2.) Larger L2 Cache (still shared by the cores)
3.) Santa Rosa Merom *platform* release in 2007 Q1 should have an Intel 802.11n chipset. (The networking card for wireless was part of the "Centrino" platform and, technically, is one of the components required to have it be a "true" Intel mobile platform; the other two components being the CPU and the GPU).
4.) Higher stats on the benchmarks.

That is just about all you get from the upgrade. For now, I would stick with your 1.8GHz T42 as it is doing just fine; upgrade when you foresee the immediate need to in a short period of time

I would really like to try it out when its available...but I don't think I will change my T60 anytime soon cuz its running very fast already for my needs (and my wallet is not willing *sigh*)

Just today, I just got a Pentium M Z60t of one of my staff from Lenovo since their prices have gone down alot. While "obsolete", I think Pentium M is very capable in running basic office tasks anyways.

I will not post my sources but I have an internal Lenovo document from April 2006 that shows transition guidance.

Please do not take my reply as "set in stone." This is my interpretation from the documents I've read:

- New X series tablet platform --> 4Q 2006
- Next X series platform --> 1Q 2007
- Next T series platform --> 2Q 2007
- Next R series platform --> 1Q 2007
- Next Z-t series platform --> 2Q 2007
- Next Z-m series platform --> 2Q 2007

chrisnyc wrote:Could someone please summarize for me the advantages of the new Core 2 Duo (Merom) processors.

christopher_wolf wrote:1.) 64-bit extensions
2.) Larger L2 Cache (still shared by the cores)
3.) Santa Rosa Merom *platform* release in 2007 Q1 should have an Intel 802.11n chipset. (The networking card for wireless was part of the "Centrino" platform and, technically, is one of the components required to have it be a "true" Intel mobile platform; the other two components being the CPU and the GPU).
4.) Higher stats on the benchmarks.
For now, I would stick with your 1.8GHz T42 as it is doing just fine

I agree with christopher_wolf ... completely...

Now for my version...
1) Increase Intel's Revenue
2) Give the Media something to rave about (or not?)
3) Make those of us with the 60 series wished we would have waited (perhaps)
3) Cause me to wish I was not an early adopter (but remain one)
4) Increase my drycleaners revenue, removing the drool stains from my shirts

The performance increase (Tomshardware posted some benchmark results against yonah) is not drastic at all when compared to yonah, %5-7 increase. As Toms comment, I beleive that the yonah will keep its value for a long time

techflavor wrote:- New X series tablet platform --> 4Q 2006
- Next X series platform --> 1Q 2007
- Next T series platform --> 2Q 2007
- Next R series platform --> 1Q 2007
- Next Z-t series platform --> 2Q 2007
- Next Z-m series platform --> 2Q 2007

I assume the new platform is the upgrade T60->T61. So that's a pretty long wait ...

I'm still torn whether I should sit it out or buy right now, although for me the bigger question is whether lenovo will use a better display on the 14.1" SXGA+ T6x models ... (i.e. flexview)

ischg wrote:
I assume the new platform is the upgrade T60->T61. So that's a pretty long wait ...

I'm still torn whether I should sit it out or buy right now, although for me the bigger question is whether lenovo will use a better display on the 14.1" SXGA+ T6x models ... (i.e. flexview)

Remember that the internal document I have is from April 2006--things could have changed since that date. However, in my opinion, I don't think the T61/X61 will be out anytime soon (like the end of Aug. like others are mentioning).

I never buy a computer when new processors just come out, it makes no sense. Vista isn't coming any time soon, and the capabilities of Vista rely more on ram and the visual processor than the cpu. Also, what real benefit are you getting from a new processor? 10 minutes more batterylife? It seems like every so called "upgrade" really isn't revolutionary enough for me to spend money on it. If they come out with a new processor that is 25-50% more effecient than what they have now, I will take a look.

BTW I am typing this on my new T60, this is the best [censored] computer I ever bought. And without making a new thread, finger oils seem to get on the lid, how do I clean them off?

My main concern is actually not the processor (they're compatible, so in theory I could upgrade later myself).

The T60 seems to be an awesome machine, but as far as I've read, the 15" SXGA+ flexview screen is far superior to the 14.1" SXGA+ panel. If I'd have to pick a T60 right now, I'd choose a 15" model with flexview (although it's heavier than the 14.1" model). I just want to make sure that there won't be a new T6x coming out within the next couple that has a 14.1" flexview panel.

ischg wrote:My main concern is actually not the processor (they're compatible, so in theory I could upgrade later myself).

The T60 seems to be an awesome machine, but as far as I've read, the 15" SXGA+ flexview screen is far superior to the 14.1" SXGA+ panel. If I'd have to pick a T60 right now, I'd choose a 15" model with flexview (although it's heavier than the 14.1" model). I just want to make sure that there won't be a new T6x coming out within the next couple that has a 14.1" flexview panel.

I didn't even notice the flexview mentioned in the website. I assumed IBM would use them on all the new thinkpads. I have the 14" sxga, it is a bit washed out, but I will still use it.