Thinkpads Forum

I'd be grateful if you could help me deciding.

Right now I have a T42 15.0" Flexview. I know that none of the widescreen models have Flexview, so my question is should I get the T60 with widescreen or without, but with Flexview?

I use my Thinkpad 90% for work and 10% for watching DVDs.

Thanks for help!

I love the Flexview, but since you already have one why not go for the Widescreen?

But, why upgrade at all? The T42 is a fantastic machine. If you're looking for a performance boost, you probably will notice little or no real-world difference between the T42 and a T60, unless your work involves heavy use of graphics.

I'd have to agree with Ron. I have a T42 15" Flexview and a T60 Flexview. The T60 is a little more responsive, but I didn't get the big boost in performance that I expected doing day-to-day engineering tasks, and what I did get is likely from having 2 Gb in the T60 versus the 1 Gb in the T42 (I was always on the 1 GB threshold). Also, I (personally) don't think the T60 FlexView is as nice as my T42's was*.

And then there's the hassle of migrating to a new machine...

Don't take this to mean that I don't love my T60, but just that the improvement is incremental.

* it's dead right now

I agree that the T60 won't be much faster than the T42. I just got a T60 with 1.66GHz Core Duo and 2x512MB RAM, and it actually seems slower than my T43 with 1.86GHz P-M and 2x1GB RAM. My guess is that's because the T43 has twice as much RAM.

However, AlexanderT, if you want to upgrade because you've been using the same T42 for too long and want to play with a new toy, then you should get the widescreen T60 because it's more different than the conventional T60. The widescreen T60 would feel more refreshing.

I think there is a pretty significant performance boost going from a T42p to a machine with a core 2 duo processor. I don't have experience specifically with the T60, but I recently set up an HP dv2130us (very nice machine btw) which has 1 gig ram, a T5500 core 2 duo 1.66 ghz processor, a 5400 rpm hard drive and intel graphics using shared memory. I was surprised by how this machine just blew away my venerable T42p (see below for configuration) in things like installing, and more importantly, loading programs like firefox, office 07. The core 2 machine was much snappier even with a slower hard drive. Also installing (not downloading) updates from Microsoft update went noticeably faster on the core 2 machine. So I would expect there to be a similar substantial gain with a T60 with a core 2 duo processor, especially one with a 4 mb L2 cache. Playing with this HP really made me want to replace my T42p.

My T42 is an 1.5GHz Intel Centrino machine, the T60 I am looking at (8744) is a 2.0GHz Core 2 Duo. Both machines are from the company, so it's essentially the company who is upgrading my notebook, and I am free to pick between 4:3 (flex) and wide.

I've been a huge fan of IPS technology ever since I got T42 three years ago, and that's why I decided to ask you guys first before making the switch to the non-IPS wide screen.

Pae77,
Systems with integrated graphics is just not very balanced in my opinion. But it would be nice if more applications - like Matlab - could take advantage of dual core processors. Personally couldn't care less if it is 1 or 3 secs loading firefox, but i see your point.

AlexanderT,
I had similar thoughts.. Here's a widescreen Z61m vs. T42 (t42 on the left): http://www.notebookreview.com/assets/12906.jpg
It will give you an idea of the color differences perhaps.

Well, if i had to choose a T60/p today i wouldn't know what to do. A lot of people here suddenly seem dissatisfied with a sparkling effect of the LG/Philips FlexView SXGA+ screens on the T60, but it remains unclear if it was a defect on a few units. The widescreen is a TN panel. Also, i think that it is too bad Lenovo offers no WUXGA screens, even if it was TN.
Conclusion: I'd buy a SXGA+ 15". If it is too bad, return it..... then wait and see what Lenovo is going to do about the UXGA issues. The WSXGA+ is a temporary solution, it seems.

Troels, thank you for the screenshots. Compared to the Flexview screen, the widescreen looks definitely washed out. What a bummer.

Btw, Lenovo does offer one Thinkpad with WUXGA, the Thinkpad Z60p. But given that it's a 15.4" screen, it's way to tiny for my eyes.

I think I will go with the widescreen, because I've never had one before, and I could really use the additional screen area.

Troels wrote:Pae77,
Well, if i had to choose a T60/p today i wouldn't know what to do. A lot of people here suddenly seem dissatisfied with a sparkling effect of the LG/Philips FlexView SXGA+ screens on the T60, but it remains unclear if it was a defect on a few units. The widescreen is a TN panel. Also, i think that it is too bad Lenovo offers no WUXGA screens, even if it was TN.

I really don't understand what people are talking about when they speak of a sparkling effect on the FlexView screen. I have the SXGA+ FlexView on a new T60p and the screen is stunning and so is the performance. I upgraded from a T42p with UXGA Flexview screen which was a great screen but not nearly as bright nor were the colors as rich, vibrant, and saturated as the SXGA+ screen. I did a comparison which included the widescreen as well as the FlexView screens which you can find here:

http://forum.thinkpads.com/viewtopic.php?t=34530

Wow, thanks for the link, WPWoodJr!

So if I understand your results correctly, the T60 15.4" 1680x1050 screen (which I am considering), with

Black 0.31 cd/m2
White 165.94 cd/m2
Contrast ratio: 535:1
Avg dE: 4.5

is almost as vibrant as the T60 15" Flexview 1400x1050 (which I still have right now) screen, with

Black 0.29 cd/m2
White 162.01 cd/m2
Contrast ratio: 558:1
Avg dE: 4.13

AlexanderT wrote: So if I understand your results correctly, the T60 15.4" 1680x1050 screen (which I am considering), with

...

is almost as vibrant as the T60 15" Flexview 1400x1050 (which I still have right now) screen, with

The widescreen is a very nice screen of its type. It is bright and has a decent viewing angle. Like other screens of its type, it's color temperature is overly blue and it has a restricted color gamut. The FlexView screen has far superior viewing angles, color gamut, and color temperature; better for photography, games, or movie viewing.

I read your article on color profiling and I am impressed. Alas, most people, including myself, have probably no clue or means to do the correct profiling. I am tending towards buying the 15.4" screen, just because I have never had a widescreen notebook before and I feel like I should give it a try. I am a bit sad to give up my IPS screen, especially because I've also used it quite a lot for watching movies.

One of the things that impressed me the most about the FlexView is that it does not really require color profiling. It seems to be very close to the sRGB (Windows) standard out-of-the-box.

AlexanderT wrote: is almost as vibrant as the T60 15" Flexview 1400x1050 (which I still have right now) screen...

Are you talking about your T42 FlexView screen? Is that the UXGA screen? Because I have that screen too and it is not as good as the T60 FlexView screen from a color accuracy and brightness perspective. See the thread I referenced above for details.

My old one is a T42 with a 1400x1050 Flexview screen, that's SXGA+ I think.

The one I am most likely to purchase next week is a T60 with a 15.4" 1680 x 1050 (WSXGA+) TFT screen.

Cool, that's a nice machine.

AlexanderT wrote:My old one is a T42 with a 1400x1050 Flexview screen, that's SXGA+ I think.

Yes, that's SXGA+.

AlexanderT wrote:The one I am most likely to purchase next week is a T60 with a 15.4" 1680 x 1050 (WSXGA+) TFT screen.

1680x1050 is the optimal resolution for 15.4" screens. I know because my Dell laptop has a 1920x1200 (WUXGA) 15.4" display and things are too small. On the other hand, the 1440x900 of the 15.4" MacBook Pro is too low.

pianowizard wrote:1680x1050 is the optimal resolution for 15.4" screens. I know because my Dell laptop has a 1920x1200 (WUXGA) 15.4" display and things are too small. On the other hand, the 1440x900 of the 15.4" MacBook Pro is too low.

I was struggling between the T60 with 1680x1050 and the Z60p with 1920x1200. Because my eyesight is limited, and because I like the sturdy feel of the T series, I decided for the T60.

AlexanderT wrote:I was struggling between the T60 with 1680x1050 and the Z60p with 1920x1200. Because my eyesight is limited, and because I like the sturdy feel of the T series, I decided for the T60.

Good decision. 1920x1200 really makes much more sense for 17" displays.

how much lighter is the T60 widescreen compared to the standard 15" T60? I already checked the Tabook but I'd like to hear a real-world opinion.