T60P WS - Keep It or Send It Back?

[pianowizard]

I now find out that I have "TN craps". What is an even worse though is that almost everything I would replace this laptop with now, and into the future, would have "TN craps".

No one on this forum is as picky about LCD quality than Puppy; just look up his previous posts. Also look up threads comparing LG and Samsung 15.4" WSXGA+ screens, where you'd see that most people are happy about their LG screens.

I think you'd dislike your T60p's LG screen only if you've been using Flexview screens exclusively for a long time (like Puppy's case).

[2 Bricks Short]

With the exception of employer provided work equipment, the Flexview is all that I have used for about three years. I understand how Puppy may feel. I really love my Flexview too. I have been using this Acer temporary computer that I bought and the screen, while tolerable, isn't as good. I would hope that the computer in the box is better.

[pianowizard]

With the exception of employer provided work equipment, the Flexview is all that I have used for about three years. I understand how Puppy may feel.

Ah, I think we can now answer this question you raised in your original post: "Would the 2623 DDU with a processor upgrade be the hot ticket?". YES! Lenovo Outlet still has some for $1,900 or less. Grab one before it's sold out!

[okashira]

With the exception of employer provided work equipment, the Flexview is all that I have used for about three years. I understand how Puppy may feel. I really love my Flexview too. I have been using this Acer temporary computer that I bought and the screen, while tolerable, isn't as good. I would hope that the computer in the box is better.

It's not that bad. but the TN is simply the worst/cheapest out of all the LCD tech's. that's not to say the TN on the 15.4 may be better then say some 4 yr old PVA panel.

but one thing is for sure, the 15.4 'in the box' would be a downgrade from your FV.

[Bing0]

Will I wish that I had waited for Santa Rosa?

While I agree with evforme that Santa Rosa won't offer huge improvements over what we have now, I am concerned that the release might accelerate the depreciation of pre-Santa Rosa laptops. For example, new laptops normally lose about 40% of their value during the first year, but yours might lose say 50% instead. Also, my coworker just bought a 15.4" T60 and I must say it's one of the ugliest Thinkpads I've ever seen.

So, 2 Bricks Short, my vote is for keeping the T60p WS sealed in the box and returning it. Wait for a 14" WS T61 with Santa Rosa. But of course, you should also consider others' suggestions.

I agree here with pianowizard.
I also agree that there is always something new.
But:
I suspect that history and people who care (such as the members of this forum) will consider the T60P with Flexview ...and especially UXGA, the last and latest true Thinkpads.

I could very easily be wrong and I hope that I am. But still the used value of any of these computers will always be more. They will be worth more monetarily and otherwise simply because they are what they are. ...more valuable and something less attainable.

Don't misunderstand me, I am not saying that a T60P with Flexview is an investment like real estate or anything.
I am only saying that when compared to anything out by Dell or hp, these will still be highly desirable machines for several years.

...you will be able to buy your widescreen T60P (or T61P...or whatever) indefinitely. You will not be able to buy the UXGA Flexview with the 256 MB graphics card new for a deal like this again...ever. >>>>>>[2623DDU on Lenovo outlet site]

I have said it in other threads but again I really do feel fortunate to have found this deal.

[2 Bricks Short]

With the exception of employer provided work equipment, the Flexview is all that I have used for about three years. I understand how Puppy may feel.

Ah, I think we can now answer this question you raised in your original post: "Would the 2623 DDU with a processor upgrade be the hot ticket?". YES! Lenovo Outlet still has some for $1,900 or less. Grab one before it's sold out!

O.k. So I grab one. How hard will it be to change the processor? And by the time I do that upgrade, add 1 gig of memory and upgrade the DVD, will I wish that I had suffered with the TN display and maybe bought an external monitor to go with it.

[evforme]

I've found myself in a very similar situation. It seems like for most of the reviews, there's only maybe at most a 10-15% increase in performance between the same clocked Core Duo vs. Core 2 Duo. Unless you have a specific need for the 64-bit extensions, I don't think the upgrade is really worth the $300 or so. You're probably better off spending the money on more RAM and hd space.

[2 Bricks Short]

O.K. I have seen the light. Back it goes. I will order the 2633DDU. Now. Can someone tell me where I can get a processor installed?

[Bing0]

O.k. So I grab one. How hard will it be to change the processor? And by the time I do that upgrade, add 1 gig of memory and upgrade the DVD, will I wish that I had suffered with the TN display and maybe bought an external monitor to go with it.

I am going to use mine for 6 months and then check the prices on the T7600. It will give me something to look forward to and it will probably be way cheaper by then.

If not the T7600 then maybe at least the T7400.

[2 Bricks Short]

I don't know why but I did it. I got a Monday ship date. I'll believe it when I see it. In the meantime I will hope that I can get an RMA number for the sealed box that I have.

You have no idea how hard this was to do for someone like me. This thing will be a year old before I ever get it. I still need to buy a processor and a stick of memory.

I have to keep reminding myself that it is all about the screen.

[Puppy]

No one on this forum is as picky about LCD quality than Puppy; just look up his previous posts.

I have got a good reputation I've been always picky on monitors and (later) notebook screens. Sometimes I work 12 hours in a row so I prefer something you can look at.

Yeah, it is true that most people probably would be happy with other screen than FlexView but side-by-side comparison is usually depressive ... Probably the worse are contrast and backlight uniformity. The main advantage of IBMs FlexView screens was persistent quality. Notebook TN panels (as you can see with the LG versus Samsung lottery) has very different quality so you don't know what you get. Don't mention different dead pixel appearance on TN and other technologies.

It is sad that TN technology is still used for notebooks while we currently have at least other three better technologies I've read that Sony is considering OLED displays for ultra-portable VAIOs. It might be good start to get rid of such problems at all.

[Puppy]

Lenovo IBM Thinkpad T60 Widescreen Review (with 15" WSXGA+ LG panel)
http://www.notebookreview.com/default.asp?newsID=3637

Well, the backlight leakage is not that bad comparing to 14" SXGA+

[2 Bricks Short]

No one on this forum is as picky about LCD quality than Puppy; just look up his previous posts.

I have got a good reputation I've been always picky on monitors and (later) notebook screens. Sometimes I work 12 hours in a row so I prefer something you can look at.

Yeah, it is true that most people probably would be happy with other screen than FlexView but side-by-side comparison is usually depressive ... Probably the worse are contrast and backlight uniformity. The main advantage of IBMs FlexView screens was persistent quality. Notebook TN panels (as you can see with the LG versus Samsung lottery) has very different quality so you don't know what you get. Don't mention different dead pixel appearance on TN and other technologies.


It is sad that TN technology is still used for notebooks while we currently have at least other three better technologies I've read that Sony is considering OLED displays for ultra-portable VAIOs. It might be good start to get rid of such problems at all.

Well. I saw and heard enough from you and others that told me that I was headed for grief. Too many years with the 42p would make me be dissatisfied with this WS. I went ahead and ordered the 15" 2623DDU from the outlet. I'll deal with a processor change out when the time is right.

Thanks for bringing me back from the brink.

[XiP]

I was about to get the T60p IPS in the outlet and upgrading the processor to core 2 duo just like you, until I saw the z61p's 1920x1200 screen. I read somewhere that the screen quality on the z61p is almost as good as the uxga IPS on the t60p so I got the z61p instead. I also needed the widescreen and C2D without upgrading it myself.

[2 Bricks Short]

I can't think of the last time I really wished that I had a widescreen. That being said, tomorrow I will think of a good reason to keep the WS that I am about to send back. I still plan to get a WS desktop monitor (Dell 2007WFP) for the times when I need the extra real estate.

[pianowizard]

until I saw the z61p's 1920x1200 screen. I read somewhere that the screen quality on the z61p is almost as good as the uxga IPS on the t60p so I got the z61p instead.

You understand how insanely small things will look on that screen, right? My 15.4" Dell Inspiron 6000 has the same resolution and it took me two months to get used to it. Now I love it because I can view so many things on the screen. Still, I run out of desktop space now and then, so I just bought a 1600x1200 Samsung external LCD to get even more real estate!

[XiP]

until I saw the z61p's 1920x1200 screen. I read somewhere that the screen quality on the z61p is almost as good as the uxga IPS on the t60p so I got the z61p instead.

You understand how insanely small things will look on that screen, right? My 15.4" Dell Inspiron 6000 has the same resolution and it took me two months to get used to it. Now I love it because I can view so many things on the screen. Still, I run out of desktop space now and then, so I just bought a 1600x1200 Samsung external LCD to get even more real estate!

Yeah I got used to 15" UXGA on my old a31p

[pianowizard]

Yeah I got used to 15" UXGA on my old a31p

Things on a 15.4" WUXGA screen look much much smaller than the UXGA on your A31p, which I've used.