Buy T60 or wait for T61 ?

[Silenceofdk]

Hey guys,

I'm new to this wonderful forum and I've already got a question

I'm currently about to buy my first ever thinkpad and am currently in a pickle.

I'm thinking of buying the following:

Link to webshop -

ThinkPad T60 - Modell: 2007-C1G (UT0C1GE)
Intel Core 2 Duo T7200 2 GHz, 667 MHz Front Side Bus, 4 MB-L2-Cache
1 GB PC2-5300 DDR2-SDRAM 667 MHz, max. 4 GB
100 GB SATA, 5.400U/min - Active Protection System
14.1" TFT-Farbdisplay, SXGA+ (1400x1050)
ATI Mobility Radeon X1400 - 128 MB SD-DDRAM
9 cell battery

But what do u guys think?

But now after reading some posts in this forum I've started thinking that I should perhaps wait for the T61 to come out.

I don't want a desktop replacement but just a laptop for school and coding and generel use - So no games But speed and battery life do matter to me

I've heard the T61 is going to be built on the Santa rosa platform but what do u think, should I wait or wont it make that much a difference ?

Wait or buy ?

[BlueDevilTide]

Welcome to the forum!

The biggest factor to me is form. The T61 will have a 14.1" WS which I believe is smaller than the 14" 4:3. The less weight and more screen space are nice qualities.

If you can wait, I think maybe you should. But if you prefer the regular 4:3 shape, then you could just go for a T60, or perhaps get one after the T61 comes out at significant discount. There will definitely be performance upgrades with Santa Rosa, I just don't know how big they will be.

If there are big changes to the box itself, ie, new ports, more USB, more security/safety features and such, then that would make the T61 a better deal, but I haven't heard much on that side of the fence. Seems to be a performance issue more than anything else.

[ryengineer]

You're the best judge of your mind BUT what I would suggest is that as I know notebooks are quite expensive in Europe so if you're planning to spend your "big bucks" on a Thinkpad; I'll say wait for T61. Also I'm not sure how much the net difference would be in their (T61 vs.T60) prices but the former would certainly be faster machine, if not better in case.

[Silenceofdk]

Well guys.. the thing which is most important to me is that the Laptop lasts. I've just sold a [censored] laptop which kept getting broke.. and that's why I don't mind spending the money on a thinkpad.

Will the T61 be made by Lenovo engineers? Basically I'm asking if it'll be just as robust as the previous Thinkpads. Don't wanna make a mistake and buy something which doesn't reak of quality

I've heard some ppl say that Lenovo are letting down quality on the thinkpads

[sugo]

I'm asking if it'll (T61) be just as robust as the previous Thinkpads.

I am afraid you won't get a reliable answer from end users until perhaps a few months after the launch of T61.

[Silenceofdk]

I am afraid you won't get a reliable answer from end users until perhaps a few months after the launch of T61.

Darn.. But will the T61 have the same chassy as T60?
Another thing you'd expect that the T60 prices will be reduced right?

As ryengineer said, laptops are expensive in Europe.. u don't wanna make a mistake

[pianowizard]

Silenceofdk, if you don't mind waiting for 2 - 3 months, I think you should wait and make a decision after the T61 has come out. You will then have the new T61 models and the existing T60 models to choose from.

[nxman]

If you need a notebook now the T60 is a great machine if you can wait buy the T61

[Johan]

Silence:

If display quality also matters to you - which it certainly does to me! - I suggest you do a search in this forum after "FlexView" or "IPS" (a type of display with wide viewing angle and high density), which are not available for 14.1" SXGA+ models, but are only available in certain 15" models. In particular, see the sticky: http://forum.thinkpads.com/viewtopic.php?t=40808 Note that this sticky primarily focus on ThinkPad's being available in the USA (different models are available in Europe).

If you can accept the slightly heigher weight and size (and power consumption) of a 15" display over a 14.1" type, I'm absolutely certain that you won't regret the choice of the FlexView display. Note that Lenovo are about to discontinue FlexView/IPS displays (e.g. see http://forum.thinkpads.com/viewtopic.php?t=40693)... so you won't have the option of choosing this type of display on the forthcoming T61's.

Update: I just stumbled across two threads, which you'd probably want to read - if interested in the FlexView-issue:

http://forum.thinkpads.com/viewtopic.php?t=23853 ("Is 15" Flexview really worth it?")

http://forum.thinkpads.com/viewtopic.php?t=40752 ("Is 14 inch SXGA+ 1400 x 1050 screen as good as 15 inch IPS?")

By the way: How long are you prepared to wait for a T61? When will Lenovo actually start delivering these? Are you willing to take delivery of the first T61's where all bugs may perhaps not yet have been fixed? Read the many users comments here about problems with the first T60's which hit the street. Some people (such as I!) sometimes prefer to wait one year and receive a more mature and stable model.

If you choose to purchase a ThinkPad in Germany (which you indicate), you may be faced with issues such as receiving the operating system in German (!!), the embedded ThinkVantage software all being in German, and having a German keyboard... which can of course all be replaced, but at both cost and significent inconvenience. Moreover, there is the warranty issue; if you buy in Germany, then I believe that you'll need to send your computer to Germany for any service - which is of course expensive and slow. I'd suggest that you check these issues carefully before ordering.

Finally, check for Lenovo's "TopSeller" models; picking one of these will give you more for your money, and also a faster delivery.

Good luck with your new T60/T61! I'm quite hapy with my T60 type 2007-QPG, model UT0QPDK - of course having a FlexView/IPS display!

Regards,

Johan

[Silenceofdk]

Hello Johan, and thank you for your lengthy and in-deepth reply.

I did think of a Flexview but I've heard that the 15.1" screen use up a lot more power than the normalt 14 " which leeds to a lot less battery time. My computer is to be used for my school so battery time is a important factor.

I'm willing to wait about 2-3 months for the IBM, but I'm buying it through my work and I plan on quitting about sept.. so I don't wanna buy it and quit right away Wouldn't be fair. But I'm thinking on waiting for the T61 anyways since they should lead to a drop in price of the T60 models. Perhaps they'll even be better than the T61. But if I read about a lot of problems I think I'll buy the T60.

In regards to buying the computer in Germany:
I don't mind the Operating system being in German since I have MSDN academy access so I've got a Vista Business and Xp Pro license anyways - The Thinkvantage software can be downloaded in english or danish I presume? And the keyboard layout acts danish even though the key's don't show it

I just think the prices in Denmark are fu**** to say the least. I can save +1000€ by buying the laptop in Germany. And since IBM has a worldwide service I can return the laptop in Denmark I presume, but I'll call and ask them anyways.

Did u buy your Laptop straight from Lenovo in Denmark ?

[s0larian]

if you buy in Germany, then I believe that you'll need to send your computer to Germany for any service - which is of course expensive and slow. I'd suggest that you check these issues carefully before ordering.

This is rubbish, please just tell people what you know and not what you believe. IBM/Lenovo has worldwide warranty.

[Johan]

@ s0larian:

Thank you for your kind comment. I sincerely regret if I wrote something which you believe is not true – but I am happy to be corrected by anyone who knows better. Also, kindly note that I wrote: “I believe that you'll have…” which I don’t consider stating a completely, fixed fact. I only intended to point Silence’s attention towards a potential problem.

The fact is (and now we’re speaking facts!), that I wrote as I did on basis of an e-mail received from Lenovo/Denmark on April 16, 2007 where I inquired about this warranty issue. Recently, I was considering buying another ThinkPad, here in Denmark, which originated from the USA (the origin is evident from a “Warranty Status” – via http://www-307.ibm.com/pc/support/site. ... yle=lenovo stating “Location = USA” of this particular ThinkPad). The shop where I was considering buying this ThinkPad (laptops.dk) is known for carrying out “parallel-import” of ThinkPad’s from abroad, and selling these somewhat cheaper compared to Danish shops trading through Lenovo/Denmark. This is known to previously having caused trouble for users in the case of needing service from IBM (see http://forum.thinkpads.com/viewtopic.php?t=39295). So, I was wondering: How about me… if buying this “Location = USA” ThinkPad here in Denmark… what about warranty from IBM/Denmark in this case?

Lenovo responded (my translation): “This machine is correctly covered by the international warranty, but it is registered as being an USA-machine, which means that is case of needing a warranty-service this will need to be done in the USA. The international warranty covers the case where you are abroad with your machine.”

I (implicitly!) agree with you that this is strange… “International Warranty” ought to cover wherever and whenever, but the above is nevertheless what Lenovo wrote. I studied the various Lenovo warranty documents - http://www-307.ibm.com/pc/support/site. ... yle=lenovo and http://www-307.ibm.com/pc/support/site. ... MIGR-50059 - but they are all are filled with limitations and various conditions, so it’s hard to extract any unambiguous facts.

Again: Sorry if I wrote something “wrong”; I would be happy to hear from anybody who has either actual experience and/or in-depth knowledge in this matter.

@ Silencedk: I bought my T60 from Proshop.dk – they are very reliable in my experience, and trade through Lenovo/Denmark, so no problems of any kind (confirmed by Lenovo).

Best regards,

Johan

[own6volvos]

I dont see waiting for new models to be such a big deal as the past 2 events. Before it was Pentium M going to Core Duo, but dual core shift. Then it was Core to Core 2 Duo, 32 to 64 bit. Now changes are minimal at best with a slightly higher bus speed, and "true 64bit" to handle more than 3.2gb of ram. Most people are going to be working fine at 1gb with vista (I am), and maybe 2gb if you are doing more intensive stuff. With everything else you arent going to notice much difference at all.

[pianowizard]

Now changes are minimal at best with a slightly higher bus speed, and "true 64bit" to handle more than 3.2gb of ram.

But performance increase isn't the only reason for waiting for the T61's. IMO, the most exciting thing about the T61 is the introduction of a 14.1" WSXGA+ model. Many forum members find such a T series very appealing, and I think it's potentially the most ideal Thinkpad ever made: most likely lighter than the current 14.1" SXGA+ T60, higher resolution, and widescreen. In fact, even if Lenovo were reverting the T61 back to Pentium M, I would still prefer a 14.1" WSXGA+ T61 to my current 14.1" SXGA+ T60!

[iatacs19]

also the changes are designed to improve battery life as well which is always welcome.