Thinkpads Forum

I'm just about to push the button to order a 14.1 SXGA+ T61. Dumb question: can someone lay out the basic pros and cons of the integrated vs discrete graphics?
1. I realize heat and battery life are an issue, but any idea about how much?

2. Is there any effect on screen brightness?
3.Any final resolution as to whether integrated graphics will drive DVI through the mini dock?

My uses: mostly text (word processing, spreadsheets). Never watch a movie or plan to, no gaming. Machine will often be used outdoors.

Any thoughts appreciated...as well as any other input on what I should/should not order. (I'm getting XP w 2 GB in 2 DIMM, 100GB 7200 HD). Cost not really an issues since I keep machines for a long time (I'm still using a 570! -- and if it had more than 640 res I'd just keep using that one!)
Thanks...

2. No, there should be no effect at all on screen brightness.

3. I honestly don't know the answer to this, however I would guess that the Nvidia dedicated graphics would be able to handle a higher external resolution. However, I have heard that the Intel integrated graphics will drive a very high resolution, so for most people it will be more than adequate.

Your configuration sounds good to me, especially for your usage. As far as the graphics go, I would just stick with the Intel integrated-sounds like it will be all you need!

The tabook quotes battery life with integrated graphics at 5.7h, and with Nvidia at 4.0h, so figure on 50% more power consumption with Nvidia (and, yes, that turns into heat that must be vented out).

Given that you are still using a 570, I suspect that you gaming plans are not very intense. Given that, I would recommend going with integrated graphics, provided that the other options you want are available with integrated configuration.

I agree, you don't need to go for a dedicated graphic chip if you don't plan game. GMA X3100 is powerfull enough to drive all screen resolutions and run Windows Vista Aero Glass. For your use, advantage of the GMA are :
- Low power consommation
- Bettery battery life
- Less heat
- Less noise

Disadvantage : none !

Its only a shame that its more difficult to get a high speced machine otherwise if you want integrated graphics (although I guess thats not too much of an issue for your uses).

DVI should be supported on Intel Graphics on T61 (I say should as I have not personally tested it but T60 supported it and the connection is shown on the electrical diagram I have).

The only thing worth maybe thinking about for the future is that there are no plans for HD-DVD or Bluray to be supported with Intel Graphics.

bill333 wrote:I'm just about to push the button to order a 14.1 SXGA+ T61. Dumb question: can someone lay out the basic pros and cons of the integrated vs discrete graphics?
1. I realize heat and battery life are an issue, but any idea about how much?

...

My uses: mostly text (word processing, spreadsheets). Never watch a movie or plan to, no gaming. Machine will often be used outdoors.

Go with the integrated. I get around 3-3.5 hours of battery life (tested via a 3 hour flight from FL->NY yesterday, movies playing the whole time!) on a 6-cell battery, using the Discrete graphics; however, your uses don't warrant spending the extra money, as well as adding to the heat and power consumption that the Discrete card will bring. Basically, when in doubt, go with integrated.

I am pretty sure all gentlemen have covered everything here.

Let me pitch in with my first hand experiences with both integrated and discrete graphics on T61 /p respectively. Battery life on T61 with GMA 965 is exceptionally very very good as compared to T61 /p counterparts with nVidia chipsets. I had a test model of T61 (GMA 965) in my hands for few days and I was able to do 4:40 mins. on 6 cell battery with loweset,--- CPU speed, balanced Performance, System fan and system temperature levels with 70% brightness level for 90% battery time and to the lowest for the remaining 10%. The machine was connected to a LAN and was in use all the time.

Also, I believe GMA 965 can easily outclass GMA 950 (speaking from experience) and any other T60/T61/p in terms of battery performance. This is the best battery result on these models, atleast that I have seen so far.

I am interested in seeing the VISTA scores of Graphics (Desktop performance for Windows Aero) and Gaming graphics (3D business and gaming graphics performance) obtained from both GMA 950 and GMA 965.

Can anyone post your VISTA scrores of the following?

T60 with GMA 950 : Graphics ? Gaming graphics ?
T61 with GMA 965 : Graphics ? Gaming graphics ?

It will help some people as well. Thanks.

ryengineer wrote:I had a test model of T61 (GMA 965) in my hands for few days and I was able to do 4:40 mins. on 6 cell battery

Thanks! I ordered a 4:3 14.1" SXGA+ T61 GMA yesterday since I want to get a T with the longest battery life without battery protruding at the back. I am glad to hear that it will outrun my undervolted T42

Is 2 GIG enough memory? Should I spend the extra $$ to get it on one chip, so I can put more in later if I want to?

and I assume the "PC card + express card" is the way to go?

thanks to everyone for the input!

For what you need i'd say 2 gig is enough - the advantage of having the 2GB on one chip is for future upgrades but 2 x 1GB chips will give you better performance due to dual channel mode.

I think so for the slots - I don't see the point of having the smart card or memory card reader built into one of these slots even when you need one as you can easily add them via a card and then still have the option of changing later

If it were not for vista, then I'd say the minimum (512MB) would still be plenty for running a word processor. And the core 2 duo is also completely overkill

Right now, 2x1GB is a good choice. Until the next windows release you'll never run out of memory...

Volker wrote:If it were not for vista, then I'd say the minimum (512MB) would still be plenty for running a word processor. And the core 2 duo is also completely overkill

Right now, 2x1GB is a good choice. Until the next windows release you'll never run out of memory...

True ! I look at my T60p cpu activity during working. Most time, it sleeps at 1000 GHz with less then 10% use. Windows XP and some Office 2003 stuff (Word + Excel + Paint Shop Pro + Outlook + IE) only need 512 MB.
For a lot of people, even first Centrino laptops are overkill...

crazyfrog wrote:snip..........Can anyone post your VISTA scrores of the following?

T60 with GMA 950 : Graphics ? Gaming graphics ?
T61 with GMA 965 : Graphics ? Gaming graphics ?.........snip

Vista scores don't do much justification about the performance of a machine. I've seen many machines handling really heavy tools on even lowest Vista scores. But for your curiosity, the T61 I had with GMA 965 did 3.0 for graphics (Aero) and 3.2 for gaming graphics. Nevertheless, GMA 965 works very efficiently, remains solid as a rock under demanding and intensive applications and I will seriously doubt if it fails to deliver under anything other than heavy games. Solemn business users and non gamers looking for performance with good battery life should buy T61 with integrated graphics.

On the other hand, since I have never tried (and seen) running Vista on T60 with integrated graphics so I don't have any figures for it.

sugo wrote:Thanks!...........snip

You're very welcome.

Pascal_TTH wrote:
True ! I look at my T60p cpu activity during working. Most time, it sleeps at 1000 GHz with less then 10% use. Windows XP and some Office 2003 stuff (Word + Excel + Paint Shop Pro + Outlook + IE) only need 512 MB.
For a lot of people, even first Centrino laptops are overkill...

heck yeah with 1000 GHz it is over kill while it sleeps

ryengineer wrote:I am pretty sure all gentlemen have covered everything here.

Let me pitch in with my first hand experiences with both integrated and discrete graphics on T61 /p respectively. Battery life on T61 with GMA 965 is exceptionally very very good as compared to T61 /p counterparts with nVidia chipsets. I had a test model of T61 (GMA 965) in my hands for few days and I was able to do 4:40 mins. on 6 cell battery with loweset,--- CPU speed, balanced Performance, System fan and system temperature levels with 70% brightness level for 90% battery time and to the lowest for the remaining 10%. The machine was connected to a LAN and was in use all the time.

Also, I believe GMA 965 can easily outclass GMA 950 (speaking from experience) and any other T60/T61/p in terms of battery performance. This is the best battery result on these models, atleast that I have seen so far.

what a good news, i am still deciding T or X series for my next laptop purchase

thanks for everyone for their help. Just ordered the T61 and got a ship date estimate of 10/25 -- probably because I ordered the thinkpad a/b/g/n card instead of the intel card.

When I ordered mine, it says Atheros a/b/g/n will cause 4 extra weeks of delay so I went with Atheros a/b/g.

danny_isr wrote:

Pascal_TTH wrote:
True ! I look at my T60p cpu activity during working. Most time, it sleeps at 1000 GHz with less then 10% use. Windows XP and some Office 2003 stuff (Word + Excel + Paint Shop Pro + Outlook + IE) only need 512 MB.
For a lot of people, even first Centrino laptops are overkill...

heck yeah with 1000 GHz it is over kill while it sleeps

Yes, I set it for the next Windows !

I had been requested by few gentlemen they wanted to see results of 3DMark05 and 3DMark06 on T61 with integrated and discrete gpu, here are the results:

3DMark05 on T61 with discrete gpu.

3DMark06 on T61 with discrete gpu.

3DMark05 on T61 with integrated gpu.

3DMark06 on T61 with integrated gpu.

P.S. Please keep in mind as of yet I do not have any specs on the machine configurations they were performed on, they could be pre or post-production models, but one thing is for sure they`re firsthand results.