Thinkpads Forum

Posted: **Tue May 13, 2008 1:37 pm**

Sealed T61 Purchase off Ebay Store:

How do I make sure it was factory "sealed"? They put the original box into a slightly larger box and the extra RAM on the side of the box.

I have the box which seems to be sealed and 2 X 2G Simple Tech memory sticks.

How do I ensure that that this is a REAL FACTORY SEAL? What do I look for / what does it / should it look like?

PS: Its an 8892 02U.

This is the Ebay ID: http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?Vi ... 0237012998

I cant understand why it shows Item ID invalid? I WON IT, I PAID FOR IT, IT GOT DELIVERED. Why should it not show up?

Posted: **Tue May 13, 2008 1:58 pm**

Update from seller:

"I got suspended by ebay for 30 days for a "feedback manipulation" violation. Basically I bought a bunch of low cost items to boost my feedback, and had no idea eBay doesn't allow that. I still have any thinkpad you need, and ill let you know if I'm able to get back up on running with eBay any earlier than the 30 days."

Posted: **Tue May 13, 2008 2:00 pm**

Serial Number and Warranty check out fine on Lenovo.

Type: Model: Serial number:
8892 02U XXXXXXXXX

Status: Expiration date: Location:
In warranty 2010-11-26 UNITED STATES

Posted: **Tue May 13, 2008 2:36 pm**

There was a small layer of sawdust or something like that on certain parts of laptop and almost all of the power brick. Its as if it was made or kept and stored in a place with lots of saw dust.

Posted: **Tue May 13, 2008 9:10 pm**

I still wouldn't buy from him.

Posted: **Tue May 13, 2008 10:36 pm**

crashnburn wrote:There was a small layer of sawdust or something like that on certain parts of laptop and almost all of the power brick. Its as if it was made or kept and stored in a place with lots of saw dust.

if its covered in "saw dust" i doubt it was "factory" sealed.

Posted: **Tue May 13, 2008 11:05 pm**

Would you mind sharing the seller's user ID, someone here might have dealt with him/her and could offer more info...

Posted: **Wed May 14, 2008 9:39 am**

His e-bay id: fastertransaction

The paypal transaction shows the following

Payment To:
Great Amco Inc (The recipient of this payment is Verified)
Seller's ID:
fastertransaction
Seller's Email:
fastertransaction@gmail.com

Box Condition:

Box was sealed with a TAPE going across the main opening all around the box. This tape has slanting RED stripes and the icon of a LOCK in a red circle repeated over the tape.

Box has the 'Thinkpad T61' Sticker with model and same serial number.

Laptop was in Plastic bag with red squared etc on it.

I'm uploading some pics as we speak.

ADD:

Also when I googled Great Amco http://www.google.com/search?q=greatamc ... =firefox-a
I found www.greatamco.com

http://64.233.169.104/search?q=cache:gA ... =firefox-a

Which looks like a variant website of thinkpadworld.

Posted: **Wed May 14, 2008 10:52 am**

PICTURES:

http://picasaweb.google.com/AbhiGlobeTr ... peningPics

There was some saw dust on little bit of the laptop and the Power brick which was not inside any plastic cover like I would expect it to be.

There are / were no CDs at all.

Win XP Pro sticker says Lenovo Singapore on it. I can take a picture if someones interested in seeing that.

The 4G RAM was offered to be installed but I insisted that I needed a sealed laptop box. Hence there were some delays.

1G RAM is installed by default in the 8992 90U. I have 2 x 2G Simpletech Memory sticks that I have yet to install and test.

Posted: **Wed May 14, 2008 11:32 am**

FWIW, no CDs came with my new T60 purchased direct from Lenovo in November 2006.

Posted: **Wed May 14, 2008 11:42 am**

whizkid wrote:FWIW, no CDs came with my new T60 purchased direct from Lenovo in November 2006.

Can you check out the pictures and let me know if the SEAL & CONDITION I am describing for this machine holds good or not.

Posted: **Wed May 14, 2008 11:48 am**

Most of the stickers on recent ThinkPads (T43 on) say "Lenovo Singapore", I haven't even tried to figure out why, but that's what I've been seeing lately.

Very rarely will you have CDs included with the unit, maybe in one out of 500, because they want you to pay for them, IBM had started doing that years ago.

If the machine is OK and the price was right, why don't you just enjoy it...

My $0.02...

Posted: **Wed May 14, 2008 11:54 am**

Hi. I looked at your photos and compared them to the box that my T61p came in direct from Lenovo. The "crumpled paper" that you have was, in my case, laying loose atop the zippered plastic bag in the inner box, and the battery was in a plastic bag.

Your packaging looks very authentic to me.

It looks like they were a little "happy" with the tape, but that small gap may have let dust in, especially if it sat around for a while, and it looks like it may have had some adventures during transportation, too.

Posted: **Wed May 14, 2008 1:30 pm**

So is that Red Tape Genuine?

There are scratches on the Bezel & the Battery. Also the battery was in like this semi torn / used plastic bag. [Please see the pictures].

3 final major questions:

- How do I check the battery - Charging cycles etc. to see its history of usage AND current & future chargeability from this point.? I hear battery / charging cycles on the board every now and then when someone is selling on the market place.

- What would be the best way to do a "Parts Inventory" ? Some software ?

- What would be the best way to do a Burn Test? < You know like the ones we used to do on on desktops to burn them in> ?

PS: I paid a certain price so I want to ensure it was untouched. If it was touched then I want some $$$ back.

Posted: **Wed May 14, 2008 2:31 pm**

just open Power Manager (icon on the taskbar by the time) and you can check battery stuff there. Go to Battery Information (obviously) and you'll see a lil arrow to expand details.

Parts iNventory is going to the Lenovo website. Click downloads and then on the left click parts information - you'll have to type in your machine type and serial number to get all the original parts that came with the machine.

Burn in? eeh... laptops don't really need that if you ask me. Most of the time when i use burn in stuff is to check a system stabilty for one that i built MYSELF. Maybe i might not have slapped something together correctly which could cause issues down the road. Laptops generally don't need that but i guess Memtest86 is just one most people use to burn in new RAM.

Posted: **Wed May 14, 2008 10:12 pm**

SHoTTa35 wrote:just open Power Manager (icon on the taskbar by the time) and you can check battery stuff there. Go to Battery Information (obviously) and you'll see a lil arrow to expand details.

Parts iNventory is going to the Lenovo website. Click downloads and then on the left click parts information - you'll have to type in your machine type and serial number to get all the original parts that came with the machine.

Burn in? eeh... laptops don't really need that if you ask me. Most of the time when i use burn in stuff is to check a system stabilty for one that i built MYSELF. Maybe i might not have slapped something together correctly which could cause issues down the road. Laptops generally don't need that but i guess Memtest86 is just one most people use to burn in new RAM.

The battery details show:
Remaining Capacity: 85.53 Wh
Full Charge Capacity: 85.78 Wh
Manufacture Date: 2007-11-13
First Use Date: 2008-05
Design Capacity: 84.24 Wh

Battery is in Good condition.

I guess I'll do Memtest.

BTW - The red tape sealing shown in the pictures. Is it A-ok?

Posted: **Wed May 14, 2008 10:39 pm**

crashnburn wrote:BTW - The red tape sealing shown in the pictures. Is it A-ok?

Yes, the red tape with the slashes and lock symbol is the original tape used when the machine is first shipped. Not sure if that tape is available elsewhere, but I can definitely confirm that it is what Lenovo uses.

The scratches would definitely concern me, though; so would the torn battery bag.

Posted: **Thu May 15, 2008 1:02 am**

crashnburn wrote:His e-bay id: fastertransaction

The paypal transaction shows the following:

Payment To: Great Amco Inc

The T42p I am referring to in the thread IBM/Denmark deny to honor warranty confirmed by IBM-Support was originally sold by ThinkPad World (via their shop at eBay) and on the invoice it indeed says: GREAT AMCO INC, 12 West 27th Street 5th Floor, New York, NY 10001, (212) 965-1420... confirming that GREAT AMCO INC = ThinkPad World.

About the definition of a "factory sealed" item, see the post by ThinkPad World owner Maurice --> eBay Seller ThinkPadWorld.

Johan

Posted: **Thu May 15, 2008 2:33 pm**

Johan wrote:
crashnburn wrote:His e-bay id: fastertransaction

The paypal transaction shows the following:

Payment To: Great Amco Inc
The T42p I am referring to in the thread IBM/Denmark deny to honor warranty confirmed by IBM-Support was originally sold by ThinkPad World (via their shop at eBay) and on the invoice it indeed says: GREAT AMCO INC, 12 West 27th Street 5th Floor, New York, NY 10001, (212) 965-1420... confirming that GREAT AMCO INC = ThinkPad World.

About the definition of a "factory sealed" item, see the post by ThinkPad World owner Maurice --> eBay Seller ThinkPadWorld.

Johan

I realized that I ended up buying from ThinkpadWorld / Maurice. I spoke to Maurice.

Their definition I read. Again, in terms of the 3 year warranty for the 8992 02U I looked up the serial number and it shows up as 3 years up to end of 2010. Just as he had specified.

It seems to be sealed to me but something smells fishy.

Johan - I have read both those threads in the past. Yes, you did have issues getting international support.

Question is.. if I have a valid serial number that I can verify on IBM Website as showing with warranty upto 2010 should be concerned? Is there a better or more rigorous way to verify warranty?

The 2nd major question is was this really NEW, SEALED, UNUSED?

Maurice / ThinkpadWorld - Do respond if you're here.

Posted: **Thu May 15, 2008 2:38 pm**

I just received this email from Ebay a week after I had completed the transaction:

eBay eBay sent this message to XXXXXX XXXXXX(xxxxxxxxxxx).
Your registered name is included to show this message originated from eBay. Learn more.

MC015 Important Message from eBay Loss Prevention Department

Dear XXXXXXXXXX (XXXXX@yahoo.com),

We're writing to let you know that the listing for the following item you bid on has been removed:

260237012998 - New Lenovo IBM ThinkPad T61 2.2GHz 4GB 100GB SXGA DVDRW

We strongly recommend that you do not complete this purchase. Purchases of items listed on eBay but then completed outside of eBay are extremely risky. They are not covered by eBay buyer protection programs and are highly susceptible to fraud.

For more information on offers to buy or sell outside of eBay, please go to:

http://pages.ebay.com/help/policies/rfe ... -sale.html

***If You Have Already Paid***
If you have already paid for this item but have not received it, you should act quickly to get your money back.

- Contact your bank to stop payment if you paid by check.

- Contact your credit card company if you paid by credit card.

- If you paid by Western Union or MoneyGram, contact the company directly (Western Union 800-325-6000 or MoneyGram 800-926-9400).

- If you paid with PayPal, you may be eligible for up to $2,000 USD coverage at no cost.

1. Log in to your PayPal account.
2. Click the "Resolution Center" tab at the top of the page.
3. Click the "Report a Problem" link.
4. Select "Item Dispute" and click continue. Follow the directions to open a dispute and escalate to a claim.

PayPal claims must be filed within 45 days of the close of the listing. It can take 30 days or more to complete the investigation and resolve the dispute.

Our goal is to keep eBay safe so you can buy confidently. It's rare that something goes wrong with a transaction on eBay. Whenever these events do occur, we try to help as much as possible to resolve the issue.

This is an Automated Response, so please don't reply to this message. If you still have questions, please click the "Contact Us" link at the left of the eBay Help pages.

Thank you for your understanding.

Sincerely,

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Learn how you can protect yourself from spoof (fake) emails at:
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This administrative email was sent to XXXXXXXX@yahoo.com from eBay. Your account is registered on www.ebay.com. As outlined in our User Agreement, eBay will periodically send you information about site changes and enhancements. If you would like to receive this email in text format, change your notification preferences.

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Posted: **Thu May 15, 2008 3:13 pm**

I wrote this to Maurice and to Paypal Dispute resolution:

Maurice:

SHIPPING ISSUES:
Also, if instead of doing the Buy It Now I would've just Bid on it and waited for your package it would have been a total cost of 1099$ + 39.95$ = 1138.95. - NON EXPEDITED PRICE

I specifically asked you for 2-day shipping with Buy It Now (1149$ + 20$) and that it would be shipped immediately. It was delayed and you promised to credit me the difference of 20$.

At the same time if I do the math, the delayed shipment still cost me 1149+20 = 1169. - EXPEDITED PRICE.

You delayed sending out the package and have charged me overall 30.05$ more than what I would have paid for normal purchase & delivery.

PRODUCT ISSUES:
The laptop package was not perfectly sealed:
- It appears this was not Brand New IBM Factory Sealed
- There was sawdust inside the package, some on the laptop, a lot on the power adaptor which typically comes in a plastic bag and it was without one, and saw dust on the extended battery (torn plastic bag)
- There are scratches on the laptop - Large scratch on the front Bezel, and bunch of scratches on the extended battery - Pictures online: http://picasaweb.google.com/AbhiGlobeTr ... peningPics
- Usage smudges on the palm rest and top of the lid
- Wavy scratches on the top of the laptop lid
- I also found that you have a poor reputation as 'ThinkpadWorld' seller online on Ebay. Especially recurring issues of this have been reported on Thinkpad Forums.
- I was seriously considering purchasing a bunch of laptops from you but I am hesitant now.
- I have received a WARNING notice from E-bay Loss Prevention Department "MC015 Important Message from eBay Loss Prevention Department - 5/15/2008" to cancel the transaction and stop payment / Dispute it on my Credit Card & Paypal.

I'd appreciate a clear and quick response or I shall not hesitate to put this up for dispute and at the same time have our company attorney look into this.

Regards,

Abhi

I got this response screen on Paypal: What does it mean?

End Communication and Escalate to a Claim
Your seller is currently unable to respond to this dispute. By escalating your dispute to a claim, you are asking PayPal to review the case and decide the outcome.

PayPal will review the transaction details and may contact you for additional information. We will make every effort to resolve this claim within 30 days.

What Happens Next

PayPal will review your communication with the seller and may contact you for additional information. We will make every effort to resolve this claim within 30 days.
If this claim is decided in your favor, PayPal will make every effort to recover funds from the seller. We will investigate this matter fairly and, if you win, recover whatever funds we can.

Reason for Escalating Claim
Let us know why you are choosing to escalate this dispute to a claim:

Additional Information
Please agree to the escalation terms and provide any additional information that will help PayPal understand your claim.

I am willing to provide information to help PayPal investigate and resolve this claim in a timely manner
The information I have provided thus far is accurate and true

Request a Refund
You may request a refund to settle this claim. By indicating whether you would accept a partial refund, you are helping the seller understand how they can resolve this matter to your satisfaction. Learn More

I will accept a refund of the following amount to settle this claim: USD
I will only accept a full refund

Provide any additional information about this transaction.

Also his E-bay account and Paypal account are currently suspended / canceled.

Posted: **Thu May 15, 2008 3:30 pm**

He called me and offered to make it up. I am wondering if I should keep it and / or ask for a $ rebate for a scratched laptop & battery, saw dust filled contents, delayed shipping, failure of ebay & paypal accounts - The pain of time & energy on this transaction.

Posted: **Thu May 15, 2008 10:09 pm**

Thoughts?

Posted: **Thu May 15, 2008 11:03 pm**

Take your money and go someplace else. Given that you've bought a SXGA+ unit, your choices may be limited.

If this type of details bothers you, eBay was no place to buy a ThinkPad to begin with.

Even stuff that you buy at Outlet as "new" might have been opened and turned on...and they are quite upfront about it. What made you think that you were going to do better on eBay?

Am I to understand that for you, this is more of an issue about the principle of the whole thing, than of the actual condition of the item? If so, I could relate to that. That's why my advice is to return the machine and get a full refund. Apologies if I misunderstood you.

There are individuals on this forum that could likely supply a new ThinkPad in a blink of an eye, but you'll have to do your own research, I'm not going around advertising other people's business. And no, I'm not one of them. I prefer not to deal with new stuff, but that's completely OT.

My opinion only.

Good luck with whatever decision you choose to make.

Posted: **Fri May 16, 2008 10:38 am**

You have a good computer that appears to work aside from the scratches on the bezel. The in-warranty date on the Lenovo website is the manufacturing date. Call lenovo technical support anmd let them know you bought the thinkpad from an authorised reseller and want the warranty start date updated. They will ask for a copy of the invoice and it will take about 3-4 weeks to get it into their system.

That's what I did with a "New Open Box" computer from an authorised e-bay reseller that was almost a year past it's manufacture date.

Posted: **Fri May 16, 2008 3:36 pm**

Thanks Keith. That makes sense. What would be the best number to call in case I keep it.

Posted: **Fri May 16, 2008 7:07 pm**

The regular 24hr tech support line: 1-800-426-7378

Posted: **Thu May 22, 2008 5:46 pm**

crashnburn wrote:
SHoTTa35 wrote:just open Power Manager (icon on the taskbar by the time) and you can check battery stuff there. Go to Battery Information (obviously) and you'll see a lil arrow to expand details.

Parts iNventory is going to the Lenovo website. Click downloads and then on the left click parts information - you'll have to type in your machine type and serial number to get all the original parts that came with the machine.

Burn in? eeh... laptops don't really need that if you ask me. Most of the time when i use burn in stuff is to check a system stabilty for one that i built MYSELF. Maybe i might not have slapped something together correctly which could cause issues down the road. Laptops generally don't need that but i guess Memtest86 is just one most people use to burn in new RAM.
The battery details show:
Remaining Capacity: 85.53 Wh
Full Charge Capacity: 85.78 Wh
Manufacture Date: 2007-11-13
First Use Date: 2008-05
Design Capacity: 84.24 Wh

Battery is in Good condition.

I guess I'll do Memtest.

BTW - The red tape sealing shown in the pictures. Is it A-ok?

I just looked this up again - Changes in 1 day !!! How come?

Remainin Percentage: 98%
Remaining Capacity: 85.53 Wh > 83.43 Wh
Full Charge Capacity: 85.78 Wh
Manufacture Date: 2007-11-13
First Use Date: 2008-05
Design Capacity: 84.24 Wh

Is this normal or because manufacture date was late 2007 & it remained unused?

Can I call Tech Support for a replacement?

PS: I just called 1800 423 7378 by mistake and was about to post saying you just gave me a HOT line number