Thinkpads Forum

I had 8.441 driver version and after last black screen of death after opening a H264-encoded video file (with wifi LED blinking mad), I decided to go one version back, to 8.383. Seems problem solved. Now I only hope it won't cause any problems with docking, as I previously updated the drivers because of it.

By the way, you can download it from Lenovo, if you guess the filename:
ftp://ftp.software.ibm.com/pc/pccbbs/mo ... d165ww.exe

EDIT: Hmm, great. This version changes resolution to 1024x768 when the lid is closed, and restores 1400x1050 after opening, which means it messes with window sizes and it takes quite long... so there are no flawless drivers. Probably better than crashes though. Lenovo, can you hear us?

Like I mentioned previously on other thread, IBM is no longer the IBM we used to belive. This is my last thinkpad purchase. I am sick and tired of no resolution for the serious issues.

Why do I have to reboot my computer everytime this happens? Sometimes, I loose valuable document information because it happens in the middle of it.

I am going for HP now. No more lenovo.

Current (Catalyst 8.10 / version 8.541) drivers from ATI/AMD do not exhibit the freeze issue. But also being generic don't handle docking properly, don't correctly switch screens and resolutions on dock/undock.

azpirin wrote:Like I mentioned previously on other thread, IBM is no longer the IBM we used to belive. This is my last thinkpad purchase. I am sick and tired of no resolution for the serious issues.

Why do I have to reboot my computer everytime this happens? Sometimes, I loose valuable document information because it happens in the middle of it.

I am going for HP now. No more lenovo.

Are you sure it's IBM to blame, and not sub-par driver support from the vendor?

My final try for now, ATI drivers for new (Tx00/Rx00/W500) machines. Works, does not freeze with videos, unfortunately dock/undock still can't properly trigger display switching, even though this time it actually does something.
And no, I don't want to use Presentation Director. The last time I tried, it took it so much time to configure two displays that I'm better off using keyboard shortcuts to ATI CCC profiles.

All,

Apologies for the delay. Many thanks to all who contributed on this thread. We believe we have successfully recreated these symptoms and have some updated drivers in test now that we believe will help.

If any of the members on this thread would like to try these unreleased drivers and provide feedback, please contact me via PM.

UPDATE: Unfortuneately, I'm not going to be able to provide the pre-release driver to members at this time. The public release of the signed driver on the website is projected in about 2 weeks.
Thanks

Mark

I've just installed the latest ATI drivers with the modding tool and they work. I haven't had a crash yet but the screen still flickers like before does just before dying.

Mark I'd be keen to test drive the new drivers.

Since degrading to the driver version 8.293.1.0 - no problems any more (T60 2007FVG 1400X1050 Flexview). I would like to know what kind of useful enhancement and/or perfomance gain there would be with the soon to be released new video driver that would hopefully solve the freeze-ups and behave as well as the old and good driver version 8.293.1.0. In other words - why to upgrade?
Thanks for any information.

Wait for the updated driver from Lenovo, it should be released very soon, and solves it.

Or, alternatively, if you don't use docking, you can use Mobility Modder to use latest generic drivers from ATI. I used them for about two months and they were okay except for docking.

Anyone tried the new driver yet?

http://www-307.ibm.com/pc/support/site. ... MIGR-62841

Video driver (ATI Mobility RADEON / FIREGL PCI Express-2) for Windows XP - ThinkPad R60, T60, T60p (20xx, 26xx, 87xx), Z61m, Z61p
Applicable countries and regions
This package installs the software (display driver) to enable the following video chips on the system board for Microsoft Windows XP Home and XP Professional.
- ATI Mobility RADEON X1300
- ATI Mobility RADEON X1400
- ATI Mobility FIREGL V5200
- ATI Mobility FIREGL V5250

The following ThinkPad systems with ATI video chipsets are supported:
- ThinkPad R60
- ThinkPad T60, T60p (Machine types: 20xx, 26xx, 87xx)
- ThinkPad Z61m, Z61p

Summary of changes

8.533.3.1-081110a-075168

* [Important] End of support for Windows 2000.
Note:
For Windows 2000 users, use the version 8.442.3-080103a1-057754C (Build ID: 79D172WW).
* (Fix) Fixed an issue where the mouse cursor moved slowly when the computer and USB mouse were attached to the Docking Station.
* (Fix) Fixed an issue where the computer might have a blue screen error if Norton Internet Security 2008 was installed.
* (Fix) Fixed an issue where the rotation function did not work if Windows XP Service Pack 3 (SP3) was installed.
* (Fix) Fixed an issue where the computer might hang during video playback after resuming normal operation from standby state.

I'm using them. The freezing during video playback is not present. The only slight quirk I might want to point out is that when you open the lid, it takes 1-4 seconds for the screen to reappear (I don't mean wake up from sleep, I have that disabled on lid close). However it does not exhibit the problems of some older drivers which set resolution to 1024x768 on lid close.

It does the resize for me. All my windows would be resized to VGA (or is it is XGA) when I open the lid.

I agree with 3DD, it does resize so it's a way back to the 2007 driver which didn't have the problem with freeze-ups but had the one with resizing on lid closure. That's really annoying for me. Moreover, this driver has totally screwed up my T60p. Oh boy, I closed my lid for about 1 hour (which I do quite often). After that the display was black and didn't resume operation even after half an hour. Otherwise it was totally responsible (I could log off, log on, but without seeing anything ) Then I went to standby, resumed and viola, the logging screen was ok, I could see it. But after logging in it took about 2s to see a black screen again. Ok, restart -> logging screen came up in 640x480, wonderfull. Logging in, wait couple of seconds -> black screen. Several more restarts -> still the same.... Computer still responding but no video. Thanks, I'm not a fan of that.

Great job, Lenovo (I understand it might be caused by ATI/AMD/Bill Gates/God...whoever, but Lenovo did release these drivers so in my opinion it's their fault).

I rolled back to the previous drivers. After applying patches (referenced in another forum: http://forum.thinkpads.com/viewtopic.ph ... 7&start=90) I've been experiencing very infrequent freeze-ups when starting a movie (2-3 times in half a year). It happens only when starting video while there is something else processor-intensive going on in parallel. The only problem is with webcam+Skype (or probably it is important that the person I'm calling with is using a webcam so there are two videos at once), in that case it happens all the time so I have to restart before a call when there was a standby-resume cycle beforehand. The other forum mentioned above is (probably) dealing with a slightly different problem but the patches from Microsoft do help (at least in my case) to lower the frequency of freeze-ups really significantly. Look for some "summary" posts in that forum which list all the patches. I'm not sure which one helped most.

To summarize: I was really looking forward to the release of this new driver because it's been pain in my * to restart before each Skype call (although having this problem solved after one year since it has been introduced in the driver sounds more like a joke with respect to the reputation of Thinkpads). I appreciated that Lenovo got interested in this forum thread. However, now I see that we are probably just beta testers to Lenovo... Oh boy

Indeed... While HP and Dell give a good and descent support for their older laptops, Lenovo keeps back stabbing on us.True, true - a thinkpad is a thinkpad and there's no support forum like this for any laptop mfg company, but Lenovo has nothing to do with it.
My brother has HP nc6400, and when the time comes, I'm REALLY thinking to switch to a business class HP instead of business class Lenovo, since, let's face it - no more IPS, no more decent support - I'm just waiting for them to take off the ultranav, offer another color and take out the magnesium/titanium from the chassis...

kronda,

Just like Pes5 said, version 8.293.1 seems to be the most stable of them all. You may want to give it a try.

I just don't understand why they just can't seem to get it right. It's not like these are new bugs, but these are the same problems over and over again. I am also wondering if Lenovo even tested the driver before they released it - all you have to do just spend an hour or so (dock, undock, close the lid, open it, put the system to sleep, etc.), then you see all the problems.

I have experienced the lockups on my T60 for over a year. The mouse moves to the top left section of the screen and sometimes is a black box or partial lined box. There seems to be activity, just non through mouse or keyboard (beeps when unplugged, music still plays). I've even been on Skype calls and continued the call even though I was effectively crashed. Also of note are the random issues I have (I think they are related): screen does psychedelic color fade into nothingness, screen freezes and audio being played goes into loop and eventually black screens, screen freezes like it will never come back but if I don't touch anything for a minute it comes back (this causes false hope for times it doesn't come back).

That is the background, so I really hoped that this new driver would make it all go away. I turned back up my hardware acceleration and starting using my laptop.

I was locked up with the mouse pointer in the top left corner within a couple hours.

The only thing that has worked for me with good success is turning off hardware acceleration completely (Display | Settings | Advanced | Troubleshooting in XP Pro). However, I will say that I was good for quite some time after following the steps outlined on this thread: http://forum.thinkpads.com/viewtopic.ph ... 7&start=90 (look at "Posted: Thu Sep 06, 2007 2:43 pm"). It took the freezes down by a fourth or so but didn't stop them. The disabling of hardware acceleration has been good for several months with one freeze (and that may be unrelated).

One day maybe I can have hardware acceleration and not be worried that I will loose the changes on whatever document or application I have open to the frozen in place bug. I still have the latest Catalyst Control Center running, but when I try to open it I get the "...cannot be started because the currently active GPU is not supported."

T60 2623KFU 3GB RAM - XP Pro SP3

Thanks, 3DD, I'm quite ok with the 8.4x drivers (latest but one). Or do the 8.293.1 drivers have any of the problems mentioned here? In particular, what happens when you close and then again open the lid? Icons and windows messed up (to fit 1024x768) or not? The drivers that came with my T60p were having this "feature", that's why I consider the 8.4x drivers the "best" for me despite their "freeze feature".

Maybe it's a question for Pes5...
Thanks for your answer.

Been running 8.293.1 with zero issues on my T60 since summer 2008 when I determined issues with the video drivers. Did not install the corresponding Catalyst Control Center as I don't need it. Have never had issues described here with resize of screen resolution. Playing videos after coming out of standby or hibernate states, battery or AC mode, was my test for success. Based on what I am reading here regarding the new driver, looks like I am going to pass on it. I don't see the benefit of upgrading something that is working well.

Hi Mark,

Those drivers seemed to fix most of the problems, thanks.

The only issue that I have seen is when docked the machine froze when starting a video on WMP. Extensive video playing when undocked has been trouble free.

kronda,

Versions 8.4 all have the video locks up behavior, and the versions 8.3 have some sort of docking/undocking/restoring resolution problems. 8.293.1 is the one that works without these problems, at least for me.

Yes, I can confirm exactly the same as Kaz says:

"Been running 8.293.1 with zero issues on my T60 since summer 2008 when I determined issues with the video drivers. Did not install the corresponding Catalyst Control Center as I don't need it. Have never had issues described here with resize of screen resolution. Playing videos after coming out of standby or hibernate states, battery or AC mode, was my test for success. Based on what I am reading here regarding the new driver, looks like I am going to pass on it. I don't see the benefit of upgrading something that is working well."

Hence, I see NO reason to upgrade from 8.293.1. However, it bothers me that LENOVO does such a bad job in releasing problematic driver updates and not responding adequately to the problems to its faithful (FOR HOW LONG???) users.

Thanks for the information, Pes5 and 3DD. I've decided to give a try to the 8.293.1 driver. However, I don't have the distribution and it's even not available from ftp://ftp.software.ibm.com/pc/pccbbs/mo ... d162ww.exe. Can you please provide the installer?

I appreciate your help.

I am sorry I do not now where to find the installer for the older driver. I used rolling-back the driver as described here by Grimmeh on Sat Jul 12, 2008 5:01 am. The driver was installed when my system came, so updating it did not entirely remove it. You may try this if it is also your case, otherwise hopefully someone else knows where to get the installer.

Since my 8.293.1 driver came with my T60 in the March 2007 timeframe, the software is located in C:\SWTOOLS\DRIVERS\VIDEO. I did not have any luck locating it for you on the internet via Google searches. Perhaps others who know where to find it and will communicate the location.

Googling "thinkpad t60 driver 8.293.1" shows that some Chinese and Japanese Web sites do have the driver, but it would be great if Lenovo could make this version available again - Maybe Mark@Lenovo could help.

3DD,

I'll inquire about previous drivers.. although I suspect I know the answer.

I agree it would be great to keep an archieve of all prior ones available.

KAZ,

Thanks again for your help. I'm a bit disappointed that this wasn't a slam dunk fix for all - it seems like there are a lot of interdependencies and a lot of different test cases.

3DD, Pes5, Kaz,

thanks for your advice, the old 8.293.1 driver seems to do a good job. I have managed to download it from some chinese or japanese or korean page, so let me know if somebody is in need of it.

Well, a little update. The old driver 8.293 causes games such as Civilization 4 to freeze my laptop after some time of playing. This is a known problem of some older ATI drivers and it is definitely solved in 8.442, I don't know exactly which version contains the fix. Moreover, the old driver causes some applications and games, such as Skype and Unreal Tournament, to fully saturate (one core of) the processor which is also not so nice.

Just to have all pros and cons on individual driver versions kept in one place...

EDIT 2009-03-17: I was probably wrong with the game freezing issue of 8.293.1. My T60p had overheating issues, so the game freezes happened will all sorts of drivers (Omega, ATI, Lenovo...). After cleaning my laptop from dust, it's stable (I haven't tested it again with the old Lenovo drivers 8.293.1, though). I'm running the latest ATI drivers using the modding tool and there is no issue I would currently be aware of.

Well, it's like pick your poison...

3DD said it well. For me, my T60 is a business computer and has never seen a game on it ( I know, boring....). Must be why 8.293 has performed flawlessly for me. I keep the games on my desktop. My gut tells me that Lenovo is hoping that the T60 series sails away painlessly into the sunset so they can concentrate their efforts on their newer series of laptops. I will be surprised if we see another video update from them. As much as I love the hardware and have been fortunate/lucky to have resolved my painful freeze issues by using the older 8.293 drivers, I can honestly say that I have never had a desktop or laptop that has had the number of new issues experienced when upgrading OEM provided drivers. The need to roll back to older drivers for many hardware components, power management, etc. is something I have not had to face in the past. Most driver updates on past computers actually resolved an issue(s) without adding new ones. I bought my T60 at the time that Lenovo was transitioning to taking over from IBM. IBM was still providing service support back in 2007, but I believe that Lenovo took over for software/driver updates. I have never owned an IBM/Lenovo product before this one so I cannot comment whether this was ever an issue in the pre-Lenovo days. When I do have to replace my T60, which I hope is still many years in the future, I don't believe that Lenovo will be my #1 choice. Just being honest and good luck to all.