T60p widescreen external monitor doesnt work w FireGL V5200

[TheStranger2007]

This is my computer info:


Product: ThinkPad T60p 2007-CQ8
Operating system: Windows XP SP2

Original description: Based on 2007-87U: T2600(2.16GHz), 2GB RAM, 100GB 7200rpm HD, 14.1in 1400x1050 LCD, 512MB ATI FireGL V5200, CDRW/DVDRW, 802.11abg wireless, Bluetooth/Modem, 1Gb Ethernet, UltraNav, Secure chip, 9c Li-Ion batt, WinXP Pro

The video card is: ATI MOBILITY FireGL V5200

This video card stinks. I cannot get it to work with a widescreen resolution monitor.
I have westinghouse 22'' 1680x1050.

My other laptop - the t60 works fine. It has a measily video card of 64MB ATI Radeon X1300, but it still can pick up the external monitor with both XP and Vista. I had both installed at one point.

For some reason this t60p is working subpar to my t60 and refuses to work with my external monitor.

I have tried the latest driver from Lenovo (includes CCC). I have tried uninstalling all of ATI drivers and letting the default windows one kick in. I have also had a configuration with Lenovo's presentation director trying to configure this laptop to work widescreen it does not work.

I have http://www-307.ibm.com/pc/support/site. ... MIGR-62841 installed. For now, the setting is on 1400x1050 and the screen looks stretched. I can set the resolution to 1680x1050, but then instead of fitting the screen, I only see a limited amount of the screen and I have to scroll to see the rest of the desktop.

The firegl driver from ati's website doesnt work, and I think it is because they do not have an option for ati mobility firegl.
They have either ati mobility or ati firegl. I got the one for ati firegl v5200 and it wouldnt even install on the machine.. I submitted a ticket for ati/amd today.

Googling for their webpage : http://ati.amd.com/products/mobilityfir ... specs.html, it talks about widescreen once, "2x/4x/6x Anti-Aliasing modes, Lossless Color Compression (up to 6:1) at all resolutions, including widescreen HDTV resolutions".
I'm not sure what that means... but nowhere on the page do they talk about whether it supports widesreen resolutions for LCDs like 1680x1050, which is not good news.


Please help if anybody knows how to get widescreen to work with my machine.

[Harryc]

Try the Omega drivers.
http://www.omegadrivers.net/ati_winxp.php

[RonS]

The Omega drivers will probably work, but you should be able to set the correct resolution with the stock drivers.

I read your post twice and I'm still not sure... With your T60p, you get a "virtual resolution" image where your 22" monitor displays 1400x1050 resolution of a 1680x1050 frame using virtual resolution (scrolling frame). Did I get it right? Also, is the Westinghouse VGA or DVI?

Here are a few things to check:

1. Go into CCC, click on "Displays Manager", right-click on the monitor icon and select "Swap Displays". Apply that. Then see if you're able to set the correct resolution. In the past, that little step has solved a lot of problems for me.
2. Uninstall your monitor drivers. They often get in the way of setting your resolution manually.
3. Display Properties -> Advanced -> Monitor, uncheck "Hide modes". Then see if you can select the correct physical resolution.

[TheStranger2007]

The Omega drivers will probably work, but you should be able to set the correct resolution with the stock drivers.

I read your post twice and I'm still not sure... With your T60p, you get a "virtual resolution" image where your 22" monitor displays 1400x1050 resolution of a 1680x1050 frame using virtual resolution (scrolling frame). Did I get it right? Also, is the Westinghouse VGA or DVI?

Here are a few things to check:

1. Go into CCC, click on "Displays Manager", right-click on the monitor icon and select "Swap Displays". Apply that. Then see if you're able to set the correct resolution. In the past, that little step has solved a lot of problems for me.
2. Uninstall your monitor drivers. They often get in the way of setting your resolution manually.
3. Display Properties -> Advanced -> Monitor, uncheck "Hide modes". Then see if you can select the correct physical resolution.

I am using westinghouse VGA, its connecting to a docking station. So I just drop my laptop on top of it and it connects to the external monitor. It shuts off the laptops display and turns on only the external. So it is not extended or mirror.

I'm not sure what virtual resolution means but basically this is what happens. let me be clearer.
My laptop is 1400x1050. I connect to the external (which supports 1680x1050) and the resolution stays the same and i see a stretched image.
The option you asked me in step 3 is clear already. I select the resolution 1680x1050 from the Properties >> Settings. Then the resolution becomes fuzzy (I think it sets it to 1400x900 and I cannot see the entire desktop, I have to keep scrolling to see both bottom and side.

I already tried uninstalling my drivers and that did not work.

I will give the omega drivers a chance, although a few months ago when I was trying to do this, I used omega then and I got same/worst results. I remember cursing the omega drivers. But I will give the newer omega drivers a chance again since I am out of ideas.

[qviri]

Are you setting the external display to extend what you have on your notebook display, or clone it?

[TheStranger2007]

Are you setting the external display to extend what you have on your notebook display, or clone it?

it is not extended or mirrored/cloned.

I just tried uninstalling all ati drviers. I reboot. Windows XP finds and installs the driver automatically) The option for 1680x1050 dissappears. So I cannot change it at all.

I then installed the omega drivers. The option for 1680x1050 appears and when I set it to that, i get the same results as with the ati drivers.. I cannot see the whole desktop and have to scroll around to see all of it.

I'm guessing this video card doesnt support widescreen which is absurd because a t60p model should not have a crappy video card.

[qviri]

Are you setting the external display to extend what you have on your notebook display, or clone it?

it is not extended or mirrored/cloned.

What are you seeing/expecting to see on the external screen?

Normally there are two ways of setting up on external display, one is to simply have it copy whatever is on the notebook's display (clone), and the other is to treat them independently (extend).

In this case, clone may give the results you are seeing because your internal notebook display isn't widescreen, so you cannot have the same resolution on both screens without issues. If you set it to extend, you pick either the internal or external display as primary (in practical terms, the one with the Windows taskbar), and the other display offers more space you can move windows onto. In this mode, you can set the resolutions of the screens to be different.

I've always configured this with the default Windows interface (Control Panel -> Display Settings), so I cannot comment on how the situation looks when using either ATI or Thinkpad display utilities.

I'm guessing this video card doesnt support widescreen which is absurd because a t60p model should not have a crappy video card.

The card supports it. This is a configuration issue.

[Troels]

The firegl driver from ati's website doesnt work, and I think it is because they do not have an option for ati mobility firegl.
They have either ati mobility or ati firegl. I got the one for ati firegl v5200 and it wouldnt even install on the machine.. I submitted a ticket for ati/amd today.

That's true for all mobile laptop video cards from ATi/AMD - and maybe also Nvidia - i'm not sure. This is because they let the laptop manufacturer customize their own drivers to suit the best with the laptops, but we most likely all know that it is a load of.... something.

Here's the deal: either the FireGL or Radeon drivers will work fine, all you need to do is install the mobility modder. It's completely free of charge. Read instructions carefully.
http://www.driverheaven.net/modtool.php

Secondly, i still really don't recommend Omega drivers or the latest ATI drivers due to performance and incompatibility issues. The Omega drivers offered a fine performance boost on the MR 9600, but i think the performance is generally worse on the v5200 than it should be. Still faster than a MR 9600 by a great margin, but it can get even faster. This is only for 3D, so it might not matter the least

I recommend ver. 7.12 as the fastest one with the greatest compatibility. http://www.driverheavendownloads.net/ati.htm and then modify with mobility modder.

There should be an external monitor setup too in catalyst control center.

[TheStranger2007]

it is not extended or mirrored/cloned.

What are you seeing/expecting to see on the external screen?

Normally there are two ways of setting up on external display, one is to simply have it copy whatever is on the notebook's display (clone), and the other is to treat them independently (extend).

In this case, clone may give the results you are seeing because your internal notebook display isn't widescreen, so you cannot have the same resolution on both screens without issues. If you set it to extend, you pick either the internal or external display as primary (in practical terms, the one with the Windows taskbar), and the other display offers more space you can move windows onto. In this mode, you can set the resolutions of the screens to be different.

I've always configured this with the default Windows interface (Control Panel -> Display Settings), so I cannot comment on how the situation looks when using either ATI or Thinkpad display utilities.

I'm guessing this video card doesnt support widescreen which is absurd because a t60p model should not have a crappy video card.

The card supports it. This is a configuration issue.

There's a third way to do it, and its not cloning or extending.
The laptop display shuts off, and the output of the video card goes straight to the external display. It is as if the external monitor is the only display you have for your laptop. The laptops own screen is off. This works with my other laptop.

What I expect to see is 1680x1050 resolution on the external monitor w/o it being fuzzy or me having to scroll to view the entire screen. I curse ATI for their crappy card.


Troels, I've never heard of this modding thing, but i'll give it a try, thanks.

[gongo2k1]

w/o it being fuzzy

you're using vga on a... less-than-stellar panel, i wouldn't get my hopes up as far as image quality goes on this thing...
try powerstrip to set the custom res, that way you won't have to keep uninstalling/reinstalling video drivers and rebooting and stuff.

OT:
i'm using a samsung 226bw on my desktop, and it's totally worth the extra $45 over the westinghouse (in january when i bought it, samsung was $330 - 10% IR - $30 MIR = $267 AR + NJ tax, westinghouse was $225 + NJ tax). sure, the westinghouse was cheaper, but the difference in image quality is ENORMOUS. like they say, you get what you pay for... and you don't get what you don't pay for!

EDIT: apparently i can't do math...

[TheStranger2007]

w/o it being fuzzy

you're using vga on a... less-than-stellar panel, i wouldn't get my hopes up as far as image quality goes on this thing...
try powerstrip to set the custom res, that way you won't have to keep uninstalling/reinstalling video drivers and rebooting and stuff.

OT:
i'm using a samsung 226bw on my desktop, and it's totally worth the extra $45 over the westinghouse (in january when i bought it, samsung was $330 - 10% IR - $30 MIR = $267 AR + NJ tax, westinghouse was $225 + NJ tax). sure, the westinghouse was cheaper, but the difference in image quality is ENORMOUS. like they say, you get what you pay for... and you don't get what you don't pay for!

EDIT: apparently i can't do math...

What is powerstrip ?

And also I disagree with you respectfully, the image quality is fine. I used it with my other thinkpad and 1680x1050 is fine. I dont do video games and I dont do video editting. I just use it for browsing, chat, watching movies. All of that it does fine. I think the major differences btw samsungs and lesser monitor models is that they put a lot of contrast into the higher models. This means sharper image, but contrast means sharp white image coming at your eyes, which can be tiring/ cause fatigue in the eyes, a lot of people dim their monitors. With mine, i dont have to dim anything, its already 'crappy' like that
Yea but most of the time I get very nice image compared to other brands that you dont hear of too often. Westinghouse is pretty good model. Its like the difference between toyota and bmw, you'd probably argue with me that the bmw is so much better and worth the extra 10 grand, but I will stick with good old reliable toyota:) Now I feel like I'm having a nonsensical debate and this isnt helping my monitor problem..

The point is that the monitor is fine and the external display should be able to display 1680x1050 and not look 'fuzzy'

[gongo2k1]

What is powerstrip ?

http://www.entechtaiwan.com/util/ps.shtm
it's a program that let's you set custom resolutions and timings, just the sort of thing we're working with here.

And also I disagree with you respectfully, the image quality is fine.

that's fine, i wasn't trying to snub you or anything, i was mostly just saying that strickly speaking from an image quality point of view, this isn't necessarily the best setup. then again, as you mention, you're after more desktop space, which this provides.

I dont do video games and I dont do video editting. I just use it for browsing, chat, watching movies. All of that it does fine.

well, i do, so i totally hear where you're coming from. my monitor at work stinks compared to my samsung, but it definitely gets the job done, and the difference in quality doesn't get in the way.

I think the major differences btw samsungs and lesser monitor models is that they put a lot of contrast into the higher models.

yes and no. percentage of the ntsc color gamut is also important in the rendering, but as you've already mentioned above, this is largely a moot point.

a lot of people dim their monitors. With mine, i dont have to dim anything, its already 'crappy' like that

touche, i admittedly dim my monitor.

Its like the difference between toyota and bmw, you'd probably argue with me that the bmw is so much better and worth the extra 10 grand, but I will stick with good old reliable toyota:)

how appropriate, i drive a 325xi... lol. though i certainly won't argue the point about reliablity, i drive a bmw because i like the way it handles. indeed, if i wanted reliable, i would have gone with toyota or honda (which are also nice cars btw, i just happened to get a GREAT deal on a cpo bmw through a friend that i couldn't turn down... and the timing was right.)

Now I feel like I'm having a nonsensical debate and this isnt helping my monitor problem..

true, but if we wanted only and exclusively tech support and nothing else, we wouldn't be on a forum like this.

back on topic:
try powerstrip, i think you'll like it, it's very flexible and i've had nothing but good experiences with it.

[TheStranger2007]

The firegl driver from ati's website doesnt work, and I think it is because they do not have an option for ati mobility firegl.
They have either ati mobility or ati firegl. I got the one for ati firegl v5200 and it wouldnt even install on the machine.. I submitted a ticket for ati/amd today.

That's true for all mobile laptop video cards from ATi/AMD - and maybe also Nvidia - i'm not sure. This is because they let the laptop manufacturer customize their own drivers to suit the best with the laptops, but we most likely all know that it is a load of.... something.

Here's the deal: either the FireGL or Radeon drivers will work fine, all you need to do is install the mobility modder. It's completely free of charge. Read instructions carefully.
http://www.driverheaven.net/modtool.php

Secondly, i still really don't recommend Omega drivers or the latest ATI drivers due to performance and incompatibility issues. The Omega drivers offered a fine performance boost on the MR 9600, but i think the performance is generally worse on the v5200 than it should be. Still faster than a MR 9600 by a great margin, but it can get even faster. This is only for 3D, so it might not matter the least

I recommend ver. 7.12 as the fastest one with the greatest compatibility. http://www.driverheavendownloads.net/ati.htm and then modify with mobility modder.

There should be an external monitor setup too in catalyst control center.

I tried what you wrote also. It did not work.
Uninstalled omega drivers.
Rebooted.
Ran 7.12 catalyst to extract, cancelled installed
Used modder to mod the files
Started up setup.exe (this was not mentioned in their steps, they just wrote 'finish installation' - but i thought you just told me to cancel the installation? is what i was thinking. they need to add a missing step which is to restart installation of ati ccc once its modded).
Finished installation.
Rebooted.

Same issue as before... The desktop is either 1400x1050 in which case its stretched. When I set it to 1680x1050 I see limited amount of desktop and have to scroll to see it all.

I also tried the 'extended' option, in which case it allows you to set different resolutions for each display. For my external widescreen monitor it only showed me non-widescreen options... so 1400x1050.. to 1600x1200, and I could not select 1680x1050.

It is almost as if the driver did not recognize my external was a widescreen.

[TheStranger2007]

What is powerstrip ?

http://www.entechtaiwan.com/util/ps.shtm
it's a program that let's you set custom resolutions and timings, just the sort of thing we're working with here.

And also I disagree with you respectfully, the image quality is fine.

that's fine, i wasn't trying to snub you or anything, i was mostly just saying that strickly speaking from an image quality point of view, this isn't necessarily the best setup. then again, as you mention, you're after more desktop space, which this provides.

I dont do video games and I dont do video editting. I just use it for browsing, chat, watching movies. All of that it does fine.

well, i do, so i totally hear where you're coming from. my monitor at work stinks compared to my samsung, but it definitely gets the job done, and the difference in quality doesn't get in the way.

I think the major differences btw samsungs and lesser monitor models is that they put a lot of contrast into the higher models.

yes and no. percentage of the ntsc color gamut is also important in the rendering, but as you've already mentioned above, this is largely a moot point.

a lot of people dim their monitors. With mine, i dont have to dim anything, its already 'crappy' like that

touche, i admittedly dim my monitor.

Its like the difference between toyota and bmw, you'd probably argue with me that the bmw is so much better and worth the extra 10 grand, but I will stick with good old reliable toyota:)

how appropriate, i drive a 325xi... lol. though i certainly won't argue the point about reliablity, i drive a bmw because i like the way it handles. indeed, if i wanted reliable, i would have gone with toyota or honda (which are also nice cars btw, i just happened to get a GREAT deal on a cpo bmw through a friend that i couldn't turn down... and the timing was right.)

Now I feel like I'm having a nonsensical debate and this isnt helping my monitor problem..

true, but if we wanted only and exclusively tech support and nothing else, we wouldn't be on a forum like this.

back on topic:
try powerstrip, i think you'll like it, it's very flexible and i've had nothing but good experiences with it.

Okay I tried powerstrip, and it also did not work. Same results as before. I sort of had a feeling this would not work because omega drivers come with a similar application called 'multires' and with that you can also set the resolutions you want.
I guess the problem is really with the driver not knowing that I have widescreen that is why when i set it to widescreen resolution I am swimming in it as if my monitor was really a regular one and i just tried to force widescreen on it.

I have 1 more option left (that i just learned about) and thats to try http://staff-www.uni-marburg.de/~schmitzr/ATIPOWPL.zip. I think this is the same guy has written another app for thinkpads - the one that monitors the fan and controls its speed, etc.

I'm gonna uninstall all drivers, install the latest ccc drivers that lenovo provides, and then install this atipowpl.zip thing.

[TheStranger2007]

"ATI MOBILITY FireGL V5200" is not in the list of support video cards for this ATIPOWPL.zip. I had noticed that when I first downloaded it. Had momentarily forgotten.. its too bad because now I am out of ideas

[basketb]

Could it be faulty GPU hardware?

[qviri]

There's a third way to do it, and its not cloning or extending.
The laptop display shuts off, and the output of the video card goes straight to the external display. It is as if the external monitor is the only display you have for your laptop. The laptops own screen is off. This works with my other laptop.

Which as far as I know is equivalent to setting the external display to primary and choosing to not extend the desktop onto the external display.

What configuration method (ATI software, IBM software, Windows' Display Settings) are you using in your other laptop?

[TheStranger2007]

There's a third way to do it, and its not cloning or extending.
The laptop display shuts off, and the output of the video card goes straight to the external display. It is as if the external monitor is the only display you have for your laptop. The laptops own screen is off. This works with my other laptop.

Which as far as I know is equivalent to setting the external display to primary and choosing to not extend the desktop onto the external display.

What configuration method (ATI software, IBM software, Windows' Display Settings) are you using in your other laptop?

Correct.

For my other laptop (the t60 with ATI Radeon X1300), I never installed the catalyst. I really hate the CCC and try to avoid it whenever I can. I think its a bloated app and does nothing extra for what I want/need.
I usually just get Windows Updates and it installs a driver for my ati card which is ATI Radeon X1300. Then when I attach my laptop to the docking station, the laptop lcd goes off and external monitor comes on (which is what you described above). Initially the resolution is stretched. So I go into Display Settings and change it from 1400x1050 (i'm guessing that it used this as the default value because my laptop was set to this resolution) to 1680x1050, and the resolution worked fine. External display showed perfectly with my widescreen external monitor.
Having changed the display settings just once, everytime I use my laptop, it remembers to use 1680x1050 for my external.

However, I havnt been able to do it with this other laptop (the t60p with FireGL V5200). So I have tried omega drivers, ati drivers, lenovo drivers, hacked/modded ccc drivers, and multires/powerstrip. All through the help of this forum and just general knowledge from the past. So far... no dice, I still have a t60p laptop with video card ATI MOBILITY FireGL V5200 that wont display the correct resolution on my westinghouse 22' widescreen monitor.

[TheStranger2007]

Could it be faulty GPU hardware?

How dare you imply somethings wrong with my GPU? >:O !! lol.
Good question, but I would not know anyway, as far as I can tell it works fine. I havnt ever experienced flickering or display not working for any reason. Just external widescreen doesnt work properly.

[gongo2k1]

you might have seen this already, it's another person with lcm22w3 having a similar problem: http://www.techsupportforum.com/hardwar ... ution.html

[TheStranger2007]

you might have seen this already, it's another person with lcm22w3 having a similar problem: http://www.techsupportforum.com/hardwar ... ution.html

gongo2k1, you are genius. The solution in the link worked. I cannot believe I did not try the simplest solution first.. which is unplug and plug everything in.. I always try to think of the simplest thing to do.. for example most computer issues, i just reboot. Resetting and starting from the beginning is a pretty key step.

So I unplugged the cable from monitors end and from computer end. I also turned off the power supply to monitor. Waited 30 seconds.

I then plugged in cable to monitor (and tightened), plugged in power to monitor, plugged in cable to computer (and tightened). I hit FN+F7 on thinkpad (to switch to external) and resolution came up as usual 1400x1050. I changed it to 1680x1050, and it stuck.. and the display is actually correct!

I am seeing widescreen appropriately without any scrolling.. amazing and awesome.

1 day on this forum and it solved a very annoying problem for me. I guess the issue was resetting the cable or it was not in tight enough, I noticed one of the ends of the monitor cable (the monitor end) was loose.

thanks a bunch guys

[RonS]

I'm going to add this solution to my playback. I can't imagine what the underlying problem was that this trick solved, but a solution is a solution. As my Dad always told me, "gold is where you find it."

I'm glad you got it working!

[gongo2k1]

that worked?!?! good to hear.