Odd white stuck pixel, more like backlight peering through

Message

cb474 · #1 Post by **cb474** » Wed Oct 01, 2008 12:38 am

I have a stuck pixel that I would describe as white, but it's really brighter than even a white background. If I use dead pixel buddy and put up an all white screen, I still see it, like light coming through the white. It also appears on all colors in the same way, like a bright spot of light coming through in the tint of whatever color I have up on the screen. Only on an all black screen do I not see the spot.

Any thoughts about what's going on? It doesn't seem like a stuck white pixel really, since it appears with all colors except black. And when I look closely it really does seem almost as if there is no pixel there and it's just the light from the backlight coming directly through.

I've been trying the undead pixel flashing box to fix it, but it's doesn't seem to be working.

#2 Post by **Harryc** » Wed Oct 01, 2008 5:56 am

Well, it can't be a hot (stuck) pixel because that would be most apparent on a dark background. It can't be a dead pixel because that would show up as a black dot on a white background. I am guessing a defective LCD is causing this, but it may be some defect other than pixel related. If this machine is under warranty I'd call it in for service.

Superego · #3 Post by **Superego** » Wed Oct 01, 2008 9:36 am

Could it be the Ultranav driver problem? Seems unlikely as I thought it was fixed, but try pressing the scroll button and see if it goes away. If it's still there, at least you know what it's not

.

Troels · #4 Post by **Troels** » Wed Oct 01, 2008 3:03 pm

Is this on a 15" T60p (UXGA, Boe Hydis) ?

cb474 · #5 Post by **cb474** » Wed Oct 01, 2008 5:45 pm

Superego wrote:Could it be the Ultranav driver problem? Seems unlikely as I thought it was fixed, but try pressing the scroll button and see if it goes away. If it's still there, at least you know what it's not .

No I tried that. Thanks.

Troels wrote:Is this on a 15" T60p (UXGA, Boe Hydis) ?

It's a 14" T60. I don't know which manufacturer made the LCD.

It's very odd. I haven't read anywhere else about this sort of stuck pixel, or whatever it is.

Troels · #6 Post by **Troels** » Thu Oct 02, 2008 6:12 pm

Hmm ok. I'm having some sort of similar issue ofn a 15" - it seems to be due to a dust spec which has entered a layer of the lcd, where it pushes slightly on the crystral structure making light emit more clearly at a given angle. It's annoying, but some times the dust specs go away again, and the white spot disappears. It is also not visible on darker backgrounds.

But your issue sounds as if they "forgot" to pigment one pixel of the color filter, so that it contains no color (like monocrome LCDs).

Has it always been like this, or did the problem just appear?

cb474 · #7 Post by **cb474** » Fri Oct 03, 2008 3:36 am

My spot just appeared the other day, when I initiated this thread. And I've had this computer for two years. So it doesn't seem like it could be the failure to pigment one pixel as you mentioned. Also since the spot has appeared it has remained there continuously and consistently (any always comes back as soon as I power on the computer).

The spot does become less visible and eventually disappears at large angles to the left of the screen or tipping the screen back, away from the keyboard. It takes an even greater angle (almost parallel to the screen) to have it disappear from view from the right of the screen. Looking at the screen from the top down the spot remains very faintly visible pretty much all the way to a viewing angle parallel to the screen.

dr_st · #8 Post by **dr_st** » Fri Oct 03, 2008 1:16 pm

It's not a stuck pixel, it's a defect in the LCD. I am very familiar with it, since I've seen it on three Thinkpad LCDs up to date.

Don't know if it is a strange dust spec which looks white from certain angles, or a pressure problem, but if the machine is under warranty - get it to service and your screen will be replaced (personal experience).

cb474 · #9 Post by **cb474** » Fri Oct 03, 2008 8:02 pm

Alright, thanks everyone. I'll check and see if it's still under warranty and have it repaired if so.

The spot does seem dimmer today, but maybe that's just my eyes playing tricks on me.

raceannouncer · #10 Post by **raceannouncer** » Wed Oct 15, 2008 7:47 am

I have a T60 15.4" screen with the same problem. Looks like it will have to go back under warranty. Thanks for making me aware of the issue. I guess I never really noticed it before.

Mike

raceannouncer · #11 Post by **raceannouncer** » Tue Oct 21, 2008 11:59 am

Heads up for those with this problem considering sending it back to IBM...

Sent mine back last week. Received a call today that the screen will NOT be replaced under warranty. Their reason--the "white spot" is damage to the screen caused by "too much pressure". They will be happy to replace the screen at "$750.00", though...

This is the first issue I have had with the warranty/service on the machine.

It might very well be my LAST Lenovo purchase.

Mike

WojtekJ · #12 Post by **WojtekJ** » Wed Oct 22, 2008 1:04 am

raceannouncer wrote:Heads up for those with this problem considering sending it back to IBM...
Sent mine back last week. Received a call today that the screen will NOT be replaced under warranty. Their reason--the "white spot" is damage to the screen caused by "too much pressure". They will be happy to replace the screen at "$750.00", though...
This is the first issue I have had with the warranty/service on the machine.
It might very well be my LAST Lenovo purchase.
Mike

I don't want to be rude but they are right.
I had the same problem with my old HP DV4000 laptop and have seen it too in my friend's old Dell.
This defect is caused by movement of the screen in a lid - and it's caused by user, not by defective construction.
My friend dissasembled the whole screen to see what's going on and told me that when you press a lid to much it meets the screen and in that point after much time (I believe it's usually two years of more) - some point on the back of the screen just wear out.
I can definitely say it's true - the same happened in my HP - I was analyzing the problem and it sounds correct. I've been traveling a lot on the motorcycle with my laptop in the backpack (I was using it as a map while traveling through Spain, France, Belgium, Holland, Germany, Poland) and the whole problem started after that.

So... I'm sorry to say that but it's something normal and depends on the user, I would not blame Lenovo at all.

My advice - next time just use stiff, solid notebook suitcase instead of light and soft ones. Notebook backpacks aren't good for it neither (I use one all the time but will switch to some good suitcase in a moment).

dr_st · #13 Post by **dr_st** » Wed Oct 22, 2008 9:40 am

Hmm...

Bad news for Lenovo customers.

In the past I successfully replaced a T42 screen with such a defect. No one even tried to claim that it was my fault.

Now I have a T60 with the same defect. I have yet to take it to repairs. Now I have to worry that someone will blame me for it.

I will update this thread once I take it to the lab and see what they say.

WojtekJ · #14 Post by **WojtekJ** » Wed Oct 22, 2008 10:38 am

dr_st wrote:Hmm...
In the past I successfully replaced a T42 screen with such a defect. No one even tried to claim that it was my fault.

My friend run over his ASUS laptop in a car by accident (he left it leant against the wheel and forgot about that). That happened in the summer of 2007, he had to change screen cause the original one looked like a cobweb (was completely destroyed). He'd bought some screen on ebay (not original one - and was quite happy with it cause replaced standard glossy screen with the mat one) but he couldn't find asus casing (the orginal one was broken).
Some time ago the casing got worse and he decided to send the laptop to warranty repair. He received his ASUS from warranty repair about two weeks ago. They changed screen and casing - gave him new ones. It was completely his fault and they changed the screen and casing without any problems.
Great surprise. Off course no one tried to claim it was his fault neither (although it was).

It's something a bit similar with 'defects' of Lenovo's screen.
It's really not Lenovo's fault but if they want - they can replace the screen.

I believe most of people with problem like tihs has been using the laptop for at least one-two years and the laptop has been traveling a lot in a backpack or suitcase?
The problem appears after much time, not immediately after the purchase.

dr_st · #15 Post by **dr_st** » Wed Oct 22, 2008 10:58 am

WojtekJ wrote:It's something a bit similar with 'defects' of Lenovo's screen.
It's really not Lenovo's fault but if they want - they can replace the screen.

Indeed, not their fault. However, most of the things that get replaced are not their fault, and Lenovo tends to replace them (or at least used to).

Loose hinges, malfunctioning optical drives, bad sectors on the hard drive, etc.

These all happen as a result of normal use, not Lenovo's fault.

However, would you find it acceptable if somebody told you that it is perfectly normal that a DVD-RW that was used to burn 100 disks a month on average breaks down after two years (and it is!), and therefore is not covered by warranty?

It's all about what level of service you come to expect when buying an expensive business-grade laptop. I find it disappointing.

cb474 · #16 Post by **cb474** » Wed Oct 22, 2008 5:32 pm

As the person who started this thread, I have not yet sent my laptop in to see if they're going to repair it or not. Partly do to laziness, partly because I don't want to be without my laptop, and partly because I'm thinking of replacing this T60 with a T61, for other reasons, and then seeing if I can get this one repaired.

That said, I can confirm that I've been carrying this laptop in a softsided backpack every day, for about two years. So perhaps it is the pressure that caused this defect. Still, I do feel like it's a bit inbetween on whose fault it is. On the one had, yes perhaps it is not a manufacturing defect. On the other hand, the purpose of a laptop is to be portable and to expect that everyone out there is always going to protect their laptop while carrying it in the optimum way is unreasonable. It just doesn't have much to do with real world practices and conditions. And I'm pretty careful with my laptop, despite carrying it in my backpack. So I don't know that I consider it great "manufacturing" to design something that has such a poor lifespan. Anyway, I can see it both ways.

I will say that my old VAIO went through far far more abuse for a much longer period of time (five years) and never developed this kind of defect in it's screen. The only problem I ever had with that VAIO was when a friend's three year old pulled the "S" key off.

I now recommend against letting three year olds cheerfully pound away on your keyboard.

raceannouncer · #17 Post by **raceannouncer** » Wed Oct 22, 2008 8:26 pm

I own both a T42 and the T60. It was the superb warranty service (that I paid extra for on both) that I truly liked about IBM. Once Lenovo took over, I was waiting to see if anything on the warranty front would change. At first, it did not. Earlier this year, I had a problem which was diagnosed at first as a motherboard issue (the third one in this particular machine). Sending it back the second time, it turned out to be the memory chips but they also replaced the DVD multi-burner as well, WITHOUT me asking for it. They did it as a way to cover all the bases on the repair.

As far as the screen goes, it may or may not been my fault--I truly do not know. But the warranty service up till now always fixed the problem; now, it doesn't, for a reason that to me seems subjective, not objective.

One more thing--last February, I spilled a soft drink on the keyboard and the machine stopped functioning. I sent it back to the service depot, fully intending to be required to pay for my clumsiness. I was astounded when they sent it back, fixed for free under warranty. I am not trying to sound ungrateful here but if they can fix it when I am definitely at fault, why can't it be fixed under warranty when the cause of the problem cannot be fully determined?

Why the change in philosophy?

Thanks for hearing out the rant.

Mike Paz

dr_st · #18 Post by **dr_st** » Thu Oct 23, 2008 7:06 am

The argument as to whether this is something that should be covered, and whose fault it is, can go on forever. My opinion in this is very similar to that of cb474 and I see no need to repeat it all.

Regarding the actual experience of getting or not getting it fixed - I feel there is a great deal of luck involved - which technician you fall on, what mood he is in, etc.

I plan to take my laptop to the service center as soon as possible (hopefully early next week), so I can provide feedback on how it went, and so that I don't have to worry that the policies will become harsher (it seems they seldom go the other way).

This thread is a good heads-up for me, as far as being prepared for a denial. If they try to deny me, I fully intend to fight and escalate it.

I will keep you posted

cb474 · #19 Post by **cb474** » Fri Oct 24, 2008 3:06 am

It did also occur to me, after reading everyone's posts, that with the T61 Lenovo did add a LCD "roll cage" to the design. That does imply that Lenovo recognized the LCD could be better protected. It doesn't mean that lack of such protection in the T60 makes the defect a manufacturing defect, when the white spot appears on the screen. But it does suggest Lenovo thought they needed to improve on their product in this respect.

I look forward to hearing how things go for dr_st when he takes his laptop in.

dr_st · #20 Post by **dr_st** » Wed Oct 29, 2008 4:36 am

Well, I brought my laptop to service today. Unfortunately, the technicians were unable to examine it on the spot, only the customer service girl did. She noticed the defects, wrote a decription of them, and took the laptop into the lab.

Normally they take up to 5 business days to process the laptops, so I guess a week from now I should know whether the screen will be replaced under warranty or whether they will try to claim user-inflicted damage.

Stay tuned...

dr_st · #21 Post by **dr_st** » Wed Nov 05, 2008 2:18 pm

Well, I got the laptop back today. The screen was replaced, just like last time, without anyone even mentioning the possibility of not replacing it.

Looks to me like one of three things:

1) Either I am very lucky and raceannouncer was very unlucky.

2) Or the service here in Israel is better. This is what my American girlfriend seems to think, having had countless problems with warranty service in the US. I told her that it was just because she was buying consumer grade laptops, and with Thinkpads it's different. But who knows.

3) The defect is not the same. Even though it sounds like what I have, I can't be 100% sure, not having seen it personally. I've seen laptops with the traditional whitish pressure spots on the screen, that look like a big white blur rather than backlight peering through. If it something like this, I can believe that they would claim user inflicted damage (I would).

raceannouncer · #22 Post by **raceannouncer** » Wed Nov 05, 2008 10:24 pm

Well, I'm glad they took care of it for you. I might try again to get another answer although it probably will be more of a long shot now...

Thanks for reporting back!

Mike Paz

raceannouncer · #23 Post by **raceannouncer** » Wed Feb 04, 2009 9:55 pm

UPDATE 02/04/09:

While out of town, the T60's combo drive decided to take a dump. When I called IBM tech support, they immediately setup a replacement which I received at my hotel the next business day. While on the phone, I again mentioned my concern for the mysterious white dot on the screen (I now had more than 6 of them rather than only one as before) and the tech on the phone immediately ordered a replacement screen. He also sent a third-party service rep to come out and replace it on the spot!

Lesson learned here: as long as the warranty is still intact, keep complaining until you get satisfaction!

Unit runs and looks perfect, NOW!

Mike

WVZR1 · #24 Post by **WVZR1** » Thu Feb 05, 2009 1:21 am

cb474 wrote:My spot just appeared the other day, when I initiated this thread. And I've had this computer for two years. So it doesn't seem like it could be the failure to pigment one pixel as you mentioned. Also since the spot has appeared it has remained there continuously and consistently (any always comes back as soon as I power on the computer).

The spot does become less visible and eventually disappears at large angles to the left of the screen or tipping the screen back, away from the keyboard. It takes an even greater angle (almost parallel to the screen) to have it disappear from view from the right of the screen. Looking at the screen from the top down the spot remains very faintly visible pretty much all the way to a viewing angle parallel to the screen.

I carried my T60 in to a "service center" in Tyson's with a "questionable" lcd situation and was pleasantly surprised with a warranty repair. In on a Tuesday maybe 1:00 and I was called back before noon next day "ready"! If you like PM me for information.

Odd white stuck pixel, more like backlight peering through

Odd white stuck pixel, more like backlight peering through

My T60 15.4 screen also has it...

Re: Odd white stuck pixel, more like backlight peering through

Re:

Who is online