Thinkpads Forum

I am looking for a Flexview 15" UXGA IPS machine and have narrowed choices to a T4x vs T6x family. There seem to be more of the T4x around, however, the T43 have the dang "2010 error" with unapproved HDD and the T6x offer the ability to use a more readily available SATA HDD, do the neewer machine seems more appealing. Would anyone comment or direct me to a comparison of the two flexview-based machines. Thanks!

Are you looking for a specific comparison of the UXGA IPS LCD panels, or a comparison of the machines as a whole?

Well, seems to me that the newer T6x machines are more current and have greater expandability (SATA HD drives, more RAM, faster processor etc) and that the older T4x 'may' have a bit sturdier build quality. From my standpoint, I'd also prefer a newer machine so as to avoid the 2010 error with a new HD, too. I was interested in the UXGA screen comparison between the two generations of machines; if there is any great differences between them. It also appears that the IPS are much more commonly seen as a T4x iteration, perhaps because of the trend towards widescreen in the T6x and the phasing out of this screen? In any event, I would likely be looking at a used machine in either circumstance.

There may be a few threads here discussing the differences between the IPS screens. I don't remember everything, but the general consensus was that the BOE-Hydis panels on T60 are superior to the IDTech panels on the T4x, especially the sRGB variant, which is present on specific units.

The T60 series is indeed more current, more expandable, more sturdy, and overall, most would agree, is superior to the T4x. The one area in which I still feel the T4x has superiority is the keyboard feel. The T60 keyboard is excellent, but the T42 I have is even better.

And, of course, the T60 will cost significantly more!

You can't go wrong with a 15" UXGA-equipped T60p, as long as the panel itself is flawless. They are much sturdier than their T4x cousins.

Agreed 100% with dr_st on keyboard feel, though...and they're uglier than T4x machines IMHO...but that's about it, in every other category they win hands down.

I have purchased 2 of each: T42p, T43p & T60p from IBM, now Lenovo, as they have been used as my main work machine. I buy two at a time so as to set them up as mirror images of each other with one serving as a spare. I'm very picky about keyboards and have had them all. Alps, Chicony, & NMB. As much as I've enjoyed the T42p as my favorite of the T4x series, I find my 15" UXGA T60p far superior in all areas but one. And that is pure personal preference as I loved the red trim on the buttons and the overall appearance of the T4x series. The T60p in all black loses the "original" ThinkPad look.
However that said the build qualtity of both my T60p models is by far the best, and the T4x's were already great. The keyboard is also the best of the bunch. I would highly suggest a T60p.
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Cheers...

alexander_s wrote:Well, seems to me (...) that the older T4x 'may' have a bit sturdier build quality.

T60 introduced the roll-cage. I had a T41 and now I have a T60. T60 is *definitely* sturdier.

Many people think a 4:3 15" T60p with a high resolution FlexView screen is probably the best ThinkPad to date surpassed only by the same machine with a 4:3 14" T61p motherboard (i.e. a custom made ThinkPad).

There are two T60 UXGA panels noted in tabook.pdf. One panel is called sRGB display which - according to some discussions here - was never build. I had both the T42 and now the T60 and while the T42 looked better, the T60 is much better for todays use. The far more easier use of the docking station alone is a big argument for the T6 series. There maybe not so much advantages to put a T61 board into a T60 as it does not fit perfectly - which for a notebook you use is a must. I replaced my motherboard with a T60 motherboard with integrated graphics and wwan and am very happy for both having a cool and long battery lasting system.

To get back on topic, the T60 SXGA+ panel is okay, it is by far not perfect when comparing it to external displays. I wonder how it would measure up against the UXGA panel.

yak wrote:Many people think a 4:3 15" T60p with a high resolution FlexView screen is probably the best ThinkPad to date surpassed only by the same machine with a 4:3 14" T61p motherboard (i.e. a custom made ThinkPad).

I would suggest that a 4:3 14" display does _not_ surpass a 15" by any margin.

They are simply different choices.

There are strong arguments for each of them, which are all centered around the type of work or usage, one does with their ThinkPad. I currently have both 4:3 14" and 15" sizes and they are both excellent.

Cheers...

ssd_thinkpad wrote:the T60 SXGA+ panel is okay, it is by far not perfect when comparing it to external displays. I wonder how it would measure up against the UXGA panel.

When I put my T60 with it's 15" 4:3 SXGA+ display next to my 15" 4:3 UXGA T60p, the comparison reveals the best by far is the T60p.

However that's providing that one can live with the very small fonts / icons etc that the UXGA displays. I'm lucky to have 20/20 vision, so for me it's wonderful. In fact I've been working everyday for years with a 4:3 UXGA ThinkPad, however I can certainly see where it's not for everyone.

Cheers...

archer6 wrote:I would suggest that a 4:3 14" display does _not_ surpass a 15" by any margin.

I think he meant to take the motherboard from the T61 4:3 14" and put it into the T60 15" chassis, so as to enjoy the Flexview LCD.

archer6 wrote:When I put my T60 with it's 15" 4:3 SXGA+ display next to my 15" 4:3 UXGA T60p, the comparison reveals the best by far is the T60p.

Could you elaborate more, please? Other than the extra resolution, what do you like better in the UXGA panel?

dr_st wrote:Could you elaborate more, please? Other than the extra resolution, what do you like better in the UXGA panel?

Yes, you're question is an excellent one as they are both great displays. Here is my take:
The difference between the SXGA+ vs. UXGA is a bit challenging to notice unless one happens to have them side by side. Or as is my case, own them both and work with them alternately. Then what is noticed is the better color balance, temps, & saturation of the UXGA. When working with photos in Black & White, contrast is much better as well. And yet that said, these differences are subtle and I find the SXGA+ still an excellent display. In terms of brightness the difference is negligible. I have been doing amateur still photography work for years and when it comes time to choose which computer I'm going to use, the UXGA T60p
is my first choice. However it still remains a personal choice as they are both highly desirable.
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Cheers...

Thanks for the wonderfully detailed reply.

When it became clear that IPS displays are history, I decided that I want to get myself a "the most up-to-date" IPS machine, which naturally had to be a T60/p.

In the end I went for a T60 non-P SXGA+ due to higher availability, lower pricing, and a small concern of not being able to adjust to the very high PPI of a 15" UXGA machine. Overall, I am very pleased with the 2007-QPG I got myself, and hope to keep it for a very long time. But since I never actually tried working on a UXGA Flexview, I can't help to wonder whether I am missing a lot by choosing the SXGA+.

dr_st wrote:In the end I went for a T60 non-P SXGA+ due to higher availability, lower pricing, and a small concern of not being able to adjust to the very high PPI of a 15" UXGA machine. Overall, I am very pleased with the 2007-QPG I got myself, and hope to keep it for a very long time. But since I never actually tried working on a UXGA Flexview, I can't help to wonder whether I am missing a lot by choosing the SXGA+.

I'm so glad you shared this, as I too have a 15" 4:3 SXGA+ T60 (non - p). I must say that I very carefully chose this specific computer as my personal machine, as for all around usage the SXGA+ is my preference. Especially for hours of research on the web which is something I do. The way web pages render in the UXGA resolution, are simply too small for my tastes. Especially pictures and other elements that are designed for resolutions between 1024x768 & 1400x1050. As an all around ThinkPad, I'll take the 15" T60 SXGA+ any day without hesitation. Thus in my opinion you aren't missing a thing.

Cheers...

We shall see how the 15" IPS display is; bought a very inexpensive T60p (no OS, no AC adapter) and am waiting for it to ship. Thanks to Harry for locating the link for me.

That's the best way to get them. I got my R60 on Fleabay very cheaply. It looks almost new. It only lacked a hard drive, which I already had. The best thing is still under warranty until September of '10, which the seller never mentioned in the description.

Grab a FlexView while you can. They're the best screens, which is arguably the most important part on a notebook. I figure mine's good for at least three more years, probably longer barring some unforeseen complications. I don't need a lot of power.

alexander_s wrote:

We shall see how the 15" IPS display is

I don't mean to sound rude, but there's really not much to see...

They're all gorgeous displays, and if in good shape with no dark spots/hairs/pressure marks are a real thing of beauty.

Your post has inspired me to put three different 15" UXGA ThinkPads side by side, and they all have something unique, while sharing a lot at the same time...

A31p with its DBU which is likely the warmest one amongst all.

T43p with an ID Tech which is probably the least tiring one when it comes to my eyesight.

T60p sporting a Hydis and its phenomenal black and darker colours in general...

Yum, yum, yummy...

I'm quite certain that you'll love your new T60p...